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Above 1200 Sq/FT Eastern Washington Workshop

Wokspaces above 1200 squarefeet.

Bob Heine

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Oct 24, 2009
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Boca Raton, Florida
Thanks Steven, I was doing fine adding Knipex pliers to my collection. Now I have to wait for those M12 bandfiles to go on sale or turn up at a pawn shop. I have 3 pneumatic and 1 electric bandfile in my current collection. Maybe I should get a paying job.
 
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slodat

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Feb 6, 2010
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3,679
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Central-ish, WA
It has been a busy couple of weeks in the shop working on this sheet metal project. End point is in sight. I have a few parts to paint today, and get them wrapped up and shipped out.

One of the biggest challenges/time ***** has been the paint. (I do plan to switch to powder coat at some point in the future.) I’m using an industrial acrylic. It’s water borne, very low VOC, and is supposed to be a very durable finish. This is, of course, dependent on proper application. I spent untold hours and numerous trips to paint shops trying to get it sorted out. The challenge has been it is a very thick paint. I’ve settled out on a temporary solution to get the project finished- I’m using a cordless Graco pump type sprayer with their “fine finish” tip. It’s unwieldy to say the very least. It is getting the mill thickness and the finish is durable from what I have been able to tell on test parts. In general I’m a big fan of 3M’s modular Accuspray setup.

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The tip is removable, replaceable, and disposable. No fluid flows through the gun. The paint is in their PPS cup with a disposable lid (with filter) and liner. This makes changeovers and cleanup truly effortless. I’ve had this setup for a long time and I’ve grown to really appreciate how much it simplifies spraying paint. It turns out even with the filter removed, a 2.0mm tip, and reduced paint it doesn’t flow this paint well enough to keep up. Figuring this out kicked my *** and took a LOT of time. It does appear they have a solution.

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Their HGP gun has a pressurized cup that puts pressure on the PPS liner to force the paint into the tip. This will be here next week. I’ll use the Graco setup until then. The Graco setup creates an overwhelming amount of overspray, it’s nearly uncontrollable, and let’s just say I’m having to live with finish quality issues I wouldn’t normally be okay with. Luckily this is not a show car!

A little about the parts themselves. This is a low voltage (480v) electrical switchboard:

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The end user wants those breakers removed and two larger breakers installed in their place. We measured just about every aspect of this section, the engineers designed the parts, I made the parts per their drawings, @cycle61 and team are handling the installation.

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Both breakers installed.

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Unfortunately the design was off and the field team had to make the insert in the door that trims out the breaker, in the field. They did a great job.

I switched over the tumbler to ceramic to try tumbling parts of the CNC plasma. It did a great job.

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This was a huge timesaver. These parts get formed and then have two small gussets welded in.

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Those gussets are a bit of a challenge to get welded in correctly. The Fireball tool magnetic 123 blocks were a lifesaver! They turned out nice in the end.

Some of the freshly painted parts..

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Lastly this is an example of the testing tools I make in use:

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They are temporary conductors for high current primary injection testing of the new breakers. They are tested with real current (at a very low voltage) to ensure all functions work when called upon prior to being put into service.
 
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slodat

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Feb 6, 2010
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3,679
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Central-ish, WA
Looking good Steven! Is it worth tab/slot locating the gussets? Eliminates the need for the Fireball block. The tumbled finish looks great!
Thank you! It's not worth the effort, and it's not in the design. The layout takes... 10 seconds no joke. It's that the weld is in a corner in a 2" wide channel. They are working out well. It's all a process with lots of learning and refinement along the way.
 

MadeByMiller

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Joined
Dec 29, 2018
Messages
1,230
Location
Rapid City, SD
Thank you! It's not worth the effort, and it's not in the design. The layout takes... 10 seconds no joke. It's that the weld is in a corner in a 2" wide channel. They are working out well. It's all a process with lots of learning and refinement along the way.
Got it. IF they were slot/tabbed you could just weld the backside of the tab though and not have to worry about fitting the nozzle into the awkward channel.
 
