AZ_Catskinner
Well-known member
I like PB better of the two. I can't stand the smell of Kroil and I really never noticed a difference in how well they work.
Kroil -vs- PB
- Thread starter Blacknwhitepit
- Start date
jeffmoss26
Well-known member
Put some paper towels down, put about 1/4 to 3/8 inch of PB Blaster in a styrofoam cup, and wait a few minutes...
Carl B
Well-known member
In the picture - you can see a badly rusted, very thin piece of sheetmetal, below it is a captive nut that the bolt is screwed into.
That sheetmetal part is actually about 14" long - and it had bolts in three other places. What you see is the one in the worst condition.
I sprayed KROIL on the one shown, PB Blaster on the next, Liquid Wrench on the next and WD-40 on the last. Let them all soak over night.. then sprayed them again around noon the next day {when my son came over for lunch}. Let them all set at least five more minutes...
Put the box end wrench on each - and applied torque... As I expected, each bolt twisted off one alfter another until I got to the one shown. It already had part of it's head rusted away... and it is the one I put KROIL on.
When I put the wrench on that last bolt - my son said; "you've got to be kidding". I applied torque.. and bolt broke lose and backed out.
Not purely a scientific test - but it was pretty impressive to my son and I.
I've also found that KROIL is exceptionally good at getting steel bolts to break lose in aluminum castings.
FWIW,
Carl B.
That sheetmetal part is actually about 14" long - and it had bolts in three other places. What you see is the one in the worst condition.
I sprayed KROIL on the one shown, PB Blaster on the next, Liquid Wrench on the next and WD-40 on the last. Let them all soak over night.. then sprayed them again around noon the next day {when my son came over for lunch}. Let them all set at least five more minutes...
Put the box end wrench on each - and applied torque... As I expected, each bolt twisted off one alfter another until I got to the one shown. It already had part of it's head rusted away... and it is the one I put KROIL on.
When I put the wrench on that last bolt - my son said; "you've got to be kidding". I applied torque.. and bolt broke lose and backed out.
Not purely a scientific test - but it was pretty impressive to my son and I.
I've also found that KROIL is exceptionally good at getting steel bolts to break lose in aluminum castings.
FWIW,
Carl B.
Attachments
subarub4
Well-known member
SpiderGearsMan
Banned
choke cleaner
Professur
Well-known member
If anyone has a canuck source for Kroil, I'd welcome hearing about it.
Kroil looks interesting but PB Plaster has always worked well for me, it's cheap, and readily available in multiple locations near my house. Logic states that if Kroil was that much better, it would be on shelves and not some obscure mail order item. Just saying.
One thing I do though is apply PB Blaster, hit the bolt/nut repeatedly with a hammer, and apply again. If it's really stuck I'll let it soak overnight. On things that I plan on working on I'll start soaking a week ahead of time. I could understand how this would be impossible for a mechanic but for a household item it works great.
One thing I do though is apply PB Blaster, hit the bolt/nut repeatedly with a hammer, and apply again. If it's really stuck I'll let it soak overnight. On things that I plan on working on I'll start soaking a week ahead of time. I could understand how this would be impossible for a mechanic but for a household item it works great.
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What does that test prove? That PB Plaster will melt styrofoam cups? What does that say about it? Just wondering.
I mean, a torch will melt a styrofoam cup too, does that make it bad?
Carl B
Well-known member
If PB blaster does everything you need - I agree - stick to it.
I got tired of twisting bolts off, having in many cases to drill them out... so KROIL was the solution for me.
Kano Lab's sells very large quantities to industrial and military customers. As I recall we ordered about 100 each, 55 gallon drums and/or 100 cases of the spray cans at a time when I was in SAC.
They will sell individual can's, or other very small amounts to people, but it is more a PR thing than part of their business model.
Selling though wholesalers, WD's and retailers is an entirely different business model - and it carries entirely different legal liabilities. As a corporation they have no desire to get into the retail trade.
FWIW,
Carl B.
I got tired of twisting bolts off, having in many cases to drill them out... so KROIL was the solution for me.
Kano Lab's sells very large quantities to industrial and military customers. As I recall we ordered about 100 each, 55 gallon drums and/or 100 cases of the spray cans at a time when I was in SAC.
