MarcSeattle
Well-known member
I know what you mean. I use Permatex Assemby Lube (the red stuff) which seems to be thin enough but still clings. Everyone has an experience though, so somewhere some engineer must have tested the choices.
You sure that wasn't some sort of super lube for women?I used super lube, and found it always turns to a sticky mess in a short time.
It’s weird. Like my Williams are lubricated all over the entire head. But my Proto instructions show that grease is only supposed to go on the pawl and not the teeth so I’m kinda confused as to the point of lubrication. My 1/2” sounds so dry I wanted to take it apart and work on it some.I think I've sat in every seat on this bus and I'm right back where I started. If I disassemble, it gets fresh 3 in 1. Other than that, I just use them. A ratchet isn't going to generate much heat.
I've often wondered how much lubrication actually influences backdrag. I'm certain individual designs will vary from one to the other but individually, I suspect there is less than we might think. I read a thread in here when I first started coming here about it and there were good points made but no solid, measured comparisons. I sometimes think the cushion of the lubricant reducing vibration causes us to think it's lighter just because it's smoother. I'm guessing, though.
Dual 80’s do fine with SuperLube, as do dual pawl Wrights and Pittsburgh Pros.When I take crusty ratchets apart, I put them back together with red grease. I don't know the spec. It's been in my shop for many years. Then I spin the ratchet well and put it in a vise and give it hell. If it slips, take it down and switch to oil. There doesn't seem to be any correlation between type of ratchet and type of lube to make it work. If it works with grease, I consider that to be a good thing as the grease will last longer in use. The only exception is high tooth count lever types as I don't expect them to do well with grease. But then, I've only done a couple of those and that was just because they were new.
Can't you read old timer? Things are getting rough here.LOL no it was a conversion kit. Can't you read old timer? I converted my 1/4" to a 3/8". Things sweet!
I'll throw in my 2 cents and advise use of Lubriplate SFL-0 since a ratchet is a pawl against gear application.
Lubriplate is an old company who know what they are doing and make high quality products for industry. The grease you are recommending is a modern full synthetic similar to Superlube, but less viscous. It contains an anti-microbial, presumably for food service equipment. SFL and Superlube are both food safe. The addition of PTFE found in Superlube would probably make it the better choice for a weapon slide or a ratchet.Lubriplate SFL-0 is also food grade and non-toxic so it is safer to use and be around!
AEAdam, you may be correct. PTFE could be a worthwhile addition to the formulation of the lubricant used. Presently I have lots of the Lubriplate SFL-0 on hand so I certainly want to exploit its use.Lubriplate is an old company who know what they are doing and make high quality products for industry. The grease you are recommending is a modern full synthetic similar to Superlube, but less viscous. It contains an anti-microbial, presumably for food service equipment. SFL and Superlube are both food safe. The addition of PTFE found in Superlube would probably make it the better choice for a weapon slide or a ratchet.
Lubriplate and SuperLube make synthetic greases in a range of viscosities. SFL-0 is a O grade (less viscous) grease than Superlube NLGI 2.
For this conversation, more than brands or even viscosities chosen, the key is differentiating between corrosion prevention needed on the gear and pawl teeth and the lubrication required on the sliding (non-toothed) surfaces. You really don’t want to pack a ratchet head full of any grease.
The US Army is switching to a dry solid film lube (DSL) for small arms instead of running wet. Even in the absence of sand, the dry film outperformed the CLP they had previously used.AEAdam, you may be correct. PTFE could be a worthwhile addition to the formulation of the lubricant used. Presently I have lots of the Lubriplate SFL-0 on hand so I certainly want to exploit its use.
While, as they say, YMMV, I have found the Lubriplate working splendidly on my ratchets, mostly round head type, which include:
Even my old Proto pear head torque wrench with dog pawls and a couple of older Craftsman pear head ratchets seem quite happy running this lubricant system. No hiccups in ratcheting action and no shifting into neutral. Nothing but smoothness and reliability.
- Classic single rocking pawl SK units
- Facom era sliding pawl SK units (SK "Tuff 1")
- Allen tri-prop sliding pawl units
- Craftsman tri-prop sliding pawl units
- Proto (current design and production) sliding pawl units
And, yes, I concur that you do not want to pack the ratchet mechanism with grease. It is not an automotive wheel bearing. As the Lubriplate motto says "It's the film".
