Above 1200 Sq/FT Barn Workshop build

[ururk]

Saturday, August 1: UGH, August is here. But my electrical should be done in a week or two, so at least I'll have finished that before any second wave in our state.

Finished the emt (repeated on both sides):

This was one of the more complex bends I had to do - it's a saddle with different depths on each side. I ended up downloading an iOS app to help me calculate where to do them.

I'm not happy with the final product - because I err'd on the side of caution and bent it for a 11" obstruction, though the brace was only 7.5" in that direction. I was on the fence about redoing these pieces... but decided against it.

The box at the bottom is strictly to accommodate the extra bends - I debated about running additional circuits in this line but nixed the idea. Once Leviton release their smaller subpanel/load center I'm going to install one on the second floor (erm, I'm assuming this is OK) and run all my electrical for the second floor on it. At that point I might redo this to make it cleaner.

 

[mike93lx]

That looks great. I understand being particular, but you really need to relex a little, IMO. You would get so much more done if you accepted just a little less

 

[InsaneEd]

I think it looks really good and it is all coming along very nicely. I am not sure you are unhappy about with the bends in the picture, they look way better than what I can do. Keep up the had work you are doing great!

 

[ururk]

I think it looks really good and it is all coming along very nicely. I am not sure you are unhappy about with the bends in the picture, they look way better than what I can do. Keep up the had work you are doing great!

Oh, stupid little things. Like, the bends could have started closer to the brace, in a few places my conduit isn't level (mainly on the left side at the back). But, whereas a year or two ago I would have redone them I just said 'meh'.

I'm going to run the wires tomorrow, and hopefully finish the panel at the house. That just leaves calling the township on Monday to schedule an inspection.

 

[ururk]

Sunday, August 2: Finished the wiring inside of the barn.

So empty! I'm holding off on installing breakers until I have the feed hooked up at the house. The cool thing about Leviton's system - it lets you install the wires before any breakers (up to a certain size ampacity/AWG size).

I left these wires a bit too long, might cut them before the inspection. Also a bit concerned the inspector won't like the low-voltage wire being in proximity to the high-voltage. At this point I'm just going to see what he says, and if he fails me I can redo the interior a bit to have the conduit go directly into the LED driver box.

Little spool holder I made:

Using lever Wago wire "nuts" to connect my wires internally. This is setup for a RF-based light switch which I am awaiting, should arrive before Monday (that is, if everything goes well on Thursday, I'll be able to install it for my final on the following Monday). While the box is sized for the # of wires, I probably need to pick up an extension ring to accommodate the additional RF device that needs to fit in here.

 

[FTWingRiders]

Impeccable as always.. glad you finally went with “meh” on a few things. You’ll sleep better, I know I finally did.. LOL! Good luck with your inspection!

 

[Blackhawks63]

If this barn build has taught you anything, I hope it’s being mindful of controlling your **** retentiveness. You agonize over way too many things. You’ve done an impeccable job and need to cut yourself a break. And sometimes, doing things FAST would be healthy for you. I would never worry about you doing a half-a$$ job on anything. And guess what, if the Inspector doesn’t like something then it’s not the end of the world. Just means you have to go back and redo something. Not life and death.

 

[BoilermakerFan]

And because of the attention to detail, your inspector might just tell you to change a couple of things and pass you if you give him your word that you'll change them. Mine did that 20 years ago because I way exceeded NEC minimums on just about everything. All I needed was to add a breaker retention bracket in my garage sub-panel and to move my low voltage CAT 5 drop out in the garage. I moved the CAT5 drop over one stud cavity while he inspected the rest of the house... so he passed me on my word that I would install the bracket when it came in stock. I did.

 

[ururk]

If this barn build has taught you anything, I hope it’s being mindful of controlling your **** retentiveness. You agonize over way too many things. You’ve done an impeccable job and need to cut yourself a break. And sometimes, doing things FAST would be healthy for you. I would never worry about you doing a half-a$$ job on anything. And guess what, if the Inspector doesn’t like something then it’s not the end of the world. Just means you have to go back and redo something. Not life and death.

I'm trying! I realize it seems like a snails pace from outside of my project, but I am moving more quickly than I have in the past. Especially since when I'm not working on it I'm doing other things, so I have very little downtime.

