Air compressor advice

[thinktwicez71]

I'm looking at buying one of two used air compressors . Not sure which way to go . One is a saylor beall vt-735-80 that looks brand new but has a bad motor which needs replacing , for $750.00 and is 2.5 hours away .

The second is a devilbliss vap5050 with a 432 compressor on it 100 gallon horizontal for $500 , running, looks usedbut in good shape and runs as is , and only 1 hour away.

What are the pros and cons of each , which is the better compressor and easier to get parts / work on / last longer .

Plans are general use , garage , home mechanic , some small sandblasting / plasma cutting.

 

[larry_g]

Saylor beall is a good machine that one looks to be a 3 phase machine. You know it needs a $400 motor.

The red on I know nothing about but would suggest that you try to find some spare parts for it.. It may be quite old and parts NLA. Look for a date code on the tank.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Majordisorder]

Saylor Beall looks brand new but might not be as indicated by the fresh overspray on the pallet.

 

[kythri]

Big motors aren't cheap.

$750 + a motor is a lot more than a running $500 unit.

Plus, what caused the motor to fry on what looks like a relatively new unit?

Make sure you're buying the right unit for whatever power you're going to hook it up to (i.e. make sure you're not buying a 3-phase unit when you only have single-phase).

 

[thinktwicez71]

I know both units I would be replacing the motors and converting them to single phase , I know the Saylor beall is already 230v. I just didn't know if the 432 pump is a quality pump and comparable to the Saylor

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[kythri]

I'd keep shopping around, if it were me, unless you had a line on a cheap motor that was up to the task.

 

[thinktwicez71]

Big motors aren't cheap.

$750 + a motor is a lot more than a running $500 unit.

Plus, what caused the motor to fry on what looks like a relatively new unit?

Make sure you're buying the right unit for whatever power you're going to hook it up to (i.e. make sure you're not buying a 3-phase unit when you only have single-phase).

New 5hp baldors on eBay for 360 shipped for the Saylor beall , and he said it was just in a shop in Syracuse and the compressor was bench tested there and is in tip top shape but the motor is junk on it. $300 shop charge he said that's why it's $750 For that one . Cost aside what one is a better quieter reliable unit when running ?

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[BuffettFan]

Not sure which is quieter or better, but is floor space a consideration? I bought my horizontal compressor because the vertical was about $100 more IIRC. wish I had those few square feet back.
For blasting, go with the largest tank you can. Mine's 80 gallons with a 2 stage, 5 hp compressor and barely keeps up. Fortunately, I don't do much blasting anymore.
As kythri said, I'd keep shopping.

 

[The Tool Tyrant]

Personally, I'd go with the S-B. Their pumps are great, run at fairly low rpm, are fairly quiet, have centrifugal unloaders...and they're made in the USA. I prefer the vertical tank over horizontal for two reasons, first they take up less real estate and more importantly, I believe they drain the condensation better.
I'm not aware who manufactures the pump on the Devilbiss although it resembles a S-B.
Here is a link to another thread on that pump... www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=152907

Try talking the seller down enough to cover the cost of a new motor...worth a try...I mean, WTH, he wants YOU to cover his 'shop charge', so why shouldn't he cover the cost of a new motor?

 

[thinktwicez71]

He originally wanted 850 I got him to 750 but he won't budge now

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[The Tool Tyrant]

He originally wanted 850 I got him to 750 but he won't budge now

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I think he'll have a difficult time trying to get that much for a non-op compressor unless he happens across someone with a motor in their possession.
Offer him what you believe is fair, and let let him mull it over if you're not in a hurry.

 

[thinktwicez71]

True I'll keep looking or the Saylor beall, 7.5 to 5hp is what I'm looking for

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[thinktwicez71]

I did just come across a interesting find and I feel it is wayyyyy overkill , but a freaking good deal . Saylor beall 10hp horizontal compressor with no motor , obviously need a motor for it and switch but it looks in great shape . I'm sure the 10hp would be pricy , but could I run it with a smaller motor seeing as I need nowhere near 51cfm of the model 4500 pump

Btw it's only $100.00


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[thinktwicez71]

Here is the $100 compressor , I just hope I can use a smaller maybee 5 or 7.5hp and slow it down and not make as many cfm since it's not needed

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[bastage]

Wow for 100 bucks I'd be all over it..