Update #2. I don’t think these ratchets like super lube. The first go was smooth but then upon using it more the ratchet slips into neutral when trying to change directions. Basically the whole anvil will turn with the dial. So I tried tightening and loosening the torx screw with zero success. Took it all apart and cleaned it out. Tried reassembly dry and the ratchet isn’t slipping into neutral anymore but it’s binding. Took it apart a third time and just dropped some oil in and now I cannot reassemble it. I don’t know if the heart spring is bent or what but it’s being a real nightmare. I’m walking away and going to work on it tomorrow.
I took a break from the ratchet today. I'm the kind of guy that will get obsessive over something like this and I don't want it to take over my holiday weekend. I'll be back at it tomorrow. When you put together your ratchets, are you holding the drive in a vise? I'm curious if that is what is causing my problem with the heart spring. I'm not sure if the heart spring is seated properly because I can change direction, but every so often the whole drive will spin as if the drive is completely disconnected.CHI_Tool&Die, take heart! I own many of the Facom design sliding pawl type of round head ratchets, including several Proto round head units such as yours. As such I have disassembled and reassembled all of them, cleaning and lubricating as necessary. All of them work reliably and I have full confidence in reaching for any of them to do the job.
While I obviously don't know all the details of your ratchet challenge I can relate my experiences, which may be helpful to you. Very recently I acquired a Proto J4757F 1/4" drive flex handle unit. It was not as smooth as my existing Proto (and other) sliding pawl ratchets, and did slip into neutral. So, in brief, I proceeded as follows:
Every time I have encountered a ratchet malfunction (so far, always caused by dry or sticky or gummy or gooey lubricant) I have emerged victorious. My ratchets, as they should, bring joy to me, not grief.
- I disassembled the ratchet head mechanism, putting the parts in a magnet bowl to prevent the untimely exodus of one of the parts (can you say "heart spring"?).
- I used my trusty Remington Shotgun Cleaner to remove any existing lubricant, the villain in this particular tale.
- After the parts were clean and dry I applied a film of Lubriplate SFL-0 to the annular head gear teeth, and to the pawl and anvil assembly surfaces upon which the pawl moves back and forth.
- Upon having the aforementioned parts in normal position back in the ratchet head I applied a drop of Blue Loctite to the Torx fastener so that it was ready to be used.
- The heart spring legs are inserted into the top pawl hole and then the selector switch cover is put into place. Slide into place making sure the pin on the cover catches the bottom or point of the heart spring as the cover slides into its place.
- While holding the assembly in place in the ratchet head thread the Torx fastener back into its appointed hole and tighten until it bottoms. Then back the fastener off a nominal 1/4 turn.
- Check your ratchet for correct function including, of course, the switching action.
Hope this is helpful, and wishing to you much success in your current tool challenge!
Pure comedy , sir!O-O-O-Kay...
60 posts about what to lube your tool with, and getting lube on your teeth.
There's some real comedy potential in this thread.
CHI_Tool&Die,I took a break from the ratchet today. I'm the kind of guy that will get obsessive over something like this and I don't want it to take over my holiday weekend. I'll be back at it tomorrow. When you put together your ratchets, are you holding the drive in a vise? I'm curious if that is what is causing my problem with the heart spring. I'm not sure if the heart spring is seated properly because I can change direction, but every so often the whole drive will spin as if the drive is completely disconnected.
Thank you! I greased the ratchet again and put it together. It’s annoying trying to line the pin up with the spring but I think I got it this time. Every so often the entire mechanism will spin if I try to change the direction but I noticed my flex 1/2” does the same and I haven’t messed with that one. So I am going to leave it and see how it goes. I really do love these palm control ratchets. I know I said Snap-on are really nice in another thread but then I go out and use the Protos and fall in love again. I think I’m a Proto round head kinda dude at heart.CHI_Tool&Die,
No, I do not use a vise nor would I recommend one. Your fingers and thumb should be able to hold the assembly together with enough firmness to achieve reassembly and reach the objective of a fine working ratchet!
