Sears Could Be Gone If Slump Lasts Through Christmas

[sberry]

Exactly. They basically raced towards the bottom of the food chain. If you sell a crappy set of 300 tools for $200. That person is not going to come back to buy much more stuff because they already got what they need (albeit low quality). If you sell a quality product at a higher price, a person can buy it in stages as they need it or as they can afford it.

Have different modules for different levels. Newbie tech/mechanic. HVAC technician. DIY'er.

Yes, and in truth the quality isn't all that bad. I bought a few wrenches, I had managed well without them but a sale come, great, now got 20 more sits there 99% of the time. Spending 600 vs 60,,, wouldn't have had them. At 60 came in handy as a couple trouble shooters, made it fairly painless and today have no regret.
I was out of town a while back and a friend asked me to do something, spotted a Sears case and said,,, alright, I commented and said she got it for 25$, had about 50 pieces or so but it worked, paid its way then and there.
The tools are almost all better than the user today. I might consider more which may be better but not once do I consider in my day to "upgrade" a socket set that I paid 10 for and served me 30 yrs,, and in comparison I am pretty brutal, if it worked for me I suspect any doubt about working for most everyone else is severely misplaced worry.

 

[sberry]

I agree with Hiball. They lost their position.

 

[chicane]

We had a Circuit City, and a Comp USA in Boise for a while, and I wasn't impressed with either store, the employees were dumber than a box of rocks.

This happened in the early 2000's when Circuit City converted all of their people from commissioned sales to hourly rate. There was a precipitate drop in IQ's i the sales department. Ironically Sears still has a significant commissioned sales force.

 

[chicane]

There was no one babbling about customer service back then. People did what they could, the consumer has it good today, a bunch of whining brats and cant do simple math.
I get 300 pieces for 200$ and try to find something wrong with it. Don't even use it and on email or 800 number ******* about a chrome blem they found with a magnifying glass. Worried to tears if the warranty will be there for their Grandkids.
People think I am anti Snapon,,, absolutely not. They are doing what they should. Sell 10 sockets for 300 is way smarter than selling 300 for 200 to a customer aint never going to be happy.

I think you hit the nail on the head. Can you really blame a retailer for trying to appeal to it's moronic client base? Sears is try to apply 1960s-70s standards to 21st century retailing. HF knows their clients are idiots and puts in firewalls to protect itself (such as their return policy).

 

[MagnumForce]

Again, only here is Craftsman looked upon as ****. Only here.

Has Craftsman even lost market share? Everyone I knows who cares about tools has a Craftsman stack filled with stuff from Sears. The only people that are the ones who buy anything like that don't give a **** about a tool truck or buying online. They want to be able to go into the store and get a good tool.

Let's separate Sears from Craftsman. Sears is failing, not Craftsman.

Trying to be an Electronics store, an Appliance Store, a tool store, a lawn and garden store a clothing store and a jewelry store just simply does not work in the year 2014 especially in a shopping mall.

The local hometown stores around me that are tools, lawn and garden and appliances all do quite well. Every other house on my block has a craftsman lawn mower and a Kenmore Fridge. All that said I know of no one getting clothes at Sears when Kohl's, Meijer and Wal Mart have hit the nail on the head with that market. I don't know anyone buying a new TV or Video Camera at Sears anymore besides the point that electronics are so cheap it is not even funny today and the profit margin in them is gone. Bedding and bath stuff? Sears is too expensive everyone will say when I can get other stuff just as good else where, the list goes on and on. Sears tries to do to much! On top of all that they will work on your car and get you new tires too! The overhead is unreal, 3/4 of the store is dedicated to things that no longer sell or sell at no profit margin.

Honestly I don;t see what you can do to make things better besides drastically changing things. Going high scale is absolutely not the answer though.

 

[Hiball]

I think you hit the nail on the head. Can you really blame a retailer for trying to appeal to it's moronic client base? Sears is try to apply 1960s-70s standards to 21st century retailing. HF knows their clients are idiots and puts in firewalls to protect itself (such as their return policy).

Could you please explain this a bit further? Harbor freight = 90 day unsatisfied return policy and Sears has a 60 day on Tools. I'm gonna take a stab in the dark, are you associated with Sears? Possibly in the Sales Department? It seems like any Sears ill chatter ruffles your feathers a bit, Just curious.

 

[Ridge Runner]

other than tools and automotive I'm not sure what else sears sells that is worthwhile..

