"Pre-Block" Grinders--Where's the Love?

[Old Radar]

The CAST IRON BLOCK GRINDERS...are probably the best BLOCK GRINDERS that were ever made.

Yep, you're preaching to the choir. Welcome to the family!

I will say that the terms used here and on the Block thread--and elsewhere--are not meant to be derogatory, just descriptive short-hand. We use Pre-Block because they were made before the cube shaped design that came to be known as the Block. There are also distinctions made like Mailbox, Round Top, etc. So while we here are all in violent agreement with your assessment of the relative quality between our beloved grinders and the Block, don't let it cause an aneurysm.

 

[Jayman17]

Love your enthusiasm caveman613!

 

[Caveman613]

Yep, you're preaching to the choir. Welcome to the family!

I will say that the terms used here and on the Block thread--and elsewhere--are not meant to be derogatory, just descriptive short-hand. We use Pre-Block because they were made before the cube shaped design that came to be known as the Block. There are also distinctions made like Mailbox, Round Top, etc. So while we here are all in violent agreement with your assessment of the relative quality between our beloved grinders and the Block, don't let it cause an aneurysm.

Hi Old Radar! Thank you for the welcome!
That's where your wrong..... look at the design. (see pic) SAME design updated with some cost cutting tweaks etc. Take a look at the old brown cast iron BLOCK compared to the slightly redesigned cast aluminum next to it. Are you talking about an older design? Because what I'm seeing is a brown cast iron BLOCK grinder that has the exact same block design in general as the later aluminum model but with some changes as is usually the case with long running designs. I understand it might be easier to say "PRE" than "cast iron" but "PRE"means before so how can it be BEFORE itself on this model?? Just look at it.......am I seeing an illusion?

In all honesty I could care less what anyone wants to call them but my anger years ago stemmed from a BOZO (that's a clown for you younger members that don't remember him) saying to a person that got a cast iron model words to the effect of " Just get rid of it ....give it away and look for a REAL BLOCK grinder." and " The PRE ones aren't really worth anything ." The new guy said "OK and that he didn't know it wasn't a REAL block grinder." Then I saw that **** being repeated and quoted all over the internet. That made my blood boil because it was basically telling people that didn't know what they had that their cast iron grinder was near worthless to collectors or anyone for that matter. See where I'm coming from Old Radar? You know better and I know better but others didn't !

When I saw this topic " "Pre-Block" Grinders--Where's the Love?" I didn't realize how old this thread was and my aneurysm(s) did almost POP LOL (Just kidding) I did however think that BOZO years ago actually affected what people think about the cast iron BLOCK grinders today. I didn't read this whole thread but I hope most people know the truth about the quality of these cast iron models now in 2022. The cast iron models were made not long before I was born.......in a time when most stuff was Made In the U.S.A. with pride and made to last! (look at me.....I'm still here . Covid-19 or "Boomer Remover" as the young crowd calls it didn't get me......yet! LOL)

I remember when that BOZO started the PRE **** years ago and just like an old wives tale it still perpetuates though. See how your NOT believing your own eyes. I don't understand how people can be so easily hoodwinked??? If they both looked like a football and were called football grinders, why would one be called PRE football grinder ? Again....look at the picture.......there is no PRE....that cast iron grinder is the same BLOCK design therefore it is an early BLOCK GRINDER ! Show the pic to a young kid and ask them what they see different between these two grinders OR if they look alike other than minor details I rest my case!
( this pic was taken about 7 years ago I think)

 

[Caveman613]

Great color choices!

Hey Old Radar ! If you didn't know already that beautiful grinder you have there was the TOP OF THE LINE!
See the pic of it in 1956 Craftsman power tool catalog.

 

[Old Radar]

Caveman:
1. Keep an eye on that blood pressure.
2. "In all honesty I could care less what anyone wants to call them..." Hmm. Not from where I sit.
3. "...my anger years ago..." Seems to have hardly faded at all.
4. As in nature, many things in manufacturing are evolutionary vs. revolutionary.
5. Incremental design changes are at odds with our desire to broadly categorize.
6. Sears Roebuck & Co. certainly never felt the need to point out those incremental changes nor to saddle their grinders with a specific moniker.
7. Shooting from the hip, I failed in my previous reply to recall all the incremental changes from the 1/2hp, 85 pound cast iron grinder last offered in 1963 to its anemic 37 pound cubic descendant who first appeared in 1974.
8. I do see where you are coming from and now that you have arrived here at GJ, you can bask in the glow of like minded enthusiasts from various eras and point any misguided miscreants or confused neophytes to these threads. Knowledge is power.
9. If you want a true expert's opinion on this subject, please enjoy a related thread started many years ago by torqueman2002.
10. Many thanks for the complements on my (cast iron) (pre) Block. It's from Jan '59.

