Question on converting/adaptor a 240v plug for 110v for 4 post lift

[aziroc]

I'll try to keep this as short as possible (probably won't happen).

In my RV garage, all the regular 3 prong outlets are 110v/15a except there is one 240v/50a 4 prong outlet. I have an Atlas 9koh 2 post lift (240v motor) that I use decently often and this 2 post lift usually stays plugged into the 240v outlet.

I recently also got an Atlas Pro8000ext 4 post lift. This came pre-wired from the motor with a regular 3 prong outlet plug and about 10 feet of cord. Issue i am now running into is "technically" the motor wants a 110v/30 amp outlet. ** It's really a 20.8 amp draw and when i called Atlas they also said max it will draw is 22 amps if ran for over 5 mins. total time to lift all the way up/down is between 1.5-2 mins. The 4 post im using more to help create some space and "worse case" id use the 4 post literally 1 time a month.

My queation is, could I use 1 of those adaptors for RV and houses that's a nema 14-50p (4 prong) that goes into a 20 amp (really 24 amp) receptacle. *here is a link from amazon

Here

 

[The Cobbler]

similar stories have been discussed on here over the years . they usually start with," those cords are not code compliant , or not certified, are potentially dangerous or such.

 

[mm08822]

A motor drawing 20.8a on a 20a circuit is within the unpredictable trip region of the circuit breaker but more likely to trip.

Is there a motor nameplate you can post a pic of? If yes, is there a 230volt connection option?

Your adapter has cb's in it. Not sure how they will like 20.8 amps never mind the inrush current. (At least it has cb's in it. So maybe it is genuinely ul or nrtl certified/listed. )

 

[aziroc]

Here is pictures of the plates on the motor.

No way to convert to a 240v motor/wiring.

The outlet/connector for the above adaptor is technically a 24 amp breaker even though it states its a 20. But will the motor need the 30 amp on initial start up (maybe???).

The lift company said they install alot of these models and majority of owners have the normal 110/15a outlets and the lifts work fine. When he plugged my lift into a normal outlet, there was maybe 1 sec where when the motor was on you could tell it was wanting alittle more power (made 3 real quick "clang" sounds) but then started up and ran normally and no breaker popped. I havent ran the lift since, mainly cause I know that was probably not the best noise for the motor to make plus I wasn't 100% on the idea of running 20 amps through a 15 amp breaker

 

[aziroc]

similar stories have been discussed on here over the years . they usually start with," those cords are not code compliant , or not certified, are potentially dangerous or such.

I would normally agree with those statements. If I was running the 4 post as much as I use my 2 post, this would really be a none discussion and I'd just put the 30amp outlet in. But the fact that I'd maybe raise/lower the 4 post once a month, its a 10 gauge cord connecting the lift to the above mentioned adaptor and it's all "outside" vs inside a wall, is where im wondering if doing this is type of setup is fine vs going through having someone install a 115/30a dedicated outlet in a spot that I'd never need an outlet for.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I'll try to keep this as short as possible (probably won't happen).

In my RV garage, all the regular 3 prong outlets are 110v/15a except there is one 240v/50a 4 prong outlet. I have an Atlas 9koh 2 post lift (240v motor) that I use decently often and this 2 post lift usually stays plugged into the 240v outlet.

I recently also got an Atlas Pro8000ext 4 post lift. This came pre-wired from the motor with a regular 3 prong outlet plug and about 10 feet of cord. Issue i am now running into is "technically" the motor wants a 110v/30 amp outlet. ** It's really a 20.8 amp draw and when i called Atlas they also said max it will draw is 22 amps if ran for over 5 mins. total time to lift all the way up/down is between 1.5-2 mins. The 4 post im using more to help create some space and "worse case" id use the 4 post literally 1 time a month.

My queation is, could I use 1 of those adaptors for RV and houses that's a nema 14-50p (4 prong) that goes into a 20 amp (really 24 amp) receptacle. *here is a link from amazon

Here

so you want to plug a 120v 30a load into a 240v 50a 4 prong receptacle? Do you know for certain the receptacle has a neutral connected to it? does the motor have integral overload protection?

technically, what you want to do is not code permissible since the manufacturer calls for 120v 30a circuit.

also that adapter you linked to wont work since its a 20a receptacle not rated for a higher draw load especially a motor with inrush starting current

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Here is pictures of the plates on the motor.

No way to convert to a 240v motor/wiring.

cheap chinese ****

The outlet/connector for the above adaptor is technically a 24 amp breaker even though it states its a 20. But will the motor need the 30 amp on initial start up (maybe???).

In-rush current on a motor is anywhere from 4x-8x FLA listed on motor nameplate. so it would be way more than 24a... and the trip curve of the breaker in that adapter may not be high enough to allow the inrush current. i highly doubt they designed that adapter for motor loads with in-rush current. surely not a motor that draws more than the receptacle is rated for.