I've gotten some pretty decent shirts from them in the past few years (polos and button-ups). I'm a bit of a clothes horse, so pretty decent for me actually means something fits well/looks good and has some quality to it. The problem is when you go back to try and give them a little more business, they no longer stock what you're looking for. Shocking, right?

I don't remember the last time I wanted to buy any of their tools. I've been working on stocking up my collection in preparation for starting my own shop and with the exception of an inch-pound torque wrench, I think it's been five years or more since I bought anything. Their website is horrible, especially when compared to how well it worked before the redesign, they quit putting out catalogs and doing anything worthwhile with Craftsman Club, and it seems like they only want to market gimmicky tools now.

 

[Hiball]

Again, only here is Craftsman looked upon as ****. Only here.

I doubt there is anyone here who doesn't have a craftsman tool in there arsenal from one era or another. I don't personally look at them as ****, they just don't appeal to me anymore. The majority of the Sears bashing came about the same time they off shored the majority of there hard line tools. I definitely don't agree that's its only here, although full warranted as this is a "tool discussion" Forum. If you read reviews at Sears.com you can clearly see that there are reviewers who are disappointed in the brand, whether its Coo or quality. As I stated earlier, the Sears stores are bleak in the tool department in regards to customers, some of that is due to the Internet I suspect, but most consumers if possible like to put there hands on tools prior to purchasing.

On a side note.. There isn't Brand alive that hasn't felt the wrath of a bad Internet review and GJ definitely isn't lacking in this department. Remember fellas.. There just tools, not your Mom's good name.

 

[MaintenanceGuy]

They will only fail if they choose to fail. They own 1000's of buildings and inventory.
The internet should have raised there profits, not lowered. They need a radical change in management.

 

[MagnumForce]

How much are giant stores in malls worth. No one is clamouring for them. Out of 4 big malls in Toledo only one is left.

 

[jd_1138]

How much are giant stores in malls worth. No one is clamouring for them. Out of 4 big malls in Toledo only one is left.

Yep, it's a huge country geographically speaking, and it's spread out. With a majority of people living in places like LA, SF, Boston,, NYC, certain cities in FL, etc..

There are empty malls in near here in Cleveland. Sad to see weeds growing up through the cracks. With people moving out to other parts of the country and internet sales, malls shut down. Unless they're in busy metro areas.

Our local mall seems to be thriving though. It's the only mall within a large area and is an hour and half from Cleveland and an hour and half from Pittsburgh.

 

[Farmall450]

How much are giant stores in malls worth. No one is clamouring for them. Out of 4 big malls in Toledo only one is left.

Most are hitting on a few cylinders around here too. lots of empty kiosks, closed wings, brick and mortar stores closing (Sears holds most of them up; if they fold it could bring down an entire mall...)

 

[Mark I]

this talk has come up multiple times here and i've always stayed out of it, but this time ill toss in my opinion.
when i was a kid & teen(70s/80s) i thought sears/craftsman was cool.
in the early 90s as a young adult i had a place to live on my own and got a sears credit card. i bought mostly tools and tool boxes and stuff for my home.
i maybe ran it(the card) up to maybe 6 or 700 bucks over maybe 6 or 7 years.
it was never outta control. anyhow i reeled it in and paid it off and rarely used the card. i got to the point that if i needed something id pay cash, but i kept it in my wallet w/ a zero balance for maybe 8 years.
last spring i found somthing nice i wanted to buy for my wife and tried to order online w/ my card.
guess what? after so many years of non-use they just dropped it and had no record of me being a "member".

I'll post this one time as well. I bought my first toolbox at Sears in 1974. I think the roller & top were $4-$500, not a small sum for an 18 year old then. My plan was to buy Craftsman tools - that's what my dad had in his boxes at work & at home. I applied for a credit card at 21. Denied. I applied a few more times in the next several years, always denied. I ended up with 90% SO tools in my Craftsman box, and eventually the C-Man box was traded for an SO in 1985. I don't recall when, maybe after I bought my first house, I started to get applications for Sears credit cards in the mail. They all went immediately in the trash. In my opinion, Sears started down the road to their current state decades ago.

 

[Toyota mechanic]

Again, only here is Craftsman looked upon as ****. Only here.

Has Craftsman even lost market share? Everyone I knows who cares about tools has a Craftsman stack filled with stuff from Sears. The only people that are the ones who buy anything like that don't give a **** about a tool truck or buying online. They want to be able to go into the store and get a good tool.

Let's separate Sears from Craftsman. Sears is failing, not Craftsman.

