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86turbodsl
Well-known member
I'm leaning hard to the pertronix. Never mess with it again. Parts are only going to become harder to find.
Above 1200 Sq/FT 86's 20HP shop
- Thread starter 86turbodsl
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Wokspaces above 1200 squarefeet.
matt_i
Well-known member
On your Clark mast, I also resealed a triple 3000 lb version in the past, about 12 years ago. I got the parts from what used to be Hercules Bulldog which is now just Bulldog Hydraulics. They needed a "mast number" which was stamped into one of the outer channels in letters about 3/4" tall. They had a "premium urethane" or something like that which I paid the extra ~$40 for. I had to buy the parts thru Motion Industries as Bulldog wouldn't sell direct to me with a credit card....but so beit. Has turned out great.
On the triple mast all of the main working seals are u-cups, which slip easily over the chromed tubes but will get torn to bits by the internal threads they are attempting to pass. I ended up machining pieces of PVC and making thin steel bands (would go all PVC the next time around), precompress the seal, slide down past the threads, then you just tap in the seal until its bottomed out. The end caps do have scrapers and o-rings but those are comparatively easy.
Big mess due to all of the fluid, any pits or edges in the chrome tubes just smooth it out with a 600 grit diemakers stone, even if the chrome is compromised as long as its not sharp or rust pitted, it will last a long time.... and then clean up the abrasive dust.
I have a set of pics and I can post if you get interested. Be careful as the shop manual references some nasty shear points when the chains are released and the carriage isn't restrained any more. The tube steel (telescoping cylinder) is heavy (!).
When you replace the rod scrapers you can see the rust down at the bottom of the seal glands, caused by condensation (etc) which was a good reminder to me to keep the thing inside, or at minimum under a tarp. I also wipe off the exposed rod regularly, it picks up sawdust and even concrete dust but those things wear out the scrapers even faster.
I would expect some leaks on the Namco as well, but as suggested I wouldn't mess with anything until you really have to do something.
I also stopped messing around with ignitions and put in a 1990s TBI-era GM HEI ignition in its place. Very reliable animals compared to anything with points. In free air the spark will easily jump a 3/4" gap....
On the triple mast all of the main working seals are u-cups, which slip easily over the chromed tubes but will get torn to bits by the internal threads they are attempting to pass. I ended up machining pieces of PVC and making thin steel bands (would go all PVC the next time around), precompress the seal, slide down past the threads, then you just tap in the seal until its bottomed out. The end caps do have scrapers and o-rings but those are comparatively easy.
Big mess due to all of the fluid, any pits or edges in the chrome tubes just smooth it out with a 600 grit diemakers stone, even if the chrome is compromised as long as its not sharp or rust pitted, it will last a long time.... and then clean up the abrasive dust.
I have a set of pics and I can post if you get interested. Be careful as the shop manual references some nasty shear points when the chains are released and the carriage isn't restrained any more. The tube steel (telescoping cylinder) is heavy (!).
When you replace the rod scrapers you can see the rust down at the bottom of the seal glands, caused by condensation (etc) which was a good reminder to me to keep the thing inside, or at minimum under a tarp. I also wipe off the exposed rod regularly, it picks up sawdust and even concrete dust but those things wear out the scrapers even faster.
I would expect some leaks on the Namco as well, but as suggested I wouldn't mess with anything until you really have to do something.
I also stopped messing around with ignitions and put in a 1990s TBI-era GM HEI ignition in its place. Very reliable animals compared to anything with points. In free air the spark will easily jump a 3/4" gap....
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matt_i
Well-known member
If useful the pics can be found lower down in this thread.
Clark C300-40 Mast Cylinder Help, etc
Hello, Came across an old Clark C300-40, but it's got a few issues. Most important one is that the main mast has small geysers coming out from around the larger seal atop the cylinder. This comes out to several quarts over a fifteen minute period of shuffling things around. At first, the lift...
www.practicalmachinist.com
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
Thanks Matt. I dug around on bulldog's site, but didn't find anything. I then searched for hercules hydraulics and found a searchable hydraulics vendor. I think they must have divested from Bulldog. I need the mast number. Now i know where to look.
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
I looked all over the mast tonight i cant find any numbers.
matt_i
Well-known member
Looks like my info has gotten dated 
While they stock "Clark" kits in the catalog they are for wheel-loaders which isn't applicable. I don't see any mention of forklifts....
