Why I can no longer recommend Proto...

[toolmutt]

I've been very satisfied with 1-800-800-TOOL both times that I have called. The first time was for a broken 1/4" drive socket that was actually my dad's. They said to return it to the place of purchase. I said that was 400 miles away. I had a new one in the mail in a few days.

The other issue was with a new Blackhawk ratchet. It was described on their website as dual pawl but the ratchet I received was single. They sent me a new dual pawl replacement kit. Neither time was I required to send anything back to them.

Keep working your way up the chain, espy. I'm sure you'll soon find someone who will make it right.

 

[espyking83]

In that kind of business you need a first-rate customer service department, because that's the face presented to the customer. Looking for a person to head that up should be as serious as looking for your new CEO.

I assume you've been calling the Proto customer support number:

(800) 800-TOOL

Perhaps try calling Stanley Black & Decker's corporate office to see if they can put you in contact with someone higher up:

(860) 225-5111

Or try Stanley Black & Decker's media contact:

(860) 826-3260

And sometimes, writing an actual letter and sending it to the corporate office will get the attention of somebody high enough in the food chain to do something about the issue:

Stanley Black & Decker
1000 Stanley Drive
New Britain, CT 06053

The latter will cost you a little more time and the price of a Forever stamp, but even in the 21st century, it's still usually far more effective than phone calls and emails because it tells the company that the issue was important enough to you to have taken the time to formally tell them about it. At the very least, at that point, you'll know you've exhausted every resource.

I considered contacting Stanley, but figured I would be told that Proto is a completely separate division and they handle their own affairs (like when I called Snap On for information to warranty a Williams screwdriver). But I will write a lengthy letter about what happened and the expectations of a mechanic when it comes to warranty issues. I won't try to sound like a pompous *****, but we spend money with the warranty in mind. Might be good for him, to know what the customer expects instead of some posterboard touting marketing hipster.

That sounds like the makings of a GJ poll on Proto Customer Service. Anyone with Proto tools (or intending to buy) should also be interested in the answer to that question. There are a lot of options for tool purchases out there. No sense in being involved with companies that have problems with either products or services.

That would be a great idea, but I have no clue how to start a poll!

To the op no need to kill off proto all companies sometimes hit bad spots and **** happens...

I can understand your rant we all do it from time to time, for me proto tools are easy to return broken tools; but things happens and you just got caught in the middle this time around.

If it would make you happier start with another company like snap on, cornwell or mac and start buying their tools.

Woody

I buy from those companies a lot. Huge fan of Snap Ons ratcheting screwdriver and their screw extractors, and a few odds and ends from Mac. Never been too impressed with Cornwell TBH, though I think we're gonna start getting a truck stopping at our hangar on Fridays so I'll be able to check out a large part of their line up.

 

[espyking83]

**UPDATE**

So I called once again today, and once again the rep passively refused to give me the contact information of a higher-up (if that makes sense). Every time I directly asked to have their information she changed the subject by asking what ratchets I sent in or what my address was. She never said no, but she never acknowledged the question either. I'm not sure what that means, I'm assuming that they have this issue quite frequently and it never goes well when upper management finds out. Even though I have never been jerked around and flat-out lied to when dealing with a company before, I dont want anyone to get into trouble, let alone lose their job. I just want their service to get better. I recommend their tools a lot, when I say a lot I mean every single opening I can get. I would feel like a total douche bag if I talked a friend or a coworker into supporting Proto, only for them to have an experience like this when they try to warranty the tool.

Anyhoo, it looks like the first ratchet that I sent in first will be replaced tomorrow. They actually emailed me a tracking number for UPS. I think I found out what happened with the ratcheting mechanism I sent in, apparently the model was discontinued so a worker just randomly threw in the wrong replacement. The woman said that they will send me a whole new flex head ratchet, which actually has more teeth in it. So that's good I guess. There's at least an attempt to make this better. I almost had second thoughts about pursuing this further, but it's my responsibility to inform the appropriate parties of what has happened so this doesn't become the acceptable norm (if it isn't already).

 

[Brownsfan]

I don't know if its been asked but.... How old are the tools you are trying to warranty? Just curious.