Trying to be an Electronics store, an Appliance Store, a tool store, a lawn and garden store a clothing store and a jewelry store just simply does not work in the year 2014 especially in a shopping mall.

The local hometown stores around me that are tools, lawn and garden and appliances all do quite well. Every other house on my block has a craftsman lawn mower and a Kenmore Fridge. All that said I know of no one getting clothes at Sears when Kohl's, Meijer and Wal Mart have hit the nail on the head with that market. I don't know anyone buying a new TV or Video Camera at Sears anymore besides the point that electronics are so cheap it is not even funny today and the profit margin in them is gone. Bedding and bath stuff? Sears is too expensive everyone will say when I can get other stuff just as good else where, the list goes on and on. Sears tries to do to much! On top of all that they will work on your car and get you new tires too! The overhead is unreal, 3/4 of the store is dedicated to things that no longer sell or sell at no profit margin.

Honestly I don;t see what you can do to make things better besides drastically changing things. Going high scale is absolutely not the answer though.

Basically right on. Appliances, Lawn and garden, and tools... My Hometown Sears is busy. Hometown stores with huge tool inventory would be great. The tools sell well, the owner here says... Alot of tradesmen like the universal sets... the spline drive.. Alot of plumbers, furnace service guys... general contractors, always at the Hometown store. It is right next to an auto parts store. Hometown stores with more inventory might be a great future for Sears. I would miss mine. They know me there, never a problem. My local Sears store is like my 'tool truck vendor'.. I don't have a tool guy, they treat me well in town. Works for me. Sometimes the manager calls me up if there are old trade-ins, he thinks might interest me; besides my daily use tool collection. Love the Sears/Craftsman history and hopefully future somehow. It is just a system that works for me, and alot of other tradesmen I know. I care alot about Sears and Craftsman... I respect all the guys that trust in MAC, Snap-on, etc... as it turned out, I have a HUGE Craftsman set for most all staple tools. We will see.....

 

[montanafordman]

I think Hiball was onto something when he said he doesn't see kids getting their first tool sets with dad/grandpa at sears anymore, nor does the brand hold the excitement, pride, or ambition with people that it once had.

Sears has failed to successfully adapt from mail order to online sales, and from quality big box to discount supercenter. There are many changing demographics at stake that are ALL working against sears.

I think people in general don't do home projects or work on things like they used to so having a quality tool, let alone feeling like they need to have many tools (or knowing what some are called) that a few years ago we all viewed as a commonplace necessity and enjoyed finding various ways to use them. When I look around my neighborhood I get disgusted at the yards and house exteriors that have fallen into disrepair. In most cases I know its not because of lack of money but because they're spending all their energy on Facebook, video games, and other forms of entertainment or working 60hrs a week because their kid wants the new iPhone. People used to decompress by fixing cars, doing various home DIY and woodworking projects and I don't get the sense there are many home hobbyists that would have a need for any tools like there once was. Now everybody runs to HF for the cheapest tool to get the job done that NEEDS to be done. Lets face it, Pittsburg tools work fine for tightening that bolt on your 4 year olds wagon, putting together some Ikea furniture, and if you're really serious changing a battery or alternator. Remember that money saved for the complete $10 wrench and socket set will go toward that new iphone 6.

 

[Allenw]

I think Hiball was onto something when he said he doesn't see kids getting their first tool sets with dad/grandpa at sears anymore, nor does the brand hold the excitement, pride, or ambition with people that it once had.

Sears has failed to successfully adapt from mail order to online sales, and from quality big box to discount supercenter. There are many changing demographics at stake that are ALL working against sears.

I think people in general don't do home projects or work on things like they used to so having a quality tool, let alone feeling like they need to have many tools (or knowing what some are called) that a few years ago we all viewed as a commonplace necessity and enjoyed finding various ways to use them. When I look around my neighborhood I get disgusted at the yards and house exteriors that have fallen into disrepair. In most cases I know its not because of lack of money but because they're spending all their energy on Facebook, video games, and other forms of entertainment or working 60hrs a week because their kid wants the new iPhone. People used to decompress by fixing cars, doing various home DIY and woodworking projects and I don't get the sense there are many home hobbyists that would have a need for any tools like there once was. Now everybody runs to HF for the cheapest tool to get the job done that NEEDS to be done. Lets face it, Pittsburg tools work fine for tightening that bolt on your 4 year olds wagon, putting together some Ikea furniture, and if you're really serious changing a battery or alternator. Remember that money saved for the complete $10 wrench and socket set will go toward that new iphone 6.

You have made a good point, a lot of people don't do home projects any more. Some where it has became more important to have fun and live large then do your own maintenance and household repairs.

