Why are Craftsman tools being crticized so much?

[matt1977]

I think it's too easy to play the race card in this situation. In all fairness alot of questionable stuff has come out of china recently. tainted baby formula, poison dog food, lead in childrens toys. It's stuff like this that make people weary about Chinese goods, not the fact that they just don't like Chinese people.

 

[shoturtle]

Think china makes alot of low end product, but they make their shear of good products as well. Most HDTV are made in china, Apple are all chinese sourced, Samsung and HTC produce there as well. I take things for what they are. There are good quality chinese craftsman tools. The Universal stuff are very good spline tools for cheap. Their max axxes passthrough are really nice as well. The chinese wrenches while ugly are not tin foil.

Gearwrench vortex pass through are good quality.

And it seems a ton of member on her jump on gearwrench or craftsman ratcheting wrench stuff when they go on sale. So they are not total **** which allot on hear would want you to believe.

And everyone here seems to love the chinese made HF tool charts.

quantified what is tool is good and what tool is ****.

I limit my made in the PRC purchased. When there is a US, EU or Taiwan made option that is good I go with them before PRC.

That said, my HDTV is made in Japan, my mac made in china. Most my tools are US and EU, with some taiwan and china dashed in there.

 

[Conductor562]

Seriously people? Now we've come to the conclusion that choosing American made tools makes one a racist? How rediculious! People aren't choosing American tools because they have a hatred for Chinese people, they may have a hatred for quality of the products, they may hate the fact that American companies have exploited the Chinese people for profit, and they may even hate the fact that China has such reckless disregard for product safety, patent rights, and ethical treatment of employees, and all those critisisums are well deserved, but it is in no way shape or form a generalized hatred for the Chinese as a people. Racism continues to exist in today's society partly because the minorities never miss an opportunity to throw the race card on the table when it suits their needs. Choosing to support your country by choosing products manufactured within its borders is a natural form of self preservation and pride and it is not an attack on foreign nations or an act of racism. This is the most ridiculous thing I've seen on GJ.

 

[-Brent-]

Fellas, you've got to look at it the way a business person does. Take for example McDonalds. Their business is real estate, not burgers. If you tasted one of their burgers, you'd realize that. HOWEVER, McDs knows that it's ALL about a great location to get you to utilize them, hence the real estate.

 

[vintagefan]

Seriously people? Now we've come to the conclusion that choosing American made tools makes one a racist? How rediculious! People aren't choosing American tools because they have a hatred for Chinese people, they may have a hatred for quality of the products, they may hate the fact that American companies have exploited the Chinese people for profit, and they may even hate the fact that China has such reckless disregard for product safety, patent rights, and ethical treatment of employees, and all those critisisums are well deserved, but it is in no way shape or form a generalized hatred for the Chinese as a people. Racism continues to exist in today's society partly because the minorities never miss an opportunity to throw the race card on the table when it suits their needs. Choosing to support your country by choosing products manufactured within its borders is a natural form of self preservation and pride and it is not an attack on foreign nations or an act of racism. This is the most ridiculous thing I've seen on GJ.

x1000

I choose to buy American because I like to support my family, friends, and neighbors. That is all. I also tend to like the quality of the tools, and the style as well.

I'm sick and tired of people deciding to just tack on whatever negative attribute they please to any group that they don't agree with. It's petty, and sad.

 

[dsmnickk90]

Not with their prices on tools. In the real world market that sears compete in. The Armstrong and SK are way to expensive.

A little late on the response here but Armstrong and SK arn't much more expensive then Craftsman if you shop around. Their wrenches are both priced about what the Cman Pros were. If you look at the price on a Craftsman socket then look at the price of a Armstrong they are within a few bucks of each other.

The way you save money with Craftsman is in their large sets. If Armstrong or SK got into a retail store and started moving more tools they could out together those large sets at a discounted price as well.

 

[shoturtle]

Craftsman pros never sold well. RP are what the customer of sears go buy. The pro line was never a money maker. And a set of RP compare to Armstrong or SK, the Armstrong or SK were 5 x as much.

SK 15pc set sells for 150, cman pro 13pc sold on sale for 89 dollars. And they could not sell them off till they drop them to 70 bucks on clearance.

