Please shed some light inside my garage

[casmurbax]

Finally built a 18' x 24' detached garage. It has 8.5 high ceiling and it will be insulated and sheet rocked. I am at the rough wiring stage now.

The outside is not quite done yet.



I want to go with LED, I don't want to have deal with fluorescent tubes and I always seem to have a bulb out.

I have looked at these lights at Lowes https://www.lowes.com/pd/Portfolio-...mmon-4-ft-Actual-14-8-in-x-52-07-in/999911229

I was thinking of 4 lights, two lights centered at 8ft from front of garage and 8 ft from back of garage running parallel to the sidewalls. But not sure how far they should be from sidewalls? Will 4 lights be enough?




The back of the garage will have cabinets and a workbench.

I will be primarily finishing the restoration of my car putting it back together. Then it will be used for general maintenance polishing/oil changes and hanging out in.

I am wondering what other options I have?

Thanks

 

[barbedwireleather]

LED is a wise choice I think four fixtures would be enough. As for as placement length and width, divide both X and Y by three and hang these lights on the centerline respectively. I hope it makes sense to you it makes sense to me. If it's unclear I will try to clarify it for you. With that said I think you'll have enough light. I forgot to put in there with respect of white wall paint


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[casmurbax]

barbedwireleather.

Thank you.

 

[Platonic Solid]

I assume you don't want the retrofit tube strip light look for a fraction of the price. Though you can do better with respect to efficiency, price and bang for your buck, I used the Cree LS4-40L-40K for the following layout:

(pic linked to larger image)
​

Here's the PDF report: casmurbax.pdf (link)

 

[casmurbax]

Platonic,

Thank you for your input and your report, much appreciated.

The lights you used in your layout that you provided are about $2k am I understanding you correctly that if I went with the retro tube strip, I could do better with respect to efficiency and price?

Or are you saying that Cree LS4-40L-40K is would be better efficiency and bang for my buck?

I have very little knowledge of the retro tube strips.

Thank you again for time.

 

[Todd.Brock]

Well, I was going to drop my .02 on layout, but I think Platonic done went scientific! That’s pretty awesome!

 

[casmurbax]

Well, I was going to drop my .02 on layout, but I think Platonic done went scientific! That’s pretty awesome!

I agree, but I would still be interested in your 2 cents.

 

[Bert_]

I want to go with LED, I don't want to have deal with fluorescent tubes and I always seem to have a bulb out.

I have looked at these lights at Lowes https://www.lowes.com/pd/Portfolio-...mmon-4-ft-Actual-14-8-in-x-52-07-in/999911229

Don't think just because you get an LED that it will last forever. The light you linked is only rated at 35,000 hours. Most standard fluorescent tubes are good for 20,000 hours...

 

[Platonic Solid]

Platonic,

Thank you for your input and your report, much appreciated.

The lights you used in your layout that you provided are about $2k am I understanding you correctly that if I went with the retro tube strip, I could do better with respect to efficiency and price?

Or are you saying that Cree LS4-40L-40K is would be better efficiency and bang for my buck?

I have very little knowledge of the retro tube strips.

Thank you again for time.

I'm saying the Cree is not very efficient and rather expensive, as is the fixture you originally linked to. The housing and lamp on page 1 of the best light fixture thread is perfect for your height unless you really hate the look. Hang on - working on a layout with that in it.

 

[Shiftless]

casmurbax:
You see why the 4 fixtures you thought would be enough really aren't good enough. Platonic gave you an excellent arrangement with 16 that will give you fantastic lighting which will energize you and encourage higher levels of garage achievement. It did for me!

I installed 5 similar LED twin tubular fixtures in my 10x20 work area with 4 extra LED floods angled toward the wall shelving and 3 extra LED floods shining downward directly over my 7 foot workbench.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Here you go:

​

Here's the PDF report: casmurbax-1.pdf
(Just ignore that the report says James lamps. I edited the attributes of the IES file to simulate the Lumengen tubes.)

12 housings + 24 LED tubes:

*********************************************
Best bang for the buck LED bypass 4ft 2-lamp strip light as of 8/25/2017:

22W LumeGen 4ft single end bypass tube
2640 Lumen
120° Beam Angle
$6.99 ea.
Free Shipping over $25

Maxlite LSS2XT8USE4803 75303 2 Lamp T8 LED Tube Ready 4 ft Linear Utility Strip Light Fixture Pre-Wired [Min Qty: 10]
$15.96 ea. x 10 = $159.60 (Free shipping over $95)

coupon "10offshine" to get $10 off

*********************************************

 

[casmurbax]

Shiftless, you aren't kidding, I was really in the dark.

Platonic, thank you for taking your time and schooling me twice. I really had no idea that a retro tube strip could actually be better than what I thought was a decent choice.

Thank you for providing the 2nd report and links to where to purchase your recommendations. I am going to follow your recommendation.

Bert, made me laugh only 35,000 hours or 20,000 hours....

 

[Bert_]

Bert, made me laugh only 35,000 hours or 20,000 hours....

