Menards vise apparently HF knockoff (pics)

[lardy1]

I have bought two used USA vises at a local auction in the area. There are usually at least a couple and up to a half dozen every week. It's online bidding so the only time I've invested is looking at the listings then driving the few miles to inspect them if I think it warrants that. Sometimes they go quite high. Other times they don't. There are a ton of variables in auction so I just throw my high bid out and it's over unless I win, then I have to go pick it up.

I'm surprised people don't talk much in these forums about auctions. They're a viable resource for used tools.

 

[428PI]

Here in Wichita, aircraft workers drive the prices of tools to crazy levels. Deals can be found but it takes a lot of patience waiting and then you have to be on the ball to reply to the ad first.

And people hoard them and store them on the floor and relist them for twice the money.

 

[LXCam]

I know I will be taking slaps to the face, for this comment, but aren’t most bench vises all
design pretty much the exact same way?

Maybe there is more than one vise factory in China, and one decided to make things slightly different.

I’ll take “what do vises and Mexican food have in common” for $200 Alex

 

[M635_Guy]

Those aren't really that similar to me. I mean, the general shape is very similar, but just about every detail and critical measurement are different. Lots of vises look approximately like that.

Yeah, those Doyles are quite legit.

I need a multi-purpose vise for working on motorcycle forks. You can swivel the jaws sideways and pad the pipe jaws with thick leather to make fork work super-convenient.

Anyhoo, if I ever break my ancient grungy generic Chinese vise, I'll mosey to the corner HF and grab this one.

5 in. Multi-Purpose Vise with Anvil

Amazing deals on this 5In Multi-Purpose Vise W Anvil at Harbor Freight. Quality tools & low prices.

www.harborfreight.com

I have a Yost 750 Di, and I absolutely love a rotating vise. That Doyle nice (and it's brothers) look pretty damn nice.

If I were the OP, I'd go back and get a Doyle.

Yes, each of them is exactly 100 miles away.

Still a better deal.

You're trying awfully hard. It's not that strong a point.

 

[liliysdad]

And people hoard them and store them on the floor and relist them for twice the money.

Twice hell. I figure I will get $400 a piece for the two 300s that I have $75 each in. Based on experience and eBay sold auctions, might get more.

That’s hardly the point. They are available for anyone to grab before me. These two 300s, for example, had one bid each on them, other than mine. I wasn’t going to pay more than $100 for them…so they were ripe for the picking.

I completely understand that I am not going to convince many in this thread that chasing good iron is worthwhile. I can, however, hopefully show folks that might not know how easy it is to find cool stuff with a little bit of effort. Oftentimes, the search is as much fun as the find.

 

[Mr_B]

If I were the OP, I'd go back and get a Doyle.

Yes that what I thinking if want easy store purchase, that would seem far better buy and should last well if ductile iron castings done half decent, only 30 bucks more for better made vise that likely outlive you & save needing spend another 130+ bucks a third time ...
Wait for a coupon and it same dollar for better product .

 

[MacMcMacmac]

 

[neophyte]

Some of these rotating vises have different specs as far as size and material.
The Yost 750-DI has “DI” in the model number because the vise is Ductile Iron.
Yost used to, and may still, sell versions that were not cast from Ductile Iron.
The 760-DI from Yost, and the Capri versions are Ductile Iron and should be more durable.
With other brands, including Wilton, it’s hard to tell what type of Iron was used.
Older versions that used similar molds to the 750-DI were routinely regular Grey Iron, and the castings sometimes broke, showing poor casting quality.
If copied directly from the original Sawyer Nutyp vise which originated the design, even the crappy Grey Iron versions might hold up for years.
The lighter weight versions that copied the idea, but not the castings of the original Nutyp design always seemed to be more brake prone.

 

[neophyte]

I should also point out that the Yost 750-DI and the Capri versions have replaceable pipe jaws, were on the other versions, the jaws look to be part of the Iron casting, or possible a cheaper design.

 

[1982fxr]

Yeah, those Doyles are quite legit.

I need a multi-purpose vise for working on motorcycle forks. You can swivel the jaws sideways and pad the pipe jaws with thick leather to make fork work super-convenient.

Anyhoo, if I ever break my ancient grungy generic Chinese vise, I'll mosey to the corner HF and grab this one.