 

[espyking83]

~5 years.

 

[Ruger_556]

I'm sorry... This is a little ridiculous don't you think? A worn ratchet and a mechanism out of another. You probably bought them off Amazon too. If you go through a distributor this is never a problem.

 

[Davefr]

Glad to hear it's working out for you.

The problem is the industrial brands aren't used to dealing with one-sy two-sy consumers. However I bet they're getting more consumer business since CM has gone to China and the tool truck brands are poor value.

IMHO the industrial brands are the best bang for the buck these days. (Wright, Proto, etc)

Hopefully they'll wake up and capitalize on the opportunity with a customer service infrastructure.

 

[ZRX61]

Good thing you weren't dealing with GearWrenches fucked up warranty issues, you'd be in a tower some place with a scoped rifle....

 

[Wamsutta]

you'd be in a tower some place with a scoped rifle....

That's funny as all get out right there....

 

[sonvolt]

Hopefully it all works out, Proto makes some great tools

 

[Nanashi]

espyking83

Is writing a concise, relatively low-key Email to Proto Customer Service explaining your situation a good idea? I.e., your dissatisfaction with the Customer Service issues. Not the quality of Proto's tools. If I were Proto management, I would want to know about issues like these. I'm sure they realize that a decent percentage of their clientele are people who make a living with tools.

At a minimum, this might provide you with personal satisfaction.

Nope! It's now a principle situation. They could mail me a new black ratchet and kiss my azz and i would still be mad. It really sounds like the company isn't doing all it can to make it's employees happy which seems to be showing through in it's customer service. Probably has temps working qc and phone calls.

 

[toolslinger]

Well you may not be looking far enough up the corporate ladder to let them know what is going on.
My girlfriend was having issues with getting CS from her mortgage company. After a little google stalking, she came up with the VP's contact info, and set him a polite letter. Not only did she get a return phone call from him, and a letter, but after that, she got whiplash from the CS department's fast response times.
VP's do not want this kind of **** taking time from their busy golf schedules...
So... After a little google stalking we have the following, not VP's, but far enough up to roll some heads:

Dave Fabris
SALES DIRECTOR
Phone: (770) 787-3850


Mark Sullivan
COO
Phone: (770) 787-3800

Personally, I'd take that info, and dig a bit more to get a mailing address. You're not going to get through on a phone, there are too many people that are going to push you off.

 

[espyking83]

Well you may not be looking far enough up the corporate ladder to let them know what is going on.
My girlfriend was having issues with getting CS from her mortgage company. After a little google stalking, she came up with the VP's contact info, and set him a polite letter. Not only did she get a return phone call from him, and a letter, but after that, she got whiplash from the CS department's fast response times.
VP's do not want this kind of **** taking time from their busy golf schedules...
So... After a little google stalking we have the following, not VP's, but far enough up to roll some heads:

Dave Fabris
SALES DIRECTOR
Phone: (770) 787-3850


Mark Sullivan
COO
Phone: (770) 787-3800

Personally, I'd take that info, and dig a bit more to get a mailing address. You're not going to get through on a phone, there are too many people that are going to push you off.

Awesome! Thanks!

 

[espyking83]

I'm sorry... This is a little ridiculous don't you think? A worn ratchet and a mechanism out of another. You probably bought them off Amazon too. If you go through a distributor this is never a problem.

It doesn't matter where I bought it, Proto is the manufacturer that offers the warranty. I have learned to always contact the manufacturer first on warranty issues, retailers/distributors constantly like to refer people to the manufacturer, so I just eliminate the middle man from the start.

 

[PFSard]

Well you may not be looking far enough up the corporate ladder to let them know what is going on.
My girlfriend was having issues with getting CS from her mortgage company. After a little google stalking, she came up with the VP's contact info, and set him a polite letter. Not only did she get a return phone call from him, and a letter, but after that, she got whiplash from the CS department's fast response times.
VP's do not want this kind of **** taking time from their busy golf schedules...
So... After a little google stalking we have the following, not VP's, but far enough up to roll some heads:

Dave Fabris
SALES DIRECTOR
Phone: (770) 787-3850


Mark Sullivan
COO
Phone: (770) 787-3800

Personally, I'd take that info, and dig a bit more to get a mailing address. You're not going to get through on a phone, there are too many people that are going to push you off.