I believe in most cases you can half the horse power and half the rpm and be ok.

 

[thinktwicez71]

Awesome sounds good to me , I plan on going tommorow to look at it and hopefully get it .Its about 2 hours away

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[larry_g]

Here is the $100 compressor , I just hope I can use a smaller maybee 5 or 7.5hp and slow it down and not make as many cfm since it's not needed

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You can go slower on the pump, however there is a minimum recommended speed to operate at. Make sure what that is and the HP to turn that speed. Some of the manufactures put out a chart that will show pressure/speed/HP/cfm's. Make sure that you have the electric power to run it also. Your starting to talk about bit amps here.

on edit, here is an example from Kellogg for pressure/speed/HP/cfm's. http://www.aircompeq.com/ka.htm

edit#2, here is from SB, http://www.saylor-beall.com/pumps/ . If you have a 4500 pump then it looks to be spec'ed for 10-15 hp and may not do well with 5 -7 hp. Also on the SB site they have manuals for the different series pumps you may want to read once you figure out the pump your looking at.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[thinktwicez71]

I have a 100 amp subpanel in my garage and a 60 amp line already for a welder I never got , should handle a 7.5 amp motor

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[Bellaireroad]

This looks like a 4500 pump, which is a beast .... a 5hp will not cut it. As has been said, you may be able to get by with a 7.5 HP running the pump at 500-700 RPM.... problem is this speed may not be adequate for the splash lubrication ... on this pump ...you should call Saylor Beall tech support directly and ask.... at any rate that is an unbelievable deal...it would be awesome for you if it works out...I would not cheap out on the motor... I'd be looking at a 7.5 hp baldor at 1725 rpm ...stay away from the 3450 rpm , not enough torque for that pump ...make sure you have 6 gauge wire from panel to outlet...


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[American Locomotive]

A friend of mine has the same devilbliss compressor, and it's a great unit. Very quiet.

 

[thinktwicez71]

I'm on my way to get the compressor with the 4500 pump on it but it's not going to be for me I talked to my boss and I'm going to get this compressor for him at our farm which has three phase power and I'm going to swap and pay him a little bit for the saylor-beall 7.5 horsepower with the 7:07 pump on it

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[thinktwicez71]

Well looks like,I'm keeping the 4500 , it's in awesome shape , no rust at all , compressor works great guy hooked his motor to it and showed me .I'll keep you posted

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[thinktwicez71]

Here is is loaded before I left

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[sld961]

Looks like a great deal for $100.

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[AJ1978]

Looks like they cut out the belt guard to remove the motor and fan assembly for the belt guard mounted aftercooler. Did you get the fan with it? Also Pulley? I would do some checking as to what size pulleys you need to spin it. Saylor Beall or someone here may be able to help. I mean for 100 bucks I am jealous for sure... Download the manual for it, see if you can get the right pulley. Let us know if you got the fan? I know they have a special mount to mount fan right to motor.

 

[thinktwicez71]

Yeah I got the fan mounted to some special pulley , something about you slide it on and the allen bolts in the back tighten it to the shaft. So the aftercooler will work great. That's the only blemish I see is why they cut that belt guard

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[AJ1978]

AWESOME, Just take your time, make sure your motor and pulley choices spin the pump to the minimum speed needed. Do it right the first time, so you don't have to do it again..

 

[thinktwicez71]

Yeah I will . I called Saylor beall today and asked a guy about motor hp I could use to run the pump and all he would say was the smallest they will run is 10hp , which is what their website says 10-15hp. I'm still trying to decide if a 7.5hp would work fine , or if I have to get a 10hp . Power wise in my building I'm fine with the 10 , just 7.5 is a little cheaper .

