Window Dilemma on New Pole Barn

[Dyno Dan]

Finally bit the bullet and getting a 36x60 pole barn built. It’s a pseudo 3 sided machinery shed, but with 2 of the 5 bays enclosed with a partition.

All of the materials were delivered today and things are looking good for the builder to start next week. The building is light stone siding with clay wainscot, roof, and trim. I upgraded the overhead doors and chose to make those clay as well. I then noticed the 3x4 slider windows are white.....aaaahhh!!

I called everywhere and the lead time for anything but white is 2 weeks, so I’d miss my window / schedule for the builder. They’re starting on Monday.

The salesman feels bad...I think...but I think not only did I overlook it, but he did as well. If he is willing to refund the windows, should I and then have the color I want installed later? .... or live with the white? Is it a big deal to add them later? There are 9 total and from what I can tell I paid $250 each.

 

[NUTTSGT]

The windows match the snow.



Seriously, I wouldn't fret over the window color. Look around at just about any house with vinyl windows and they will be white. Next year this time, you'll look back at this thread and chuckle while enjoying that new shop.

 

[alwaysFlOoReD]

I believe there is primer and paint meant for vinyl.

 

[astroracer]

And, if the builder frames for the windows, you can order them in the color you want and in two weeks he'll be about ready for them.

 

[Chris4x4Gill2]

My build was similar colors and I used white windows - but my doors are white as well.

 

[bullnerd]

I'm with astro racer.

Every time I compromise on stuff like this I regret it.

Make it the way you want it.

 

[Dyno Dan]

Thanks for the comments guys! I do want to make it the way I want it, but my back is against the wall at this point. The materials were delivered yesterday and the builder starts on Monday. They intend on finishing up the job on Friday or Saturday. The lead time on a clay colored 3x4 slider windows is 2 weeks, so I'm going to miss the building window.

The contract was signed on July 11th, and then I made 3 change orders:

• Increased the building width to 36'
• upgraded to better overhead doors (better insulation, (3) 24'x12' lite panels, and clay color)
• added 7 more windows (5 across back, and 2 on opposite gable end)

The entry door is white, but that's on inside of the building in the partition wall between the enclosed bays and open bays.

If the builder creates the framing for the windows, and then finishes the building, would it be a big deal to come back in fit the windows I really want (same size but clay color)? Do builders typically frame the building, frame the windows, install the windows, skin the building, cut the sheet metal out for the windows, and then install the windows??

 

[astroracer]

Talk to the builder. If you exchange the windows just make sure he can install them correctly without a lot of tear up. He should be able to frame everything around the white windows, the issue will be getting them trimmed out. He will have to wait for the windows to fit the steel panels and J trim correctly.
Mark

 

[Dyno Dan]

Talked to the builder today, they’re starting Monday morning and will be done Thursday or Friday.

On the windows he said “it’s possible, but probably not advised”. I think I’ll have to run with the white windows....argh.

Also talked to “alpine windows”, the manufacturer, and they said do not paint the vinyl windows....it may warp the frame, etc etc.

 

[like2wheel]

I'm with astro racer.

Every time I compromise on stuff like this I regret it.

Make it the way you want it.

X3

Very similar situation when I built my house 20+ years ago. Contractor got my wife in his side so I lost that battle. Shortly after it was done, my wife realized I was right. We both have regretted it ever since. Windows are now close to needing replacement, wife is looking forward to getting the color we should have had all along.

Of course the builder is going to say what he can to lead you in the direction that's best for him.

 

[Dyno Dan]

My options at this point are to have them install white windows, have them frame for the windows and not install them, or do nothing as it regards to the windows. The latter 2 options will require some negotiation on labor and material refunds.....and I’m not sure how that will end, but I feel I would be on the short end of the deal. Also going this route will require I purchase and install the windows I want.

 

[lakeroadster]

That's going to be an awesome space Dan. Are you by chance Dyno Don's brother?

If they do your building the way my Lester building is made they will frame inside the building for the window after the steel has been hung outside. But they don't cut the steel until after framing.

So the good thing is you could reorder the windows and have a sealed up building until they arrive....

But the bad thing is you would have to cut the steel yourself.

It takes a couple guys to install a window. One guy to kind of pull the steel out and away from the building at the top, while the other guy slides the flanged window into place.

Three guys, even better.

The details below are for a Hayfield Window Unit.... yours may vary.

Rough opening is pretty tight. 1/4" larger than window in width, 3/8" larger in height.