You could still call them and see if they could help, but it looks like they are into bigger equipment. Probably the old Clarks are not a very large sales volume these days. I think there are probably kits still out there but it might take more digging. It seems like I had a photo one time of where my number was stamped but its probably easier to locate the number again tomorrow....as I recall it was in one of the outer mast channels' flat sides but that doesn't guarantee anything common I suppose. They were larger characters than I was expecting. I used a flashlight shined at an angle to help me find it with the glare.
Although its not as comforting to have the actual seals in-hand as a fully formed kit, everything is nominal inch-sized, and all of the seals are what I call "loaded U-cups" and you could measure and build your own kit as you go.
Guessing someone there could help you find the proper rod scrapers and the standard buna o rings needed for the end caps.
Having a large chain-vise (for pipes, etc) is pretty helpful (ridgid and reed both make them, think I have a BC810A). I think I also got some "adjustable pin spanners" from McMaster Carr - the endcaps have 2 drilled holes in the face and need to be tapped loose. One could also make their own in the mill & lathe out of flat stock, drill close fitting holes, plug weld in the pins from one side and weld on stubs and slip a pipe over the stub for leverage. As always the basic "time vs money" proposition. The spanners I've made reside in a drawer after their initial flash of glory, now with a paint mark as to their specific application, probably to be thrown away by the next generation lol.
While they stock "Clark" kits in the catalog they are for wheel-loaders which isn't applicable. I don't see any mention of forklifts....Bulldog Hydraulic Kits | Demand the Brand
Quality Aftermarket Replacement Parts for Bulldog Hydraulic Kits
www.bulldogkits.com
You could still call them and see if they could help, but it looks like they are into bigger equipment. Probably the old Clarks are not a very large sales volume these days. I think there are probably kits still out there but it might take more digging. It seems like I had a photo one time of where my number was stamped but its probably easier to locate the number again tomorrow....as I recall it was in one of the outer mast channels' flat sides but that doesn't guarantee anything common I suppose. They were larger characters than I was expecting. I used a flashlight shined at an angle to help me find it with the glare.
Although its not as comforting to have the actual seals in-hand as a fully formed kit, everything is nominal inch-sized, and all of the seals are what I call "loaded U-cups" and you could measure and build your own kit as you go.
Guessing someone there could help you find the proper rod scrapers and the standard buna o rings needed for the end caps.
Having a large chain-vise (for pipes, etc) is pretty helpful (ridgid and reed both make them, think I have a BC810A). I think I also got some "adjustable pin spanners" from McMaster Carr - the endcaps have 2 drilled holes in the face and need to be tapped loose. One could also make their own in the mill & lathe out of flat stock, drill close fitting holes, plug weld in the pins from one side and weld on stubs and slip a pipe over the stub for leverage. As always the basic "time vs money" proposition. The spanners I've made reside in a drawer after their initial flash of glory, now with a paint mark as to their specific application, probably to be thrown away by the next generation lol.
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bimmer1980
Well-known member
Did you try calling the place in Mechanicsburg pa that I suggested?
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
I haven't tried calling anybody yet, because i have no identification on the mast. I had my forklift guy check on seals with the data tag on the machine, but he couldn't find anything as he said the data tag identified the mast as something special. The hydraulics place and Matt both said there should be something printed on the mast on the channel but there's nothing there.
The machine doesn't run right now, so i have no way to extend the mast to check cylinder sizes either. Really don't want to pull apart without seals in hand. that's how jobs fall apart for me.
The machine doesn't run right now, so i have no way to extend the mast to check cylinder sizes either. Really don't want to pull apart without seals in hand. that's how jobs fall apart for me.
Strouty
Well-known member
Sometimes you can't avoid tearing into it to find out.
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
i know, but that turns a 2 day project into a 2 month project. Remember the supply chain is beyond F*cked right now, by the time you pull **** apart, measure, check 5 suppliers, order from 3, wait for shipping, get seals, build tools, assemble, find out 3 seals are wrong, more measuring, more shipping time, reassemble, forget how it went together, research, reassemble, test, you're at 2 months and snows flying, and you had a giant mess in the shop taking up 2 car bays. Ask me how this movie ends....