 

[Caveman613]

Keep it up "Professor Preblock", waiting for your pics.

Hey wrenchguy ! I like that....think it'll stick lol?
Anyway.....here are some old pics for comparison that I took years ago and was going to post to show that BOZO that he didn't know what he was talking about ......but never did

 

[Caveman613]

Keep it up "Professor Preblock", waiting for your pics.

More pics..... Notice how beefy and well built the cast iron model is. The newer aluminum one is rated 1/2hp and the iron one is only rated 1/3hp but rated at 5.5 amps vs 5.2 amp for the 1/2hp. With the weight of the cast iron (I think they called it semi-steel) I'm able to slide it out on the bench on it's rubber feet and it won't move. After dressing the 7" wheels with a diamond dresser on the front and sides it's so smooth I could balance a shot glass on it running. Because of it's smoothness it's my go-to grinder when I want precision. I can take a couple of thousands off with a good finish. The only one better for my purposes would be the one Old Radar has because it was the very top model and rated 1/2hp but probably more like 3/4hp or more in reality. Hope this helps??
Professor PreBlock LOL

 

[Caveman613]

Caveman:
1. Keep an eye on that blood pressure.
2. "In all honesty I could care less what anyone wants to call them..." Hmm. Not from where I sit.
3. "...my anger years ago..." Seems to have hardly faded at all.
4. As in nature, many things in manufacturing are evolutionary vs. revolutionary.
5. Incremental design changes are at odds with our desire to broadly categorize.
6. Sears Roebuck & Co. certainly never felt the need to point out those incremental changes nor to saddle their grinders with a specific moniker.
7. Shooting from the hip, I failed in my previous reply to recall all the incremental changes from the 1/2hp, 85 pound cast iron grinder last offered in 1963 to its anemic 37 pound cubic descendant who first appeared in 1974.
8. I do see where you are coming from and now that you have arrived here at GJ, you can bask in the glow of like minded enthusiasts from various eras and point any misguided miscreants or confused neophytes to these threads. Knowledge is power.
9. If you want a true expert's opinion on this subject, please enjoy a related thread started many years ago by torqueman2002.
10. Many thanks for the complements on my (cast iron) (pre) Block. It's from Jan '59.

You have very good points and I agree with most. I may even refer to the cast iron models as PRE-Block on this forum so people know what I'm talking about......nah.....I don't think so LOL. You must be a good judge of character Old Radar! My blood pressure is fine but I'm one of those people that it spikes on when I get excited. The bikers I used to ride with when I was in my twenties used to say I was just an excitable boy.
My whole point was/is that it's just not right to put down someone else's tools especially when it isn't warranted or true. I haven't really read anything about blocks since that BOZO.....(yes miscreant) misled Block Grinder newbie's (neophytes) and trashed a well built grinder. And IF people were/are getting the wrong impression because of the "PRE-"in front I wanted to reassure them that what that miscreant spread years ago was ****, fiction, bull---- and get the point across that I think I did.

My father told me a story when I was a young kid about "Joe the blacksmith" that did the most beautiful wrought iron work you could imagine with tools that many people would probably throw out. In other words .....a person with skill can do amazing things with crude, old, or worn tools. I've seen that first hand in my years working with metal.
So......if a person has a cheap Chinese grinder because that's all that they can afford.....I won't insult them. Instead I'll teach them to use it to its full potential and quite possibly they would be able to do a better job with it than someone with the best block grinder who doesn't know how to properly dress the wheels but that's a topic for another time.

By the way....if you look at my pics you'll see a cheap Chinese grinder on the left side of my bench in the back. I pick them up at flea markets for a couple of bucks and usually give them away to someone that doesn't have one. I put an indicator on the shafts then put a pipe on them and bent/tweaked them so it ran true at the end where the wheels go. And yes......the bearings were fine. Didn't take much pressure. (I used to make foot and half diameter self centering bearings working for Zubler Bearings many moons ago) Then I dressed the front and sides of the wheels as I always do. You would be surprised at the difference in vibration. Gave it to a young guy that didn't have one. He may even still have it.

wrenchguy refered to me as "ProfessorPreBlock". What do ya think Old Radar? Kinda catchy huh.LOL Someone else said I look like a Professor with my reading glasses.