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slodat

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Got it. IF they were slot/tabbed you could just weld the backside of the tab though and not have to worry about fitting the nozzle into the awkward channel.
Copy that. I'm not in charge of the design. I'm the guy making them ;) The nice thing about this setup is there's no trial and error getting the tab slot sorted, and it goes really fast.

In a more general sense, I want to get a workflow dialed in for tab and slot stuff. It's really handy and can yield some clean results.
 
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slodat

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Feb 6, 2010
Messages
3,679
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Central-ish, WA
Came up with this idea for painting both sides of parts in the same session. I set them face down on the TIG rod, spray them, then flip, and paint the top. The rod supports the part with very little surface contact. It works well for these parts.

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Finished welding these 1.25” x 2” gussets. The magnetic 123 block works great for holding in place.

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I settled on a good tack weld near the corner on the vertical leg.

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That pulls the longer leg to the side. A few taps with a small hammer and it’s back to square. Then I lay the longer bead. Generally speaking I’m happy with the long bead. I know I don’t know how to weld vertical. Because of this I weld the other leg flat by turning the part.

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The shorter weld is always bulkier. I feel like I’m using the same small round circle motion. I’m sure there’s a lesson here for me in this weld. I get good penetration, consistent HAZ, and I know the weld is going to do its job. I have a welder buddy I’m going to ask about it when I see him next. I think it might be the angle of the torch. I’ve tried several variations and it’s pretty consistent.

Several of these parts ready for paint prep:

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DennisK59

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Joined
May 21, 2021
Messages
205
I think you need to start with the filler rod then back it out and let flow until the weld fillet gets thin, then add more filler. Overhead welds w/stick AC/DC are not bad, Tig seems like a black art to go back uphill for a continuous weld.
 
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macgyver37

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 7, 2013
Messages
608
Location
Pittsburg, Kansas
My suggestion on the weld; after the tack, start at the tip of the long edge as there is the least amount of material there and if you end there, the gusset is hot and it won't take the same amount of filler without washing out. Run the weld towards the corner app a third the length, then I'd vertical down weld the short side and turn the corner and finish into the end of the previous weld. Vertical down gets a bad rap, but for this I think it would be the best, it looks great and the small amount of less penetration compared to vertical up I do not think would be a concern. It will minimize the dingle berries too and clean up easier etc. Vertical down is very easy to do, you likely won't even need to whip the torch, just draw it down in pace with the puddle formation. Try a few scrap pcs this way and see what you think. One other savings is you won't need to reposition to finish the welding.

Also, might look at a smaller wire size for these if you have some available, see if that helps lay it out nicer or easier to control.

One other thing to think about, I have used straight CO2 for a shield gas for years because it works for me and I am cheap. If you really need to get a nicer looking weld and where it will lay flatter etc, use an Argon mix, it makes a noticeable difference. My guess is you are already, but thought I'd bring it up.
 

cycle61

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 5, 2020
Messages
500
Location
Middle of Oregon
The field shop isn't quite as fancy as the Eastern Washington shop but we make do. Thank you for the specific tooling suggestions!

Door skin from a piece of equipment that's being removed serving as a pre-painted, color matched donor panel.

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Test fit
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Cleaning up the edges.
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We scratched the paint quite a bit on the first installation, so some touch-up was required.
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Internal trimming and fitting to get legal clearance between the electrical bus and the support pieces
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slodat

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Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
3,679
Location
Central-ish, WA
Some tidbits on the mill, you can get new keypad membranes cheap from china, but be wary, there have been quite a few people that put them on to find out they press multiple keys at once and when they power up the machine it deletes the parameters. There has been multiple people that have not had any issues as well, but I have been advised by a tech that has had to restore the parameters to just buy new from Fanuc and not risk it.
Also, there are knobs on the back of the crt that you can adjust brightness etc if you need to mess with it. I had to make mine a hint brighter to read the ladder as the crt does get dimmer with age. There are also quite a few LCD screen upgrades for them as well if you want to go that route. I have not yet as mine works fine, but a quick search and you will find a few forum threads with suggestions on which kit or parts.