 

[thdewey]

I just found out that our Sears will close at the first of December. Which is kinda weird that they are doing that before Christmas. Now there will be no Sears near me. closest will be 20 miles.

I loved going there for tools and appreciated there quality for the dollar. I had a real problem with the help the store manager put in the tool section that really knew nothing about tools. It seems mismanagement might be killing a lot of these stores.

Our Kmart survives with a few Craftsman tools but of course no staff at all.

http://www.gastongazette.com/spotlight/sears-to-close-in-december-1.375257

 

[Steinmetz]

I think Hiball was onto something when he said he doesn't see kids getting their first tool sets with dad/grandpa at sears anymore, nor does the brand hold the excitement, pride, or ambition with people that it once had.

Sears has failed to successfully adapt from mail order to online sales, and from quality big box to discount supercenter. There are many changing demographics at stake that are ALL working against sears.

I think people in general don't do home projects or work on things like they used to so having a quality tool, let alone feeling like they need to have many tools (or knowing what some are called) that a few years ago we all viewed as a commonplace necessity and enjoyed finding various ways to use them. When I look around my neighborhood I get disgusted at the yards and house exteriors that have fallen into disrepair. In most cases I know its not because of lack of money but because they're spending all their energy on Facebook, video games, and other forms of entertainment or working 60hrs a week because their kid wants the new iPhone. People used to decompress by fixing cars, doing various home DIY and woodworking projects and I don't get the sense there are many home hobbyists that would have a need for any tools like there once was. Now everybody runs to HF for the cheapest tool to get the job done that NEEDS to be done. Lets face it, Pittsburg tools work fine for tightening that bolt on your 4 year olds wagon, putting together some Ikea furniture, and if you're really serious changing a battery or alternator. Remember that money saved for the complete $10 wrench and socket set will go toward that new iphone 6.

I know many people that don't even own a modest tool box. Years ago, things were entirely different. Even my 86 year old mother has one.

 

[Contract_Pilot]

Rarely ever go to sears any more. Their website is horrible not user friendly sorting thru all the non in store items and 3rd party sellers! In store the pushy idiot sales staff last in store experience the cashier could not do simple addition and subtraction in his head and the tool guy did not know the fraction and decimal system! Goes to show how the government school system is today! They need to being back shop class's and make everyone take it.

 

[Contract_Pilot]

Ohh... also a lot of their tools now are made off shore! They do not honor the lifetime warranty on tapes and files like they used to!

 

[Nick Danger]

I'll post this one time as well. I bought my first toolbox at Sears in 1974. I think the roller & top were $4-$500, not a small sum for an 18 year old then. My plan was to buy Craftsman tools - that's what my dad had in his boxes at work & at home. I applied for a credit card at 21. Denied. I applied a few more times in the next several years, always denied. I ended up with 90% SO tools in my Craftsman box, and eventually the C-Man box was traded for an SO in 1985. I don't recall when, maybe after I bought my first house, I started to get applications for Sears credit cards in the mail. They all went immediately in the trash. In my opinion, Sears started down the road to their current state decades ago.

The credit card division was one of the things they were doing right. Before they sold it in 2003, it was the source of half the company profits.

 

[Yankee]

Looks like the sale of Sears Canada was a bust. http://nypost.com/2014/09/22/sears-canada-auction-flop-darkens-outlook/

Lampert is now under investigation for his 400 million dollar loan. The end may be sooner than we think...

At first hearing how they are closing stores BEFORE Christmas didn't make any sense, but I'm guessing they don't have the money to stock those stores for the Christmas rush.

 

[BirdMobile]

I think the question to ask here is how much of the U.S. economy will Sears take down with it? A lot of this economic system is based on investor confidence and faith in our retail institutions...

 

[franzdom]

Sears (SHLD) has lost almost 18% of it's value in the 5 days this thread has been active.

 

[blackwire]

Peter's trip to Sears

 

[Virgil Cain]

I think the question to ask here is how much of the U.S. economy will Sears take down with it? A lot of this economic system is based on investor confidence and faith in our retail institutions...

The answer to that is "none". Sears has been long expected to fail and it not signification relative to the U.S. economy.

The stock market may well take a tumble sometime soon, but it won't be because of Sears.

 

[garthg]

The answer to that is "none". Sears has been long expected to fail and it not signification relative to the U.S. economy.

The stock market may well take a tumble sometime soon, but it won't be because of Sears.

Agree 100%. Retailers come and retailers go, even ones that have been around a long time.