 

[ururk]

Called the township today, uggh. She said - "Well, we only charged you for one inspection so if you can just do the final it'll be one and done." This is just a bit frustrating because I was under the impression that I needed two inspections. So final is on Monday! I went ahead and hooked everything up, will post pics tonight. Just waiting for a moment when I can shut the power off to install the circuit breaker in the house.

 

[ururk]

Wednesday, Aug 5: Took the day off and finished the electrical... mostly. Couldn't turn off the power so did not wire up the feeder at the house, nor an RF light switch.

I'm hopeful I'll be able to work on it this evening, otherwise I'll just wait till the weekend. My free fiber optic cable arrives tomorrow, so will try to get that installed if I finish the electrical.

 

[ururk]

Thursday, Aug 6: Electrical is done! Well, provided the inspector doesn't make me change anything.

Little RF switch for the exterior lights:

Covered up with antenna exposed:

This, THIS will give me nightmares for a while:

It's a mess.

 

[ururk]

Saturday, Aug 8: Installed the fiber-optic cable from house to the barn. Before I was using a tp-link power line ethernet adapter - while it was fast enough I could never get more than 50 Mbps download speed, and it was not always reliable. As for the new setup, the speed is equivalent to what I get at the house over wireless (5GHz) - 114 Mbs (0% loss). Whereas I experience packet loss with the powerline adapter (which is expected, IMHO).

I ended up going with a Ubiquiti AP, rather than mess with mesh (or some abhorrent networking product that includes a "voice assistant/spy"). Time will tell if this was a good decision, but I'll likely replace my aging airports at the house when they fail with these AP's and a dedicated switch.

Also flattened out the last remaining piles from the electrical dig:

Next I need to finish the gas line - it's been languishing a bit, need to find a plumber to add some fittings to the existing line that will let me tie into it.

 

[ururk]

Monday, Aug 10: Electrical was approved! Turned power on and it worked.

He basically wanted to see where the power came in, was OK that I told him it was 18" to top of conduit (didn't need to see pictures).

Was in the barn for at most 10 minutes, asked some questions (wire gauge, # of conductors, separate ground/neutral), and that was it.

I turned power on after he left and it worked. Now, it bugs me a bit that he didn't want to see inside my panels or do any sort of testing whatsoever (ie, "plug in to the outlets to see if I wired them correctly").

So... yes! This is one step closer to finishing things up for good. Obviously I need to wire up some lighting circuits, and some side outlets, but first I'm going to finish the gas line, and will do some decluttering.

 

[fourbyford]

Wow!

You've reached yet another milestone...

Well done!

...D

 

[smschriefer]

Congrats on passing the "inspection"! Sounds like it was the equivalent of going out to the bar on your 21st birthday and not being carded. lol

 

[ururk]

Thursday, Nov 19:

And update of sorts - "officially" (in my mind at least) I only have a few things left to do to call this project complete - the gas line is one of them. Had a plumber come out and help me with this.

Hookup at the house:

Barn:

Right now it's under 15lbs of pressure, will check tomorrow and the next day to ensure it keeps holding. It was 62 out today, not sure what will happen when it cools next week (Inspector is coming Tuesday). I haven't done the thermodynamic equations, doesn't seem worth it

Still have a few small things to do:

1) Wrap tracer wire around the risers
2) Get a clamp for the riser up at the house
3) Install my ground wire
4) Clean up the surrounding area a bit

 

[jollygreengiant]

Am I the only one who can't see any pics?

 

[ururk]

Am I the only one who can't see any pics?

I'm using Instagram - I'll try to post links to pictures directly next time I post. My profile is here:

https://www.instagram.com/wondersofthesmall/

 

[ururk]

Sunday, Nov 22:

Finished the gas install, inspector comes tomorrow.

Link: https://www.instagram.com/p/CH1XK1KJwFZ/

Also, it was 62F out when the system was pressurized to 15psi. The pressure has dropped slightly - by about 0.5psi. The temp is now 33F. So I ran the gas pressure drop calculations:

https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=(16.6+459)/(.555+459)=(15+14.7)/(x+14.7)

https://up.codes/s/example-5-calculating-pressure-drops-due-to-temperature-changes

It comes up with 14psi - this tracks with what the gauge shows. What should I expect when the inspector comes? Will they understand this, or do I need to present my calculations?