 

[byoungblood]

A little late on the response here but Armstrong and SK arn't much more expensive then Craftsman if you shop around. Their wrenches are both priced about what the Cman Pros were. If you look at the price on a Craftsman socket then look at the price of a Armstrong they are within a few bucks of each other.

The way you save money with Craftsman is in their large sets. If Armstrong or SK got into a retail store and started moving more tools they could out together those large sets at a discounted price as well.

I actually bought a fair number of loose S-K sockets when one of the load auto parts chains still carried them in store, and their prices were fairly competitive with Craftsman from what I recall. S-K cut out their lesser expensive satin finish wrenches a while ago, so they really haven't had anything to compare to the RP wrench, but their set prices are even today not that much higher than the non-sale prices on Craftsman. So unless you are using HF has your pricing metric, good US brands aren't expensive for something you will likely buy ONCE in your lifetime.

What makes those brands more expensive many times is a lack of widespread retail distribution, which of course allows the retailers that do carry them to charge a higher price due to a lack of competition. When those brands lost most of their large retail distribution through auto parts stores, hardware stores, etc., when they went with in house imported brands, their prices went up.

 

[coolreed]

I have been very satisfied with Craftsman Hand Tools. Most of my wrenches and socket sets are Craftsman. However, I tend to stay away from Craftsman Power Tools. I do have some Craftsman Power Tools but I will not purchase them any longer.

Sears has started marketing some very cheap Chinese hand tools the last few years but these are not Craftsman Brand (at least up until now?).

I do not see any advantage of having a Snap On combination wrench over a Craftsman combination wrench. In fact I would take the Craftsman and put the extra money back in my pocket on the wrenches.

In certain applications I purposely purchase cheap hand tools at HF type stores if I am concerned about losing them, abuse, loaning or one time use.

 

[vartz04]

Everything craftsman branded that is not.a hand tool is complete garbage. Air tools power tools ect. Same with tool boxes. I still like the hand tools I have (us made that were all purchased in the last 10 years. Aside from filling out the SAE side of my combo wrenches I can't say ill buy anymore craftsman tools. Not because of China's name on them but just because of the lack of quality of everything craftsman makes that isn't a hand tool has been garbage in my experience.

Even the bar stools I bought were ****. One isn't level and I have to grind down the legs to make them even. How do you f up a stool.

It's just sad when I was a kid I wanted all craftsman tools like my dad and grandpa had cause they never broke and if they did we got to go to sears to get a new one and look at all of the other tools.

 

[bczygan]

To me, what is most upsetting, is a change in the status quo. For most of my life, Sears was something you could count on. You knew what you were getting. You knew you would always get that same thing.
Now you don't know what tomorrow holds. The value of the warranty depends on getting equal replacement value. Will the China made tools be equal? And value is more than just mechanical quality. There is value in brand name and in COO. There is a cachet in "USA". So simply removing that reduces value because perception really IS reality.
And it is not just Sears. The whole bedrock of manufacturing is shifting. And those of us who counted on things "the way they were", will never be completely happy again.

 

[shoturtle]

craftsman never had that so call preception of high end. Even before COO was an issue. Their tools were aways talked down about, and consider second grade to the other brands. It was made in the USA, but it was never consider that high level.

It seems that since they move some items off shore, allot here seems to try to make it seems craftsman were this high end brand that it never was. It has and always be a brand that is consumer oriented and price of the tools are always one of the most important points of their tool, with a lifetime warranty.

 

[byoungblood]

craftsman never had that so call preception of high end. Even before COO was an issue. Their tools were aways talked down about, and consider second grade to the other brands. It was made in the USA, but it was never consider that high level.

It seems that since they move some items off shore, allot here seems to try to make it seems craftsman were this high end brand that it never was. It has and always be a brand that is consumer oriented and price of the tools are always one of the most important points of their tool, with a lifetime warranty.

Only folks I ever heard talk down about Craftsman hand tools were folks who drank the tool truck Kool Aid and had to justify spending too much money on tools by berating literally every other brand out there. Craftsman just happens to be the most well known one out there.

