Why don't high end ratchets have a quick release button?

[M6erfan]

carlyle CHT R38LFQR
it 90 tooth, very compact head quick release locking flexi, on sale till 30th sep for 40.99
Really nice ratchet.
I got the long version too CHT R38LFLQR .

https://realdeals.napaecatalog.com/app.php?RelId=6.2.3.29

No, it's 72 tooth.

Still, great ratchet

 

[derosa]

As mentioned craftsman has their 75t version which I also like, I have the trio but largely rely on my non-QR wrights. I also don't buy the whole adding a tiny hole weakens the anvil. I've twisted the square ends off of craftsman extensions, a couple of adaptors and wrecked ratchet internals and have never twisted off the square part of the ratchet, have a hard time believing the teeth or socket wouldn't give first.

 

[Citation]

Quick release buttons make the whole thing weaker. The most common failure point on ratchets in this day is twisting off the anvil. Drilling a hole down through the center of the anvil weakens it somewhat.

So let's actually look at the math...
I just got some quick measurements off my Husky (Apex-Gearwrench based) 3/8 drive. The 3/8 anvil measures 9.53mm per side. The hole in the center is 4.55mm. Yes, the hole is 50% of the "diameter" of the square. But I linked to the equations earlier. If we assume the anvil is a round shaft then the torsional strength with the hole is 94.8% of the solid shaft. If we assume the anvil is actually a square shaft then the one with the hole is 95.4% as strong as the solid shaft.

Now look at the differences in failure torque of these ratchets
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/ratchet-handles-torture-test/
A 5% difference is noise in the test.

Yes, it's a tiny bit weaker but not enough to matter...

 

[Citation]

As mentioned craftsman has their 75t version which I also like, I have the trio but largely rely on my non-QR wrights. I also don't buy the whole adding a tiny hole weakens the anvil. I've twisted the square ends off of craftsman extensions, a couple of adaptors and wrecked ratchet internals and have never twisted off the square part of the ratchet, have a hard time believing the teeth or socket wouldn't give first.

I've got both types and prefer the QR all else equal. My current go to ratchet is a roto head that isn't QR. I think my 3/8 Cman failed internally but I've sheared one or two 1/4 drive Cmans (14mm socket with pipe, hard to blame the failure on the ratchet).

 

[Loscaldazar]

So let's actually look at the math...
I just got some quick measurements off my Husky (Apex-Gearwrench based) 3/8 drive. The 3/8 anvil measures 9.53mm per side. The hole in the center is 4.55mm. Yes, the hole is 50% of the "diameter" of the square. But I linked to the equations earlier. If we assume the anvil is a round shaft then the torsional strength with the hole is 94.8% of the solid shaft. If we assume the anvil is actually a square shaft then the one with the hole is 95.4% as strong as the solid shaft.

Now look at the differences in failure torque of these ratchets
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/ratchet-handles-torture-test/
A 5% difference is noise in the test.

Yes, it's a tiny bit weaker but not enough to matter...

It's tiny bit weaker, but a fair amount in the world of advertising (especially since ratchets are compared not by ft-lbs they can take, but instead by % of ASME torque. A F80 is advertised at 200% of ASME torque (150 ft-lbs is ASME for 3/8 drive ratchets). A 5% difference in strength results then in a 10% difference in ASME when advertising (placing a F80 about equal with a GW 84T). Not something the advertising department would be found of.

With no quick release, the ratchets are slimmer, easier to design/engineer, easier to manufacturer, and there is no risk of a socket falling off from an accidental hit to the button, which while annoying when working on cars, can be very dangerous in a nuclear power plant or a space shuttle (snap on sells to both areas, so a legitimate concern for them).

Ultimately manufacturing with no quick release is beneficial for many reasons, but the only reason that really matters for an end user like us is strength. And as several have already pointed out, their quick release ratchet has not failed them, proving that QR vs no QR is a minor factor in strength.

 

[bdelmar2]

I notice the QR ratchets tend to have problems with the mechanism itself. Either it sticks and lets sockets/extensions fall off or it breaks altogether.

I have 3 or 4 quick release ratchets and none of them are currently working correctly for one reason or another, and maybe 15 or 20 regular ratchets, one of which isn't working right.

So maybe one of the reasons the truck brands don't make QR ratchets much is because of the increased warranty claims.

 

[Mr_B]

No, it's 72 tooth.

