200 amp. ?
- Thread starter 700jfm
- Start date
dont you need 4? what code cycle are you under? Is the house attached to the garage? Or are there 2 seperate buildings? What size conduit is that? What exactly are you doing? Are you setting a new service, then using this cable to refeed the existing panel from the new service?
I was told that I don't need four. The new service will be at the garage and the house will be the sub. the braker box is going to be a 200 amp. feed through combo it has the meter slot and lugs to feed the house. The old meter will be removed and I will use 2" conduit where the old weather head is now. As for what code cycle I'm under
I was told that I don't need four. The new service will be at the garage and the house will be the sub. the braker box is going to be a 200 amp. feed through combo it has the meter slot and lugs to feed the house. The old meter will be removed and I will use 2" conduit where the old weather head is now. As for what code cycle I'm under
is the garage attached to the house? Do you have a permit for this work? Usually the power company needs a permit and inspection signed off before theyll connect you. Also, most power companies have a say in where the meter goes, but I dont know if this is the case with yours. What power company do you have? Most of them have on their website, a huge pdf with all the specs for a new service.
out of curiosity, who said you dont need 4 wires? you may not if the garage is detached, and you are under an old code cycle. Im sure someone can chime in and clarify this.
Aceman
Well-known member
1. Is the garage attached?
2. Specifically, what kind of wire did you pull? It looks like 4/0 4/0 2/0 URD(Sweetbriar)
3. Is it in conduit the whole way?
4. Have you called the power co. and made sure they'll accept your new service location?
5. Have you called the building department for a permit yet?
2. Specifically, what kind of wire did you pull? It looks like 4/0 4/0 2/0 URD(Sweetbriar)
3. Is it in conduit the whole way?
4. Have you called the power co. and made sure they'll accept your new service location?
5. Have you called the building department for a permit yet?
As for permits I tryed to get one, and was told by the the city office that for what I was building I did not need one. As for the three wires it is what the electric supply and the electrician told me to use. The power co. came out and said when I get the box set that they would move the meter. Is there a problem with three wires? The new box will have a grounding rod (and the house already has one.)
Aceman
Well-known member
4/0 4/0 2/0 Sweetbriar
I was told that it did not have to put it in conduit but I did anyways
Yes they came out
I tryed but the Building department did not want my money.
I not sure if a breaseway makes it attached
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what does the wire say on it? what type is it? if its not a recognized type, you cant use it inside at all.
Is the garage attached to the house?
FYI, all the ground rods in the world dont mean everything's bonded properly. The purpose of the grounding conductor is to provide a path for fault current. Ground rods dont accomplish this.
Is the garage attached to the house?
FYI, all the ground rods in the world dont mean everything's bonded properly. The purpose of the grounding conductor is to provide a path for fault current. Ground rods dont accomplish this.
bigdav160
Well-known member
I know it comes to a surprise to most of you but the OP is correct.
In Texas, the homeowner can do all his own work. Most jurisdictions there is NO permitting and NO inspections. Only in the last year has Texas adopted any building codes. It looks like 2003 IBC is currently being used.
(edit), I believe the above question has been answered and looking at the pictures it appears the garage and house are connected by a long breezeway.
I'm no sparky, but shouldn't the question be if there are any metal, like water and gas lines connecting the house and garage?
In Texas, the homeowner can do all his own work. Most jurisdictions there is NO permitting and NO inspections. Only in the last year has Texas adopted any building codes. It looks like 2003 IBC is currently being used.
(edit), I believe the above question has been answered and looking at the pictures it appears the garage and house are connected by a long breezeway.
I'm no sparky, but shouldn't the question be if there are any metal, like water and gas lines connecting the house and garage?
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Thanks bigdav160 I was starting to get a little scared. I couldn't even get the insurance co. to give a damn they just said how much would you like to cover it for. I said don't you need a inspection? They said only if you want.
I asked this and was told it's no problem.
There is no water or gas just the cable and phone
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the state of Texas adopted the 2008 NEC effective Sept 1, 2008 for all unincorporated areas, if you are within municipal limits you have to check with them.
I REALLY think you cant use URD inside, it is not a recognized wire type and is made for underground service entrances.
I also think you need the ground wire.