 

[shoturtle]

Half my tools are craftsman, they are the best band for the buck, and their sockets are one of their bargain. And while they are not matco, snap on or proto. They are good quality tools. Back in the 80's and 90's people still consider craftsman as a consumer grade to, even with bob vila pushing them with this old house.

They tried to come out with higher grade stuff. But history has shown the craftsman pros were not a hit. If they were popular and sold well to their target customer. They would have had more then just a few power tools and wrenches.

Even with the chinese and taiwan tools they have. They are still nicer quality then the HF stuff. While the chinese RP ratchet is nothing special, they are still nicer then the HF 36t ratchet which is prone to selector switch issues. Even with the chinese wrenches from craftsman, I will still pick them over the indian made ones form HF without a second thought.

 

[SantaAna12]

Personally, I will not be buying any more Craftsman because of the seeming inevitability of their demise. Hopefully I am wrong, but that's how i see it. I am not happy to see them go, "but times they are a changin." Also, over time, I have had the desire to seek out, and the money to afford, a higher quality tool. To each his own, but frankly I do not relate to a Craftsman/Journeyman/Professional that does not end up doing the same, unless constrained by economics.

 

[Farmall450]

Re: Why are Craftsman tools being crticzed so much?

To me craftsman's basic hand tools quaility competes with any other tool company out there. 90 percent of the tools I got from Dad were craftsman, Used them all my life. But I am willing to look past that if they are going to go overseas for their manufacturing. Don't get me wrong, I do have foriegn made tools in my box, sometimes you can't find some stuff made domestically. I would just rather support Made in the USA.

I have actually yet to really break any US-made Craftsman, besides screwdriver & sockets. But for the price point, you can't argue. I will continue to purchase their US stuff.......

 

[desert]

New to this forum.

My problem with Craftsman is quality. Craftsman is not what it used to be so lets all admit that. I also have a problem with made in China **** and I see people are trying to turn that into a racial issue. I will usually go out of my way to buy an American made product if possible and that includes buying second hand on line or at yard sales.

 

[desert]

I think it's too easy to play the race card in this situation. In all fairness alot of questionable stuff has come out of china recently. tainted baby formula, poison dog food, lead in childrens toys. It's stuff like this that make people weary about Chinese goods, not the fact that they just don't like Chinese people.

Most of us here are smart enough to know and realize this is NOT about race. It's all good

 

[RCStocker]

I'm not trying to start any arguments here, I just really want to know why Craftsman tools are thought to be of lower quality? I keep reading that they really ****, or they aren't as good as other tools in their price range. Are they breaking or failing, or is it just mostly cosmetic flaws? I understand that Craftsman is not the quality of some high end brands, but I never thought that was who Sears was competing with anyways.
I have a fair amount of tools, with most of them being Craftsman, but I also have some Snap on, Proto, and other various American made brands, and I don't remember any of them ever breaking or failing. As long as the tool does the job it was designed for, I'm happy. I keep my tools clean, lubricated, and well organized, but I don't really admire them for their beauty, or the prestige of having the best there is. If the tool does it's job, and helps me perform a task, that's all I expect of it.

Because most mechanics think the more you pay the better the tool. That is not true. While they are not even close to being the top of the line they are so good that they have been the best bang for the buck for the past 60 years. Everyone wants made in the US and does not realize that it is a global economy and any nation can not gain wealth unless it does business with other countries. The country the object is made in has nothing to do with quality. The Chinese have been making some of the worlds finest artifacts for thousands of years but heaven forbid they can't make a tool. The quality has gone way down on the C man line. That is the real kicker.
I just sold a set of Snappie soft grip handled screwdrivers and the chrome was flaking off. They were a mess. Half of what Snap-on sells is rebranded and not of good quality but the highest price on the market.

I have C man ratchets in the VF old series that are smoother than my clunky Snap-on's They are nicer in the hand and I like them much better. If the tool gets the job done I don't know what all the fuss is about. Yes Snappie fit and finish are the best but that does not make the tool any better.

 

[Hootbro]

New to this forum.

My problem with Craftsman is quality. Craftsman is not what it used to be so lets all admit that. I also have a problem with made in China **** and I see people are trying to turn that into a racial issue. I will usually go out of my way to buy an American made product if possible and that includes buying second hand on line or at yard sales.