 

[ururk]

Tuesday, Nov 24:

Inspector came, approved the gas line!

So, this is pretty great. Later this week when it gets into the 50's I can backfill everything, then that wraps up exterior work until next year.

 

[smschriefer]

Congrats! Are you going to start work on the interior now? I know you have you upstairs office, is it complete, or do you still have work in there too?

 

[ururk]

Congrats! Are you going to start work on the interior now? I know you have you upstairs office, is it complete, or do you still have work in there too?

Thanks! It's a major relief - and today was about 12 degrees warmer, and the gas pressure in the line increased a bit, confirming the drop was due to the colder weather.

The upstairs office is very temporary - consists of two sheets of 3/4 plywood, extension cord, a nice oak table, and a comfortable IKEA chair and I get to walk a 6.5" beam every time I go there to work.

I am evaluating next steps - but I really want to get the second floor finished this winter. That will include subfloor, pex, and finished flooring. I'm evaluating options now, and need to plan an electrical layout which seems like it should be easier to figure out than it really is. I'll be putting in a ships ladder, the kind with alternating full/half steps (supposedly allows descent/ascent without holding a rail). That will greatly reduce the footprint of the stairs, but if it becomes a pain I could always switch to a traditional style stairway.

As with the gas install, I'll probably not document the second floor in as detailed of a fashion as the main project - but I'll try to post updates when I can. I'd like to get my materials in for the subfloor before Christmas - we got extra season days off - which I could use to make some progress. We'll see though.

 

[ururk]

Hey all, thought I'd post an update - and a question.

Due to COVID-related wood price increases, I opted to hold off on the second floor wood decking. In the interim, I started putting stone (real thin stone veneer) around the foundation. I realize - priorities - but the price for the stone basically matched what I had budgeted pre-COVID, so either I got a great deal or the salesman didn't lie when he told me prices have stayed pretty constant in their industry.

I have the lath installed - going to put my scratch coat on tomorrow and all next week when the weather cooperates. Then the fun part begins - setting the stone. I chose this stuff:

TRAILHEAD

generalshale.com

It's about 150 square feet, but I hope to finish this mid-august. I've never done stone like this before, so whatever time it takes it takes.

----- Now for the question

I ran a PVC pipe through the foundation so I could put an outdoor power outlet in. I'd PREFER to mount the outlet on a post in the ground, and not on my structure. I posted a mostly to scale picture - the pipe exits 18" below grade and I currently just have it capped off at the top. I've searched online for various ideas - leaning towards something like Arlington's GPD19B-1 Gard-N-Post... but it's made of plastic. Would prefer metal, or perhaps I could buy a 4x4 plastic timber (Menards carries these) and mount a box to it? A company called PEDOC carries what I want but their prices are around $300 . Any thoughts/ideas would be appreciated!

 

[smschriefer]

First, glad to see you back. As to the question, I think I'd do it out of PVC dimensional lumber and make a decorative top to it. I understand the hesitancy to the first option listed as you know you'll beat it up weed eating. The PVC dimensional approach would be stout and rot resistant.

 

[ururk]

First, glad to see you back. As to the question, I think I'd do it out of PVC dimensional lumber and make a decorative top to it. I understand the hesitancy to the first option listed as you know you'll beat it up weed eating. The PVC dimensional approach would be stout and rot resistant.

Thanks! This is my first time posting since they redid the forums, although I've poked around from time to time.

I was considering that - I have some pieces left over from the project, might just have enough.

Once I finish the foundation stone I'll be putting stone around the perimeter for both weed control and to help with splash back from the rain (I don't have gutters... hoping to avoid putting them on). Also some grading - and a little concrete pad outside my side door. I hope to finish those this summer, still have a few months left.

 

[ururk]

Finished the foundation stone JUST IN TIME for cooler weather to roll in.

