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Epstein's Tool Gossip : Channellock's New Locking Pliers

dnschmidt

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Here is a little SK news, a guy on a FB SK tool group posted these pictures of a newly acquired wrench.

SK Chinese Wrench.jpgSK Chinese Wrench2.jpg
So, you just had to make the S-K guys suicidal didn't you? If they price these accordingly I see nothing wrong with them. If they price them like S-K has always been priced they will follow the Eagle-Grips into oblivion. Not a big deal since S-K has been there several times before.
 
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sparky 1971

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Here is a little SK news, a guy on a FB SK tool group posted these pictures of a newly acquired wrench.

SK Chinese Wrench.jpgSK Chinese Wrench2.jpg
Old news. SK announced several months ago that wrenches would be made in China. Sockets, ratchets, and cushion grip screwdrivers are staying in the USA for now at least. I don't remember the rest.
 

Fedwrench

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Old news. SK announced several months ago that wrenches would be made in China. Sockets, ratchets, and cushion grip screwdrivers are staying in the USA for now at least. I don't remember the rest.
Perhaps, SK had the PRC made wrenches displayed at their SEMA booth if you asked about them :bounce: An announcement is one thing but, holding the new wrench in your hand, and seeing the packaging brings it all home. X Frames are also staying US Made for the time being. I think ratchets and sockets will be an evolving target.
 

ForrestT

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GJ consensus seems to be Milwaukee, with honourable mention to Bremen as good value, and a grudging admission that Irwin is better than it was but not as good as it used to be.

I have a few Grip-Ons. I haven’t used them hard yet, so I haven’t noted any issues with the teeth. I grew up on Petersens, and tend to like their feel, still reach for them first, but the GripOns do still seem well made, offer a nice range of jaw shapes, and I quite like the epoxy coating.

Hardness doesn’t really matter for clamps. I don’t know where to get these in the US, but I really like the one I have with this jaw shape:D54945B8-41B6-4BBE-9F6E-EF94774EDC76.jpeg

(There was also a thread about 3.peaks - a Japanese made plier. Not many GJ’ers have tried them, but they look interesting)
The last time I was in harbor freight an associate was checking every Bremen locking plier on the shelf. I said man you must like checking each one of those out. He laughed and said corporate just sent a memo. I have to check to make sure that none of ours are stamped Milwaukee. Ours and Milwaukee are made in same Taiwan plant and corporate says we got a shipment of Milwaukee with our tags on them and they all have to be found. With a chuckle, he said I sold a set yesterday that were stamped Milwaukee. The guy that bought them thought they were really cool. Corporate is too late on this one!
 

slowtwitch73

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The Aztec was a massive flop.. where's Pontiac now?

Tools are mundane consumer goods... not luxury clothes or cars.

They entered a flooded market and failed. No amount of sizzle was going to help.
 

sparky 1971

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Perhaps, SK had the PRC made wrenches displayed at their SEMA booth if you asked about them :bounce: An announcement is one thing but, holding the new wrench in your hand, and seeing the packaging brings it all home. X Frames are also staying US Made for the time being. I think ratchets and sockets will be an evolving target.
You're probably right. I've never been a fan of SK wrenches so I couldn't care less about them coming from China.
 

CHI_Tool&Die

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Perhaps, SK had the PRC made wrenches displayed at their SEMA booth if you asked about them :bounce: An announcement is one thing but, holding the new wrench in your hand, and seeing the packaging brings it all home. X Frames are also staying US Made for the time being. I think ratchets and sockets will be an evolving target.
I figured it was only a matter of time until they started circulating around. Grainger and Zoro have had the COO as PRC for some time now. ***** but what can you do. At least the ratchets and stuff are still swinging USA.
 

matthew

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The last time I was in harbor freight an associate was checking every Bremen locking plier on the shelf.
That’s kind of funny.