Still, great ratchet

My mistake your right it 72tooth, it only the sealed heads without QR that 90tooth

 

[Citation]

It's tiny bit weaker, but a fair amount in the world of advertising (especially since ratchets are compared not by ft-lbs they can take, but instead by % of ASME torque. A F80 is advertised at 200% of ASME torque (150 ft-lbs is ASME for 3/8 drive ratchets). A 5% difference in strength results then in a 10% difference in ASME when advertising (placing a F80 about equal with a GW 84T). Not something the advertising department would be found of.

With no quick release, the ratchets are slimmer, easier to design/engineer, easier to manufacturer, and there is no risk of a socket falling off from an accidental hit to the button, which while annoying when working on cars, can be very dangerous in a nuclear power plant or a space shuttle (snap on sells to both areas, so a legitimate concern for them).

Ultimately manufacturing with no quick release is beneficial for many reasons, but the only reason that really matters for an end user like us is strength. And as several have already pointed out, their quick release ratchet has not failed them, proving that QR vs no QR is a minor factor in strength.

I agree with most of that. Quick release doesn't have to make the ratchet taller. The Husky qr 72 tooth ratchet has a button that doesn't stick up at all and is no thicker than the similar Gearwrench without qr.

My other qr ratchets do have buttons that stick up.

 

[Bcom]

My current Cman ratchet does have a very low profile QR button. Its so low in fact that it's hard to press with gloves on and sometimes without gloves.

 

[Al Borland]

I destroy tools for a living, (at least that's what it seems like). I have broken many ratchets. I've bent the handles and stretched the loops on round heads, stripped the internal gears, and smashed the guts out using them as hammers. The only ratchet I ever twisted the anvil off was a cheap round-head without quick release (think dollar store quality) that was sent out to a job. and that took a 3 foot cheater bar.

 

[jumbojak]

I've found that cheap qr ratchets tend to have pretty obnoxious qr buttons. They stick out way, way too far. The old snap on I found at the farm has a button that barely stands proud of the ratchet head. My new carlyle is the same way. An old craftsman I have has a button the sticks out enough to catch on things. It's not a deal breaker but it can be annoying.

 

[Bcom]

I destroy tools for a living, (at least that's what it seems like). I have broken many ratchets. I've bent the handles and stretched the loops on round heads, stripped the internal gears, and smashed the guts out using them as hammers. The only ratchet I ever twisted the anvil off was a cheap round-head without quick release (think dollar store quality) that was sent out to a job. and that took a 3 foot cheater bar.

How does someone get a job like that? I would love to do what you do!

 

[Al Borland]

How does someone get a job like that? I would love to do what you do!

Construction/Demo/Salvage. Spend too much time in old factories.
When you are 40 feet off the ground and something needs smacking, everything looks like a hammer.

 

[GTO]

Just got a SO TRLL72 and love it !

 

[Bcom]

I was walking through Lowes and i spotted this. It's a 3/8 drive 11pc socket set. You could get your choice of metric or standard for $12. Included in the kit is a 90 tooth Kobalt ratchet with QR button. I grabbed a kit off the shelf and brought it home. I didnt figure I could go wrong for $12 and the kit came with a 90 tooth QR ratchet. Below are some photos of the kit and the ratchet compared to my CMAN ratchet. The Kobalt ratchet is about a 1/2" shorter. Don know if I'll like that or not.

 

[Citation]

The Cman you have is based on the single pawl Gearwrench ratchet mechanism. Husky uses basically the same mechanism. The Kobalts used to use the same mechanism as the Harbour Freight (and Tekton) ratchets. However the 90 tooth is different since the direction lever is now "non reversed". That is move the lever to the left for clockwise (like Snapon, unlike HF).

 

[Bcom]

I would like to hear more opinions on this 90 tooth Kobalt ratchet. Pros and cons of its shorter length maybe as well. I wonder why they made it so short? I still haven't ruled out getting a SO FR80 ratchet. I think the Kobalt is Taiwanese if im not mistaken. Ive had Taiwanese ratchets in the past and theyve actually held up quite well till a 3ft cheater broke the one i had

 

[visionguru]

I would like to hear more opinions on this 90 tooth Kobalt ratchet. Pros and cons of its shorter length maybe as well. I wonder why they made it so short? I still haven't ruled out getting a SO FR80 ratchet. I think the Kobalt is Taiwanese if im not mistaken. Ive had Taiwanese ratchets in the past and theyve actually held up quite well till a 3ft cheater broke the one i had

There are many varieties of ratchets: standard, stubby, long, extra long, flex head, locking flex head, quick release.... Each has their own advantages and short coming in certain situations. Yours is just that particular length. There is no why!