 

[Old Radar]

I don't know if you can change your alias once established, but if you can, now would be the time since you are still in single digits for posts. We'll have to compare wheel balancing techniques sometime.

 

[JEFinCLE]

Is it possible to move this thread to the Vintage Tool Forum? If it is "possible" would the O.P. and the major contributors support that suggestion? I always forget where to find this thread.

 

[exmaxima1]

I remember when that BOZO started the PRE **** years ago and just like an old wives tale it still perpetuates though. See how your NOT believing your own eyes. I don't understand how people can be so easily hoodwinked??? If they both looked like a football and were called football grinders, why would one be called PRE football grinder ? Again....look at the picture.......there is no PRE....that cast iron grinder is the same BLOCK design therefore it is an early BLOCK GRINDER ! Show the pic to a young kid and ask them what they see different between these two grinders OR if they look alike other than minor details I rest my case!
( this pic was taken about 7 years ago I think)

When I started this thread I thought I made it clear that the Pre-version is dramatically different from the later alloy version and deserves it's own nomenclature. The guts of the cast iron models are completely different and have zero in common with the alloy design (see post #1 of this thread). I feel it's a failure on my part if ultimately people just look at the similarities of the housings and say they are "the same". So maybe the PRE-block is too confusing---what should we call them? Would IRON-Block be better? It certainly sounds cooler.

 

[exmaxima1]

Is it possible to move this thread to the Vintage Tool Forum? If it is "possible" would the O.P. and the major contributors support that suggestion? I always forget where to find this thread.

I'm the OP and don't mind if it makes it easier to find.

 

[Caveman613]

When I started this thread I thought I made it clear that the Pre-version is dramatically different from the later alloy version and deserves it's own nomenclature. The guts of the cast iron models are completely different and have zero in common with the alloy design (see post #1 of this thread). I feel it's a failure on my part if ultimately people just look at the similarities of the housings and say they are "the same". So maybe the PRE-block is too confusing---what should we call them? Would IRON-Block be better? It certainly sounds cooler.

I agree with you mostly although I don't know if I would say "dramatically different" , "completely different" or "zero in common" ?? I see more similarities than differences. For instance I would say a Baldor grinder is "dramatically different" or "completely different". Yes.... I do think they are different enough to deserve their own category and if they were called "IRON-Block" as you suggest, it would be MUCH more appropriate AND yes......it does sound cooler if I don't say so myself LOL.

As Old Radar said "As in nature, many things in manufacturing are evolutionary vs. revolutionary." Block is a reference to the shape and the "Iron" models are most definitely the block shape ! That's where my beef is..... saying "PRE-" means BEFORE suggesting they are in fact NOT "Block" shaped grinders. Anyone can obviously see they have the same "BLOCK" shape. Alloy versions are just an evolution of the design as Old Radar pointed out. My beef started years ago when a BOZO told another "Iron-Block" owner that his grinder was NOT a true "Block" grinder but a "PRE" Block and wasn't really worth anything because of that. The poor guy said he was going to get rid of it or give it away and look for a REAL Block grinder. See where I'm coming from?

If they were called "PRE- Alloy Block" grinders OR "IRON-Block" grinders , they would then have an appropriate name. I really like "IRON-Block" and may start using that instead of "PRE" Block. People will still know what I'm talking about and if anyone wants to correct me.....well then bring it on ! I will not abet that BOZO that started the "PRE" nonsense years ago! (for now anyway) I'm still taken aback at the ease of which people started quoting that clown many years ago eventually making it the de facto name or category. Can we change that?? Or does it really matter anyway nowadays as long as we're on the same page?? If someone called me "PRE" Human because I'm a different race than they are (unless I was an ET or Neanderthal)...... I would have a beef with that too regardless of whether that was accepted or not.
Maybe I should be called a "Block" headed Human though huh?? That sounds appropriate too LOL.
Anyway....great thread and thank you for that !!

 

[Caveman613]

I'm the OP and don't mind if it makes it easier to find.

Vintage Tool Forum? Why not! Maybe start a new thread titled "Iron Block" Grinders? That DOES sound catchy....doesn't it?

Being an old time Machinist/Tool Maker, I like heavy old American made "Iron" machines. Made to last! I even have an old "Alien Head" Craftsman drill press (or two) with original speed reduction pulley. Love it! Never thought I would see the day when all we can get is Chinese junk. Not all Chinese is junk .... but most is when compared to U.S. made! Shame for our kids and grand kids.