I find mistakes interesting. The actual error was likely someone using the wrong tailscrew which caused it to be misidentified later on.
 

reader2580

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Old news. SK announced several months ago that wrenches would be made in China. Sockets, ratchets, and cushion grip screwdrivers are staying in the USA for now at least. I don't remember the rest.
I don't know why anyone would buy an SK wrench made in China. It will likely cost more than other Chinese wrenches with less distribution. Also, a big part of the appeal of SK in recent years has been the whole made in the USA thing. No point in trying to find a place that sells SK if it is just another Chinese tool.
 

sparky 1971

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I don't know why anyone would buy an SK wrench made in China. It will likely cost more than other Chinese wrenches with less distribution. Also, a big part of the appeal of SK in recent years has been the whole made in the USA thing. No point in trying to find a place that sells SK if it is just another Chinese tool.
These are just in my basement. I could go to yhe garage and take 20 more pictures, then go to my service truck and take 30 more just like the others. A lot of the guys bitching about SK producing some tools in China are Milwaukees biggest fan boys. Made in the U.S.A. is quickly becoming a thing of the past.
 

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consti2tion

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These are just in my basement. I could go to yhe garage and take 20 more pictures, then go to my service truck and take 30 more just like the others. A lot of the guys bitching about SK producing some tools in China are Milwaukees biggest fan boys. Made in the U.S.A. is quickly becoming a thing of the past.
Doesn't mean we have to agree with it. I don't buy anything made by Apex tool company, because they gutted multiple great US made tool companies. If you're cool with supporting PRC profiting companies, by all means continue to buy Milwaukee tools. My service truck is full of Dewalt and Proto tools, at least SBD makes some of their **** here still.
 

reader2580

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These are just in my basement. I could go to yhe garage and take 20 more pictures, then go to my service truck and take 30 more just like the others. A lot of the guys bitching about SK producing some tools in China are Milwaukees biggest fan boys. Made in the U.S.A. is quickly becoming a thing of the past.
I buy USA made when I can. I am not aware of anyone who was making Lithium-Ion cordless tools in the USA when I first started buying them. I later bought some of the Dewalt assembled in USA cordless tools.

There are still wrenches made in the USA so I will buy wrenches from them if I need new wrenches.
 

ive

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So who without question actually makes the best buyable in production locking pliers and c-clamps?
I am guessing knipex or nws. I haven’t handled either, but going of what I have I’d say the Germans make a great locking plier.
 
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drtyler

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Jan 31, 2012
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I am guessing knipex or nws. I haven’t handled either, but going of what I have I’d say the Germans make a great locking plier.
Most of the German locking pliers (Knipex, Hazet, BollmanGrip, and others) are made by Bollman.

Gedore makes their own at their plant in Austria. They are very good. The Bollman produced pliers are not bad, but they are not worth paying a premium price.
 
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neophyte

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Most of the German locking pliers (Knipex, Hazet, BollmanGrip, and others) are made by Bollman.

Gedore makes their own at their plant in Austria. They are very good. The Bollman produced pliers are not bad, but they are not worth paying a premium price.
Bollman produces a few styles of licking plier that have never been made or rarely available from US manufacturers or brands.
The pivoting lower jaw version for non parallel or parallel surfaces is one style that I wish were more available.
Knipex seems to sell the design now and are available in the US, but it’s not that common outside specialty German tool sellers.

The other style is the actual parallel jaw design, that was patented more than 70 years ago, but which no US tool manufacturer ever seemed to bother offering, even when the patent was long expired.
The style seems to be made in serrated and smooth jaw versions from different german tool brands.

Also, the angle grip pliers.

These have the advantage of not being as easily available on the US market, and offering advantages over regular licking plier designs.
 

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jsackin

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What other juicy grapevine action can you tell us? SK news? AP finally sells us their version of the Snap On JP1? Epstein Day 2023?

Hmm. Have heard 0 from SK. We were one of their largest distributors and reached out multiple times and never got a phone call back. After that press release that made it sound like they were going to leverage the manufacturing ability of Great Star's, I all but gave up, but after seeing that made in china wrench I think we're done. I do know that most of their US socket production has been coming out of Wright Tool. So I'm not sure if the plant in Pennsylvania is actually making anything at this point.

Can you clarify what you mean, and where this equipment is?

The WF equipment in general was liquidated and the property sold and plant torn down. The site has new buildings and is a Amazon distribution center now.


I suspect some of the equipment and tooling was pulled out before the liquidation, and possibly sent to S-K, but I never heard for sure.

It took months to haul away all that equipment, still makes me sad to think about it.
Guess I'm just plain wrong about this. Didn't know any of this info, so that's too bad. Martin was probably looking at starting from scratch manufacturing that knurled piece. Not sure why it's so expensive but this is the second or third time I've heard this from a manufacturer about the adjustable wrench.

What happened to the BollmanGrip German locking pliers HJE used to carry? Only a couple of welding pliers left.