My guess is that the pin on the underside of the switch cover is not properly engaged with the heart spring. This may come from assembling by more-or-less vertically lowering the switch cover onto the waiting assembly.
The heart spring is called such since it resembles an iconic heart shape (of course) and the switch cover pin needs to catch onto the bottom of the heart shape, opposite from the top lobe shapes and the two spring "legs" that fit into the pawl's top hole. This, of course, as the heart spring lies on top of the rotating assembly, with the fastener hole centered to the spring, waiting for you to attach the switch cover.
With regard to putting on the switch cover this analogy may be helpful. An aircraft landing on an aircraft carrier deck comes in at an angle, and after making contact needs to have its tailhook catch a cable. Similarly you need to slide the cover into place, catching the bottom point of the heart spring with the pin, and then continuing to move the cover into place. The heart spring is now tensioned by having its bottom point stretched by the pin. Hold the assembly firmly together while you insert and tighten the Torx fastener. Again, factory standard is to bottom the screw and then back off a quarter turn (with something like Blue Loctite used to keep your screw adjustment from changing or the fastener from backing out over time).
Hoping this answers your question(s). I'm sure that you are more than capable of getting your ratchet to perform properly and, having had success, will not view future disassembly and reassembly as too daunting of a proposition.
Please let us know how you fare. Here's to a happy, content, and satisfied tool user!
Yeah the heart spring is the thing holding the entire pawl onto the drive/anvil and the cap has a peg which goes into the v of the heart spring and that creates the tension to change direction. I was having issues with alignment and direction changing probably because the torque on the screw is what applies all the holding force. It’s not my favorite mechanism but when it works it’s so smooth.The only ratchet that I ever had an issue with SuperLube was a Proto.
If I ever open up another Proto, I may just use Ultra Slick 81950.
I put a socket on it and clicked it through all the teeth a bunch of times and it worked better and better.
Is the heart spring the spring that goes into the selector switch?
Out of all the ratchet designs I have… I like the mechanism of these the least.
It’s for sealed systems with sumps. Excellent light oil, but too light for an unsealed ratchet and really wrong for the application. You really want something that will stay put and has thickness for the sliding surfaces.If you are going to use an oil instead of a grease there is nothing in the lubrication world that has had more science put into it than ATF. When you consider what it all has to do to accomplish its intended purpose the chemistry involved is impressive. I like corn head grease for many purposes but if it's oil that I need I'm using ATF.
The science is on making it work in the particular kind of transmission it's put in though, not into making a magic oil. (And a quick look at the range of ATF offered by a single maker will tell you there's lots of application specific lubrication going on.) It's very nice light oil, and the endurance under extreme conditions is impressive. but that doesn't make it the right oil for anything else. That's not tot say it's not suitable for a lot of general low demand oil uses. But in a ratchet, it's going to leak out and make a mess in the drawer. Something a little thicker or stickier works better, but it's really hard to screw up lubing a ratchet. Too much grease is about the only way to do it.If you are going to use an oil instead of a grease there is nothing in the lubrication world that has had more science put into it than ATF. When you consider what it all has to do to accomplish its intended purpose the chemistry involved is impressive. I like corn head grease for many purposes but if it's oil that I need I'm using ATF.
Must be great for everything then! I'll be sure to throw that in my engine, use on my door hinges, spread on my cookie sheet, use in the bedroom, etc....there is nothing in the lubrication world that has had more science put into it than ATF.
You could use canola oil and it would "work fine". Sure, ATF can work, it's just not the space age wonder-lubricant you were making it out to be. Also has a few downsides compared to other options but nobody is telling you what to use.I've used ATF for decades and it works fine.
I have yet to see a sealed round head ratchetI have several sealed head ratchets that I simply dunk in ATF...
I have several sealed head ratchets that I simply dunk in ATF
What is considered a sealed ratchet? If it's sealed, shouldn't dunking in oil not do very much?I have yet to see a sealed round head ratchet![]()
I have seen some of the Facom models or Snap-on dual 80s advertised as such.What is considered a sealed ratchet?
My thoughts exactly. And if oil could get in, it can certainly get out too. And does this mean that the user isn't disassembling the mechanism to clean? Too many questions if you think about that statement for more than a second.If it's sealed, shouldn't dunking in oil not do very much?