Who is to blame? Excessive Union demands ? ( I worked for a great good paying company plant.... Hobart.....that shut it's doors because a Union was voted in and wage and benefit demands were not economically feasible. Easier to just leave ) Society looking down at men and women that use their hands to produce great products? (Blue collar workers) Excessive lawsuits because of consumer stupidity? (Try suing a Chinese company when someone was hurt because of there own stupidity and no warning label to tell them different Ha,Ha) Excessive Federal and Local Government taxes on manufacturing businesses? Chinese buying up our companies? Not enforcing anti-trust laws giving too much power to big companies so they can squash smaller company competitive innovation for stock holders and ship our Manufacturing to China for greater profit margin?

It seems people are now starting to appreciate how great vintage American made tools were/are and we must get back to our roots if we are going to survive as a world economic power. We have to bring back American manufacturing to continue as a world leader. We cannot survive as a service oriented country! We need Government to STOP penalizing American manufacturing through excessive taxes and regulation while propping up foreign competitors!

Bottom line..... these forums educate people on the merits of superior American made tools and machines and maybe.....just maybe, encourage people to get out and vote for needed change in THIS country, not trying to change the rest of the world. We were once able to lead the world by example and show the world that THIS IS HOW IT'S DONE! We were once able to say "do as we do" NOT "do as we say".

It's NOT TOO LATE to do it again and I hope these forums help to preserve the tools and machines from a time of American manufacturing greatness! Sorry to be so long winded but I am very passionate about American manufacturing as I have worked in manufacturing my whole life and have seen first hand how extremely talented American Men and Women can be when challenged to be the best at what they do.

 

[JEFinCLE]

I'm the OP and don't mind if it makes it easier to find.

When I made that suggestion, I did not realize this thread has 5 years of history. I think I'll just learn to look for it. Nothing to see here. Don't mind me.

 

[Caveman613]

I don't know if you can change your alias once established, but if you can, now would be the time since you are still in single digits for posts. We'll have to compare wheel balancing techniques sometime.

Hi again Old Radar! I'm sure your whee balancing technique is way better than mine. I'm all about free hand using knuckles and fingers as a sliding guide with a cluster diamond sometimes clamping a thin parallel to the rest with a parallel clamp. It's what I got used to on the job when the boss wants to know why the job isn't done yet LOL. Goes without saying that the wheels were mounted decently to begin with. Then proceed to knuckle drag the rest or parallel to dress the front and sides of the wheel with the diamond. I'll dress right into the blotter paper if it extends beyond the clamp washer because I use the sides of the wheel too when it helps me flatten something out.

There is a right way and an OK gets you by fast way. For instance....free hand was enough to dress a green wheel and make a smooth sharp 1/32" wide o-ring grooving tool (with relief on all sides) made from a broken cemented carbide tool bit found in the drawer when the shop ran out of inserts . Always wondered why my hands look like old leather LOL. If you wonder how I get a real smooth finish on carbide using a green wheel ( All I had access to) without a diamond wheel.... I use a technique that an old toolmaker showed me many moons ago. You slow the wheel to near stopped. Like 100 RPM. Sometimes would have to just jog the wheel with the on/off button several times. Can get near diamond wheel finish if your green wheel is dressed well. Don't ask me why it works but it does so I never tried to analyze it.

Went to grind something small the other day on my Iron Block grinder (don't recall what it was) and it heated up real fast and got real heavy quick if you know what I mean. (too laze to go get water and mine doesn't have the trough like yours) So I shut the grinder off and waited the usual eternity for the thing to stop. (didn't have any scrap within reach to slow it ) Can't believe how loaded and glazed both wheels were. (and no....I don't grind aluminum on it) I should know better and keep my wheels sharp but.... yea...... I'm guilty.

Would like to hear your method,...... but please don't tell me you put the wheel on a special arbor riding on precision ground parallels and poise it like a watch balance LOL I really do that with my pocket watch balances though using the balance staff as the arbor and ruby parallels. Some things give you no choice but to do it the right way.......

 

[Old Radar]

Would like to hear your method,...... but please don't tell me you put the wheel on a special arbor riding on precision ground parallels and poise it like a watch balance

Well, kinda... But only for my wire wheels. So far, for my grind wheels I've only found it necessary to shim around the hubs to eliminate wobble and vibration. I stick a paper ring on the sides of the stone and touch a pencil on the edge to determine where the wobble is and use paper shims under the hub to eliminate it. Then I use a diamond edger.

This is on my Baldor.