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[jjracoon1]

I recently bought a Saylor-Beall 705 compressor form a person on Craigs list knowing they are good compressors. I had him start it up to make sure it ran OK but didn't have him run it to shut-off pressure. Now I find it was switched from 3 phase to single phase,it will build up pressure to 60 psi and then start acting strange. It also has steel pipe between the head and tank and no belt guard and when running I am getting a mild electrical shock when I touch it. I feel taken advantage of but that is my problem and am looking for help.

 

[thinktwicez71]

How will I know if a 7.5hp will work with this compressor ? That's the only thing I'm unsure of , I can spin the compressor pump pullsey by hand and can feel the compression as I do it , will the lower hp motor slow down the speed or struggle at the same speed ?


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[thinktwicez71]

This is the motor pulley and fan that came with it

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[thinktwicez71]

Well I talked to my local electric motor rewind house today. The guy said I could put a 7.5 horse on it , he asked the pulley size on the pump I said 16" and based on 1725 rpm motor the 7.5 hp motor would need a 6" pulley ( right now it has 8" ) .

Only problem is I just measure the pump pulley and it's actually a 20" pulley so I'm not sure if that'll change being able to use the 7.5hp and if so what,that changes to the motor pulley size I'll need , any ideas ?

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[The Cobbler]

a good online calculator for pulley sizes, belt sizes etc here
https://www.blocklayer.com/pulley-belteng.aspx

 

[AJ1978]

I recently bought a Saylor-Beall 705 compressor form a person on Craigs list knowing they are good compressors. I had him start it up to make sure it ran OK but didn't have him run it to shut-off pressure. Now I find it was switched from 3 phase to single phase,it will build up pressure to 60 psi and then start acting strange. It also has steel pipe between the head and tank and no belt guard and when running I am getting a mild electrical shock when I touch it. I feel taken advantage of but that is my problem and am looking for help.

I WOULD START A NEW THREAD ON THIS... I see this is your first post. I ALSO WOULD NOT RUN THIS ANY MORE until you can clarify what is wrong and correct it. Welcome

 

[thinktwicez71]

So based on that calculator, a 1725rpm 7.5hp motor running a 99" belt , and a 776 rpm on the pump would require a 20" pu mp pulley and a 9" motor pulley

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[thinktwicez71]

I just don't get how pump hp plays in if u can just change pulleys , can someone chime in on this

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[The Tool Tyrant]

Well, I'll be the first to say 'You ****', that's a hell of a deal.

I read the SB manual and unfortunately, it doesn't state MINIMUM rpm, only MAXIMUM @ 830 rpm. I did see the copycat LaPlante model giving a minimum rpm of 400, but you need to verify with SB regarding the MINIMUM ACCEPTABLE operating RPM.

Let's say for shits & giggles that minimum rpm is 450. If the motor is 1725 rpm then 450 ÷ 1725 = .261 (rounding off). The 4500 pump pulley is 20", so .261 X 20 = 5.22", which would be your drive pulley size. That's all well and good, but you may have an issue with not enough of a contact patch with the drive belt on that small of a drive pulley which may cause the belt to slip. The only way to increase the contact area is by increasing the distance between the pump and motor. I have a reference sheet regarding pulley contact patch somewhere...I'll look for it.

 

[thinktwicez71]

I believe my standard motor pulley I habe here right now is 8" and a pump pulley is definitely 20" so that would make it spin a little faster and still not be over the max .

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[The Tool Tyrant]

I believe my standard motor pulley I habe here right now is 8" and a pump pulley is definitely 20" so that would make it spin a little faster and still not be over the max .

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Think of the pulley ratios as gears in a manual transmission. If you're pulling a heavy load you need to use a lower gear because the engine doesn't have the power to pull the load in a higher gear.
In order for the 7.5 HP motor to turn the pump, it will need a lower gear ratio...ie, smaller drive pulley. Your 8" drive pulley will be too high of a gear ratio and the motor won't pull it....now do you understand? Using the 8" pulley would give you 690 rpm @ the pump...if the motor could pull it. Your best bet is to verify minimum pump rpm and gear for that and hopefully the belt won't slip.

 

[thinktwicez71]

I understand that analogy perfectly now. I drive tractor trailer on a big farm , so bogging down in a heavy load I understand


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