Also, your original question is not valid. QR is just one of those kinds, many high end tool companies are making them. Your original question should be: why don't commonly seen high end ratchets have QR feature?

The answer is a simple one: the mechanics/workers as a whole decided that QR is not an essential feature. Had they prefer QR, you could have seen QR on most ratchets. It's more about the customer's choice than anything.

I think a good analogy would be: burgers!
Cheaper ratchets: just burger and some cheese, cost $3
mean stream ratchets: common McDonalds burger, cost $5
Highend ratchets: gourmet burger from better restaurants, cost $20

They all serve the same purpose: cure your hunger. You definitely don't have to have the $20 burger, unless you developed a taste for them.

Same as Snap-On, there is no practical reason to buy one in terms of functionality. If you prefer certain flavor (minor things), that's why people pick certain brand over others.

I have 20+ ratchets: snap on, craftsman, and dirt cheap. My first no-name brand ratchet lasted 20 years and still works perfectly. The one that has the worst workman ship is a 11" 1/4 dr 72-tooth flexhead, Made in Taiwan. Country of origin is not a good indicator about quality, the price is. For an average DIYer, ratchets from any brand could last a life time.

 

[Bcom]

Visionguru--- you kinda lost me on your whole spiel here. My question isn't valid? It sure looks valid since people are answering it. I'm all in for hearing people opinions but you had me walking away when you started talking about burgers.

 

[Al Borland]

Let us know how the new Kobalt ratchet does. I've got the sets with the 72 tooth ratchets, they came with deep and shallow sockets.

 

[Bcom]

Let us know how the new Kobalt ratchet does. I've got the sets with the 72 tooth ratchets, they came with deep and shallow sockets.

I'll do that. I bet the ratchet itself turns out to work well. I just dont know about losing that 1/2" length on the end of it. A half inch doesn't seem like alot til you put it in your hand. Especially if you have large meaty hands. The ratchet definitely feels like a mini version compared to my CMAN ratchet.

 

[visionguru]

Visionguru--- you kinda lost me on your whole spiel here. My question isn't valid? It sure looks valid since people are answering it. I'm all in for hearing people opinions but you had me walking away when you started talking about burgers.

Your original question was: "Why don't high end ratchets have a quick release button?" You think it was valid, when every high end tool maker actually makes QR ratchets?

The burger analogy is to help you understand what high end ratchets or tools in general are about, which you didn't seem to know.

 

[Citation]

Your original question was: "Why don't high end ratchets have a quick release button?" You think it was valid, when every high end tool maker actually makes QR ratchets?

The burger analogy is to help you understand what high end ratchets or tools in general are about, which you didn't seem to know.

If one didn't look I could see how it would be easy to miss that say Snap-On had QR ratchets. I've never seen one and almost any pictures I see are of Snap-On w/o QR. Compare that to most big box store stuff that home/amateur/hobiests will use and they almost always have QR. I can see why one would ask the question. Now, the short answer is, "They do". That leads to the second question which was also discussed, "why aren't they common".

 

[Wakefield]

History of quick release? Didn't Sears buy the idea cheaply from one of their employees,patent it and then commission Armstrong or Moore Drop Forge to manufacture it? (For Sear's own Craftsman brand) Then did the patent expire allowing companies such as Snap On to manufacture it? Then the courts found that Sears did something wrong in not paying more to the employee who invented it?
I guess old time mechanics were a bit skeptical of it and I think it does weaken the drive a little bit but perhaps Snap On has found a way to make the hole smaller and thus the weakening trivial?
Was Craftsman "RHFT" 1/2" drive the first one with a quick release?

 

[derosa]

I would like to hear more opinions on this 90 tooth Kobalt ratchet. Pros and cons of its shorter length maybe as well. I wonder why they made it so short? I still haven't ruled out getting a SO FR80 ratchet. I think the Kobalt is Taiwanese if im not mistaken. Ive had Taiwanese ratchets in the past and theyve actually held up quite well till a 3ft cheater broke the one i had

Looking at the packaging I'm going to guess shorter ratchet to fit the case. Shorter case, more cases in a box meaning more in the container. Smaller case also seems more full since lest wasted space so a seemingly better value.