I've found wire wheels are always out of balance. I made a crude set of parallels with razor blades and use an old socket extension for the hub. When the wheel settles with the heavy end down, I weight the opposite end with screws. When I spin the hub on the blades and it no longer stops on one spot, I'm done. Both methods are finicky and time consuming but a quarter can rest on the top of my grinders all day long.



I found this setup at an estate sale last year. Haven't used it yet, but it should be better than my razor blade jig.

 

[Caveman613]

Well, kinda... But only for my wire wheels. So far, for my grind wheels I've only found it necessary to shim around the hubs to eliminate wobble and vibration. I stick a paper ring on the sides of the stone and touch a pencil on the edge to determine where the wobble is and use paper shims under the hub to eliminate it. Then I use a diamond edger.

This is on my Baldor.


I've found wire wheels are always out of balance. I made a crude set of parallels with razor blades and use an old socket extension for the hub. When the wheel settles with the heavy end down, I weight the opposite end with screws. When I spin the hub on the blades and it no longer stops on one spot, I'm done. Both methods are finicky and time consuming but a quarter can rest on the top of my grinders all day long.



I found this setup at an estate sale last year. Haven't used it yet, but it should be better than my razor blade jig.

Hi Old Radar! Sorry I'm just replying now....... been busy. I like your idea with the wire brush !! You really do poise it like I do with pocket watch balances. The screw weights are clever! I will try that myself for sure. Just never thought about balancing a wire wheel and have just put up with the vibration. Thank you very much for sharing your great idea with me.

The estate sale find is nice for sure and would also be great for the wire wheel. Toolmakers sometimes balance surface grinder wheels with something like that by drilling the side of the grinding wheel to balance it but that's for a better finish. Don't think I would bother with that method for a bench grinder though when just eliminating vibration. Your first method is fine for that. Basically what I do but I just dress the sides as long as the wobble is within reason. I think taking the time to shim is definitely better though and I may try that as well to see how long it takes me.
Thanks again for your ideas Old Radar. I never stop learning new tricks.

 

[Old Radar]

My pleasure! Please post your thoughts after trying them.

 

[LSUmAniac]

Well just acquired this grinder and I'm a newbie in this world but am learning alot everyday. From reading this forum it doesn't look like mine is a pre block. I'll be restoring this in the coming days just need to find the paint I want to use. I would like to go as close to original color as possible so if anyone knows what could get me in the ballpark please let me know.

 

[Old Radar]

Welcome to GJ, LSU!

I just saw your query on Mattblast's vintage grinder sticker reproduction thread. Matt does do amazing work, and I don't mean to deprive him of your business, but that label seems to be in very good shape for its age and shows only the marks of honest use. If it were mine, I'd keep it. Just my unsolicited two cents... BTW, I'll be watching the Citrus Bowl today--Go Boilers!

 

[LSUmAniac]

Welcome to GJ, LSU!

I just saw your query on Mattblast's vintage grinder sticker reproduction thread. Matt does do amazing work, and I don't mean to deprive him of your business, but that label seems to be in very good shape for its age and shows only the marks of honest use. If it were mine, I'd keep it. Just my unsolicited two cents... BTW, I'll be watching the Citrus Bowl today--Go Boilers!

Yeah I'm sure it would look just fine when it's all painted up, I guess I just like to go all out on things. Also hope it's a good game to watch I know both teams are down alot of players

 

[Old Radar]

hope it's a good game to watch I know both teams are down alot of players

Ouch! Even with the 2nd string and injuries, embarrassingly one-sided.

 

[Caveman613]

Well just acquired this grinder and I'm a newbie in this world but am learning alot everyday. From reading this forum it doesn't look like mine is a pre block.

Hi LSUmAniac, .... Welcome and congrats on your new (old) grinder!
By the looks of your grinder from what I can see, it appears to be an early cast iron block grinder. See if a magnet sticks to the base. If yes, then that is what others call a pre-block even though I like to call them iron block grinders. Just a beef I have about the name PRE-block when the design is the block style for sure. Anyway.... if it's the early iron model like I think it is, then that's my favorite type because of the weight and build quality. I can use mine just sitting on it's rubber feet without being bolted down to the bench because of the weight. Then I can slide it back out of the way when not using.

Don't know if you've seen the pictures of the one that OldRadar has restored but his is the top of the line most beautiful IRON block grinder on here. (You should be able to go back a few pages and see it) If you like the colors of Old Radar's restoration maybe he can help you with that??

Oh.... the type that is referd to as BLOCK grinder vs PRE-block for the iron ones are made with aluminum housings. I believe the aluminum design came about some time in the mid 60's. Old Radar is the expert to ask though. He is very knowledgeable about these grinders.