I bought several pairs a number of years ago and they were nicer than anything else at the time and have held up very well. They were a bit limited on styles, though.

I have some GripOns and Tektons, too. Meh, not my favorite. All the others are old USA ViceGrips.
We gave up on Bollman when the EagleGrips came in because we try to buy US when we can. At this point we will probably try the channellocks and see how it goes but we're still thinking about what's the best option.
Here is a little SK news, a guy on a FB SK tool group posted these pictures of a newly acquired wrench.

SK Chinese Wrench.jpgSK Chinese Wrench2.jpg
Yikes. Kind of what I thought, but hurts to see.
I hope Channellock's list prices are imaginary because it they think they're going to sell any at those prices they're dead wrong. Didn't these assholes learn anything from Malco? I guess not.

List prices are ALWAYS imaginary.
 

lwlobo

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Guess I'm just plain wrong about this. Didn't know any of this info, so that's too bad. Martin was probably looking at starting from scratch manufacturing that knurled piece. Not sure why it's so expensive but this is the second or third time I've heard this from a manufacturer about the adjustable wrench.
Bummer, I was hoping you had some inside information on someone buying up a bunch of old WF equipment and tooling or something and having it available.
 

Etchase

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Hmm. Have heard 0 from SK. We were one of their largest distributors and reached out multiple times and never got a phone call back. After that press release that made it sound like they were going to leverage the manufacturing ability of Great Star's, I all but gave up, but after seeing that made in china wrench I think we're done. I do know that most of their US socket production has been coming out of Wright Tool. So I'm not sure if the plant in Pennsylvania is actually making anything at this point.


Guess I'm just plain wrong about this. Didn't know any of this info, so that's too bad. Martin was probably looking at starting from scratch manufacturing that knurled piece. Not sure why it's so expensive but this is the second or third time I've heard this from a manufacturer about the adjustable wrench.


We gave up on Bollman when the EagleGrips came in because we try to buy US when we can. At this point we will probably try the channellocks and see how it goes but we're still thinking about what's the best option.

Yikes. Kind of what I thought, but hurts to see.


List prices are ALWAYS imaginary.



Thanks for the update. We need to recruit a Williamsport resident to tell us if it is just a warehouse SK is operating. Looking at SK’s latest YouTube videos, their equipment was embarrassingly antiquated before they moved, if they even moved the machinery.
 

Bubba Fett

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My guess is that when Western Forge closed down, Ideal moved the tooling to one of their own plants, since a lot of the SK and Ideal tools were identical to what WF was producing. If that's the case, than there's a good bet Hangzhou Great Star now has the tooling and equipment.

I did notice that the new Master Mechanic acetate screwdrivers, which are made in China (by Hangzhou Great Star) now, look a lot like the old Craftsman drivers that were made by Western-Forge. The handles have the same shape, and the tips on the keystone drivers even have similar ridges and forging pattern. Curious.

Edit: I wonder if the handles have that same smell.
 
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Etchase

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3 years ago SK were trying to turn on a 80+ year old extruder to try to make competitive screwdrivers. I assume this came from WF. This channel shows everything they had laying around their facility two three years ago. Doesn’t look competitive.

 

neophyte

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A screwdriver isn’t a complicated item, except maybe nowadays the tip, which users tend to want precisely formed and machined.
There were plenty of screwdrivers made 150 years ago that had a shape just as complicated, or more complicated than what tends to get sold as screwdrivers nowadays, with the exception of the tips on current better screwdrivers, which are likely more precisely formed.
Older
 

neophyte

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Sorry, didn’t finish tha
A screwdriver isn’t a complicated item, except maybe nowadays the tip, which users tend to want precisely formed and machined.
There were plenty of screwdrivers made 150 years ago that had a shape just as complicated, or more complicated than what tends to get sold as screwdrivers nowadays, with the exception of the tips on current better screwdrivers, which are likely more precisely formed.
Older
Sorry, didn’t finish that last post.

Basically, screwdrivers from 100-150+ years ago were made in relatively large quantities, with complex “forgings”, and sold to hardware dealers in bulk boxes of at least a dozen, if not way more.
If the tools could be produced in quantity 100+ years ago, on machinery from 100+ years ago, then that machinery, if still functioning, should be perfectly capable of still producing quality tools if properly restored.
That just leaves the screwdriver tips, which could likely be cold formed, or CNC machined in batches, with a custom jog made to hold the preformed screwdriver shafts.