They will sell individual can's, or other very small amounts to people, but it is more a PR thing than part of their business model.
Selling though wholesalers, WD's and retailers is an entirely different business model - and it carries entirely different legal liabilities. As a corporation they have no desire to get into the retail trade.
FWIW,
Carl B.
subarub4
Well-known member
on something that was stuck with PB I would finally take a torch to it and then spray some PB on it.. smoked like crazy but I DID finally get the bolt off... but really I did not feel like I should of had to do all those steps.
Carl B
Well-known member
Yes - AeroKroil is just Kroil in an aerosol can. I can shoot it though that little tube - to spots that are hard to reach.
I use the liquid in a couple of different ways. Sometimes I want to soak smaller parts over-night - so I pour about an inch in a small container and throw the parts in.
I cleaned up a full set of Williams open/box wrenches - that I had let set in storage for years - and they had accumulated a bit of surace rust. I let them soak in a pan of Kroil... then hit them with a ScotchBrite pad - and they cam out like new.
I also put the liquid in a small pump can - like the old can's we used in the 50's... That allow a better control of the amount to be applied ...
I'd say that I actuall use about three AeroKroil cans per year - and I've used about 1/4 gallon of the liquid this year. I restore old cars.. and spend at least 20 to 30 hours per week in the garage. {I'm retired so I have the time}.
My wife actually likes the Kroil because it doesn't smell offensive {I put loads of shop rags in "her" washer } NEVER PUT A RAG WITH Rear Gear Oil on it - into your wifes cloths washer!!
FWIW,
Carl B.
FWIW,
Carl B.
jeffmoss26
Well-known member
I think the trick is just to show that it's more powerful than say WD-40. If you put WD-40 in a cup of styrofoam it won't eat through it.
subarub4
Well-known member
is Kroil as drippy as Pb blaster is? Sorry for all the questions just curious.. I wonder if it will get my oxygen sensor out without messing up the treads on it
Ratchet.
Well-known member
We don't get any of them on this side of the Atlantic, Kroil, pb blaster or liquid wrench 
and no one seems to ship here either.
only ones ive personaly used are plus-gas and various variants of rost off (made by wurth, and mainly only available to trade) plus wd40 of course, not that its lot of use for anything but mildly seized bolts (i use it as water dispersant mainly.. which is what it was designed for)
pity as kroil etc sound pretty good.. no idea why no one sells them here
and no one seems to ship here either.only ones ive personaly used are plus-gas and various variants of rost off (made by wurth, and mainly only available to trade) plus wd40 of course, not that its lot of use for anything but mildly seized bolts (i use it as water dispersant mainly.. which is what it was designed for)
pity as kroil etc sound pretty good.. no idea why no one sells them here
djb2
Well-known member
Errrmmm, the only thing it shows is that the carrier solvent doesn't dissolve styrene.
I consider not dissolving plastic parts a feature, not a drawback.
We always have four or five different types of penetrating oil in our project garage, including LW, PB and Kroil. Hmmm, make that six or seven types. None are magic. None work as well as the MAPP torch. Of course you don't want that near plastic either.
jeffmoss26
Well-known member
I just know when I started working in hardware stores, I was taught the trick, which I passed down to future employees. It's a wow factor I guess.
To be fair though, Blaster Chemical is 5-10 minutes from my work
To be fair though, Blaster Chemical is 5-10 minutes from my work
bobcatdan
Well-known member
I like PB, very good product. My buddies and I always joke, " cover your eyes when I spray this bolt, the nut is going to fly off!" That said, Kroil is just faster working. At work I have ZEP zepresever ( I have no idea how to spell it.) Works very good. Also tried some stuff we called "bubblegum" since it smells like strawberry starburst. I don't remember who made it, but for loosening something it worked very good. But it didn't lubicate at all.
BrokewrenchLS1
Well-known member
I normally use PB Blaster (called "skunk piss" around here because of the smell), but I use Liquid Wrench (especially the stuff with moly) pretty often, too. Ordered some of the Google-special Kroil to see what it's like, and I have the components for the "evil penetrant" in the garage to mix up at some point.