5 in. Multi-Purpose Vise with Anvil

Amazing deals on this 5In Multi-Purpose Vise W Anvil at Harbor Freight. Quality tools & low prices.

www.harborfreight.com

$200? Is the Yost even that much?

The old blue hf version was the shittiest version of this style vise I've ever seen.

 

[finn]

200 mile round trip.

My truck gets 18 mpg.

Gas is $4 a gallon.

Add another $45 on to the price.

To say nothing of the five hours it takes out of your life, or the frustration you’re going to endure as you pull up and see someone else loading it into the back of a beat up pickup truck.

Chasing used tool deals is fun for some people, and a waste of time for others.

I haven’t seen a deal on CL or Marketplace in the past six months.
When I need a vice, I need that vice NOW.

 

[American Locomotive]

To say nothing of the five hours it takes out of your life, or the frustration you’re going to endure as you pull up and see someone else loading it into the back of a beat up pickup truck.

Chasing used tool deals is fun for some people, and a waste of time for others.

I haven’t seen a deal on CL or Marketplace in the past six months.
When I need a vice, I need that vice NOW.

Yeah, it's a game for some people. They love the "thrill" of hunting down tools. They enjoy the time spent scouring ebay, craigslist and facebook market place; the hours making calls, driving, haggling, and procuring; and the cathartic nature of belittling people online for purchasing something readily available and affordable. So when you need a vise and go shopping for used, you're competing with all of the Vise & Anvil collectors that vacuum them all up as fast as they can find them, then throw them up on a shelf never to be used.

I know very well that old vises are great, but they are not really readily available. I would not call "Being within 100 miles distance" being available, either. I barely like to drive more than 10 miles, let alone the 200 round trip.

 

[M635_Guy]

$200? Is the Yost even that much?

The 750 Di is ~$175 on Amazon, which is about what I paid for mine (from Lowe's). It's ~$265 on Eastwood (plus another $50 shipping).

The cheapo Yost 750E is a retail-grade vise.

The old blue hf version was the shittiest version of this style vise I've ever seen.

That's not the one under discussion here though, at least not the rotating one...

The Doyle rotating vise looks pretty nice IMHO - slightly down-spec from my 750 Di though (65K psi ductile iron vs. 60K, 5 1/8" vs. 5", 9K# clamping vs. 8K), but on the shelf vs. in the mail or having to wait to pick it up at Lowes/HD (the folks at Lowes were mighty unhappy about lugging the small-but-heavy box )

 

[dnschmidt]

The Doyle is the best deal. Just truck over to HF and pick it up.

 

[M635_Guy]

The Doyle is the best deal. Just truck over to HF and pick it up.

...but bend at the knees, not the waist...

 

[zendriver]

I’ll take “what do vises and Mexican food have in common” for $200 Alex

They are relatively easy to make

 

[dwasifar]

200 mile round trip.

My truck gets 18 mpg.

Gas is $4 a gallon.

Add another $45 on to the price.

Plus your time.

 

[dwasifar]

If I were the OP, I'd go back and get a Doyle.

Yes that what I thinking if want easy store purchase, that would seem far better buy and should last well if ductile iron castings done half decent, only 30 bucks more for better made vise that likely outlive you & save needing spend another 130+ bucks a third time ...
Wait for a coupon and it same dollar for better product .

The Doyle is the best deal. Just truck over to HF and pick it up.

The one I bought is already bolted to the bench and I've put enough time into this for now, so I'll use it until it breaks; if it does, I'll take it back to HF for warranty exchange and upgrade to the Doyle at that point. Appreciate the advice, thanks guys.

 

[dwasifar]

I’ll take “what do vises and Mexican food have in common” for $200 Alex

They're both associated with grease and gas?

 

[LXCam]

They're both associated with grease and gas?

Tis a valid analogy but it was a inside joke from something zen said in another thread

 

[dwasifar]

Tis a valid analogy but it was a inside joke from something zen said in another thread

My guess would be that Zen's remark had something to do with Mexican food always being the same ingredients, just in a different shape. Am I right?

 

[LXCam]

My guess would be that Zen's remark had something to do with Mexican food always being the same ingredients, just in a different shape. Am I right?

Half right. It had to do with him saying all Mexican food tastes alike.

 

[dwasifar]

Half right. It had to do with him saying all Mexican food tastes alike.

I wouldn't know. I can't eat it. It would kill me.

 

[LXCam]

I wouldn't know. I can't eat it. It would kill me.

