Mechanics: Tips and tricks you've learned

[2ndGearRubber]

an issue can come up with the bucket toss method if some engineer spec'd a higher strength bolt in one spot and it is the same length etc. as lower strength ones

That's a fantasy.

Bolts for critical components where they are different, are marked as such. Its not like 1 single bolt on your timing cover is a secret super bolt. Additionally, anything that would use such a bolt, would be torqued anyways, and thus the difference would be seen on the torque specs. Nobody is subbing out the bolt for your timing belt tensioner, with something holding your under tray on.

 

[AldeanFan]

I hate the bucket method!
When I was In College I worked in a body shop and my job was to put the cars back together after they were painted.

Of course I hadn’t been the one to take it apart and I received it with a big box of parts and hardware dumped in the trunk.
The first step was to sort the hardware, then look for parts that needed the number of bolts or screws I had, so if I had 8 black screws and the headlights had 4 screws each that might be a match, or it might be for the grill that needed 8 screws.

To mess me up even more, if there had been collision damage or rust and the person taking it apart had to cut bolts or had parts missing I wouldn’t know, so maybe there were supposed to be 10 of those black screws and two broke or were missing and they weren’t for the headlights or for the grill!

An extra few minutes by the guy taking it apart would have saved me and the shop many hours of frustration.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[mikeinri]

While I don't love everything about Lean Manufacturing, some of the more basic elements would really help some of you guys, especially if your managers don't understand the scope of how much time (and money) they're wasting.

While I think there's something to be said for knowing a vehicle well enough to look at a fastener and know where it belongs, that's maybe not the most efficient way to operate.

Mike

 

[Ralf11]

Bolts for critical components where they are different, are marked as such. Its not like 1 single bolt on your timing cover is a secret super bolt. Additionally, anything that would use such a bolt, would be torqued anyways, and thus the difference would be seen on the torque specs. Nobody is subbing out the bolt for your timing belt tensioner, with something holding your under tray on.

It's a fantasy that your helper will check for markings and you may forget too.

I've seen exactly this issue on older German cars.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

It's a fantasy that your helper will check for markings and you may forget too.

I've seen exactly this issue on older German cars.

Helper? Must be nice.

I dont let people install wheels on my tickets, let alone touch any of my hardware.


EDIT: if one runs a fast and loose shop with multiple hands on critical items, that fantasy may be a reality, I concede. Terrible way to run things.

 

[Ralf11]

you go run yours; I'll run mine

 

[Radio Flyer]

related to "bagging and tagging".....

I pulled the engine on a 90 year old rig knowing it would be a year until it went back in. Someone with clean hands was "bagging and tagging". When it went back together, I couldn't find bell housing bolts or a main shaft keyway. There were 2 bags of flywheel bolts, and 2 clutch shaft keys though.

 

[hilld]

related to "bagging and tagging".....

I pulled the engine on a 90 year old rig knowing it would be a year until it went back in. Someone with clean hands was "bagging and tagging". When it went back together, I couldn't find bell housing bolts or a main shaft keyway. There were 2 bags of flywheel bolts, and 2 clutch shaft keys though.

Just like horseshoes and hand grenades, close is good enough.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Here's a good one for the newer guys- dont let management or writers ******** you.

Until a SIGNED WORK ORDER APPROVING DIAGNOSTIC TIME IS PRESENTED YOU DONT LOOK AT ****.

Just punted one back up front, after they tried to ******** me into no diag time. "They wanted it looked at" and all those other ******** half truths trying to say you're getting paid, when you're not. Work smarter.

 

[kelpaso1]

Here's a good one for the newer guys- dont let management or writers ******** you.

Until a SIGNED WORK ORDER APPROVING DIAGNOSTIC TIME IS PRESENTED YOU DONT LOOK AT ****.

Which is why I would never work flat rate.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Which is why I would never work flat rate.

Applies to anyone who makes anything beyond straight hourly. Commission, efficiency bonus, flat rate, anything. Also applies to hourly people with dignity.

Most importantly, it keeps the broke losers out of the shop. If they can't afford $20 to diagnose a cooling system leak, they can **** right off. A hose costs more than that, thus they cannot afford even the cheapest possible repairs, thus I do not care about them or their vehicle.