The newest machinery and techniques don’t always lead to a better (or cheaper to produce) product.
 

dscheidt

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My guess is that when Western Forge closed down, Ideal moved the tooling to one of their own plants, since a lot of the SK and Ideal tools were identical to what WF was producing. If that's the case, than there's a good bet Hangzhou Great Star now has the tooling and equipment.
there was an auction of the equipment ideal didn't move. I looked at the listings, nothing made in the 21st century. It was a lot of screw machines, turret lathes, and stuff like that. Old, but perfectly capable of turning out screw drivers (and probably those little knurled bits on adjustable wrenches) by the thousand if it was still working. Also, big, heavy, expensive to move, and not much use except for turning out screwdrivers by the thousand. I expect most got scrapped, or left in the building for new owners to scrap.
 

Kasal

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These Channellock locking pliers ain't nothin new!

Had these for about 8+ yrs now, bought them used off the Bay along with my no name Facoms

Love me some Grip-ons in any color!


PXL_20230228_172714053.jpgPXL_20230228_172722363.MP.jpgPXL_20230228_172733241.jpgPXL_20230228_172752827.jpg


Yes, that's what I thought, I've had mine since 2018, they came in a set of 3, a Channellock 420, an adjustable wrench (irega) and the Grip_on. Nice set for the price it had.

edit: I have pictures:
Screenshot_20230301_165935_eBay.jpgScreenshot_20230301_165943_eBay.jpg
 
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toolenthusiast

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Channellock is still in business, presumably because they generate enough revenue to pay their bills and be a reasonable use of capital for their owners. I'm sure their management has a lot more knowledge about the success or failure of their products than us end users.
They hated him because he spoke the truth
 

lwlobo

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there was an auction of the equipment ideal didn't move. I looked at the listings, nothing made in the 21st century. It was a lot of screw machines, turret lathes, and stuff like that. Old, but perfectly capable of turning out screw drivers (and probably those little knurled bits on adjustable wrenches) by the thousand if it was still working. Also, big, heavy, expensive to move, and not much use except for turning out screwdrivers by the thousand. I expect most got scrapped, or left in the building for new owners to scrap.
You're right, not much newer equipment. Almost everything sold and was moved out, though. I was surprised how much certain things, like pallet jacks, lots of ladders, cabinets, racking, etc sold for. The wholesalers showed up in force and paid decent money. I bought a drill press and a water heater from the cafeteria. There were riggers on site for months moving out the equipment after it sold at the auction.
 

CHI_Tool&Die

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Hmm. Have heard 0 from SK. We were one of their largest distributors and reached out multiple times and never got a phone call back. After that press release that made it sound like they were going to leverage the manufacturing ability of Great Star's, I all but gave up, but after seeing that made in china wrench I think we're done. I do know that most of their US socket production has been coming out of Wright Tool. So I'm not sure if the plant in Pennsylvania is actually making anything at this point.


We gave up on Bollman when the EagleGrips came in because we try to buy US when we can. At this point we will probably try the channellocks and see how it goes but we're still thinking about what's the best option.
I’m all about trying new things and I have no qualms about ordering some rebranded Channellock locking pliers. Malco can shove it, not because they did what they did but it’s about how they did it.

As far as SK, I really hope something starts coming out. I’m still trying to get a few ratchets to complete my set and it’s ******* me off that everything is in limbo. Obviously someone somewhere is making the LP ratchets because they have been available for a bit and Olsa seems to be sourcing the same stuff. I noticed a few of the industrial suppliers have been stocking some stuff but it is so scattered and random. I’m not expecting a detailed report, but it’s irking me that SK and SBD have been hiding what the hell is happening with their plants. Hell, a simple statement explaining their intentions would even suffice for now. It’s crazy that we literally live in an age of information at our fingertips and no one knows anything. 🤪
 

Jbullfrog

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These Channellock locking pliers ain't nothin new!

Had these for about 8+ yrs now, bought them used off the Bay along with my no name Facoms

Love me some Grip-ons in any color!


PXL_20230228_172714053.jpgPXL_20230228_172722363.MP.jpgPXL_20230228_172733241.jpgPXL_20230228_172752827.jpg
Tell us more about the slip joint adjustable locking pliers. I didn't know I needed them, until now!
 
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