I’ll take “pancreatitis for $500” Alex



Hope not d, I don’t wish that on anybody.

 

[dwasifar]

I’ll take “pancreatitis for $500” Alex



Hope not d, I don’t wish that on anybody.

Thankfully not that.

 

[bwringer]

$200? Is the Yost even that much?

The 750 Di is ~$175 on Amazon, which is about what I paid for mine (from Lowe's). It's ~$265 on Eastwood (plus another $50 shipping).

The cheapo Yost 750E is a retail-grade vise.

That's not the one under discussion here though, at least not the rotating one...

The Doyle rotating vise looks pretty nice IMHO - slightly down-spec from my 750 Di though (65K psi ductile iron vs. 60K, 5 1/8" vs. 5", 9K# clamping vs. 8K), but on the shelf vs. in the mail or having to wait to pick it up at Lowes/HD (the folks at Lowes were mighty unhappy about lugging the small-but-heavy box )

The Doyle is the best deal. Just truck over to HF and pick it up.

Right. That 750 DI Yost is awfully nice, and somewhat better in several ways than the Doyle.

However, if my old no-name vise fails, it's because I'm in the middle of something, so I will need another vise right then, not whenever Amazon gets around to to sending it, (and further assuming that scAmazon listing is not a counterfeit Yost or some other piratical skullduggery.)

The nearest Harbor Freight is about one mile away, and that vise is generally in stock. There are at least three or four other HF stores in around the city, so I'm happy to let them continue to burden their shelves with the vise until the day I need it.

There are many other tools like that; I have very limited space, so HF and other stores are welcome to store large tools for me until I need them.

I've been beating the absolute hell out of my ancient Chinese beast for over 20 years, so maybe I accidentally got a good one and it will outlast me.

 

[Jayman17]

Here is a pretty decent looking Yost from another thread on GJ. On sale for $120
55C, 5-1/2

 

[1982fxr]

Here is a pretty decent looking Yost from another thread on GJ. On sale for $120
55C, 5-1/2

Ad says $600?

 

[M635_Guy]

Right. That 750 DI Yost is awfully nice, and somewhat better in several ways than the Doyle.

However, if my old no-name vise fails, it's because I'm in the middle of something, so I will need another vise right then, not whenever Amazon gets around to to sending it, (and further assuming that scAmazon listing is not a counterfeit Yost or some other piratical skullduggery.)

The nearest Harbor Freight is about one mile away, and that vise is generally in stock. There are at least three or four other HF stores in around the city, so I'm happy to let them continue to burden their shelves with the vise until the day I need it.

There are many other tools like that; I have very limited space, so HF and other stores are welcome to store large tools for me until I need them.

I've been beating the absolute hell out of my ancient Chinese beast for over 20 years, so maybe I accidentally got a good one and it will outlast me.

Agree. When I was looking for a vise, I went by HF and was completely unimpressed. I kept looking and eventually wound up ordering the Yost from Lowe's because they could get it to their store faster than Amazon would deliver at the time.

Not long after they released the Doyle vises, I swung buy and eyeballed them. I would have totally bought the Doyle if it had been available when I was buying.

 

[dwasifar]

Update: I wrote to Irwin asking if they would warranty the broken vise, and they wrote back asking for my shipping address (specifying no PO boxes). So I believe I will have two vises in the not too distant future.

 

[decableguy2000]

I had a HF blue vise for years before a found a Wilton. Beat the hell out of it and it kept on ticking, gave it to my BIL. As far as I know he still has it. As far as Irwin and warranty I had a good experience. They replace the whole tool instead of a small plastic part.

 

[whateg01]

And people hoard them and store them on the floor and relist them for twice the money.

Ah. You've seen that ad too!

 

[1982fxr]

Anyone had hands on the new Wilton version of this? The gray one...

 

[Schurkey]

On Saturday I broke my Irwin vise:



Looking for another affordable vise to replace it, I was going to go to HF for one of these for $129:



I bought the HF vise and returned the Menards one,

WHY are you buying a vice, when Irwin advertises a "Limited Lifetime Warranty" on their vices?

Example:

Heavy Duty Workshop Vises

With a 6" jaw width, the IRWIN Heavy-Duty Workshop Vise features a captured safety jaw to prevent the slide from falling out during use. At a solid 30.6 lbs., this anvil and pipe jaw incorporated table vise maneuvers quickly into position with a swivel base. An aggressive set of steel jaws...

www.irwintools.com

 

[dwasifar]

WHY are you buying a vice, when Irwin advertises a "Limited Lifetime Warranty" on their vices?