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
Plus i haven't shared the drama going on with the daughter's car. It's been on the lift a month now. I got the steering rack out, realized the power steering hoses were beyond crusty, ordered the 40 dollar hoses on rockauto, the high pressure one came in and is nowhere close to right. The next higher priced one is over 200 dollars. Nope. Working on ordering the banjo adapter and metric adapter to JIC so i can just get a hose made at Napa. Nothing is easy these days.
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
I went out with a scraper and scraped down the clark mast on both outsides and didn't find anything. Maybe the number is somewhere less obvious. Or not there.
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
FINALLY. Found the serial number of the mast. Pretty painted over.
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
More news. The engine in the Namco is out of a 1972 Namco so the original must have blown or something. At least its a correct replacement engine. Explains the oil filter too.
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
And better news. Hercules had the cylinder kit in stock for my clark mast. About 150. On the way.
And FYI, i know Hercules is not the cheapest supplier but i threw them the business because they were
able to look the mast up and gave me the number, and most of the cheaper suppliers are out of stock and
well, you know how the supply chain is these days..
And FYI, i know Hercules is not the cheapest supplier but i threw them the business because they were
able to look the mast up and gave me the number, and most of the cheaper suppliers are out of stock and
well, you know how the supply chain is these days..
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bimmer1980
Well-known member
That's progress!!!!! Sometimes it's not about the money, but about the service.
Parts on order is good!!!
I have a few various parts that I have on order myself.....
Parts on order is good!!!
I have a few various parts that I have on order myself.....
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
Yep, little by little. Hay bale day is this Saturday, so i have a fire under my ****. I have room for 4 bales in the horse stable and 6 bales in the machinery shed, then when i get the mast swapped they can all get moved to the stable. The lack of room in the machinery shed will be the fire i need to get it done.
In other news, looks like the flywheel on the namco is behind the engine, so i guess that's coming out for the install of the pertronix... mission creep. At least i get to clean the insides better. Also, there's no engine oil drain pipe for the engine, so to drain oil, you pull the plug and let it drain all over the inside of the machine. That explains why the hydro motor area is soaked in oil. It'll get a detroit-diesel style flexible hose with a cap on it for service. It's always something...
In other news, looks like the flywheel on the namco is behind the engine, so i guess that's coming out for the install of the pertronix... mission creep.
At least i get to clean the insides better. Also, there's no engine oil drain pipe for the engine, so to drain oil, you pull the plug and let it drain all over the inside of the machine. That explains why the hydro motor area is soaked in oil. It'll get a detroit-diesel style flexible hose with a cap on it for service. It's always something...bulletpruf
Well-known member
I've starred in that particular movie several times...i know, but that turns a 2 day project into a 2 month project. Remember the supply chain is beyond F*cked right now, by the time you pull **** apart, measure, check 5 suppliers, order from 3, wait for shipping, get seals, build tools, assemble, find out 3 seals are wrong, more measuring, more shipping time, reassemble, forget how it went together, research, reassemble, test, you're at 2 months and snows flying, and you had a giant mess in the shop taking up 2 car bays. Ask me how this movie ends....
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
Lol. Haven't we all...
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
One friggin bolt. One bolt holding the onan in the namco. There sure are a lot of armchair engineers out there.
bimmer1980
Well-known member
Well that was the "easy button" to remove it then....!!!! Is there provision for more than one bolt or was that the only engineered and installed bolt?
Does it have the hydro pump bolted directly to the motor? Any other belt driven items on the engine that would require precise location?
Does it have the hydro pump bolted directly to the motor? Any other belt driven items on the engine that would require precise location?
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
Yep, scope creep.... sigh.
the engine stub shaft direct drives a hydro pump. the front belt sheave drives the generator.
The original engine supposedly had the same bolt pattern as the new one, but they only used the one bolt.
I'm not sure what's going on with the chassis. It needs scraped out so i can see what the heck is going on.
I might drive it over to the house garage and hose it all out if the rain ever stops. I pulled the engine so i could have it
in the shop this weekend. I have the pertronix here and i needed the blower cage off to install that on the flywheel.
The points box gets abandoned in place. Not sure if i'm going to reuse the old coil or just put a different one on there.
i have a Ford 2.5L dual plug coil sitting around from my Ford days i can use.
the engine stub shaft direct drives a hydro pump. the front belt sheave drives the generator.