My point was that those LED fixtures are only going to last as long as 1.5 standard fluorescent lamps (there are better lamps out there that will last much longer). And to make it worse you aren't likely to find replacement LED chips, so your stuck replacing the whole fixture rather than a simple lamp.


Many of the other options that others have listed look to be better fixtures. People just need to realize that just because something is LED does NOT mean it will last.

Rant over.

 

[casmurbax]

Bert,

I didn't see your point, but I do now. Replacing them didn't really cross my mind, I wss thinking that they would last a long time. You are correct down the road having to replace one or more could really turn into a **** show.

I thank you for your rant.

 

[AP514]

So a quick question on these fixtures..Are you saying the fixtures have some type of ballast or something that can go out ? Making the whole fixture replacement necessary ?

Or just the Bulbs do not have the longest life and will need replacement some day ?

 

[Platonic Solid]

AP514 - With very few special case exceptions that really don't apply here, all LED fixtures and bulbs have a driver of some variety. LEDs operate on low voltage DC and require current and voltage control. The driver may be a replaceable component that looks much like a fluorescent ballast, or as in the case of the Cree LS fixture an open circuit board separate from the LED array (but still replaceable if you can get it), or integrated into the LED array itself (which is the cheapest and least efficient method).

The driver is the weak link in the chain. With proper heat management, LEDs can last 200,000 hrs (with reduction in light output over time), but the driver isn't likely to last longer than 50,000 hrs. If it's a separate component, like a ballast then there's a good chance you'll be able to find a replacement in the future. If it's a custom PCB or integrated with the array odds are you'll end up replacing the whole fixture. The only way to know is to go to the store and take the fixture apart or contact the manufacturer and ask.

 

[Platonic Solid]

casmurbax - The fixture you originally linked to claimed 5000 lumens @ 68W. Thus 74 Lumens per Watt, which is worse than most fluorescent fixtures. There's certainly nothing wrong with buying a complete LED fixture with better aesthetics than your basic retrofit strip light, you just need to dig into the specs so you know what you're really getting.

 

[casmurbax]

Platonic,

I was looking at that light for the aesthetics as well as for the 5,000 lumens. obviously that is all I saw.

Between you and Bert schooling me I see the errors I was going to make and apparently a costly one.

Thank you again to you and to the others who chimed in and schooled me, I really appreciate everyone's time.

John

 

[Platonic Solid]

It's not unusual to sacrifice some efficiency for aesthetics. The most efficient retrofit bulbs have clear lenses, but that creates painful point light source and uneven distribution making what should be a comfortable environment quite unpleasant. Hence it's best to sacrifice some efficiency by opting for a frosted lens, especially on lower ceiling heights.

 

[AP514]

AP514 - With very few special case exceptions that really don't apply here, all LED fixtures and bulbs have a driver of some variety. LEDs operate on low voltage DC and require current and voltage control. The driver may be a replaceable component that looks much like a fluorescent ballast, or as in the case of the Cree LS fixture an open circuit board separate from the LED array (but still replaceable if you can get it), or integrated into the LED array itself (which is the cheapest and least efficient method).

The driver is the weak link in the chain. With proper heat management, LEDs can last 200,000 hrs (with reduction in light output over time), but the driver isn't likely to last longer than 50,000 hrs. If it's a separate component, like a ballast then there's a good chance you'll be able to find a replacement in the future. If it's a custom PCB or integrated with the array odds are you'll end up replacing the whole fixture. The only way to know is to go to the store and take the fixture apart or contact the manufacturer and ask.

So, I was looking at the Spec's on the fixtures and Lites you listed(Best BANG). I did not see if it had the controller/PBC but I imagine that is where it is..So if the PCB goes out I would be looking at replacing the whole Fixture instead of the LED lite itself @$15 a pop....This would put me in the same boat I am right now..the ballast on these old T12's are as much as buying new fixtures.

The reason I am asking a lot of questions is I am tired of working out in my Garage with only a few old T12 lite fixtures to see by(1/2 do not work due to ballast out)...I want to redo my lite setup and want to do it correctly this time

 

[Platonic Solid]

AP514 - The "best bang fixture" is made up of an empty strip light housing that is nothing more than an empty box with a few wires and lamp holders. No drivers. Nothing there will need replacing. The lamps contain the driver, thus if the lamp fails you replace it just as simply as you replace a fluorescent tube. The mounted strip light housing remains attached to your ceiling.

 

[AP514]

Thanks for the Fast Reply...really like'n the lighting threads..learning a lot.

I have a drawing of my shop any chance of a lighting layout ? or should I start another thread ?

 

[Platonic Solid]

No promises, but pictures and drawings are more likely to get a response.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Those original fixture were nice looking bit at $99 a piece they are out of my budget ! I bought a couple of Feit double double "bare bulb" with reflector LED fixtures on sale at Costco for about $20. They are meant to be mounted via a chain, but there is no reason you could not shoot some hole through and attach them to the ceiling. They are light enough, you could probably use plastic drywall anchors. Toggle bolts for sure.

They have a cord, so you could install one octagon box in between and an adapter plate for standard duplex receptacle and you would be all set. But, I am cheap !