 

[alwaysFlOoReD]

I have a brake. I bend colored aluminum to cap wood windows and doors all the time. I could do the same to vinyl windows if needed. Perhaps you can hire someone to do that for you.

 

[notdavidspade]

I agree with the others as far as doing what you want. If the white is going to bug you every time you look at it, by all means change it out. If your out a grand, in the long term it will be money well spent on getting what you wanted. Then again, if its far enough away from the house, and you aren't going to be staring at the windows all the time, you can focus on staying warm and dry in there with your car. I assume the Galaxie is going in there... can't be that many Dyno Dans in Montana Installing windows isn't rocket science either, so if you have to do it yourself, its not the end of the world. Its only money... but only you can make the call if the juice is worth the squeeze.

 

[red61cj5]

Paint will warp the frame?

 

[Dyno Dan]

Lakeroadster....I’m afraid I don’t have a brother with that handle [emoji4] In talking with the builder he indicated that they frame the building and window openings, install the windows, and then sheet around the windows. At least that’s how I understood it.

The intent for this building started as a machinery shed to get a few tractors and trailers and other stuff out of the weather. I then made the decision to enclose two of the five 12’ foot bays and “spruce up” the building a bit. The existing 30 x 30 shop is in closer proximity to the house and built with similar construction and finishes. All that being said the new building is set 350’ away and the windows probably won’t bug the **** out me in the end. My wife is already tired of me yap’n about it, so it’s a good thing I can vent here [emoji6]

notdavidspade > you got me. Fast Fords seem to The getting replaced by John Deere tractors, snowmobiles, and various power equipment. It is Montana after all. I still do have the Galaxie though.

 

[Dyno Dan]

Paint will warp the frame?

The manufacturer said something about the chemicals used in primer and paint could soften the vinyl and compromise the frame / void the warranty.

 

[Dyno Dan]

Here’s a birds eye view of my property and the yellow box indicates where the new building will be.

Did I mention that I had to bring in 850 yards of 3 inch gravel for this site? Ouch

 

[MikeF2316]

I could easily live with the white windows, especially if they're willing to refund the $250 per. But it sounds like it will bug you too much, you better get the "right" colour.

 

[like2wheel]

I could easily live with the white windows, especially if they're willing to refund the $250 per. But it sounds like it will bug you too much, you better get the "right" colour.

Pretty sure if they refund the $250/ea, he won't have any windows to live with.

Not sure I'd be afraid to paint them. I'd consider painting the front ones. If they were casement windows i'd do it for sure. Manufactures are always nervous about letting someone modify thier product because they cant control how its done & threaten warranty issues.

Worst case something goes wrong & you replace them with the correct color.

 

[lakeroadster]

Smart man.. happy wife, happy life.

Righteous place you got there Dyno Dan... and the Galaxie is awesome.. (needs more tire sidewall, the more the better )

 

[Dyno Dan]

Pretty sure if they refund the $250/ea, he won't have any windows to live with.

Correct.

On a separate note the crew showed up this morning at 7:30am, just as planned. First snafu = salesman called and said the crew noticed the trusses were cut off leaving a 12" overhang instead of the 18" specified in the plans (for 18" overhangs with vented soffit). They said they could have new trusses in a "few days", or extend the truss overhang by "scabbing" a board on to get the extra 6". That just sounded dirty, but nonetheless they did bring it to my attention instead of hiding it. They said that structurally everything would be sound, and since I have soffit and a ceiling liner that cosmetically it would be concealed. Is this an acceptable solution?

lakeroadster - man, those are sweet rides! I agree, I need more sidewall. I was't a big fan of the wheel and tire combo I ended up with, but that's a battle for another day. I'm slowing making my way through your build thread and man oh man, what a sweet shop you have! As I have time I'll continue to read / drool, and try and keep an eye on the progress at my site.

Cheers!

 

[jives]

We had custom color windows as well. But. . .the windows, doors, overhead doors, and trim manufacturers were not all the same. The overhead doors and man doors are the same and match the trim really well, but the windows are a lighter shade of tan. Not only that, but the interior divided light (fake mullions) dividers on the custom tan doors were white! We finally said what the hey and accepted it all. I would not, though, go with the white unless you decided you like it.

Do not accept the short trusses.

 

[rburke65]

Order the Windows you want.....refuse the trusses.....get he trusses you want. Maybe by the time the trusses are in your windows will be here.

 

[Dyno Dan]

New trusses could be 3-5 days to produce + 1 day of transit. Then I have to try and negotiate when the crew would come back. These guys (MQSbarn.com) were about 3-4 months out, so now that’s it my turn I want to get it done.....as right as possible. What a nerve racking experience. Then there’s the weather, this week is going to be nice and then we’ll be back to snow / rain.

