Homemade electrolysis. What do you use?

[Craptain]

For those running PSUs, are you running switching models?

Most switching psu's will be fine. But the automatic chargers are a type of switching psu that will not work. I have previously used a converted computer psu and it had outputs in several voltages. Search back in this thread for plenty of info and links.

Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk

 

[Outlawmws]

If you run a light bulb in series with a charger, you won't run the risk of killing it if the plates short out. An old tail light bulb will work.

Somehow I was thinking on the primary side of the transformer, not the secondary side...

Doing the Primary side like that a an old time way to not kill a tube amp while testing it. Depending on the bulb wattage you can reduce the voltage quite a bit!

I'l have to give that a try next time I run my E tank...

 

[trijeff]

TJ: i'm not sure how to hook up a computer to power up an Electrolysis tank so could you take a few pictures to show us the next time you use yours? i have several old battery chargers that will probably work great, but still would like to know and others i'm sure would too. here's a link to the homemade electrolysis thread we made last year if you have time to add it there too.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=237752&highlight=homemade+electrolysis

Hey Drives, no problem. Here is the setup and I also posted it in the Vise Repair 101 thread as you requested.

What I did is:

1. cut the end that went to the computer
2. stripped about 8" of the insulation from the outside cable
3. stripped about 3" of the insulation from the inside cables
4. soldered alligator clips to the inside stripped cables
5. covered the cable-to-clip connections with heat shrink tubing

The alligator clips don't go in the water themselves, the positive is connected to a wire that I have looping around rebar attached to the sides of the tank (sacrificial anodes) and the negative gets clipped to gate wire that I have attached to the piece(s) to be de-gunked.

I had originally tried electrolysis with an old military batter charger I purchased specifically for the task but, even though it's really old, the charger is "smart" and knows when there is not anything to charge (i.e., when the battery to which it is connected reaches a full charge) and then turns off - it was happening within seconds of being turned on. It would have been neat if it did work because there is three separate chargers in the one unit and all of them have adjustable voltage and amperage. After it failed (for electrolysis) I looked into other solutions because I didn't want to buy another battery charger and that's when I stumbled upon the computer power source.

Really, you can use any type of transformer plug that transforms 110/120VAC 20A wall power. In my research I found 12VDC and 1A amperage is ideal (even though it takes longer than with higher voltage and especially with higher amperage) so I just looked through my e-waste pile and found something close. The ideal volts/amperage had something to do with keeping the microscopic structure of the iron intact/properly aligned, but that's all a bit beyond me, I just looked for people who knew what they were talking about and used those figures. Once complete, I REALLY monitored the first "cook" closely as I had no prior experience with electrolysis and especially because I was not using the typical battery charger method, but everything went swimmingly and now I let things cook for a week or more without a second thought. Much to my wife's chagrin, the "rust bucket" is up and running nearly all the time, I use it on vises and so much more.

I'm sure this is noted earlier in this thread, but make sure to: (a) do outdoors and (b) only use GFCI protected outlets.


Let me know if you have any questions and anyone else feel free to do the same.

***Use this method at your own risk, I am not responsible for any bodily, property or environmental harm that should befall you or others if attempting this method - it's simply something that's worked for me.***

 

[Jon.H]

Quick question. I'm running my setup with a 2amp charger on to rebar. I am finding that it is taking the surface rust but leaving virtually all of the more deep seeded rust on it. When I hit whats left with some sandpaper it does come off. My question is; Will this deeper rust come off if I leave the tool in for longer? or is there a trick I am missing?

 

[CwazyWabbit]

Deeper rust will come off when left longer, you may have to clean your sacrificial electrodes depending on how much surface area they have.

EDIT: If you look at the front face of the dynamic jaw in these two pictures it shows how deep the rust was, it's all gone in the second picture and all it's had is electrolysis, pressure wash and dried with compressed air.

 

[drivesitfar]

All: anybody use this Electrolysis method and want to share pictures of their tank and set up please do. i'm getting ready to finally set up mine some day soon and wondered if there is any new or better ideas since we completed this thread last year?

anybody use a steel tank because i have one on wheels the i could use that is about 2 foot square. i have rubber padding to put on the base to keep from shorting out or would i need something else?

cheers

 

[SeattleKent]

anybody use a steel tank because i have one on wheels the i could use that is about 2 foot square. i have rubber padding to put on the base to keep from shorting out or would i need something else?

cheers

I don't think you want to use a steel tank because it will corrode as the donor metal. I use a plastic trough of a plastic garbage can.