_________________________________________________________

Back to topic-ville from the tangent I created -

Bungee cords - use them to hold up intake manifolds while you work underneath them. No need to remove and deal with the associated BS and problems. Get them high enough to swap the o-rings and do whatever work needs done, and no higher. Blocks of wood can also prop them up to wiggle coil packs in and out.

Mark steering wheels and column splines with paint/sharpie when removing, if there is no master notch in the column.

Never rule out bad parts. Registering some key-fobs for a friend today, el-cheapo chinese ones obviously. First one went great, second one DOA, battery was fine. I can't even describe how many bad parts I've seen in just 10 years.

Scope all the things. If you're dead practice and test. Just picked up some chassis ear attachments, 6 of the clamp leads with 15' cables for $45. Waiting on the phono-jack to BNC adapters. Now the picoscope will decide where the noise is coming from.

Run multiple scan tools. Snap on failed me twice today, autel to the rescue.

 

[kelpaso1]

Applies to anyone who makes anything beyond straight hourly. Commission, efficiency bonus, flat rate, anything. Also applies to hourly people with dignity.

"Most importantly, it keeps the broke losers out of the shop. If they can't afford $20 to diagnose a cooling system leak, they can **** right off. A hose costs more than that, thus they cannot afford even the cheapest possible repairs, thus I do not care about them or their vehicle.:"


Agreed. If you can't afford a car repair, you cant afford to drive. I don't usually charge to diagnose, unless it's some wierd computer/fuel injection problem. If the customer declines a repair then he can go to some other ill reputable shop.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Agreed. If you can't afford a car repair, you cant afford to drive. I don't usually charge to diagnose, unless it's some weird computer/fuel injection problem. If the customer declines a repair then he can go to some other ill reputable shop.

I suppose what you work on is super easy to diagnose? Seems like just writing up a ticket has got to be worth $20 of hassle time? Unless it's just built into the hourly rate, and you have an extremely low decline percentage.


People always want stuff "looked at". Well, I can look at it all day. But if you want an answer, a correct answer, then that costs money. Yes, even if I find it in 5min. Yes, even if your car isn't worth repairing vs. value of the car. Yes, even if the dealer said that part never goes bad. If I can't diagnose, replicate, or repair it - I charge nothing. Always felt that was more than fair.

It ain't just the time, you're paying for the years, the tools, and caviar for my cat.



BTW: That ticket from earlier, I did get paid my diag time. Not sure how I'd use my scan tool I paid to purchase and update out of my own pocket, to calibrate the blend door position without diagnostic time? Charged 1/2 of the labor time on the repair too, since I felt it was easy.

 

[kelpaso1]

I suppose what you work on is super easy to diagnose? Seems like just writing up a ticket has got to be worth $20 of hassle time? Unless it's just built into the hourly rate, and you have an extremely low decline percentage.


People always want stuff "looked at". Well, I can look at it all day. But if you want an answer, a correct answer, then that costs money. Yes, even if I find it in 5min. Yes, even if your car isn't worth repairing vs. value of the car. Yes, even if the dealer said that part never goes bad. If I can't diagnose, replicate, or repair it - I charge nothing. Always felt that was more than fair.

It ain't just the time, you're paying for the years, the tools, and caviar for my cat.

Sorry, if you own your business you do what it takes. You are looking like it as an employee and not as an owner. Are you paid hourly or flat rate?

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Sorry, if you own your business you do what it takes. You are looking like it as an employee and not as an owner. Are you paid hourly or flat rate?

I have an hourly minimum, approx 50% of the $30-$40/hour or so I average. I get 20% of everything I bill, outside tires and batteries. I typically get paid hourly the week of christmas. I'd rather not be there, and receive $0 for the week.

Of course, if you own the place and the tools, that's 100% your call on how you want to pay..... you.



Being that the shop supplies literally nothing but racks, torches, a beat welder, tire machine, AC machine, and compressed air, I don't take lightly to using any of my literally $10,000+ in diagnostic tools for free. I am only paid a percentage of $ dollars billed. Unless the customer is paying, I am not compensated. So I really don't care if the shop likes it or not. Until they supply their own tools, it's really not their call. If you took the value of all the other employees tools, combined them, then multiplied that by ten, I would still easily have more. No power steering pulley tool? No power steering pulley related jobs for you - grab another oil change kiddo.