Last thing for now, if you do not have a backup of the parameters, do that first thing. I am talking about the 900 series params, my Leadwell had them printed out in the manual. Hopefully you got them with it. If not, you can download them off the control, you'll have to look it up as I don't remember at the moment. If the batteries die and you don't have them backed up you now have a big brick in the shop until you get them from someone and hope they are the same exactly as what your machine needs.

If you don't know, Do Not take the batteries out without the machine powered on, that is what the batteries are for, to save the memory while the power is off, taking them out erases the memory.
If you have a reliable Fanuc parts contact, please send it my way!

I installed the keypad I bought. It seems to be of at least as good quality as the old beat up one it replaced.

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I got the machine homed out. I know literally nothing about this control. Lots to learn.
 
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slodat

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Feb 6, 2010
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Central-ish, WA
Lots going on lately. Showed my tooling kits at a small trade show for the specific niche industry that uses this sort of thing. Got some great feedback, sweet praise, and ideas for changes and new products. All in all a great trip.

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Hopefully some purchase orders come in as well.

It’s time to clean and re-zero the shop after the rushed sheet metal order and mad dash to get ready for the show.
 
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slodat

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Feb 6, 2010
Messages
3,679
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Central-ish, WA
Had an issue with the Z axis on the CNC plasma. Shop Sabre’s support is really great. Sent them a photo via email and they let me know the bearing is a R8. This is the ball screw upper radial support bearing. It failed. Completely.

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I was left with the inner race on the ball screw.

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Thankfully I had a suitable puller setup:

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And, off!

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Replacement went on with a tap of the brass hammer.

I have a couple of sheet metal orders to knock out. 11 sheets total- 9 x 14ga and two 12 ga should get it done. I’m using cold rolled. It makes paint prep rather easy with a RO sander. 14ga 4x8 sheet weighs 100lb, 12ga comes in at 140lb. Heavy enough they aren’t easy to wrestle around the shop.

I came up with this system on the last order:

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Slide out of the truck, onto the work table. When ready, slide onto the plasma. This is working well and not putting my back at risk.

More to follow!
 

Finallygotit

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Jul 6, 2013
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4,076
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Tucson, AZ
Holy ****! I've seen dry bearings fall apart like that but not a lubed bearing. I take it no damage to the ballscrew? Glad you got that straightened out.

:beer:
 
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slodat

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The Z axis, by design, falls when the control is powered down. This means the torch crashes into whatever it is above. This can cant the torch hard, putting radial load on the ballscrew because of the heavy Z axis with the drill unit. They should have included a brake on the Z. I have a small chunk of wood I put in place to prevent it from falling all the way. It’s an overall somewhat good machine, with some really piss poor design decisions. It was far from low price. This **** pisses me off. I would have happily paid a little more for a z axis brake. I bought this machine because I wanted the drill unit. I’m quite happy it has it.
 
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slodat

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OK, that just baffles me that they would design a machine in such a way to let the Z axis fall and basically crash! But knowing you, I bet you figure out a work around.

:beer:
There’s a handful of things they do because “we can’t include every good idea and keep the price where it’s at”, or some similar ********. This is a $35k machine not a bottom dollar $7k bolt together Langmuir. To be clear, nothing wrong with the low cost machines. They make this technology accessible to the home shop guy and that’s a big deal. My point is, for this class machine, it’s not low priced.

The reasons I went with this machine were the drill unit, the mechanical construction, the Clearpath servos with planetary gear reduction, and Shop Sabre’s excellent support reputation. They have absolutely lived up to the customer support reputation and any expectations I’ve had. They are great to work with. I just wish they’d do the following. I would have happily paid more:
  • Stop using WinCNC for the control. It’s a ************* at best. While it “works”, it leaves SO much to be desired. Centroid’s CNC plasma THC control is light years better in every way. And it would cost Shop Sabre less.
  • A power disconnect on the drill unit VFD. The 240vac power cord is their idea of a disconnect.
  • Control of drill motor speed in the control. It’s all there, they just don’t wire and configure.
  • The control panel door hinges down. So when you open it you have to reach over it or possibly sit on it to do anything inside the control enclosure.
  • The $550 keyboard and monitor stand is a joke. It’s about 24” from the floor at its highest setting. It’s just bad.
  • The Z axis falling until it comes to rest on whatever is below it is beyond me. The brake option for that motor is like $100.
With all that grumpy ranting sounding stuff said, I’m making parts with it. The cuts are good. I’ve worked with Autodesk to get the post processor updated so Fusion can post code for the plasma, drill, and air scribe.