 

[drivesitfar]

SK: i'm planning on using a black and yellow storage container that i bought at Costco, but i know some of the guys were talking about using an old cast iron bath tub or cast iron something that will hold water.

have you showed your set up? please do and let us know some details on what you put in there and for how long and any wire brushing or washing off afterwards if you can.

thanks and anybody else use a steel or cast iron tub?

 

[SeattleKent]

Here is a thread on restoring a Snap On tool chest. Post 7, 27, and 57 show my electrolysis set up and give some details of the process.

 

[Fretters]

anybody use a steel tank because i have one on wheels the i could use that is about 2 foot square. i have rubber padding to put on the base to keep from shorting out or would i need something else?

It's not worth the hassle DIF, unless you have a cast iron container which you're planning on using as the cathode. If you tried that with a steel container, you'd get a couple of weeks tops out of it before it pinholed.

Tried this two or three years ago with an old gas cylinder. Inside was painted, bar the hole at the bottom for the drain valve. I wired the supply through a relay so that any leakage would trip the relay and cut the supply. It only made it through a week or two before the relay was chattering away like buggery due to their being enough leakage to power the relay coil.

That cylinder is currently acting as a plant pot for an apple tree, until I decide where to plant it.

 

[drivesitfar]

SK: awesome tool box restoration. did the drawers in your small Snap on roller box fit in the garbage can E tank you set up?

Fretters: i thank you for sharing your wisdom and humor as always. good to have a few fruit trees in the yard. my wife just brought in a few figs from our fig tree. since you have similar climate you might want to grow one. guaranteed if you like plums you'll like fresh figs.

 

[SeattleKent]

SK: did the drawers in your small Snap on roller box fit in the garbage can E tank you set up?

Yes. I just wandered around the house looking for something big enough. The search stopped at the garbage cans.

Similar for the main cabinet - the kiddie pool was the only thing that would work.

 

[drivesitfar]

SK: I've heard kiddie's pools work. nice to know. i do have a few big plastic garbage cans and even a few metal 50 or 100 gallon barrels?

 

[bagged89s10]

I just made a new electrolysis tank today. Bought a 27 gallon container, 6 pieces of 1/2"x24" rebar, and some rebar tying wire from Home Depot.


Measured and cut the rebar to be even with the top of the container.


I drilled 2 small 1/16" holes at each rebar location.

Used the tying wire to secure the rebar.

I went all the way around the outside and used some scrap 12 gauge house wire and wire nuts to tie all the rebar together.

 

[bagged89s10]

I then made a loop to make it easier to connect my battery charger positive cable.



I ran some tying wire on the inside as well.

Put a Wilton in there

And it's cooking


One vise was done and I put an American scale in there and covered it to cook overnight.

 

[bagged89s10]

Hey Drives, no problem. Here is the setup and I also posted it in the Vise Repair 101 thread as you requested.



What I did is:

1. cut the end that went to the computer
   
2. stripped about 8" of the insulation from the outside cable
   
3. stripped about 3" of the insulation from the inside cables
   
4. soldered alligator clips to the inside stripped cables
   
5. covered the cable-to-clip connections with heat shrink tubing
   

The alligator clips don't go in the water themselves, the positive is connected to a wire that I have looping around rebar attached to the sides of the tank (sacrificial anodes) and the negative gets clipped to gate wire that I have attached to the piece(s) to be de-gunked.



I had originally tried electrolysis with an old military batter charger I purchased specifically for the task but, even though it's really old, the charger is "smart" and knows when there is not anything to charge (i.e., when the battery to which it is connected reaches a full charge) and then turns off - it was happening within seconds of being turned on. It would have been neat if it did work because there is three separate chargers in the one unit and all of them have adjustable voltage and amperage. After it failed (for electrolysis) I looked into other solutions because I didn't want to buy another battery charger and that's when I stumbled upon the computer power source.



Really, you can use any type of transformer plug that transforms 110/120VAC 20A wall power. In my research I found 12VDC and 1A amperage is ideal (even though it takes longer than with higher voltage and especially with higher amperage) so I just looked through my e-waste pile and found something close. The ideal volts/amperage had something to do with keeping the microscopic structure of the iron intact/properly aligned, but that's all a bit beyond me, I just looked for people who knew what they were talking about and used those figures. Once complete, I REALLY monitored the first "cook" closely as I had no prior experience with electrolysis and especially because I was not using the typical battery charger method, but everything went swimmingly and now I let things cook for a week or more without a second thought. Much to my wife's chagrin, the "rust bucket" is up and running nearly all the time, I use it on vises and so much more.