It used to be you could run 3 wire to a detached structure, but now you need 4 wire. Doesnt matter for the OP because the garage is attached to the house.
I REALLY think you cant use URD inside, it is not a recognized wire type and is made for underground service entrances.
I also think you need the ground wire.
It used to be you could run 3 wire to a detached structure, but now you need 4 wire. Doesnt matter for the OP because the garage is attached to the house.
to elaborate on the URD issue, you cant use it inside because the insulation doesnt meet any of the flame travel standards. NOW, look carefully at your cable. Some URD has a dual rating, it will say RHW or XHW or something like that on it. If it does then youre ok.
you might not need a permit, but you do need to adhere to the code. Its up to you what you do, but it is a safety thing, and i would want to do it right.
700jfm, i forgot to note, i apologize if i come off harsh or rude, i dont mean to find fault with your hard work. Just trying to help make sure its safe and done properly.
Unforseen things can happen. For example, if your new service burns up for some reason, and the urd cable catches on fire and burns your house down, you may find your insurance company wont want to pay out due to the wrong wire being used.
I was involved in a similar situation a few years ago (as an outside consultant) in a commercial property where there was some improper wiring in the building (wasnt even line voltage) and there was a serious fire. It took a year, and six figures in atty costs to get the insurance company to pay out -they were claiming the fire could have been caused by or exaserbated by the improper wiring, even though it had nothing to do with the cause of the fire.
Unforseen things can happen. For example, if your new service burns up for some reason, and the urd cable catches on fire and burns your house down, you may find your insurance company wont want to pay out due to the wrong wire being used.
I was involved in a similar situation a few years ago (as an outside consultant) in a commercial property where there was some improper wiring in the building (wasnt even line voltage) and there was a serious fire. It took a year, and six figures in atty costs to get the insurance company to pay out -they were claiming the fire could have been caused by or exaserbated by the improper wiring, even though it had nothing to do with the cause of the fire.
rburke65
Well-known member
OK....I'll bite....What or who is "OP"? Everyone has these abreviations and I reread the posts but I saw no deffinition of "OP". Thanks
CenTex52Chevy
Active member
"OP" = original post
. Is it piped the whole way? Is it in the correct size pipe. Is it 4 wires?
ok I went to two electric supply co. and they both said that I did not need a ground wire. But if it makes me feel better they would sell it to me. The one that I've been dealing with said if I'm that worried about it that I could increase the ground wire size to the rod that's on the house. So I don't know It's not to late to do the ground wire I guess I'll sleep on it.
As for the cable there is no problem with it running in the attic (in or out of conduit.) so I'm leaving it the way it is. Here some pics. of the new braker box and meter.
As for the cable there is no problem with it running in the attic (in or out of conduit.) so I'm leaving it the way it is. Here some pics. of the new braker box and meter.
Do what you want but your install isn't close to current code.
Aceman
Well-known member
Figured I'd mention a couple things here.....
The garage is attached, if it was getting inspected, you'd need that grounding wire. Even if it wasn't getting inspected and it was my own place, I'd still pull a ground.
Secondly, the cable you pulled(which looks like single conductors without an overall nonmetallic sheath) would fail an inspection being installed without conduit. It's equivalent to stripping the sheath off Romex and stapling the bare wires to the studs. It's not code legal and just like above, I wouldn't do it in my house even if it wasn't getting inspected.
Third, I don't put any faith in the supply house counter help. They're not electricians, they only sell to electricians. How do they know what's supposed to be installed and how it's to be installed when they simply sell the parts. Do they regularly use a codebook or just sell them? It's like telling the doctors receptionist your medical symptoms and asking her for a diagnosis.
All things said, bottom line, you can do what you like, it's your house. Just figured you might like to hear an electricians perspective on it.
The garage is attached, if it was getting inspected, you'd need that grounding wire. Even if it wasn't getting inspected and it was my own place, I'd still pull a ground.
Secondly, the cable you pulled(which looks like single conductors without an overall nonmetallic sheath) would fail an inspection being installed without conduit. It's equivalent to stripping the sheath off Romex and stapling the bare wires to the studs. It's not code legal and just like above, I wouldn't do it in my house even if it wasn't getting inspected.