Time will tell if I decide to change out the control. For now I have a solid, reliable work flow and I really appreciate Shop Sabre’s support when I need it.
 

Finallygotit

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I understand them saying “we can’t include every good idea and keep the price where it’s at” but they "could" let the customer add things to the machine ala carte. But what do I know................

:beer:
 
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slodat

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Feb 6, 2010
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Central-ish, WA
What's the point of having a shop full of machines if I don't enjoy them, right?!

A while back the forklift ignition switch seemed to take a **** in the start position. Got by using a screwdriver to short the terminals on the starter while the weather was less than ideal. Getting this fixed has been on the shortlist since it went down. I really try to keep up on the maintenance at the shop. After all, it's how I'm supporting myself. Whelp, nice sunny weather today was perfect to take a look and see what's going on. Couple of tests confirmed the ignition switch start contact was no longer conducting. This is a really common '70's Jeep style switch. Local Napa had one in stock. This is not the norm living in such a small town.

Both switches old and new came with this **** thin sheet stamped backer nut to set the offset from the panel.

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I had the top nut off the old switch, and I have a lathe (or more). It's designed with a shoulder that bottoms out on the top of the switch. This would prevent it from threading down enough to replace the little stamped nut.

Insert Pacemaker:

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This is exactly what the bump alignment tool is for! Once its running true, tighten the chuck up snug and get to work taking light passes with a sharp tool.

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All in all, a five-minute job on the lathe. Quite satisfying and it works much better. It's good to have the forklift back to 100%. On to the next!
 

GeddyT

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Jun 17, 2015
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Bellingham, WA
Sometimes, these are the most satisfying projects. The ones that go both quickly and exactly as planned. I have a lock that secures the hitch ball to my truck's receiver. When I switched trucks, the new one had slightly thicker steel for the receiver, so the lock pin was about 1/8" too short to engage with the lock. Off to the lathe, a bit off the non-functioning handle side, and working lock again in five minutes.

Many times, I've had people ask me, "What do you make with these machines?"

My answer is always, "Whatever I want!"
 

GeddyT

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Jun 17, 2015
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Bellingham, WA
Years ago right after I got the laser I was placing my first order of acrylic at a plastics distributor. He asked me what I was going to make with all the acrylic. I said the same thing - Whatever I want!

When the insurance adjuster was sifting through and cataloging all my burnt belongings after the shop fire, she came to the pile of materials and the conversation got weird. This stuff was all burned past usefulness, but you could surprisingly still tell what all of it was. She asked about the two rolls of white fabric and the roll of black fabric, and I told her fiberglass mat, fiberglass weave, carbon fiber weave. She gives me this "what!?" look and then asks what the black puddle of goo under them was, and I told her it was ultra high molecular weight polyethylene.

"What the hell is that?"

Me: "It's a really tough and slippery plastic that's typically used as a bearing surface."

Her: "Why do you have this? Why do you have all of this!?"

Me: "I don't know, I like to make stuff!"
 

lilscorpion

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Joined
Mar 15, 2010
Messages
3,599
Location
Colorado
When the insurance adjuster was sifting through and cataloging all my burnt belongings after the shop fire, she came to the pile of materials and the conversation got weird. This stuff was all burned past usefulness, but you could surprisingly still tell what all of it was. She asked about the two rolls of white fabric and the roll of black fabric, and I told her fiberglass mat, fiberglass weave, carbon fiber weave. She gives me this "what!?" look and then asks what the black puddle of goo under them was, and I told her it was ultra high molecular weight polyethylene.

"What the hell is that?"

Me: "It's a really tough and slippery plastic that's typically used as a bearing surface."

Her: "Why do you have this? Why do you have all of this!?"

Me: "I don't know, I like to make stuff!"
Two things you said frightened the $hit out of me.

1) the thought of having a garage fire

2) having to articulate to anyone why I’ve accumulated the stuff I have

😆
 
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