I'm sure this is noted earlier in this thread, but make sure to: (a) do outdoors and (b) only use GFCI protected outlets.





Let me know if you have any questions and anyone else feel free to do the same.



***Use this method at your own risk, I am not responsible for any bodily, property or environmental harm that should befall you or others if attempting this method - it's simply something that's worked for me.***

Thanks for that info. I have a broken charger from an old laptop. It's 19v, 4.64amps though. Do you think it's too much power?

Also I have blue, black, and a white wire. Which wire do I use as the positive and negative?

 

[scooternut]

Nice setup bagged, looks like we are very much on the same page here. The rebar gets heavily corroded and must be removed for cleaning each use so I had a slightly different idea here.

I too use the rebar, and rebar wire, but I used some pegboard type stuff to hold the rebar. I just enlarged the holes, made one for a 5 gallon bucket as well. This allows very easy setup and removal. Also, allows a variety of different insertion locations to work around large and or bulky awkward items.... like big vises

 

[bagged89s10]

Nice setup bagged, looks like we are very much on the same page here. The rebar gets heavily corroded and must be removed for cleaning each use so I had a slightly different idea here.



I too use the rebar, and rebar wire, but I used some pegboard type stuff to hold the rebar. I just enlarged the holes, made one for a 5 gallon bucket as well. This allows very easy setup and removal. Also, allows a variety of different insertion locations to work around large and or bulky awkward items.... like big vises

Thanks. For the rebar, I want to find or make a ring clamp of some sort. I want to be able to easily loosen a bolt, and then slide the rebar out to clean it. The wire would attach to the clamps. I think the plumbing department at most home centers has what I am picturing but I'll have to go search.

Something like a split ring hanger or a ground rod clamp is what I'm thinking. This way I can remove the rebar without disconnecting any of the wiring.



I also didn't think how I'm going to move this container with 20+ gallons of water to dump it.

 

[scooternut]

I just bail mine out into a 5 gallon bucket one scoop at a time

 

[bagged89s10]

I just bail mine out into a 5 gallon bucket one scoop at a time

Yeah that's what I think I'll have to do.

 

[Dragoonmc]

Bagged: on that go charger I think it is a smartish charger so 2 of those wires have real power and one is there to identify the charger to the laptop. Blue is the identifier and black and white are full power.

I would set it up with a power limiter as the charger is not meant to run at full power for super extended periods and will get very very hot if it does.

 

[bagged89s10]

Bagged: on that go charger I think it is a smartish charger so 2 of those wires have real power and one is there to identify the charger to the laptop. Blue is the identifier and black and white are full power.

I would set it up with a power limiter as the charger is not meant to run at full power for super extended periods and will get very very hot if it does.

How would I set it up with a power limiter?

 

[Dragoonmc]

How would I set it up with a power limiter?

http://www.radio-electronics.com/in...rent_limiter/power_supply_current_limiter.php

This seems like the simplest limiter I have seen. If you don't have anything in that psu you can always just let it run and see what happens

 

[Craptain]

Simple limiter is a bulb in series with it. Add bulbs until the current is where you want it. I use around 1 to 2 amps.

Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk

 

[taumac]

Thanks. For the rebar, I want to find or make a ring clamp of some sort. I want to be able to easily loosen a bolt, and then slide the rebar out to clean it. The wire would attach to the clamps. I think the plumbing department at most home centers has what I am picturing but I'll have to go search.

Something like a split ring hanger or a ground rod clamp is what I'm thinking. This way I can remove the rebar without disconnecting any of the wiring.



I also didn't think how I'm going to move this container with 20+ gallons of water to dump it.

I would get a furniture mover from HF and modify it to hold the bin. A small pond or water feature pump also from HF can empty the bin of water.

 

[bagged89s10]

I would get a furniture mover from HF and modify it to hold the bin. A small pond or water feature pump also from HF can empty the bin of water.

I might do that. It wasn't that hard using a 5 gal bucket to empty it but it would be 10x faster to be able to wheel the tank away. I did get one a few weeks ago for $1 but it's being used.