Example:

Heavy Duty Workshop Vises

With a 6" jaw width, the IRWIN Heavy-Duty Workshop Vise features a captured safety jaw to prevent the slide from falling out during use. At a solid 30.6 lbs., this anvil and pipe jaw incorporated table vise maneuvers quickly into position with a swivel base. An aggressive set of steel jaws...

www.irwintools.com

Why would I want another one like it when this one broke?

You might note that earlier in the thread, I did say I contacted Irwin, and they seem to be preparing to send me a new one. If so, I'll likely Craigslist it, or use it for lighter duty. But I used this as an opportunity to replace it with something beefier.

 

[finn]

I think Project Farm did a vice comparison earlier this year. It was interesting, or maybe entertaining at least, but I don’t recall the conclusion. I’m not in the market.

 

[neophyte]

I think Project Farm did a vice comparison earlier this year. It was interesting, or maybe entertaining at least, but I don’t recall the conclusion. I’m not in the market.

From various vise tests, the take away was that older USA made industrial vises, even ones made from grey iron, were usually very strong and abuse proof.
On newer vises, the ones made from Ductile Iron tended to be very durable, with the ductile iron usually springing back to original shape after massive over torquing.
This was even true of weird cheap brands.
Steel vises were usually strong, but might deform rather than springing back to shape, although with steel, it’s way easier to weld a broken vise, or even heat and reshape the vise if bent, compared to cast iron, so it’s a toss ip which is better.

I would still be wary of a grey iron vise do to the potential of a heaving item falling on my foot if the vise failed.
The extra cost to upgrade to ductile iron is less than an Emergency Room deductible.

 

[finn]

From various vise tests, the take away was that older USA made industrial vises, even ones made from grey iron, were usually very strong and abuse proof.
On newer vises, the ones made from Ductile Iron tended to be very durable, with the ductile iron usually springing back to original shape after massive over torquing.
This was even true of weird cheap brands.
Steel vises were usually strong, but might deform rather than springing back to shape, although with steel, it’s way easier to weld a broken vise, or even heat and reshape the vise if bent, compared to cast iron, so it’s a toss ip which is better.

I would still be wary of a grey iron vise do to the potential of a heaving item falling on my foot if the vise failed.
The extra cost to upgrade to ductile iron is less than an Emergency Room deductible.

I broke what I think was a grey iron vice. It let go with a loud bang. There’s a tremendous amount of energy stored in a vice that’s really cranked down. I suspect that one of the primary failure modes on some of the PF vices was bent handles… the handle bende to keep the vice body from literally exploding and hurting the user / abuser.

Mine was a Duracraft from Farm and Fleet. The manager of my local store sent an email to corporate, and they replaced it. They actually let me pay the difference between the failed vice ans their top of the line vice, which is still unopened on a shelf in my shop.

 

[bwringer]

... I suspect that one of the primary failure modes on some of the PF vices was bent handles… the handle bende to keep the vice body from literally exploding and hurting the user / abuser.

Yep, vise handles are deliberately designed to be torque limiting.

Jason over at Fireball Tool discussed this when explaining the design of his Hardtail vise; people wanted to know why the handle wasn't longer, and had reliefs in it. It's designed to bend and even break and protect the rest of the vise if you're dumb enough to put a hunka pipe on your vise handle. The threads in the vise are finer pitch than most, and the mechanism has good bearings, so you can develop monster squeezification without destroying the handle. He also proved this with load cell testing.

 

[jayemm]

I broke what I think was a grey iron vice. It let go with a loud bang. There’s a tremendous amount of energy stored in a vice that’s really cranked down. I suspect that one of the primary failure modes on some of the PF vices was bent handles… the handle bende to keep the vice body from literally exploding and hurting the user / abuser.

Mine was a Duracraft from Farm and Fleet. The manager of my local store sent an email to corporate, and they replaced it. They actually let me pay the difference between the failed vice ans their top of the line vice, which is still unopened on a shelf in my shop.

One advantage of ductile iron over cast iron is that it yields instead of violently fracturing with energy release. Other is 60,000 PSI versus 25-30 ,000 of cast iron. As for handles bending, the original Record brand of vises made in England were designed for the handle to bend before vise limits exceeded.