I basically operate like an independent contractor. If I'm the only one in the building with the tools, knowledge, or skills to diagnose/repair something, I hold 100% of the cards. If they want to cut me in on a bigger slice of the pie, that's another thing entirely. For the most part, things roll quite smoothly. The shop basically revolves around me running around and doing everything, with a couple other guys for the BS.

Got a dodge needing a serp belt/tensioner, impala blend door issues, clock spring on a toyota, alignment on an audi, clunking noise in a mazda, welding an exhaust on a ford truck, another ford with a restricted TXV venting refrigerant all over the place....

 

[guitarbutt]

This was going well then got pretty strongly off topic..

Dollar Tree has oil drain pans that are $1. I've never had any problem with them. They're good for their intended use, but also (to be on topic) great for rust dissolving longer tools. A good depth, can minimize the amount of fluid used.

Latex rubber bands don't dry rot for those instances when you need rubber bands

If you have an older vehicle, put wrenches and sockets to everything you can find under the hood. Write a list (9/16 starter bolt, 1/2 distributor, etc). Keep spares in the trunk/ behind the seat/ accessible in case of an impromptu need

 

[ThePostman]

6 point when you can.
Cobalt drill bits, see new tools thread in a few.
I get it as far as don't have the tools, too bad, why should I let you borrow what I have to make you money. Isn't the rule ask twice you should probably buy it?
I was in that kind of environment for a while, made me money and made me miserable.
I moved 2 weeks ago, newer equipment, for example hunter revolution tire machine, which is not perfect, but I'm not getting younger. And I like my small crew, and the yoda I work for.
50/50 atf and acetone for penetrant oil, it is the best.

 

[mvdavid]

Use t pins from sewing section for backprobing wire connectors I keep them punched through the lid of a film spool container. Need an insulated t pin, stick it through an old plastic hydraulic shipping cap. While in sewing aisle, grab a couple of seam rippers, they are great for opening up harnesses without nicking wires.
On cars with a hood prop rod I tie a line from hood to luggage rack or over roof to rear bumper. Usually gets hood open a lot more for better light and access. Also keeps it away from the sharp corner to top of head interface
If drill is too fast for bit, slow it down by increasing feed pressure also cutting oil makes it easier. If in a clean area use a wax stick like Door-Eze for lube.
When trying to find a bad wheel speed sensor that is not coding, graph the abs solenoids instead of the sensors. If the cars computer can’t find the fault with a sensor, you probably won’t either. But, you will see which solenoid is activating.
Always try to verify or duplicate client complaint. If it is too intermittent upsell more DX time beforehand instead of later when bill is presented.
Try to keep ALL parts with vehicle when it will be a lengthy repair. Bagged and tagged. And under cover.

 

[Eric29]

I’ve worked on cars from the 60s. They weren’t that forgiving. I’m not sure how he cleaned the gasket surfaces.

One of the sharpest mechanic's I've ever known. The Chevy dealer was ******* them over on warranty work so he adjusted his techniques. No comebacks, SBC's are pretty forgiving. Remember, this was the 1960's. You wouldn't get away with that on today's engines.

 

[mark#3]

In the 70's when repairing cars, I'd throw all the parts in a can/box, then when putting together I'd remember what parts went where.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Be careful backprobing with tpins. Most modern sized connectors wont put up with that. I buy banana jack backprobes in bulk on amazon.

 

[setfocus]

cheap parts **** and management that wont listen, latest case...

turbo sonic with coolant leak on a saturday. Leaking from t-stat housing. Tell the service writer to get a dealer AC delco one. The dorman t-stats don't have enough resistance in the t-stat heater and throw high voltage codes. I know because I drive a turbo cruze and went through that issue.

Was told that we couldn't get the dealer t-stat and they ordered a motorad... well at least it's not a dorman. Plugged the t-stat heater in before I swapped it out and keyed the car on just to see if it would instantly throw a code... it didn't, installed the new t-stat, fill with coolant and start car. Instantly leaking at the radiator hose connection, not the original source of the leak.