Nothing wrong with buying second hand, but do not fool yourself that you are keeping a factory going here in the USA buying second hand.

 

[blackz26]

Craftsman has been a let down. I like the HF ratchets better then my USA rp ratchet. Feels strong and fits better in my hand. I sold all but one USA craftsman ratchet I owned. They only thing it'll be used for us tightening a gear puller. And its in a drawer all by itself. I can buy more for less and get better quality elsewhere. $100 for 3 ratchets that doesn't make me feel confident and feels cheap? I'll pass. I like every ratchet I have better then cman.

Now my rp wrenches, they feel good in my hand. Maybe its placement difference on a wrench vs a ratchet. All are USA made. The fit and first.wish is good and have never had a problem with them. Same thing with my sockets that are cman. Except the last bunch of USA sockets. They have a sand paper feel on the inside of the socket. They're only purpose on my box is to fill a gap in socket trays. Duralast sockets are years a head of what new cman sockets looks and fit.

I wouldn't be the least bit upset if they went under and someone else gave them a new life.

 

[ganymede]

Most of us here are smart enough to know and realize this is NOT about race. It's all good

Ah, so SK give the happy ending?

........

 

[deltaphisig]

My father's old craftsman sockets and wrenches are made of stainless and/or heavily chromed vanadium steel. They don't have a spot of rust despite being abused by two generations of children AFTER working on boats in a marine environment.

My recent (2010) Craftsman tools have rust all over them despite having never been left outside or abused. Some had rust spots before coming out of their plastic bags. The quality is not what it once was. I will be buying SO or similar as funds become available.

 

[desert]

Nothing wrong with buying second hand, but do not fool yourself that you are keeping a factory going here in the USA buying second hand.[/QUOTE

You sir maybe correct.

 

[wmartin]

Good heavens, there's a lot of responses here.

Just to throw chum in the water.

. Most everyone has owned a bunch of CM tools.
. The ratchets always break.
. The screwdrivers are pretty bad.
. The RP wrenches are kind of big and clumsy.

There you have it.

 

[d.mcfarland]

The RP wrenches are kind of big and clumsy.

Many are going to disagree and say the USA RP's are the best value there is.

 

[AStrahota]

I have tools from all over. Including USA and non-USA craftsman.

There are plenty of high quality tools from overseas, there are plenty of junk too.
Same in America, some good and some horrific.

When I shop for tools, I do not care where they are made. I buy them, I use them. If they **** I do not buy that brand again for that particular tool. Some companies do better with one type of tool and not so great with another.

 

[desert]

I have tools from all over. Including USA and non-USA craftsman.

There are plenty of high quality tools from overseas, there are plenty of junk too.
Same in America, some good and some horrific.

When I shop for tools, I do not care where they are made. I buy them, I use them. If they **** I do not buy that brand again for that particular tool. Some companies do better with one type of tool and not so great with another.

can't argue there

 

[desert]

I just try and buy and support American made products when and where I can...I dont see what's wrong with that. And yes..somtimes buying china made stuff is unavoidable. But that doesn't mean I have to like it.

 

[Adam McLaughlin]

Re: Why are Craftsman tools being crticzed so much?

Wtf does race have to do with tools!?!

HA HA HA HA
Funny

Adam

 

[unslow1]

I have tools from all over. Including USA and non-USA craftsman.

There are plenty of high quality tools from overseas, there are plenty of junk too.
Same in America, some good and some horrific.

When I shop for tools, I do not care where they are made. I buy them, I use them. If they **** I do not buy that brand again for that particular tool. Some companies do better with one type of tool and not so great with another.

That's the approach I use.

 

[desert]

Race has zero to do with it and it gets old. Seems no matter what you do or say someone somehow wants to place the race card. Including the buying of tools. Pay no attention to that. Why does everything have to be about race...ugh !

 

[Adam McLaughlin]

Race has zero to do with it and it gets old. Seems no matter what you do or say someone somehow wants to place the race card. Including the buying of tools. Pay no attention to that

I am from West Germany, I can remember living there and most people holding made in USA products in high regard

And the American dollar which was very welcome over there too!