I think it's just plain stupid to call the iron BLOCK SHAPE ones PRE-block when the name BLOCK grinder obviously refers to the shape. Not going to change people though. They will just continue to confuse the new owners with the stupid term.
I've seen some guys tell new people that their IRON one is a PRE-block and worth less. DON'T believe that if someone tells you that !! I would pay MORE for a nice CAST IRON model. If you go back and look at my posts you'll find pics that I posted side by side showing the inside build quality of the old cast iron models that I think was better. Some BOZO started the term PRE-block for the iron ones years ago and it stuck. Has been used since .

 

[lafester]

Hi LSUmAniac, .... Welcome and congrats on your new (old) grinder!
By the looks of your grinder from what I can see, it appears to be an early cast iron block grinder. See if a magnet sticks to the base. If yes, then that is what others call a pre-block even though I like to call them iron block grinders. Just a beef I have about the name PRE-block when the design is the block style for sure. Anyway.... if it's the early iron model like I think it is, then that's my favorite type because of the weight and build quality. I can use mine just sitting on it's rubber feet without being bolted down to the bench because of the weight. Then I can slide it back out of the way when not using.

Don't know if you've seen the pictures of the one that OldRadar has restored but his is the top of the line most beautiful IRON block grinder on here. (You should be able to go back a few pages and see it) If you like the colors of Old Radar's restoration maybe he can help you with that??

I think it's just plain stupid to call the iron BLOCK SHAPE ones PRE-block when the name BLOCK grinder obviously refers to the shape. Not going to change people though. They will just continue to confuse the new owners with the stupid term. Some BOZO started the term PRE-block for the iron ones years ago and it stuck. Has been used since .

Since when does a block have a round top? The blocks are the later model flat tops.

 

[Caveman613]

Since when does a block have a round top? The blocks are the later model flat tops.

Hi lafester!
I remember many years ago when a guy started the term PRE-block for the Cast Iron block grinders (as in looking like a block) and I thought THAT made no sense whatsoever because the shape was the same as the later aluminum models. He told a new guy that his cast iron block grinder was basically worthless because it wasn't a true "BLOCK" grinder...... only a PRE-BLOCK. I got angry at what the guy was telling the new owner so did research to refute some of the stuff this BOZO was telling people. Saw I was getting nowhere and basically wasting my time so never went back to that forum.Not worth getting my blood pressure up!

Fast forward MANY years and I came across this forum. You can go back and see what my opinion is regarding the "PRE-BLOCK" terminology.
So let me get this straight..... your now saying most of the aluminum models are "PRE-BLOCK" ?? Your kidding right ?
Are you saying these are all Pre-Block too?

 

[Caveman613]

Since when does a block have a round top? The blocks are the later model flat tops.

Is this the only type that you say is a "BLOCK" grinder ? Please tell me that's not what your saying?? If so ....I give up!!

 

[Old Radar]

Old Radar is the expert to ask though. He is very knowledgeable about these grinders.

Thanks for the complement, Caveman, but you're making me blush! I'm just handy with a rattle can and a little OCD about vibration. There are plenty of real experts--guys who have done significant research and who can talk knowledgeably about the grinder innards, their specs and history, @exmaxima1, @torqueman2002, @drivesitfar, and @lafester, just to name a few. I don't doubt your own extensive knowledge--you just need to tame the "excitable boy" in you just a bit--and let go of that old BOZO from your past.

 

[Caveman613]

Thanks for the complement, Caveman, but you're making me blush! I'm just handy with a rattle can and a little OCD about vibration. There are plenty of real experts--guys who have done significant research and who can talk knowledgeably about the grinder innards, their specs and history, @exmaxima1, @torqueman2002, @drivesitfar, and @lafester, just to name a few. I don't doubt your own extensive knowledge--you just need to tame the "excitable boy" in you just a bit--and let go of that old BOZO from your past.

Yep..... your absolutely right OldRadar! I really could care less what others call a Tomato lol.
You can see the ones I have now. The one I use the most now is the cast iron one. The one with the flat top next to the old Juke Box I used and beat for over 20 years and it STILL WORKS! That's why I like them so much. I have to restore some like the flat top when I get to it. I'm just a sucker for a good deal. When I see them for $30 or $35 bucks I just can't walk away. One of my weaknesses lol. I'm going to give one to my neighbor and another to a young buddy I've been trying to set up with his garage shop. I gave him a Chinese junker a while ago (worked OK) and now I have to make amends lol.