I would just bite the bullet and put in the correct recetacle

The lift company said they install alot of these models and majority of owners have the normal 110/15a outlets and the lifts work fine. When he plugged my lift into a normal outlet, there was maybe 1 sec where when the motor was on you could tell it was wanting alittle more power (made 3 real quick "clang" sounds) but then started up and ran normally and no breaker popped. I havent ran the lift since, mainly cause I know that was probably not the best noise for the motor to make plus I wasn't 100% on the idea of running 20 amps through a 15 amp breaker

good way to fry the motor prematurely...

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I would normally agree with those statements. If I was running the 4 post as much as I use my 2 post, this would really be a none discussion and I'd just put the 30amp outlet in. But the fact that I'd maybe raise/lower the 4 post once a month, its a 10 gauge cord connecting the lift to the above mentioned adaptor and it's all "outside" vs inside a wall, is where im wondering if doing this is type of setup is fine vs going through having someone install a 115/30a dedicated outlet in a spot that I'd never need an outlet for.

starving a motor with a an insufficiently sized circuit is a good way to end its life prematurely.... those windings getting too hot will burn it out eventually

does this motor even have integral thermal overload protection? it isnt listed on the nameplate

what does the manual say? if no integral overload, then the motor is relying on the properly sized breaker for OL protection

 

[theoldwizard1]

I recently also got an Atlas Pro8000ext 4 post lift. This came pre-wired from the motor with a regular 3 prong plug (NEMA 5-15P) and about 10 feet of cord. Issue i am now running into is "technically" the motor wants a 110v/30 amp outlet.

NO ! Technically it wants a a 120V- 15A circuit !

** It's really a 20.8 amp draw and when i called Atlas they also said max it will draw is 22 amps if ran for over 5 mins. total time to lift all the way up/down is between 1.5-2 mins. The 4 post im using more to help create some space and "worse case" id use the 4 post literally 1 time a month.

My queation is, could I use 1 of those adaptors for RV and houses that's a NEMA 14-50P (4 prong) that goes into a NEMA 5-20R. Here is a link from Amazon

Will it work. YES ! Is it "code compliant" ? Probably not.

You can overload/burn out the motor because that adapter comes with a 20A breaker !

 

[theoldwizard1]

... when i called Atlas they also said max it will draw is 22 amps if ran for over 5 mins.

That is a really STUPID statement ! If that was true and the NEMA 5-15P that it came with was connected to a 15A breaker, that breaker would trip before 5 minutes !

 

[Dumber than lumber]

Homeowner location? Or a commercial property?
Your insurance company could be a major source of grief if you have a fire or worse.
Get a licensed professional out there. Heck! You own an RV! I figure you might be able to afford whatever the cost is to keep yourself and your things safe.

 

[mm08822]

Why are these lifts such a PIA??!!! Put an amprobe on it and see what it draws once moving. Nothing says it's at full load.

It should really be on a 30A circuit with that rating.......2500w/120v = 20.8A w/o power factor considerations.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

NO ! Technically it wants a a 120V- 15A circuit !

since when can you put a 20+ amp load on a 15a circuit? never

 

[wyliesdiesels]

that breaker would trip before 5 minutes !

not always. totally depends on the breaker's trip curve profile

 

[theoldwizard1]

since when can you put a 20+ amp load on a 15a circuit? never

So why did the manufacture put a "regular 3 prong plug" (NEMA 5-15P) on it ?????

 

[wyliesdiesels]

So why did the manufacture put a "regular 3 prong plug" (NEMA 5-15P) on it ?????

i mustve missed where the OP stated the plug was a NEMA 5-15p. regular means nothing. there are nema 5-15 5-20 and even 5-30 plugs

but if it does indeed have a 5-15p on the cord, then chalk it up to poor chinese manufacturing.

 

[theoldwizard1]

i mustve missed where the OP stated the plug was a NEMA 5-15p. regular means nothing. there are nema 5-15 5-20 and even 5-30 plugs

To an NEC "code lawyer", you are correct !

In my lifetime, I have only seen ONE 5-20P. I have NEVER seen a 5-30P or 5-30R !

 

[wyliesdiesels]

In my lifetime, I have only seen ONE 5-20P. I have NEVER seen a 5-30P or 5-30R !

I have seen 5-20p on frozen food vending machines, countertop ovens, microwaves (very old), PDUs, and UPSs

I have seen 5-30p on UPSs and PDUs

 

[aziroc]

so you want to plug a 120v 30a load into a 240v 50a 4 prong receptacle? Do you know for certain the receptacle has a neutral connected to it? does the motor have integral overload protection?

technically, what you want to do is not code permissible since the manufacturer calls for 120v 30a circuit.

also that adapter you linked to wont work since its a 20a receptacle not rated for a higher draw load especially a motor with inrush starting current

The 240v does have a neutral connection.