I had no idea about this stuff. Ill take the dive at that price.
bentwrench54
Well-known member
Busted Bolts
Well-known member
kroil
shampoop
Well-known member
Kroil smells funny. My friend has a lot of it lying around his place. There was a test on here a while ago and according to it, liquid wrench was very nearly as good as kroil, but is one of the least expensive products on the market.
Greatbear
Well-known member
I prefer Kroil for very difficult (or potentially difficult) jobs, where PB and WD are fine for taking apart moderately sticky bits and general lube and cleaning. Kroil has (to me) a foul smell, like a cross between oil and Pine-Sol, so it gets used sparingly. I use both the spray and liquid versions of Kroil and WD-40. Kroil seems to be able to work its way into the most tightly seized and rusted parts IMO.
Started with WD-40. Basically did nothing except allow the nut to spin easier once you got it down onto the external threads. No real penetration. Smelled good.
Graduated to PB Blaster. Definitely actually penetrated somewhat, but there was still a lot of the really bad stuff it just didn't seem to get into. Smelled HORRIBLE. Got all over every damned thing.
Finally found the light and started using Kroil. IMMENSE improvement in penetration compared to PB Blaster or WD-40. IMMENSE reduction in torque compared to anything else. Taking apart the rights and lefts on the same car, I consistently start on one side, pull it apart beating my head against the wall with wrenches, remember I have Kroil, hose down the other side, take it apart with ease. It's a big enough difference that I was initially convinced I just kept getting "lucky" and the second side wasn't a stuck as the first side. After 2 years of using it, it's like that every time. It's the Kroil, not a placebo. Smells much better than PB Blaster as well. It's kind of a pine-scent but so strong it's like getting a nasal enema with a spruce tree if you get a big whiff of it.
Graduated to PB Blaster. Definitely actually penetrated somewhat, but there was still a lot of the really bad stuff it just didn't seem to get into. Smelled HORRIBLE. Got all over every damned thing.
Finally found the light and started using Kroil. IMMENSE improvement in penetration compared to PB Blaster or WD-40. IMMENSE reduction in torque compared to anything else. Taking apart the rights and lefts on the same car, I consistently start on one side, pull it apart beating my head against the wall with wrenches, remember I have Kroil, hose down the other side, take it apart with ease. It's a big enough difference that I was initially convinced I just kept getting "lucky" and the second side wasn't a stuck as the first side. After 2 years of using it, it's like that every time. It's the Kroil, not a placebo. Smells much better than PB Blaster as well. It's kind of a pine-scent but so strong it's like getting a nasal enema with a spruce tree if you get a big whiff of it.
WRX/Z28
Well-known member
Having used both, I can say that I haven't noticed any appreciable difference. I think it's all just clever marketing of products that amount to doing the same exact job.
Anyone happen to know the chemical make up of PB vs. WD vs. Kroil?
Anyone happen to know the chemical make up of PB vs. WD vs. Kroil?
Also, I'm wondering, and I've never tried this, but would it make sense to use an air hammer with a blunt chisel on it to hammer on the bolt head or nut? Seems like that would really shake up the rust in the threads. From what I have found, typically the rust doesn't penetrate into the threads, it's mostly a superficial hardening of the bolt surface to the surface it's mounted to.
In fact, I recently took apart the suspension of a car that had spent roughly half its 15 year life in up state NY, and even though all the bolts were rusted, the inside threads seemed perfect.
In fact, I recently took apart the suspension of a car that had spent roughly half its 15 year life in up state NY, and even though all the bolts were rusted, the inside threads seemed perfect.
zoomzoomjeff
Well-known member
Sometimes I heat the part up just slightly, (warming is more like it) and then spray Kroil and watch it creep UP a vertical surface.
Kroil is the King Kong of pentrants, IMO. If I think nothing else will touch the fastener, short of cutting it off with either a grinder or a fire wrench, then I grab the Kroil. And the more time it sits, the better. I'm in awe of whatever the hell it's made of!
Kroil is the King Kong of pentrants, IMO. If I think nothing else will touch the fastener, short of cutting it off with either a grinder or a fire wrench, then I grab the Kroil. And the more time it sits, the better. I'm in awe of whatever the hell it's made of!
les_garten
Banned
I read the whole thread and can't figure out what you guys are referring to and why you won't spell it out?