 

[Bcom]

Looking at the packaging I'm going to guess shorter ratchet to fit the case. Shorter case, more cases in a box meaning more in the container. Smaller case also seems more full since lest wasted space so a seemingly better value.

Lowes had the same ratchet available for purchase by itself. Buying the ratchet by itself was $25. It was also a short 90 tooth. Makes me wonder why the 11pc case with the ratchet was so cheap?

 

[isb cornbinder]

Peter 'Pete' Roberts invented the quick release socket wrench. He sold his patent to US retail store chain Sears for $10,000 who said that they did not think the invention was worth very much. When he learned that Sears had done a market study which revealed a huge market and that they had sold 26 million of his wrenches for a profit of $44 million within a year, he sued them for fraud. In 1976, a US Federal jury agreed with him and awarded him $1 million in damages. Sears appealed the decision all the way to the US Supreme Court but lost.[1]
On further appeals he was granted $5 million in damages, however the lawsuit continued, and in 1989 it was reported that he had finally settled with Sears for $8.9 million.[2]
My local Sears/Craftsman is nothing like the tool store of the 1950s, 60' and 70s. I would doubt that anything Craftsman is made in North America, now. I have lots of vintage Craftsman tools and they are all about quality. I have two broken vintage sockets and I would rather keep them than turn them in for some insulting warranty replacement.
I took my 1/2" Craftsman torque wrench to an rebuild shop because it was slipping. They removed the factory grease and suggested I run it dry. I do not grease or oil my ratchets.
I have one 3/8" quick release and I never use it. I have had the QR release ratchets break. It would appear the strength is reduced from the drilled drive.

 

[derosa]

Lowes had the same ratchet available for purchase by itself. Buying the ratchet by itself was $25. It was also a short 90 tooth. Makes me wonder why the 11pc case with the ratchet was so cheap?

I bought the cman 75t ratchet in a case for the car, came with 6-18mm sockets and 2 different extensions for 20, just the ratchet is often 25.00. Guess they keep replacements for warrenty or those people who don't want more sockets rolling around. I've never understood the markup of ratchets vs sets.

 

[disston]

I understand you want what you want but I think plain ratchets with the detent ball spring loaded work just fine. I find all quick release ratchets a pain and slower to change sockets on than a plain type. I've been an ametuer mechanic for more than 50 years. I didn't see it here but how do the pros feel about this? I'd be interested if they thought QR was a useful feature.

 

[jacob_coulter]

It's a deal breaker for me if they don't have a quick release button. The slightly thinner profile just doesn't mean much, I can use a wrench in those situations.

Having greasy gloves and trying to swap sockets is just too frustrating. It gets to the point I have to keep a flat head screwdriver nearby in order to change them.

I guess it's just cheap ratchets from here on out for me.

 

[mudflap]

It's a deal breaker for me if they don't have a quick release button. The slightly thinner profile just doesn't mean much, I can use a wrench in those situations.

Having greasy gloves and trying to swap sockets is just too frustrating. It gets to the point I have to keep a flat head screwdriver nearby in order to change them.

I guess it's just cheap ratchets from here on out for me.

x2......I have no use for a non-QR ratchet... Between the grease, oil, and diesel fuel .. fighting sockets off got old a long time ago. Alot of my QR rats are thin head with a recessed button...so no clearance issues. And any time i have snapped the drive off one..i had a pipe on it..so that don't count.

 

[Bcom]

Now I'm wondering if it's possible to put a nice rubber handle on a ratchet that doesn't have one?

 

[ihateminimumwage]

Now I'm wondering if it's possible to put a nice rubber handle on a ratchet that doesn't have one?

Plenty of options (although the Photobucket debacle screwed a lot up).
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=96359

 

[Tennessee Cattleman]

My current daily user is an 84T Craftsman ratchet which works"ok" but the reverse lever always seems to stick and kick over into the wrong direction. Ive been wanting to upgrade from my 3/8 Cman ratchet but it seems that every good high end fine tooth ratchet brand doesn't have a quick release button which I like. Any reason why the high end fine tooth name brand ratchets dont have a quick release button? My ratchet pic below.

My opinion on this is simply because a high end fine tooth ratchet should hold and release a socket/extension without needing a quick release button in most circumstances.

 

[Tonyuk]

I prefer ratchets without a QR but there isn't much in it, if a saw one with a designed that i liked i would buy it even if it did have a QR without any bother.