Great stuff. Thanks for the research.

 

[Davefr]

It doesn't matter where I bought it, Proto is the manufacturer that offers the warranty. I have learned to always contact the manufacturer first on warranty issues, retailers/distributors constantly like to refer people to the manufacturer, so I just eliminate the middle man from the start.

It does matter. In the case of the industrial brands they almost always rely on their distributers to provide the warranty service.

However they should provide backup when you end up getting the runaround from the distributers.

 

[espyking83]

It does matter. In the case of the industrial brands they almost always rely on their distributers to provide the warranty service.

However they should provide backup when you end up getting the runaround from the distributers.

No, it doesn't. If this were really a problem they would direct you to a distributor on their site.

 

[espyking83]

Proto offers the warranty, not the distributor.

 

[LB-1911]

Proto offers the warranty, not the distributor.

Cut & Paste of Proto Warranty and Disclaimer

EXCLUSIVE REMEDY AND CLAIM PROCEDURE

Distributors of record must act as a return agent.


Warranty and Disclaimer @
http://www.protoindustrial.com/en/support/Pages/Warranty.aspx

 

[JDSV]

Cut & Paste of Proto Warranty and Disclaimer

EXCLUSIVE REMEDY AND CLAIM PROCEDURE

Distributors of record must act as a return agent.


Warranty and Disclaimer @
http://www.protoindustrial.com/en/support/Pages/Warranty.aspx

+1

Which is why I lean toward Wright, they make no such statement in their warranty clause. A call to Wright CS will either lead you to a distributor or if you do not have one near by they will handle warranty for you. I believe SK has a simliar warranty to Wright, and Williams has you send items back to their location in Midland, GA.

 

[thebeekeeper1]

Proto offers the warranty, not the distributor.

As I said above, that wasn't my experience. I called Proto, but the nice CS lady referred me to a local distributor (I did NOT buy the ratchet there), and they handled the replacement. It took just over a week and was very smooth. I just had to pay one way shipping. If that's their system, then perhaps that is why you are having problems.

 

[espyking83]

Cut & Paste of Proto Warranty and Disclaimer

EXCLUSIVE REMEDY AND CLAIM PROCEDURE

Distributors of record must act as a return agent.


Warranty and Disclaimer @
http://www.protoindustrial.com/en/support/Pages/Warranty.aspx

Choose your arguments.
http://www.protoindustrial.com/en/support/Pages/ServiceCenters.aspx

Not all tools are bought through distributors.

 

[e30bradley]

customer service is EVERYTHING. I'm having issues with my local HF..

 

[espyking83]

^I agree. Part of the premium price I pay is towards my expectations of exceptional customer service.

 

[Davefr]

^I agree. Part of the premium price I pay is towards my expectations of exceptional customer service.

If you don't have a relationship with a Proto industrial distributer then I'd choose another brand since that's Proto's current business model. (for first line warranty service.)

It's just like when "joe six pack" steps onto the SO truck for the first time and wants warranty service right off the bat.

There is no shortage of other quality brands that offer convenient mail in service. Maybe SK or SO.com would be better choices for you if warranty service is that important.

 

[espyking83]

If you don't have a relationship with a Proto industrial distributer then I'd choose another brand since that's Proto's current business model. (for first line warranty service.)

It's just like when "joe six pack" steps onto the SO truck for the first time and wants warranty service right off the bat.

There is no shortage of other quality brands that offer convenient mail in service. Maybe SK or SO.com would be better choices for you if warranty service is that important.

There is no excuse for bad customer service at any level, quit trying to be argumentative. I already said I didnt want to change brands if this isn't the norm. And already deal with SK for sockets. Also, SO wouldnt argue with Joe whatever because they have flawless customer service.

 

[kythri]

You, sir, have unreasonable expectations when it comes to this particular brand.

People have already pointed out the various reasons why.

 

[jakemac]

The point that most posters here seem to be missing is that in his initial calls to Proto, the CS rep kept giving him the run-around, assurances, and outright lies about the status of the items that they acknowledged that they had in their possession.