Just did a search on the forums and saw one named "let's see your craftsman block grinders". Goes back to 2012 and many are showing the aluminum ones with the radius on top as their "BLOCK" grinders. Now lafester is saying... "The blocks are the later model flat tops".

Another thread I just saw when searching is titled "Craftsman Bench Grinder Parts; Block, Pre-Block, Pre-Pre-Block, Post-Block".
Block, Pre-Block, Pre-Pre-Block, Post-Block? I think this has gotten so far out of hand that I'm waiting for the "YO-MAMA" Block to appear?? LOL

 

[FrankLee]

Another thread I just saw when searching is titled "Craftsman Bench Grinder Parts; Block, Pre-Block, Pre-Pre-Block, Post-Block".
Block, Pre-Block, Pre-Pre-Block, Post-Block? I think this has gotten so far out of hand that I'm waiting for the "YO-MAMA" Block to appear?? LOL

Well, you could have at least provided the link. LoL!

Craftsman Bench Grinder Parts; Block, Pre-Block, Pre-Pre-Block, Post-Block

I accept Zelle or cash only. Craftsman Bench Grinder Parts; Block, Pre-Block, Pre-Pre-Block, Post-Block :rolleyes: I have some Craftsman (or other) bench grinder parts available.

www.garagejournal.com

The rolleyes in the first post means that I also think it has gotten out of hand. I dislike the distinction too. Several months ago, I asked the mods to merge those two threads and was shot down.

 

[Caveman613]

There are plenty of real experts--guys who have done significant research and who can talk knowledgeably about the grinder innards, their specs and history.

Thank you for the heads up with the other knowledgeable members! I did hours of research years ago and can't even remember all the info I read it was so long ago. Stuff like how the company that made them was bought out and became a division of a new company that picked up on the design for sears etc, etc. etc. I've restored old Craftsman cast iron drill presses when I had time too. So much to learn about them also.

My head is already swimming with information about so many old American machines that It might pop if I try to cram anymore info in there LOL. Remember..... I started working in Machine shops about 50 years ago. Grinders and drill presses were just small potato tools. Never cared about their history etc, just had to work to get the job done. Now most stuff is made in China so the old American made stuff has sparked more interest. As an American working in manufacturing I always did my best to make quality products and tooling. Not only for the company but for myself so I could sleep at night feeling good about my contribution to the country while making a fair wage. It was a different country and world back then. We weren't JUST BLUE COLLAR workers. There was a certain pride in the trades then and we made things that lasted. These block grinders are proof of that. Look how many are still around after all these years.

Shame where the country is now. Seems acknowledging and catering to special interest and minority demands has become more important than our safety, putting food on the table and gas in our cars. Climate Alarmists are costing us our way of life too....for a climate emergency that doesn't exist while the Chinese are laughing all the way to the bank ,but I digress.

 

[Caveman613]

Well, you could have at least provided the link. LoL!

Craftsman Bench Grinder Parts; Block, Pre-Block, Pre-Pre-Block, Post-Block

I accept Zelle or cash only. Craftsman Bench Grinder Parts; Block, Pre-Block, Pre-Pre-Block, Post-Block :rolleyes: I have some Craftsman (or other) bench grinder parts available.

www.garagejournal.com

The rolleyes in the first post means that I also think it has gotten out of hand. I dislike the distinction too. Several months ago, I asked the mods to merge those two threads and was shot down.

Ahhh .....now I don't feel alone! Thank you!

 

[fatfillup]

Wow, you guys are deep into grinders. I like em and have several in the fleet and buy every one I can get at a reasonable price because I sell them. I only clean and test them and put a price tag on them, no painting for me but yours' look beautiful.

I see the 1/2 HP blocks most. Have had a few 3/4 hp, and have seen a 1 hp but couldn't buy it. It may have been 8 inch.

Did just get an IRON block recently that works fine but ain't pretty, 1/3 hp. Was surprised at the oomph it has when leaned on.

 

[lafester]

Is this the only type that you say is a "BLOCK" grinder ? Please tell me that's not what your saying?? If so ....I give up!!

Well yeah... doesn't that one look like a block? I call the others round tops, but while I am here I use the traditional naming. What about the two older 'iron' models?

 

[FrankLee]

Here are a few Craftsman Cast Iron round top grinders that I haven't posted before. I'm no longer using those other "B" terms.

115.7566 dated 9 55 with nice original paint and fabricated tool rests. This one is my keeper/user.