Some notable things:

• 3D printed a grommet to go over the stone edge where my gas pipe goes in. Thinking of using electrical putty to "seal" the pipe (pipe is held in place by a link-seal, so this would just be to prevent bugs from making a house in the hole).
• Against all common sense, I carved the year my foundation was put in (yeah, 2015), used a piece of limestone and did it by hand.
• I'm never going to do a stone veneer project ever again

I might have mentioned my gas line depressurized since being inspected. Well, I suspected the pressure gauge was at fault, so I repeated it with both valves shut - months went by. The 18" segment on the gauge side lost all pressure - the section underground between both valves never lost any. I'm pretty confident it's the gauge, leak detecting fluid didn't detect any leaks at the joints.

In other news... I'm done with outdoor stuff this season, will have to get to grading in the spring (unless I can convince a bunch of people to help me out, any takers? ). I'm probably going to order soil for a winter delivery (when the ground is frozen) so the truck can drop it off right by the barn (not sure if that's even possible, but one can hope). Maybe I'll rent a Home Depot truck and do a few loads that way... loads of time to figure this all out.

Besides posting about the foundation, a week ago I checked in on wood prices - since June they've fallen over 40%, with one lumber yard over 50%. Placed an order for 600sqft of T&G 2x8 decking, should have it in a few weeks (they mill the stuff from kild dried stock). I couldn't find a cheaper price, and I called all the usual suppliers in my area.

 

[jollygreengiant]

Finished the foundation stone JUST IN TIME for cooler weather to roll in.

Some notable things:

• 3D printed a grommet to go over the stone edge where my gas pipe goes in. Thinking of using electrical putty to "seal" the pipe (pipe is held in place by a link-seal, so this would just be to prevent bugs from making a house in the hole).
• Against all common sense, I carved the year my foundation was put in (yeah, 2015), used a piece of limestone and did it by hand.
• I'm never going to do a stone veneer project ever again

I might have mentioned my gas line depressurized since being inspected. Well, I suspected the pressure gauge was at fault, so I repeated it with both valves shut - months went by. The 18" segment on the gauge side lost all pressure - the section underground between both valves never lost any. I'm pretty confident it's the gauge, leak detecting fluid didn't detect any leaks at the joints.

In other news... I'm done with outdoor stuff this season, will have to get to grading in the spring (unless I can convince a bunch of people to help me out, any takers? ). I'm probably going to order soil for a winter delivery (when the ground is frozen) so the truck can drop it off right by the barn (not sure if that's even possible, but one can hope). Maybe I'll rent a Home Depot truck and do a few loads that way... loads of time to figure this all out.

Besides posting about the foundation, a week ago I checked in on wood prices - since June they've fallen over 40%, with one lumber yard over 50%. Placed an order for 600sqft of T&G 2x8 decking, should have it in a few weeks (they mill the stuff from kild dried stock). I couldn't find a cheaper price, and I called all the usual suppliers in my area.

Hey look , pictures!

Looks good! I hear you on the lumber prices, so nice to finally see them come down to more reasonable levels.

 

[FTWingRiders]

Looking great! I did the stone veneer, (well, I paid someone), on my barn… made all the difference in the world covering up the concrete. Well worth it.

 

[racer-john]

Just finished going through your build.
Well done, building looks great.

Just as JGG said not so far back, I couldn't see any pics, just the word "media". However the latest couple of pics showed ok.
Now you can enjoy your BARN.

 

[ururk]

Just finished going through your build.
Well done, building looks great.

Thanks!

Just as JGG said not so far back, I couldn't see any pics, just the word "media". However the latest couple of pics showed ok.
Now you can enjoy your BARN.

Ah, yes, I had been using Instagram, but it turns out if you don't have a login (there is likely a tie-in with a Facebook cookie as well) the images don't load. Over the winter break I'm going to try and migrate all my photos (from Flickr/Instagram) to my website. I will hopefully be able to do a bit of scripting to make the job easier.

 

[ururk]

Lumber was delivered last week, got it into the barn (ended up having to carry it - ground was too soft). Right now it's a comfortable 50 inside - enough that I need a light jacket, but no layers as of yet.



At the moment I'm decking in the second floor - doing some prep work first - sanding (some of the beams got water stains during the build) and relocation of electrical conduit (my exterior lighting circuits... should have installed the conduit higher). Once I start putting in boards I'll post some photos.