I've never had an issue with taking sockets off a non-QR ratchet, possibly because i wear gloves which add a bit of grip even when the socket is covered in oil or a bit of grease. Most cheaper ratchets seem to be coming with a QR option now, problem is on a lot of them they can be a bit sloppy, either not fully releasing the socket when pressed in or not holding it properly do it falls off often.

 

[jptbay]

Thanks for posting this. Awesome!

Peter 'Pete' Roberts invented the quick release socket wrench. He sold his patent to US retail store chain Sears for $10,000 who said that they did not think the invention was worth very much. When he learned that Sears had done a market study which revealed a huge market and that they had sold 26 million of his wrenches for a profit of $44 million within a year, he sued them for fraud. In 1976, a US Federal jury agreed with him and awarded him $1 million in damages. Sears appealed the decision all the way to the US Supreme Court but lost.[1]
On further appeals he was granted $5 million in damages, however the lawsuit continued, and in 1989 it was reported that he had finally settled with Sears for $8.9 million.[2]
My local Sears/Craftsman is nothing like the tool store of the 1950s, 60' and 70s. I would doubt that anything Craftsman is made in North America, now. I have lots of vintage Craftsman tools and they are all about quality. I have two broken vintage sockets and I would rather keep them than turn them in for some insulting warranty replacement.
I took my 1/2" Craftsman torque wrench to an rebuild shop because it was slipping. They removed the factory grease and suggested I run it dry. I do not grease or oil my ratchets.
I have one 3/8" quick release and I never use it. I have had the QR release ratchets break. It would appear the strength is reduced from the drilled drive.

 

[Citation]

Peter 'Pete' Roberts invented the quick release socket wrench. He sold his patent to US retail store chain Sears for $10,000 who said that they did not think the invention was worth very much. When he learned that Sears had done a market study which revealed a huge market and that they had sold 26 million of his wrenches for a profit of $44 million within a year, he sued them for fraud. In 1976, a US Federal jury agreed with him and awarded him $1 million in damages. Sears appealed the decision all the way to the US Supreme Court but lost.[1]
On further appeals he was granted $5 million in damages, however the lawsuit continued, and in 1989 it was reported that he had finally settled with Sears for $8.9 million.[2]
My local Sears/Craftsman is nothing like the tool store of the 1950s, 60' and 70s. I would doubt that anything Craftsman is made in North America, now. I have lots of vintage Craftsman tools and they are all about quality. I have two broken vintage sockets and I would rather keep them than turn them in for some insulting warranty replacement.
I took my 1/2" Craftsman torque wrench to an rebuild shop because it was slipping. They removed the factory grease and suggested I run it dry. I do not grease or oil my ratchets.
I have one 3/8" quick release and I never use it. I have had the QR release ratchets break. It would appear the strength is reduced from the drilled drive.

Again, the reduction in strength is an insignificant 5% or so. I'm sure the difference between a non QR Snapon and a QR cheap ratchet is more than 5% but the difference isn't due to the drilled hole.

I do recall reading the sears story. I think there was more to it. If I recall it was a breach of contract issue in that the royalty was under calculated.

 

[openwheelracing88]

If the detent is designed well then QR is not needed. When it comes to hand tools, simple is the key. When it comes to ratchets, the strength and ratcheting action are way more important than QR. If I find a good ratchet with good ratcheting action that happens to have QR, then I wouldn't hesitate. However, I wouldn't sacrifice the other way around. Just my 0.02.

 

[Wakefield]

Just now in front of me are two 3/8" drive ratchets with QR,a pearhead Craftsman -V-43785 and an expensive Nepros "Ninety Gear"
the Nepros does indeed have a smaller diameter hole through the squaredrive and its button is recessed making it less apt to get pushed accidentally
I suppose a good QR should never allow the socket to fall off unless the button is pushed,giving some kind of safety aid in situations such as the publicized Missile accident where a heavy socket dropped from a worker's ratchet down into the silo,bouncing into the missile and causing a fuel or oxidant leak which eventually resulted some days later in the silo and missile exploding and killing one or more U.S. Servicemen
I still somewhat prefer not having the QR and probably the QR weakens it more if on a 1/4" drive
Snap On Catalog "1200" has some QR and most (ratchets) without QR so I think they are trying to stock both types,Perhaps now they have most models in both

 

[Wakefield]

Anyone ever have dirt or grit get in the QR through the button causing the socket/extension to not want to come off? That possibility occurs to me