115.7575 also dated 9 55. Eye shields are from a 397.19580. The left cover was from another 397 model. Almost all standard parts and hardware were replaced.





Parts:
grinder - FBMP
left cover - ebay
eye shields - Darin - from a 397.19580
bearings - https://jsbgreatbearings.com/62032r...ring-62032nse-62032rs-emq-bearings-p-788.html
switch - https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01IYKSLCG/?tag=atomicindus08-20
capacitor - https://www.airstarsupply.com/product.aspx?id=720
power cord - https://www.homedepot.com/p/Husky-8...eplacement-Cord-in-Black-HD-165-018/303679847
rubber feet - https://www.homedepot.com/p/Everbilt-1-in-Heavy-Duty-Anti-Skid-Surface-Pads-4-Pack-49644/203661092?
cord grommet - https://www.lowes.com/pd/Hillman-0-3125-in-Rubber-Grommet/4565085
paint - primer - https://www.walmart.com/ip/White-Ru...rimer-Spray-Paint-12-oz/17011205?athbdg=L1200
paint - champagne gold - https://www.homedepot.com/p/BEHR-PR...etallic-Spray-Paint-Aerosol-B061744/319367966
paint - flat burnished amber - https://www.walmart.com/ip/Burnishe...rior-Flat-Metallic-Spray-Paint-11-oz/43380444
wire wheel - https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01022VAJ0/?tag=atomicindus08-20
buffing wheel - https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01JKI15DS/?tag=atomicindus08-20
lamp cord - https://www.homedepot.com/p/Cerrowi...tranded-Copper-Lamp-Wire-251-1001A1/303288879
socket head hardware - https://www.midstatesbolt.com/default.aspx?page=home
copper slip couplers spacers - https://www.homedepot.com/p/Everbilt-1-2-in-Copper-Pressure-Slip-Coupling-Fitting-C601HD12/100345672
misc consumables



Here's another 115.7575 I picked up on 1/4. This one is dated 10 58. I hoped the original paint might clean up ok, but nope, this one will also get new paint.




2/21/2023

I finally completed the '58 this morning. I'm not thrilled with the Champagne Mist, but it turned out ok.

 

[LSUmAniac]

See if a magnet sticks to the base. If yes, then that is what others call a pre-block even though I like to call them iron block grinders.

First of all thank you for the information, and yes a magnet does stick to the base and it is extremely heavy for its size. It's from 1962 and I attached a few more pics to maybe clear it up some. Man I had no idea the huge amount of differences from these from grinder to grinder. Im just a huge fan of the older made in USA tools and would rather use the old stuff over a Chinese knock off any day of the week. In the coming days I'll be uploading all the pics of my progress and the process I took to restore this beauty. Thanks for all the great info guys

 

[F-22]

Would always be cool to me to own US stuff, but these sadly don't exist over here in central Europe.
But I wanna show my big old Italian cast iron pedestal grinder (~1.5kW, 3 phase 400V). I use a 240 and a 600 grit flap wheel (awesome to prep stuff for polishing). It's really nice and rounded design, thinking about giving it a nicer restoration at some point (sand blasting, maybe chrome the left and right bearing holders and powder coat the middle... Would probably look really sweet). I'm actually not sure if it's cast iron or alloy (Italians used to be known for their high quality cast alloy/aluminium). In that case I might just polish some stuff. But I'm pretty sure the middle is cast iron.




Also the pretty massive 70's production grinder we have at work. Hard to see the scale on the photo, but that thing is gigantic. I forgot exactly how powerful it is, either 8kW or 12kW. Probably meant to be used in foundries and forges for grinding off the lines in mass production...

 

[LSUmAniac]

So I've looked everywhere on here and online for a manual or parts breakdown on the 1/4 hp 397.19501 grinder and can't find anything. I got this thing all broke down and it seems to me I'm missing parts particular the spring washer. I only see one spring washer on the left hand side of the grinder and to me I would think it needs one on each side. It would also just be very helpful to see if I'm missing other parts.

 

[LSUmAniac]

Disregard that last post I finally found what I needed and I see for whatever reason there is only one spring washer being used.

 

[torqueman2002]

Ha!
Just saw your last post. But was in the process of writing my reply. Where did you find your info and does your model use a centrifugal switch?

LSU - I've come across CM grinders with one and two spring washers, but IDK which styles tend to have either.

I looked through my modest 'library' of CM owner's manuals/parts list and found a manual for a 1/4 HP m-115.19500 that uses a centrifugal switch and a single spring washer.

Click on image for larger view.