 

[whateg01]

The lift company said they install alot of these models and majority of owners have the normal 110/15a outlets and the lifts work fine.

Those 120/15 receptacle are probably on 20A circuits.

I havent ran the lift since, mainly cause I know that was probably not the best noise for the motor to make plus I wasn't 100% on the idea of running 20 amps through a 15 amp breaker

So you know it's a 15A breaker? Or you're assuming that since they are 15A receptacles?

 

[whateg01]

When he plugged my lift into a normal outlet ... amps through a 15 amp breaker

i mustve missed where the OP stated the plug was a NEMA 5-15p. regular means nothing. there are nema 5-15 5-20 and even 5-30 plugs

but if it does indeed have a 5-15p on the cord, then chalk it up to poor chinese manufacturing.

I think that's what he meant by regular outlet

 

[mikedodge]

To an NEC "code lawyer", you are correct !

In my lifetime, I have only seen ONE 5-20P. I have NEVER seen a 5-30P or 5-30R !

I have seen 5-20p on frozen food vending machines, countertop ovens, microwaves (very old), PDUs, and UPSs

I have seen 5-30p on UPSs and PDUs

I see 5-20P all the time, both for commercial kitchen equipment, where 5-30P also shows up, but it's also the most common type of plug for a lot of photocopiers and other bigger office equipment.

For the lift, I would probably be inclined to use an adapter for it if you can't add a new proper size plug for it. It ***** that they didn't give the option of wiring it 240V and pretty sketchy if it really did come with a 5-15P when the motor is more then that. That might be more Atlas that did it then the Chinese power unit manufacturer.

 

[u3b3rg33k]

a friendly reminder - motor dataplates list RATED power/current. if your LOAD doesn't require it, it won't pull it.
lift with a car on it uses more amps than a lift without a car on it.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Those 120/15 receptacle are probably on 20A circuits.

So you know it's a 15A breaker? Or you're assuming that since they are 15A receptacles?

It is both LOGICAL and REASONABLE to ASSUME that a TYPICAL 15A receptacle is on a 15A circuit !

 

[matt_i]

Note the motor can only handle 5 mins of use at FLA per nameplate. This is a cheaped-down motor hiding in plain sight.

I have replaced one on a lift which couldn't handle the constant start/stop jogging and subsequently burned out, in the lightest duty lift application ever seen (probably 500# was being lifted a couple times per year).

I would spend the time to come up with a better 240vac motor and then you will have solved this problem and your electrical problem for a long time.

 

[Cruzan80]

It is both LOGICAL and REASONABLE to ASSUME that a TYPICAL 15A receptacle is on a 15A circuit !

Not really in this case. 15A receptacles are rated for 20A passthru, so the fact that you have only seen one 5-20 in your life means that you could have installed 5-15R on all of your 20A circuits, simply for being able to run multiple things at once. One item for builders to buy/stock, that works on both kinds of circuits in the house.

 

[whateg01]

It is both LOGICAL and REASONABLE to ASSUME that a TYPICAL 15A receptacle is on a 15A circuit !

No. No it's not. It's possible, but I wouldn't assume that.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

It is both LOGICAL and REASONABLE to ASSUME that a TYPICAL 15A receptacle is on a 15A circuit !

Not always

Kitchen SABCs are required to be 2x 20a circuits and you can use 15a receptacles on them

Also Most 15a receptacles are rated for 20a pass thru so…

 

[KenC]

It is both LOGICAL and REASONABLE to ASSUME that a TYPICAL 15A receptacle is on a 15A circuit !

Not in my world! Every building I've owned or rented since the '60s had panels filled with 20a breakers, 12ga wire and almost all the recpts were 15a. 20a recpts were for HD dishwashers, small ovens, my MIG welder and a few woodworking machines.

15a recpts are rated for 20a pass through.

 

[mikedodge]

Not in my world! Every building I've owned or rented since the '60s had panels filled with 20a breakers, 12ga wire and almost all the recpts were 15a. 20a recpts were for HD dishwashers, small ovens, my MIG welder and a few woodworking machines.

15a recpts are rated for 20a pass through.

Must be a regional thing. Here, both residential and commercial it's pretty much always 15A breakers unless there's a reason for them to be bigger.

 

[Ztim]

I have the exact same Atlas 4 post lift plugged into a 110volt 20 amp circuit with a 20 amp gfci outlet. It has never been a problem.

 

[dscheidt]

Not always

Kitchen SABCs are required to be 2x 20a circuits and you can use 15a receptacles on them

Also Most 15a receptacles are rated for 20a pass thru so…

Not out pass through. They’re rated 15a on each plug, so a duplex 15a receptacle can have 20 a load on it