Once the CS rep told the OP that they would take care of the problem, any written warranty clauses were presumed to be void.

It wasn't the warranty, or the quality of the tools, that the OP was complaining about. It was the poor treatment of a customer, with no regard for the companies image or the customer's needs that the original post was about.

Just my 2¢

 

[espyking83]

You, sir, have unreasonable expectations when it comes to this particular brand.

People have already pointed out the various reasons why.

Oh yeah? Care to elaborate on how I am unreasonable? Is it the fact that I was lied to? Or was it that the rep said she would take care of it and never even mentioned a distributor?

 

[espyking83]

The point that most posters here seem to be missing is that in his initial calls to Proto, the CS rep kept giving him the run-around, assurances, and outright lies about the status of the items that they acknowledged that they had in their possession.

Once the CS rep told the OP that they would take care of the problem, any written warranty clauses were presumed to be void.

It wasn't the warranty, or the quality of the tools, that the OP was complaining about. It was the poor treatment of a customer, with no regard for the companies image or the customer's needs that the original post was about.

Just my 2¢

Precisely.

 

[CoyoteKyle]

Proto's got problems. Customer service is just saying what they're told to say. I'd hate to be the one taking the calls getting yelled at everyday. I'm surprised Stanley hasn't ran this brand into the ground like most of the other brands they killed and sold off. They can't magically make a ratchet appear if they don't have any. They should man up and tell you the darn truth.

 

[mech-tech]

I can possibly add something here since I been in the oilfield industry for the past 10 years. Most oilfield companies around here use Proto mainly cause they are readily available at almost every single industrial supplier in the area, also they have almost everything in stock including the large hammer wrenches and large sockets, These oilfield companies get discounts through the industrial suppliers for buying soooo much at once, plus they have accounts with them so they know they are a steady customer. Generally speaking, these companies will NEVER return a tool for warranty. Once the tool is bought, it is used until is fails, or rusts away, or dropped overboard, or stolen, or lost. Only the repair guys with their own personal Proto tools will actually seek a warranty return if something breaks. On top of that, the industrial suppliers will refuse to honor the warranty if they tool appears to be damaged...which is more times than not due to being hit with a hammer or used with a cheater pipe. It's not just Proto, my local supplier also sells Klein screwdrivers, and will refuse warranty if there are marks on the handle that look like someone has tried turning it with pliers. These big suppliers are used to selling pallets of tools at a time to companies that will send the tools where they are needed and forget about them. That being said, I have bought a fair amount of proto from them for my personal toolbox, but I know if I break something at work, I will have to wait until I have the time to drive to the supplier and swap it out...if they have another one in stock. Wrenches, sockets, and ratchets are well stocked...everything else like pliers and screwdrivers are hit and miss. These suppliers are more ran like a warehouse with 6 or 8 guys answering phones and taking orders, they are making sales and shipping out order after order every day. I suggest trying a small supply house that sells proto, thats where I have my best luck. Those guys tend to deal with you more on a personal level rather than as salesman acting like he is losing money by swapping out a tool.

 

[OutsideMachinist]

I like my proto tools. Quite a bit of the job supplied tools are proto. But the hoops you are jumping through are cause of all the crooks who buy stuff second hand or from cheap online retailers and try to warranty stuff. That is a contributing factor to why craftsman ***** now. Anything I buy from amazon or whatever online retailer like that, I dont expect any warranty. The price you paid for it does matter. If i paid half or less what an authorized distributor charges then I just call it taking my chances. In any case hope it works out for you as I have read you have quite a few proto tools and always sing their praises.

 

[Gmonkee]

All my Proto is 2nd hand or greater and among the best stuff I own.

No need to even think about replacing any of it yet.

 

[Conductor562]

So the issue here is that you had a 3/8'" ratchet that has some wear on the teeth and finish and some rust, that Proto didn't want to replace under warranty?

Sounds like normal wear and tear, neither of which are covered under "defect in material or workmanship". The fact that you got it replaced at all should make you feel special.