 

[CwazyWabbit]

How often do you plan on emptying it? I've not emptied mine in years, just keep topping up the evaporation losses. Granted there must be quite a lot of silt in the bottom now but it still works well.

 

[bagged89s10]

How often do you plan on emptying it? I've not emptied mine in years, just keep topping up the evaporation losses. Granted there must be quite a lot of silt in the bottom now but it still works well.

So you throw very greasy and painted parts in your tank?

 

[CwazyWabbit]

I throw painted parts in all the time, it's the easiest way to strip the old paint. I've often put a vice in before taking it apart if it's particularly rusty as it's then easier to dismantle, once dismantled it can have another go in the tank.
Heavy grease can stop the electrolysis working but I normally pressure wash parts that come out of the tank so if grease has stopped a part being cleaned it'll go back in for another go.
Granted you get horrible scum on the top of the water after a session of derusting but it mostly settles to the bottom after a while.

 

[PCMusicGuy]

I came across a new older dell laptop power supply (19.5V @ 4.62 A) and was wondering if that could work to do some electrolysis in a 5 gallon bucket. I have an old vice I need to clean up. Also, where is the best place to buy the graphite anodes?

 

[drivesitfar]

CW: could you maybe skim off the scum before removing the vise or part you are de rusting so all that won't settle in the tank? also how often are you cleaning off your rebar or steel that you are using as anodes?

any pictures of your tank to share because i can't remember seeing yours?

thanks

Scooter: I've never seen a set up like yours and it looks like it works for you. great idea.

 

[CwazyWabbit]

DIF: There's a picture of it on this post http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4672302&postcount=334 admittedly not a good picture but it really is just a 50 gallon plastic barrel with two lumps of scrap steel hanging in it.
The electrodes get cleaned when the current drops off, normally they will get a quick pressure wash, dried with compressed air and then hit with a grinding disc if I'm in the mood.
The scum doesn't bother me as everything coming out has to be washed anyway.

 

[bagged89s10]

I throw painted parts in all the time, it's the easiest way to strip the old paint. I've often put a vice in before taking it apart if it's particularly rusty as it's then easier to dismantle, once dismantled it can have another go in the tank.
Heavy grease can stop the electrolysis working but I normally pressure wash parts that come out of the tank so if grease has stopped a part being cleaned it'll go back in for another go.
Granted you get horrible scum on the top of the water after a session of derusting but it mostly settles to the bottom after a while.

I guess I've never let my tank sit to see all the stuff settle. I'll have to find out.
Do you add more washing soda when you add more water or no?

 

[CwazyWabbit]

I've not added any more washing soda. My view is that so long as you are getting a reasonable current flow then there is enough washing soda in the barrel/tank. I probably added far too much washing soda when I first filled it up

 

[bagged89s10]

I've not added any more washing soda. My view is that so long as you are getting a reasonable current flow then there is enough washing soda in the barrel/tank. I probably added far too much washing soda when I first filled it up

Thanks for the tips.

 

[drivesitfar]

CW: are you hanging your sacrificial pieces from wire hanging off the edge too or just the vise parts? the more i'm thinking about it i'm leaning towards an outside tank. i was just going to shove it under a bench in the shop. i have a few spots that might work and i don't have any worries about kids or critters getting into it. i'll probably have some sort of lid though.

thanks

 

[CwazyWabbit]

Yep, the sacrificial stuff is just hanging from wires hanging off the edge. The vice parts hang from wire off of flat bar resting across the top. There is a screw on lid but I just rest it on top. Years ago I made a fancy bucket tank with bolted in rebar but this one that I just chucked together works far better.

 

[Craptain]

I came across a new older dell laptop power supply (19.5V @ 4.62 A) and was wondering if that could work to do some electrolysis in a 5 gallon bucket. I have an old vice I need to clean up. Also, where is the best place to buy the graphite anodes?

I bought my graphite on eBay. Fair price and quick delivery.

Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk

 

[Outlawmws]

I guess I've never let my tank sit to see all the stuff settle. I'll have to find out.
Do you add more washing soda when you add more water or no?

No real reason to. Most of the water loss is through evaporation (a little when you take stuff out), at least in my experience. Usually between runs. if you feel the need to add more, you won't need much...

 

[bagged89s10]

This guy has a thick southern accent but these are good electrolysis videos. Here is a link to one. There are 7 or 8 videos.