Adam

 

[zkling]

Good heavens, there's a lot of responses here.

Just to throw chum in the water.

Rarely do I disagree completely with someone on this forum.

. Most everyone has owned a bunch of CM tools.

Got to hand it to Sears, they have done a fantastic job, marketing, building and living off of a reputation. I would be willing to bet that craftsman tools are the most sold to the civilian market.

Good heavens, there's a lot of responses here.

. The ratchets always break.

There you have it.

I rarely hear this about their ratchets. True they are not very smooth and have a very loose feel, but break? I have abused (sad to admit) my 3/8" RP ratchet, and it has held up just fine.

. The screwdrivers are pretty bad.

Many folks are very happy with their professional line of screwdrivers.

. The RP wrenches are kind of big and clumsy.

There you have it.

Same as Mcfarland said, lots of folks own these as a good value wrench set.



As far as why craftsman is so criticized on this forum? I don't think many folks criticize or make fun of the craftsman line, it is more of a disappointment in new vs old. Sears quality over the years has drastically declined without a price decline. With so many competitive manufactures out there craftsman is becoming just another brand.

I really don't think that anyone (sensible) on this forum is going to rag on some guy because he uses craftsman tools. It is just that some of the craftsman line is not quite up to snuff for everyday heavy use.

 

[ar2stp48]

First job and steady income in 1970. I started buying Craftsman tools. They were a good and well respected brand. I still have most of those tools and still use them regularly. The top box of the roll around was an early purchase; still in use. I cleaned and organized it today. It is well made; strong, heavy construction; and will likely out last me. Compare that to the ones offered today. The quality is no longer there. The box I bought for my son a year ago is horrible; it will be sold or junked and replaced with a box from HF that is much better made.

Now I buy Snap On when I find a bargain. Though I like to buy US made, my main concern is quality for money spent

 

[desert]

I have plenty of craftsman and most have held up well. I dropped a 3/8 ratchet about from waist high on a hanger deck twice and every possible part that could come off did so. I worked in aircraft maintenance dept and most employees had craftsman

 

[Conductor562]

Changed out the thermostat and water pump on my truck this weekend with my Dad's RP's. they got the job done, but with every bolt I found myself longing for my Proto palm control or Blackhawk BP-1338QR. That pretty much sums up Craftsman for me.

 

[ganymede]

Race has zero to do with it and it gets old. Seems no matter what you do or say someone somehow wants to place the race card. Including the buying of tools. Pay no attention to that. Why does everything have to be about race...ugh !

You aren't a racist right? Of course not.
So people who point out that race comes up when talking about crappy import tools aren't talking about you. Simple.
Why so defensive ?

Oh and...

Ah, so SK give the happy ending?

 

[buening]

I didn't read all 8 pages of responses, but my 0.02. I think the hatred spawns from the fact that Craftsman was a brand that their marketers founded on Made in USA quality at a reasonable price, yet they now sell chinese tools at the same prices as the USA tools were. There are many to this day that still think all Craftsman tools are Made in the USA. Not everyone looks at the back of the package at the small print that now says Made in China (that is their fault IMO). So now they are selling the chinese tools in similar packaging at the same pricepoint as was the USA tools.....so I think that is where everyone's beef is with this brand. They've also changed some of the design of the handtools, like the open end of the wrenches that are now enormous and inhibits their performance in tight clearance locations (like crows foot wrench use).

 

[Brownsfan]

I have a set of rp wrenches from 1996. They are indestructible. Maybe they were made differently then? I also have all 3 rp ratchet and socket set from the same years. All have been great and used pretty much daily except for the last 2 years. I have only replaced lost Sockets and added sockets. Never broke one. My 10mm wrench has a nice burn in it from almost arc welding my wedding ring to it and the fender of a van. Last time I wore my wedding ring at work. Or pretty much ever. I have used sockets on air ratchets and impacts with no issues. Now that i am older I have since added impact sockets. When I started out all my stuff was craftsman. Even the box. The only tools that ever gave me an issue were the smelly screwdrivers in particular the torx. They were a little soft. Most of the original stuff I still have. The new stuff now I have no use for.