The original engine supposedly had the same bolt pattern as the new one, but they only used the one bolt.
I'm not sure what's going on with the chassis. It needs scraped out so i can see what the heck is going on.
I might drive it over to the house garage and hose it all out if the rain ever stops. I pulled the engine so i could have it
in the shop this weekend. I have the pertronix here and i needed the blower cage off to install that on the flywheel.
The points box gets abandoned in place. Not sure if i'm going to reuse the old coil or just put a different one on there.
i have a Ford 2.5L dual plug coil sitting around from my Ford days i can use.
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racer-john
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Ford, I thought you were a Chebby man?
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
Lol, no. I have zero Chebby here and at least 7 Fords if you count ones that run. If you count em all, i'm up near 20. You're thinking somebody else.
Strouty
Well-known member
If you had more GM, you would have more time…..,
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
haha don't start.
ClappedOutBport
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If you had more GM, you would have more time…..,
....spent repairing cars.
racer-john
Well-known member
I think I just hit a hornets nest. Lol
Strouty
Well-known member
I don't mind Ford, but I prefer GM, when I was younger and was looking at cars, Ford was twice as expensive to build an engine as GM was. I ended up with a 305 in a Monte Carlo, put a cam, intake, and updated 4 barrel carb, it was fun and didn't break the bank. Had that been a 302, it would have been a lot more expensive, especially once I got to rebuilding 350s. I actually have quite a few fords in the yard right now........
ClappedOutBport
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Lol. I've never owned, dealt with, or repaired either. I see guys online working on both brands a plenty though. Just having a giggle at other's expense. >
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
Yeah ford used to be a lot more expensive. The 5.0 fox bodies changed all that. Now its pretty close anymore.
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
Funny story, i was 1/2 hour from being a GM guy. When i was 16, my parents and i went on vacation in Florida in March 86. Dad and I were looking for an old car for me as first car. For quite a while i had been in love/lust with a 66/67 Chevy Nova. We got all the local car sale rags, pored over them and found a 67 Nova for the right price within driving distance. I called immediately and had no responses for a half a day or so. Kept calling every few minutes for hours. When i finally get thru (no cell phones those days) the guy on the other end of the line says - I sold it a 1/2 hour ago. Sorry.
So dad and I jumped in the car and started cruising around looking and found my Fairlane on the Nissan dealer's lot in Bradenton FL, it was a grandma's car, but it looked right and had no rust for the right price. The rest is history. I still own it today. Been the owner for 35 yrs now.
Strouty
Well-known member
I wish my first car was rust free.
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
All it takes is miles...I wish my first car was rust free.
Strouty
Well-known member
My car had T-tops, I remember removing them, then I was standing in the car and all of a sudden my feet were on the floor, yup, rotted bad enough to fall through. I did learn to gas weld, used old hoods and other random sheet metal, that is one good part about full frame cars, you can fix them fairly easily.
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
Well, you are a big guy... or so you tell me...
1Garageman
Well-known member
Those are some pretty good first car stories. I think we could use some pictures of them, if you have any.
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
I'll have to dig around. Its all pre-digital camera era.
Strouty
Well-known member
I don't even think I have any pictures left of my original car, I wasn't a big fan of pictures when I was younger. When I finally decided to get a camera, I was an early adopter of digital cameras, I had purchased the HP photosmart printer and camera, I even shelled out extra for the big 4mb memory card! Sucky part is, I have a lot of pictures that I took with that camera, but the quality is so bad, you can barely can't even get a 5x7 out of them. I will have to see if I can find one.
They are all in a .tif format and I had to convert it. May of 1998, this was after I put another frame under it, it was damaged in an accident. The car was originally all Chevrolet orange, I had black doors and with the T-Tops it looked like a weird paint job, I did love that car.
They are all in a .tif format and I had to convert it. May of 1998, this was after I put another frame under it, it was damaged in an accident. The car was originally all Chevrolet orange, I had black doors and with the T-Tops it looked like a weird paint job, I did love that car.
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86turbodsl
Well-known member
Speaking of digital cameras, i bought an Olympus early on. That stupid thing was 3MP and cost like $600. And took special batteries. I have it sitting somewhere but man tech goes by fast...