There was another article in today's paper discussing a failed auction of 51% of Sears Canada. They couldn't find a buyer. This does not bode well for Sears Holdings.

 

[Revere Cycles]

I've been to three different Sears stores this week, cleaning out the sale bins of USA Craftsman Professional tools that were incredibly marked down. I picked up several reversible ratcheting wrenches for $2.00 to $5.00 each, a set of metric flare nut wrenches for $10, a 1/2" 84T Premium Ratchet for 40% off, and a bunch of Professional Torx Screwdrivers for $2.97 each. I bought enough gear to empty out Gearwrench and Kobalt "road" toolbox and replace it with all Craftsman Professional. Not a bad deal.

I also saw several insane deals on open box Craftsman toolboxes, but most of them were crud; crooked drawers, creases, etc. I guess you can't win them all...

I'll be sad if they close, but at the same time, they brought this on themselves. I really do like the Professional line, and as an automotive enthusiast on a limited budget, I feel like I get more for my money than any other brand. When Craftsman kicks it, or goes fully overseas, I guess it will be SK and Proto for me. I'll miss the convenience of picking up tools at 9:30PM on a Thursday night, that's for sure.

 

[woody 73]

He is a smart Man if they take his cash and get out of their debt., he wins. If they fail he wins prime locations and walks away with even more cash.

 

[franzdom]

He is a smart Man if they take his cash and get out of their debt., he wins. If they fail he wins prime locations and walks away with even more cash.

This is a very unethical move, I don't think this is going to end well.

 

[RedneckWelder]

I wish Sears would finally be put out of their misery.

They've been choking for a couple of decades.

 

[leadfoot415]

This is a very unethical move, I don't think this is going to end well.

I agree...smells fishy from the get-go. I, however, am not an expert on SEC related business, so my opinion means little to nothing, lol!

 

[SO/PW newbie]

In store the pushy idiot sales staff last in store experience the cashier could not do simple addition and subtraction in his head and the tool guy did not know the fraction and decimal system! Goes to show how the government school system is today! They need to being back shop class's and make everyone take it.

I'll bet you they know how to do all that social media trash and all that hash tag garbage very well though. Not much else...

(I still know it as a pound sign)

 

[Ruger_556]

Thank God! Maybe people will stop posting threads about it finally...

 

[BirdMobile]

Thank God! Maybe people will stop posting threads about it finally...

Nah...
Endless threads will appear cheering the demise, then the threads mourning the loss of U.S. made retail store sockets. Then all the "good old days of Sears" threads, then the "which Craftsman tools are more collectible" threads... then...

 

[PureLeaf]

Putting all other things aside, a lot of the value to me in craftsman tools is their best in the business warranty. Craftsman's warranty is a main part of the reason I buy their tools.

So my thought of them potentially going out of business makes me think should I attempt to warranty all of my tools for refunds (it'd be a ridiculous process to even attempt), and then use that money to go with another company that'll hopefully be around a bit longer for future warranty needs if they came up.

 

[Mechanical Noise]

Putting all other things aside, a lot of the value to me in craftsman tools is their best in the business warranty. Craftsman's warranty is a main part of the reason I buy their tools.

I'd expect any new owner of the Craftsman name to continue the warranty. The warranty expenses benefit the brand much like advertising expenses or sale prices.

 

[franzdom]

Nah...
Endless threads will appear cheering the demise, then the threads mourning the loss of U.S. made retail store sockets. Then all the "good old days of Sears" threads, then the "wish Craftsman tools are more collectible" threads... then...

fixed

 

[kc-steve]

From my perspective, Sears and Craftsman died years ago. It gradually changed over the years into something unrecognizable. Kinda like revisiting an old girlfriend ya had a thing with 20 years ago, it just isn't the same!

Steve

 

[Schurkey]

Putting all other things aside, a lot of the value to me in craftsman tools is their best in the business warranty. Craftsman's warranty is a main part of the reason I buy their tools.

So my thought of them potentially going out of business makes me think should I attempt to warranty all of my tools for refunds (it'd be a ridiculous process to even attempt), and then use that money to go with another company that'll hopefully be around a bit longer for future warranty needs if they came up.

It's a "tool satisfaction" warranty; "If this hand tool ever fails to provide complete satisfaction it will be repaired or replaced free of charge."

It's not a company satisfaction warranty. Also "repaired or replaced" does not equal "refund".

The Craftsman warranty has evolved over the years, some early tools may have a repair, replace, or refund warranty. Been so long I've forgotten.