Wax ring or rubber for toilet?

[Fav Onefour]

Sort of went through this following the tank crack. Was going to buy a new toilet and asked the retired and still working plumber's about the wax or synthetic rings, both stated wax. The shop I bought the tank from they said similar for a toilet install. I detest the clean-up but those wax rings do last. Don't use the plunger or pour hot water down.

I do like the advice and comments with the Sani Seal product. It looks simple enough and easy to clean if you pull the commode.

I've done a few toilets over the years. Wax is easy and holds up quite well in most situations.
I had one renter that seemed to keep having issues with the seal leaking. I had stopped by to visit and one of her little guys yelled that the toilet was plugged again. I looked to see if I could figure out why and help get it flowing again. She said, "Use the plunger for awhile." Leaking seal problem was solved. The kid was using paper towels and it was a lot. They were forcing the wad through the flange.

I have found over the years that seals don't just start leaking. If a toilet rocks or moves, the seal will fail. Using pressure like plungers isn't a good plan either. Most floor toilets operate as a gravity system and the seals are designed to keep gasses in the plumbing.

As a side note, I've never had to replace a leaking seal in our house. I'd never really noticed until we started doing rentals. I also noticed after awhile, that we do not have a plunger in the house.

 

[BOB4TA]

I use the closed-cell reusable ones from H.D. and never had any issues. One time I had to remove a toilet after setting it 2 weeks earlier. It did what it states .. reusable. I reinstalled it w/o any issues.

 

[Kuma601]

I have a variety of unused plungers which is a good reminder to toss them out.

One of the neighbor's told me their little girls would plug the upstairs toilet from using lots of TP which they would plunge it. I suggested them to not do this but use an auger. They continued the plunger practice and eventually discovered a stain on the kitchen ceiling under that bathroom.

 

[Sumboodie]

We have old plumbing thus, a few stop ups every year. I got tired of cleaning up the old wax rings, heating the replacements, just a messy deal.
While I don't recall the brand, HD has a closed cell reusable ring that I installed last time. It also locates the base studs for you. No more one shot or fail. I've tried many "universal seals" only to find that many don't allow the camode to sit
flush(rocks).

Plus if the ******* or pipes moves a little from settling or the 400lb mother-in-law doing the funky chicken dance, it'll still seal.

 

[K'ledgeBldr]

WAX!

 

[Copymutt]

Update on the closed cell ring. After recent tree roots the john backed up. Found the clever sealed ring had disintegrated into a core and a loose green cover. Never again.

 

[rlitman]

Update on the closed cell ring. After recent tree roots the john backed up. Found the clever sealed ring had disintegrated into a core and a loose green cover. Never again.

I've heard reports of that issue with the green rings. They're a fluffy foam with a paper thin skin.


The Fluidmaster Better Than Wax product uses a solid silicone flange/horn protecting a closed cell foam gasket. It will not fail in service.

 

[gahrajmahal]

The son and daughter-in-law are doing a home addition and soon will be installing two new toilets. The new master bathroom will be done by a contractor and the old bath I will be doing as it needs a toilet that uses a Uni-fit trap to accommodate the 1920’s 14” rough in distance from the wall. Their current 1960’s giant tank toilet sits 4” away from the wall and your knees bump the bathtu when you sit down. I think I will choose one of those fluidmaster silicone sealing rings when I do the install.

Here in Cincinnati a lot of the old homes have a toilet installed in the basement, often sitting out in the open. The boys home was no different. This toilet when I remodeled it into a small bathroom, was mortared to the floor with concrete. This isn’t the first time I have found this. I had to chisel the concrete floor flat and screw a metal repair flange to the floor.

 

[rlitman]

The son and daughter-in-law are doing a home addition and soon will be installing two new toilets. The new master bathroom will be done by a contractor and the old bath I will be doing as it needs a toilet that uses a Uni-fit trap to accommodate the 1920’s 14” rough in distance from the wall. Their current 1960’s giant tank toilet sits 4” away from the wall and your knees bump the bathtu when you sit down. I think I will choose one of those fluidmaster silicone sealing rings when I do the install.

Here in Cincinnati a lot of the old homes have a toilet installed in the basement, often sitting out in the open. The boys home was no different. This toilet when I remodeled it into a small bathroom, was mortared to the floor with concrete. This isn’t the first time I have found this. I had to chisel the concrete floor flat and screw a metal repair flange to the floor.

Sounds like fun. That Uni-fit looks to seal to the porcelain similarly to how their wall hung toilets rubber ribbed flanges work, except oriented 90 degrees differently. That's a new one for me (I'm not a plumber). Because of how it gets bolted down and is isolated from the movement of the toilet, I think wax would be just fine, but now that I've gone wax-less, I'm not going back to that mess.

Don't forget to apply their silicone lube to the rubber seal before placing the toilet.

 

[Sumboodie]

The son and daughter-in-law are doing a home addition and soon will be installing two new toilets. The new master bathroom will be done by a contractor and the old bath I will be doing as it needs a toilet that uses a Uni-fit trap to accommodate the 1920’s 14” rough in distance from the wall. Their current 1960’s giant tank toilet sits 4” away from the wall and your knees bump the bathtu when you sit down. I think I will choose one of those fluidmaster silicone sealing rings when I do the install.