Hop on the computer and order a t-stat from oriley's. Remove motorad t-stat and replace with oriley's unit, fill with coolant and start car.... same thing, leaking at rad hose connection, look at the box... same part number and made in italy sticker, the oriley's unit is a motorad.

Back to the computer, napa has one with different #. I call napa... "Is your t-stat made by motorad?" answer is yes, so F that. Finally get the ac delco unit on monday, installed, no leaks or codes.

Removed, replaced, and filled cooling system 3 times and got paid once because they wouldn't get the part I asked for originally and didn't want to tell the customer that the quality part was 2 days out and they had to wait... which they did in the end anyway

 

[Davefr]

Not a mechanic, but here are a couple.

1. Fasteners should either be off or on and tightened to the proper torque. (ie never leave fasteners in a state of not to proper torque thinking you'll finish torqueing them down later.)

2. "When you see hoofprints, think horses not zebras". (ie start your trouble shooting with the most likely pareto of possible causes and work your way down the list.)

 

[SeisMec]

"When you see hoofprints, think horses not zebras". (ie start your trouble shooting with the most likely pareto of possible causes and work your way down the list.)

Start with any quick (one minute or less) and simple diagnostics. If none of those quick checks find the problem, then see Dave's #2.

Eg. Engine doesn't crank, connect the starter solenoid actuator terminals. Yeah, it's probably a bad connections at the battery or the battery itself is bad - not the solenoid. But occasionally it is a bad solenoid and this takes about 1 second on a Ford.

 

[Citation]

Not a mechanic, but here are a couple.

1. Fasteners should either be off or on and tightened to the proper torque. (ie never leave fasteners in a state of not to proper torque thinking you'll finish torqueing them down later.)

When I was much younger I was stupid and put the wheel on when the car was still on the jack. I couldn't torque the lung nuts down when the car was up and forgot when it was down. Well... after that I always leave one lug nut off until it's time to torque all of them to spec.

Sometimes I will compromise and leave the fastener in the hole but backed out to the point where it is visibly loose.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Removed, replaced, and filled cooling system 3 times and got paid once because they wouldn't get the part I asked for originally and didn't want to tell the customer that the quality part was 2 days out and they had to wait... which they did in the end anyway

#1 reason I make my own estimates. If there is an issue, I have no one to blame but myself. I hear the same thing.... a generic TXV is $3 cheaper, and available today. A motorcraft OE part, is available tomorrow. Everybody wants the junk.

Never time to do it right, ALWAYS time to do it over. The original ****** part made it 60k or whatever, and we think dorman trash is going to even make it out of the shop? Plastic will be the end of aftermarket cooling system parts. They simply seem incapable of making cooling system parts correctly.

 

[bwringer]

1. Fasteners should either be off or on and tightened to the proper torque. (ie never leave fasteners in a state of not to proper torque thinking you'll finish torqueing them down later.)

Excellent and not often thought about.

Some people seem to have a very bad habit of that sort of thing, and "I'll come back and snug it up" has bitten me more than once.

 

[RedneckWelder]

Be careful backprobing with tpins. Most modern sized connectors wont put up with that. I buy banana jack backprobes in bulk on amazon.

We have specific backprobe spoons shaped and sized appropriately for the terminals we test for this reason. The tiny terminals in modern high density connectors are insanely fragile.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

We have specific backprobe spoons shaped and sized appropriately for the terminals we test for this reason. The tiny terminals in modern high density connectors are insanely fragile.

The spoon probes by electronic specialities?

I'd assume they're way too big for micro64. I read picoscope was working on some backprobes using hypodermic needles for longer life. I think they abandoned the idea though.

 

[Ricky Joe]

In the 70's when repairing cars, I'd throw all the parts in a can/box, then when putting together I'd remember what parts went where.

If you worked on Ford Y blocks, you better pay attention to which head bolt went where. There were three different length bolts per head. Also, when you remove rockers, valves, pistons, etc. that you are going to reuse, you need to keep them so they go back in the same spot. Rod caps and main bearing caps need to go back with the same orientation. I vote against the bucket.