Are you referring to Ed's Red?
BrokewrenchLS1
Well-known member
I think (or at least I'm assuming, from what I've read) it's the commonly-referred to combination of ATF and acetone; it seems like you slop some on, ask the bolt nicely, and it works itself out with no help.
Not quite sure why no one's allowed to talk about it, though.
les_garten
Banned
subarub4
Well-known member
les_garten
Banned
Must be an inside Joke!
lwlobo
Well-known member
It's sort of an inside joke. The ****** fluid/acetone mix is always brought up whenever the "best penetrating lubricant" discussion is held around here. Primarily, it's people saying: "I haven't mixed any up yet, but I hear it's better than Kroil." then "No way, Kroil is the only thing that would get the bolts on my..."
You get the idea.
I think the OP was wanting to keep this thread to PB vs. Kroil. Thus the references to the "mix we do not mention".
As for me, I like Kroil, but I've been wanting to mix up some...
You get the idea.
I think the OP was wanting to keep this thread to PB vs. Kroil. Thus the references to the "mix we do not mention".
As for me, I like Kroil, but I've been wanting to mix up some...
Carl B
Well-known member
Agreed - "the mix we do not mention" is 50%/50% ATF and Acetone.
That came out of penetrating fluid test case that AIR Popular Mechanics Magazine did years ago.
I do not mention that mix - because it can easily damage component parts and paint. Acetone is very nasty stuff !! Kroil on the other hand seems to be pretty safe to use on almost any material.
FWIW,
Carl B.
That came out of penetrating fluid test case that AIR Popular Mechanics Magazine did years ago.
I do not mention that mix - because it can easily damage component parts and paint. Acetone is very nasty stuff !! Kroil on the other hand seems to be pretty safe to use on almost any material.
FWIW,
Carl B.
dellwas
Banned
Apparently Century Vallen in Canada carries it. I searched their website but didn't get a hit on it.
These two stores were listed on another forum when someone asked about a Cdn. dealer.
Century Vallen Calgary 780-468-3366
Century Vallen Edmonton 780-490-2700
Also, another forum mentioned Blue Mountain Sports in NB. This forum was related to guns, apparently Kroil is used widely by gun owners.
Blue Mountain Sports Inc.
Address: PO Box 406
Browns Flat, NB
E5M 2S1
Telephone: (506) 468-2919
Let me know if you find a Cdn. source, and I'll do the same after I look some more.
These two stores were listed on another forum when someone asked about a Cdn. dealer.
Century Vallen Calgary 780-468-3366
Century Vallen Edmonton 780-490-2700
Also, another forum mentioned Blue Mountain Sports in NB. This forum was related to guns, apparently Kroil is used widely by gun owners.
Blue Mountain Sports Inc.
Address: PO Box 406
Browns Flat, NB
E5M 2S1
Telephone: (506) 468-2919
Let me know if you find a Cdn. source, and I'll do the same after I look some more.
xpmcharly
Active member
How many creeps do you have to render for a can of creep oil? If you lived in Tennessee, you would know that Nashville is the best source. Great stuff, by the way.
diesel research
Well-known member
Voted PB. It's only one of the two choices I have used. I find for the most part, it pretty much *****. Unfortunately, we carry it in a 3gal aluminum fuel cell with tap, and fill up squirt bottles.
Most of the time, it seems to be a waste. Sometimes I heat up bolts, vibrate them with air hammers, hit them with sledges, or various other tricks. Often I find myself wasting too much time and just cut them off with the torch or cutoff wheel.
It is usually some kind of exposed nut/bolt combo so chopping it off is the easiest solution.
I still use it on wheels rusted to hubs, out of sheer habit, but it usually does very little good, and the 16lb sledge wails on the rims.
Most of the time, it seems to be a waste. Sometimes I heat up bolts, vibrate them with air hammers, hit them with sledges, or various other tricks. Often I find myself wasting too much time and just cut them off with the torch or cutoff wheel.
It is usually some kind of exposed nut/bolt combo so chopping it off is the easiest solution.
I still use it on wheels rusted to hubs, out of sheer habit, but it usually does very little good, and the 16lb sledge wails on the rims.