Here in Cincinnati a lot of the old homes have a toilet installed in the basement, often sitting out in the open. The boys home was no different. This toilet when I remodeled it into a small bathroom, was mortared to the floor with concrete. This isn’t the first time I have found this. I had to chisel the concrete floor flat and screw a metal repair flange to the floor.

$1100 for those special shitters. For that price it better give me 4 or 5 shakes and zip up my pants after.

 

[Fav Onefour]

@gahrajmahal , I have a couple of excrement collectors that came with Uni-fit trap assemblies. (Wife buys and I deal with the install) Anyhow, the two I've done both have a rubber flange seal built into the receiving end of the assembly. Two different brands of toilet, two different styles of Uni-fit. One came with a foam gasket ring included for the install. The other required purchasing a ring. The Uni-fit assemblies are both hard mounted to the floor. I'm a fan of using a good seal that will hold up a long time.
I've only run into one toilet that was "poured" into the concrete. The floor was 3/4" above the flange. Everything underneath was cast iron too. It was a real riot.

 

[toyotadriver]

I've had decent luck with the Saniseal but did have one leak. I replaced it with a rubber one and so far, all good. I do NOT caulk between the toilet and the floor.

 

[johnu]

I’m not sure what I’ve purchased the last two times other then they were extra long/thick with the long plastic funnel in the middle.
In both cases the issue causing the replacement was the original gasket was not thick/tall enough to seal.

 

[gahrajmahal]

Toto toilets are the ones we’ve been discussing. Funny, when I looked up one to Link to this thread, the trap by itself at Home Depot is $84 and suggested to go with it is the flush master seal mentioned above

 

[gahrajmahal]

If we weren’t interested in a one piece toilet (tank attached) the price would be cheaper. This one picked at random $885

Toto unifit toilet

 

[nadogail]

When I add up all the toilets in my home and rentals; they are a bunch. I use only premium quality (not cheap) wax rings. I have been buying mine at Home Depot, no only do I get a Military Discount, i own stock in the company.

 

[rlitman]

When I add up all the toilets in my home and rentals; they are a bunch. I use only premium quality (not cheap) wax rings. I have been buying mine at Home Depot, no only do I get a Military Discount, i own stock in the company.

Oh of course. Always get the wax made by premium bees. The wildflower types just taste better than orange blossom or clover.

 

[CoogarXR]

On a new toilet on a nice flat floor, I'll just use the wax seal.

But on a crooked, jakey-*** floor, I'll use a Fernco no-wax seal:


Never had one leak yet, even on a severely sloped floor. All new toilets though, I never tried to install one on a used/existing toilet.

 

[rlitman]

Fernco no-wax seal

How does the sticky part of that adhere to a toilet already contaminated with wax?
Also, I've never had luck installing a ribbed Fernco dry. Do you use dish soap or silicone grease on them?

 

[CoogarXR]

How does the sticky part of that adhere to a toilet already contaminated with wax?
Also, I've never had luck installing a ribbed Fernco dry. Do you use dish soap or silicone grease on them?

I said that I never used one on an old toilet, only new ones, so no old wax to contend with.

As far as fitting them in the pipe, it's been a few years since I used one, but I don't remember having any trouble. But I am usually working on old-*** houses with slimy, gross cast-iron waste pipes. They just glide right in, lol.

 

[Fav Onefour]

The Fernco setup is pretty slick.
@CoogarXR , pretty much summed up my feelings. Not sure how it would "stick" to old wax. I think the sticking part is critical because the seal slides into the pipe. If the glue doesn't stick tight, the seal is not complete.

I had to sorta fashion an assembly with an old wall mount location. The old toilet was damaged and it was being replaced. I used the Fernco and added to it a little.
The previous owners must have tried every trick with conventional seals. It had, a wax ring, plumbers putty, and a variety of caulk attempts around the opening.

It still leaked and the wall was damaged.
The wall mount location was fine and the framing was still good so I wanted to reuse those. The old pipe flange assembly wasn't exactly suited for modern foam seals. The pipe was 4" without a flat face for a nice squeeze.

I cut and tapered a foam seal,

to help seat and hold the Fernco with additional compression.

I'm not sure if the extra foam was needed. The adhesive on the Fernco was pretty good. I was nervous about the wall mount leaking later, so I created the extra measure of holding the flange in place.
I can also attest they work with old ganky cast iron. The ribs have quite a bit of flex. I did a dry run on this fitting before attaching. I didn't use soap or plumbers grease because I was concerned about anything affecting adhesion on the final install. That pipe wasn't pretty and it seemed to work well.

 

[nadogail]

There is no reason to not level an uneven floor if necessary, floor filler is too cheap to take chances on trying to get by with a half assed effort.

 

[speed bump]

Not sure which non-wax rings I've used but they all worked fine. Personally if I'm pulling a toilet it's probably a problem and the last thing I want to deal with is more mess so that's why I use non wax rings.

 

[paulsomlo]

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On a new toilet on a nice flat floor, I'll just use the wax seal.

But on a crooked, jakey-*** floor, I'll use a Fernco no-wax seal:


Never had one leak yet, even on a severely sloped floor. All new toilets though, I never tried to install one on a used/existing toilet.

I've used those - they work really well and stick like crazy; you can pick up the bowl by the seal, they stick so well.