 

[espyking83]

So the issue here is that you had a 3/8'" ratchet that has some wear on the teeth and finish and some rust, that Proto didn't want to replace under warranty?

Sounds like normal wear and tear, neither of which are covered under "defect in material or workmanship". The fact that you got it replaced at all should make you feel special.

Uhhhhh, wear on ratcheting mechanisms is under the warranty, and the black oxide was flaking prematurely. My God, some people....

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Not trying to prod any more debate, but how much did you pay for the ratchet? That would decide my action.

EDIT: And how long did you have it?

 

[Ruger_556]

So the issue here is that you had a 3/8'" ratchet that has some wear on the teeth and finish and some rust, that Proto didn't want to replace under warranty?

Sounds like normal wear and tear, neither of which are covered under "defect in material or workmanship". The fact that you got it replaced at all should make you feel special.

I agree with him ^^^

Uhhhhh, wear on ratcheting mechanisms is under the warranty, and the black oxide was flaking prematurely. My God, some people....

I don't think wear is covered and if your black ratchet is rusty maybe you need to wipe it down with oil on occasion. That's like complaining that your impact sockets are rusty...

 

[espyking83]

I agree with him ^^^



I don't think wear is covered and if your black ratchet is rusty maybe you need to wipe it down with oil on occasion.

I clean/lube my tools every Friday, I'll take pics tomorrow. The black oxide flaked off and for some reason it almost immediately rusted. Wish people would quit insinuating that I did **** wrong instead of focusing on the topic at hand.


I got another one in trade recently that had the exact same problem, even without the flaking.

 

[Ruger_556]

Directly from Proto's website...

Warranty and Disclaimer
LIFETIME WARRANTY

Except as specified below, Proto Industrial Tools, a business unit of Stanley Black & Decker, Inc. (“Proto”) warrants any of its Proto® branded products, including products sold by the Proto Industrial Tools that are marketed as products “by Proto,” for the useful life of the product against defects in material or workmanship.

Torque Wrenches, Torque Multipliers and Torque Testers are warranted for one year, except for calibration which is warranted for ninety (90) days from date of purchase. Torque products can be repaired and recalibrated for a nominal charge at the Proto Authorized repair center located at 2195 East View Parkway, Ste 103, Conyers, GA, 30013 or any other such location as may be designated by Proto. Defects in material or workmanship will be repaired or replaced at no cost: all other repairs will be at a nominal charge. Torque products are precise measuring devices that require care in handling. Proto recommends that all torque wrenches be recalibrated once a year or more, depending on usage.

Air tools are warranted for a period of TWO YEARS from the original purchase date. Our obligation to the original purchaser shall be to repairing or replacing, at our expense (not including shipping charges) a defective tool if returned by the original purchaser within two years from the date of purchase, all incoming shipping charges prepaid. THIS WARRANTY DOES NOT COVER DEFECTS OR DAMAGES TO THE TOOL (i) after the warranty period expires; (ii) resulting from misuse or abnormal operation; (iii) resulting from a failure to properly lubricate, maintain or operate the tool; or (iv) resulting from any repair or maintenance services performed by any party other than PROTO at all DeWALT Service Centers or a person authorized by PROTO to provide repair and maintenance services for this tool.

DISCLAIMERS AND LIMITATION

This lifetime warranty:

​Is subject to the disclaimers and limitations described below and is in lieu of all other warranties, express or implied, including the implied warranty of merchantability or fitness for a particular purpose.

Gives you specific legal rights. You may also have other rights that vary by state.

Does not extend to products that have been improperly used, altered, or repaired by any entity other than Proto.

Does not cover the following categories of products: universal sockets, universal joints, thin-wall impact sockets, adapters, and retaining rings.

Does not cover damage due to ordinary wear and tear.

Does not extend to any claim for incidental, consequential, or special damages. Some states do not allow the exclusion of limitation of incidental or consequential damages, so this exclusion may not apply to you.

Proto makes no representations beyond those contained in this Lifetime Warranty.

Employees and agents of Proto have no authority to make representations of any sort beyond those contained in this Lifetime Warranty.



The gear mechanism in your ratchet is not covered. Neither is a black oxide tool rusting. Don't like it then buy a chrome ratchet