I'm also trying to decide whether to put a mini-split in. I have tubes in the concrete for radiant, and ran my own gas line... but it only cost me materials - labor was all me. I loathe the idea of putting in a mini-split to heat, with electric being so much more expensive than gas... but running tubes on the second floor is going to be a challenge, flat panel radiators are probably the better option there, and I'd still have to buy a boiler, associated piping (or have the system made up). Depending on the mini-split I could install most of it myself and have an HVAC tech finish the install.

 

[ConCretin]

deleted. didn't read far enough.

 

[ururk]

Ack - almost a year. What's happened?

• 1/3 of the flooring is installed
• Learned how to weld aluminum ("good enough") and welded a set of nesting frames for a hatch
• Built a set of stairs

So yeah - not a lot. Been traveling in and out of town frequently the past year, which is my only legit excuse for slacking off.

Yep - place is a mess. But I'm making progress. I wasted a few months where I was trying to figure out how to build the stairs and a hatch.


This is about where I left off with the flooring - two boards past the posts:



The hatch... the hatch is intended to lift bulky items up to the second floor - I don't think it will get a lot of use. I oversized it, which means it's going to weigh a bit (around 50lbs) once done. I called around to a few welding places but couldn't get anyone to give me a quote so I bit the bullet and learned how to weld aluminum. They are pitiful tack welds (TIG), but they hold it together and hopefully won't break. This process was not without it's challenges - I worked on it at a workshop I have access to. They have limited equipment - so I had to cut my 45's on a Bridgeport for each piece, plus the aluminum stock had to be cut down to height, which takes quite a bit of time with a manual mill.



Taken just a few days ago - after staining some boards waiting for it to soak in:



I sourced some lumber for the stairs (10" x 8/4 x 12'), after cutting it into pieces reluctantly learned Fusion 360 CAM so I could set up toolpaths to cut the steps. I built a set of alternating tread stairs. This took two months, which in my opinion, is a personal best for quickest completion time.



Ignore the line - I was going to notch these at 5" but realized 4.75" was the right depth.



all steps installed, including the unexpected 18th step. My plans were for 17, but after completing it I realized there would be a hug gap at the top where the stair met the stringers. So I made the top step overnight, polyurethaned it, notched the stringer, and had it installed in less than two days.



Better view of the stairs, pre-18th step. Doing the notches at the top whilst installed were... interesting. As for fixing it to the floor, I drilled two 1/2" holes to epoxy bolts into.



And finally I was able to install 4 more floor boards. At this point it's going to slow down as I route the board that goes around the hatch, but only a little - my ultimate goal is to get the floor done as soon as humanly possible. After which I'll get to do some fun work putting in electrical outlets on the second floor, once done move all my tools that belong in this space.

Project-wise, I aim to do a light "restoration" of that Dunlap drill press - not a full repaint - but I want to get some experience as I have a vintage ceiling fan I'd like to restore and install on the second floor.

 

[j p smith]

WOW, awesome stairs

 

[smschriefer]

Agreed. I love those stairs!

 

[ururk]

Also - this style of stair gets a lot of love/hate on the internet. I went back and forth between a winder, spiral stairs, and this. Do I like them? Yes. Would I put them in a house? No. They are comfortable enough going up down - but you can't run up/down them. They feel safe, and they are functionally equivalent to the stairs in the house. If I was redoing this project, would I make them again? Yes - but I'd probably do a 52 degree angle instead of 60. That change wouldn't be for me - it would be for others who use the stair. I'm hoping railings make a difference because it would be sad if I was the only one who could use them comfortably. I had my family members try it out - it went well but they were - let's just say - hesitant.

 

[dfiler2]

Looking good, thanks for the update. I built a couple of sets of stairs like that about 15 years ago, they are both still in use today. They do take a little getting used to, the one mistake I made with mine is you lead with your left foot. I see you did yours so you lead with your right, much better I think.

 

[ururk]

I see you did yours so you lead with your right, much better I think.

It was a compromise - it was either right at the top or bottom, and I'm so glad I picked the bottom. My plan was for 17 steps which meant the top would be left first going down. With the 18th step, balance was restored to the world and it's right foot both ways

 

[FTWingRiders]

Amazing as always! I am in awe of your tenacity and grit to not cut corners even after all this time. You should be proud!