Holes are augured down 42”. Looks like they tamped and then dropped some Sakrete in the hole as a footer. From there I’m assuming they set the poles, which have a piece of rebar through the bottom, and the front row of poles get a bit more concrete to capture the rebar (uplift protection?).

 

[NUTTSGT]

I would guess my thoughts would be how they scab on the end. If done right, it probably won't be too hatefully bad.

Time to make lemons out of lemonade, two mistakes on their part, time to make it right with you. Try to work some kind of deal, you accept the windows for what they are and the short overhangs in exchange for enough liner panels for "you" to do the interior ceiling.

 

[Dyno Dan]

Columns are in.....mostly. They left 2 out to leave room for maneuvering with trusses.

 

[larry_g]

Correct.

On a separate note the crew showed up this morning at 7:30am, just as planned. First snafu = salesman called and said the crew noticed the trusses were cut off leaving a 12" overhang instead of the 18" specified in the plans (for 18" overhangs with vented soffit). They said they could have new trusses in a "few days", or extend the truss overhang by "scabbing" a board on to get the extra 6".
Cheers!

I don't know if the metal for the roofing is onsite, or cut yet but it would be worth the effort to check if it is sized for 12" or 18" overhang.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Dyno Dan]

He did that first thing I believe. That’s when he discovered the truss overhang was short.

 

[lakeroadster]

Scabbing On To Trusses To Increase Overhang.

Are you planning to use gutters? If not then the loads on the scabbed boards would be negligible.

Did you get a permit for the building? If so the inspector may get pissy if there aren't revised drawings approved by the engineer.

I would guess my thoughts would be how they scab on the end. If done right, it probably won't be too hatefully bad.

Good point.

How long are the "scab" boards they are contemplating? Tell them you are specifying they be 36" long and the same grade and size of boards as the truss top chord. That will give plenty of room for fasteners spaced away from each other to minimize any splitting and will allow them to nail past the factory splice where the top and bottom chord come together above the wall top plate.

I'd also want them to use ring shank nails... or screws.

They shouldn't be screwing the roofing to the trusses, so there shouldn't be any visually noticeable offset in the roofing screws.

 

[rburke65]

The ceiling liner is a really good idea!

 

[notdavidspade]

I'd make them fetch new trusses here... Last thing you'd want is to climb on the roof for some reason and have the scabbed in section fail. But looks like great progress so far. I'm having a hell of a time getting my project even started. Glad you still got the Gal and I get to see your projects here now. I still have mine too, but it certainly isn't as pretty. Hopefully you'll see it soon in the background on a build thread in the near future. Best of luck! As someone else mentioned, there's no guarantee that the windows will match the rest of the trim. I'd just paint them to match. I wouldn't worry about the warranty on a 250 dollar window. Best case, you have what you want and it outlasts the building. Worse case, you'll have to replace it with what you want later.

 

[Dyno Dan]

Some progress pics from today.

 

[lakeroadster]

Awe inspiring place you have there Dan.

Those fella's are getting after it on the barn.

 

[notdavidspade]

Its going to be hard to get the trusses down from there!
Oh well, I'm sure the on site engineering will be sufficient, hopefully they over engineer it putting on your extensions.

 

[Dyno Dan]

Scabbed extensions look to be 2’ long 2x6’s. From what I can they simply used their nail guns to fasten them. Perhaps I can have a closer look in the morning before they get here.

To answer an earlier question, no I did not have to pull a permit and yes I’d like rain gutters. It’s not part of this deal, but I did ask him today if there would be any issues if I decided to add them. You can imagine what he said....

 

[Dyno Dan]

Today’s progress.

I have a roof (with micro foil liner), soffit, wainscot, entry door, and some other trim.

On a side note (the topic that started it all) we’re going to do clay colored windows!! The builder called me and wanted to discuss the spacing of the windows, and that’s when he said, “I want you to be completely happy so let’s call the office and see if they will give you a refund on these white windows and you can get the windows you want.”.....”We’ll just get the framing done for the windows and then skin the building, but leave the screws out on the panels that we need to pull back in order to install the windows when they come in”. Deal! So I went ahead and ordered some Milgard slider windows in clay color shortly there after!

 

[slow]

Glad the windows worked out!

Ryan

 

[NUTTSGT]

Congrats on the windows and the color is looking great.

 

[ptgarcia]

Damn, you're living my dream!