 

[TTMotorsports]

^ not suggesting throwing parts, but screw taking sub-assemblies apart and trying to salvage them.

AC clutch pulley is bad, internals of the compressor aren't spinning. Remove the compressor and replace the clutch, many can't be done in car. Now the internals mechanically spin, but it has low output even with a full charge. Compressor is mechanically worn, due to low oil charge or whatever. Now what? In what world are you being paid twice for that?

Now you do it again, for free, instead of making a living.

I had the AC clutch on my dodge diesel go out. I changed it in place so I wouldn't have to recharge it or anything and worked like a charm. Luckily it was on the bottom of motor and easy to get to

 

[anndel]

Go OEM parts as much as possible. If not go name brand and avoid Ebay or Amazon as much as possible.

 

[xjfish]

Always disconnect the battery before working on anything electrical on your car or even anything near anything electrical

Don't disconnect the battery and be careful. Saves a lot of time on a modern car...

 

[seber]

Don't disconnect the battery and be careful. Saves a lot of time on a modern car...

It may save time, or it may cost thousands.

 

[Olafur]

If you are diagnosing a complex problem and you are stuck and you think you have tried "everything". You probably haven't, you are simply short of ideas.

Try walking away and take your mind off it for an hour or two. Stop thinking about it. What usually happens is a new idea pops into your mind. Something you can check to bring you closer to the solution. Give your unconscious mind time and peace to form new ideas. It's all about ideas.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

If you are diagnosing a complex problem and you are stuck and you think you have tried "everything". You probably haven't, you are simply short of ideas.

Try walking away and take your mind off it for an hour or two. Stop thinking about it. What usually happens is a new idea pops into your mind. Something you can check to bring you closer to the solution. Give your unconscious mind time and peace to form new ideas. It's all about ideas.

Good point.

Sometimes that walking away process will jog your thoughts. Sometimes you even need to start over at square 1, and see what you missed.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

Use ball hones to clean caliper slide pin bores. You can remove all the rust within, in just a few minutes. An air hammer quickly removes the frozen pins, clean and hone, and replace.

Saves the customer money, and much easier and faster than sourcing a bracket. I buy them on amazon for 5 to 10 bucks a piece, and they usually last a year or more.

 

[mikeinri]

For some reason, Fords seem to be very sensitive about not liking aftermarket electronic parts, at least on my 90s and 00s vehicles.

One of the reasons that I stopped using my local garage was that he always refused to use OEM parts. I told him I didn't care that they cost more or took longer to obtain (his two common excuses).

He probably got a bigger margin with the generic stuff, or didn't want to tie up the service bay waiting for parts.

Mike

 

[bwringer]

For some reason, Fords seem to be very sensitive about not liking aftermarket electronic parts, at least on my 90s and 00s vehicles.

That's every vehicle nowadays.

Spark plugs, too -- figure out what the OEM used and ONLY EVER use the same. Same for oxygen sensors. They're all based on the exact same physical principle, but somehow your ECU will know and will soon betray you.

On Toyotas, for example, a lot of parts are made by Nippondenso, Aisin, NGK, and a few others, and sometimes Rockauto will even mark which one is the OEM part and manufacturer.


That said, you do have to pay attention. Sometimes you pay many American dollars for something like an OEM alternator or CV axle from a dealer, wait for the magical elves of the far-away homeland to chisel it out, and then... they hand you a ****** third-world reman with an OEM part number sticker slapped over the CarQuest sticker.

 

[bonneyman]

#1 reason I make my own estimates. If there is an issue, I have no one to blame but myself. I hear the same thing.... a generic TXV is $3 cheaper, and available today. A motorcraft OE part, is available tomorrow. Everybody wants the junk.

Never time to do it right, ALWAYS time to do it over. The original ****** part made it 60k or whatever, and we think dorman trash is going to even make it out of the shop? Plastic will be the end of aftermarket cooling system parts. They simply seem incapable of making cooling system parts correctly.

Yep, most everyone wants cheap. On some specific things cheap works (i.e. rubber gloves) but I always try to shoot for the middle of the road. My dad taught me this. "You don't want the cheapest option, but you don't always want the most expensive choice, either. Shoot for the middle of the road on price". That advice has done me pretty well.