Third, I don't put any faith in the supply house counter help. They're not electricians, they only sell to electricians. How do they know what's supposed to be installed and how it's to be installed when they simply sell the parts. Do they regularly use a codebook or just sell them? It's like telling the doctors receptionist your medical symptoms and asking her for a diagnosis.
All things said, bottom line, you can do what you like, it's your house.
Just figured you might like to hear an electricians perspective on it.I would quit listening to the guy at the supply house. The advice he is giving you is scary. I almost wonder if he is sabatoging you since youre not having an electrician do the work?
You NEED the ground wire. Putting a larger wire to a ground rod isnt going to perforrm the necessary bonding. The purpose of the ground wire you need is to connect the two cans together to provide a path for fault current. This doesnt really have anything to do with a ground rod in the soil.
That triplex cable you ran. What does it say on it? If it is just URD / XLP or whatever -you CANNOT use that inside whether its in conduit or not.
NOW if its marked RHH, RHW, XHHW then you can use it in the building provided the whole thing is in conduit, and you add the ground wire.
Whatever these supply house guys are telling you is a pile of ****.
You NEED the ground wire. Putting a larger wire to a ground rod isnt going to perforrm the necessary bonding. The purpose of the ground wire you need is to connect the two cans together to provide a path for fault current. This doesnt really have anything to do with a ground rod in the soil.
That triplex cable you ran. What does it say on it? If it is just URD / XLP or whatever -you CANNOT use that inside whether its in conduit or not.
NOW if its marked RHH, RHW, XHHW then you can use it in the building provided the whole thing is in conduit, and you add the ground wire.
Whatever these supply house guys are telling you is a pile of ****.
All things said, bottom line, you can do what you like, it's your house.
I hear what you'r saying. I had two different electrician come out who had the biggest ads in the yollow book. And they both were going to do it this way. I used their material list to order from. And it's in conduit just not at the ends
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2 different licensed electricians were going to use 3 wire URD inside a home for a subpanel?
no. two different guys with ads in the phone book, who obviously dont know texas has an electrical code now were going to use 3 wire URD.
either that or big ad in phonebook = responded to posting on craigslist
or someone found some URD somewhere..........
Well when you say home I'm not sure. It runs to the braker boxs in the garage of the house witch at one time it was a car port that we turned into a garage. so what every it is at this point I'm not going to change it, but I will run the box to box ground.
Charles (in GA)
Well-known member
Re: 200 amp. Update ?
Ok Cable update: After researching, and calling the manufacturer (who did not have a problem with it in the attic as long as the terminations were outside) I have decided to pull the cable and put it in the ground where it belongs. I just could not take the chance that someone could possibly cut into the cable or some other mishap after I am gone, most likely my own family, since I plan to live here until I die. So the new plan is to mount the boxes I have at the corner of the garage and put a junction box where the meter is now to keep the termination of the aluminum cable outside(something to do with arching), bury the cable, and add a ground wire to bond the boxes. I have not told my son yet as I figure he will quit on me. I guess I will buy him a free steak dinner and break the news in public while he is eating.
Ok Cable update: After researching, and calling the manufacturer (who did not have a problem with it in the attic as long as the terminations were outside) I have decided to pull the cable and put it in the ground where it belongs. I just could not take the chance that someone could possibly cut into the cable or some other mishap after I am gone, most likely my own family, since I plan to live here until I die. So the new plan is to mount the boxes I have at the corner of the garage and put a junction box where the meter is now to keep the termination of the aluminum cable outside(something to do with arching), bury the cable, and add a ground wire to bond the boxes. I have not told my son yet as I figure he will quit on me. I guess I will buy him a free steak dinner and break the news in public while he is eating.
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Aceman
Well-known member
Is the cable you pulled in marked RHH, XHHW, etc? URD(Sweetbriar) is sort of a common trade name around here. The power co. uses one type of URD(definitely not allowed in homes), but what we use is dual rated as RHH also.
I would be very surprised if yours wasn't also the dual rated type as I can't see an electrical supply house selling the power co. version to electricians wiring homes.
I would be very surprised if yours wasn't also the dual rated type as I can't see an electrical supply house selling the power co. version to electricians wiring homes.