Ratchet mechanisms: How they work
- Thread starter bonneyman
- Start date
The one I have pictured did the same thing. Couldn't get it to stop auto-reversing. The inside of the selector knob was plastic (Go figure!), and I think it was made so that it had a little "give" and friction whereas steel wouldn't. That little amount of friction and give, I surmise, allows the mechanism to function. Too much lube or wear, and the thing doesn't work. I know that's not much help, but it was my experience.
This question could start a free-for-all. But, being this is America - and we're all allowed to have our opinions - I've give you mine.
I always liked the S-K roundheads. I have one I've had for 30 years - a 45170 3/8" (the one pictured) - and, as the pic shows, it has minimal wear and still ratchets cleanly. Has never slipped, and has the original mechanism in it.
That being said, I'm really in love with the Indestro teardrops. I have 3 (in 1/4, 3/8, and 1/2), and they are the nicest ratcheting action I've felt. Even though they are batman/triangular pawls. IMHO.
The pic doesn't show it, but, on the back side of the selector knob is a little peg sticking out. When you install the knob, you have to first catch the bottom of the spring with that knob. Then, install the knob onto the ratchet, without letting the spring slip off that peg. It can be a tricky operation - one that makes you wish you had an extra hand!
The spring is held under tension at all times. When the selector is turned, the pressure of the spring slides the pawl (hence, the "sliding" pawl) up against one side of the inside of the rat head. When turned one way, the spring has enough give to let the pawl slide enough so the mechanism "ratchets" past the teeth. When turning the other way, the spring pressure holds the pawl against the teeth, and the pawl "jams" between the inside of the head and mechanism body. Very little chance of stripping the teeth off, as the action is more jam thatnteeth grabbing. This style has a very fine ratcheting action, and is quite durable. If you can find one half-way reasonable, grab it!
Do you need a Craftsman ratchet?
Thanks for all the kind words, guys. I appreciate it. And the pics are awesome!
I'm just glad people have found the info useful, and it looks like the thread will turn into a really good place to dump rat pics!
Are you looking for a Craftsman ratchet? Bought a set that needs one, or been handed down a socket set that you'd like to find the "correct" ratchet for? Ever tried looking on ebay, and the seller doesn't know the number - or the picture(s) don't show the info, or have too low a resolution to show you what you need? Well, here's a quick tutorial on the C-man tear drop ratchets.
There are two main styles: What Sears calls the long lever tear drop (LLTD) and the standard tooth ratchet. The LLTD was made for Sears by EASCO from about 1967 to 1993, and then Danaher replaced that style with their "standard" ratchet from about 1993 thru the present. They look alot alike from a quick glance, they are both quick-release, and both are the same overall length. But they have totally different mechanisms, and the kits don't interchange.
It's easy to distinguish between the two with a little practice. Once you know what to look for, even a poor photo on ebay can tell you if the tool in question is the one you want.
Here's the two tear-drop ratchet heads side-by-side. The older on the left, the newer on the right.
From the front:
The older style has a donut-shaped front plate, the newer one has a "figure-8" shaped-plate. Dead give-away.
From the back:
The older has what I call a "baby rattle" selector knob, while the newer rat has a "manta ray" (or stingray)-shaped knob. Again, a dead give-away.
If you have a socket set from the 70's or 80's, then you don't want the newer style ratchet in there. There's nothing wrong with them - I've grown to like them - but they just don't "fit" in vintage sets. And, if you're looking for a rat to throw in the tool box, you probably don't want it to be one of the older styles. If it's all you've got, sure - it's a tool! But to beat daily on a style that's no longer made wouldn't be my first choice.
The older style had other selector knobs, but, you'll have to learn them as you see them. (Perhaps one of the Craftsman collectors on the forum can post pics of those??) And there were oil port styles of LLTD (which are quite collectable), but they serve only to more closely date the ratchet, and don't affect the mechanisms.
Hope this helps!
Thanks for all the kind words, guys. I appreciate it. And the pics are awesome!
I'm just glad people have found the info useful, and it looks like the thread will turn into a really good place to dump rat pics!
Are you looking for a Craftsman ratchet? Bought a set that needs one, or been handed down a socket set that you'd like to find the "correct" ratchet for? Ever tried looking on ebay, and the seller doesn't know the number - or the picture(s) don't show the info, or have too low a resolution to show you what you need? Well, here's a quick tutorial on the C-man tear drop ratchets.
There are two main styles: What Sears calls the long lever tear drop (LLTD) and the standard tooth ratchet. The LLTD was made for Sears by EASCO from about 1967 to 1993, and then Danaher replaced that style with their "standard" ratchet from about 1993 thru the present. They look alot alike from a quick glance, they are both quick-release, and both are the same overall length. But they have totally different mechanisms, and the kits don't interchange.
It's easy to distinguish between the two with a little practice. Once you know what to look for, even a poor photo on ebay can tell you if the tool in question is the one you want.
Here's the two tear-drop ratchet heads side-by-side. The older on the left, the newer on the right.
From the front:
The older style has a donut-shaped front plate, the newer one has a "figure-8" shaped-plate. Dead give-away.
From the back:
The older has what I call a "baby rattle" selector knob, while the newer rat has a "manta ray" (or stingray)-shaped knob. Again, a dead give-away.
If you have a socket set from the 70's or 80's, then you don't want the newer style ratchet in there. There's nothing wrong with them - I've grown to like them - but they just don't "fit" in vintage sets. And, if you're looking for a rat to throw in the tool box, you probably don't want it to be one of the older styles. If it's all you've got, sure - it's a tool! But to beat daily on a style that's no longer made wouldn't be my first choice.
The older style had other selector knobs, but, you'll have to learn them as you see them. (Perhaps one of the Craftsman collectors on the forum can post pics of those??) And there were oil port styles of LLTD (which are quite collectable), but they serve only to more closely date the ratchet, and don't affect the mechanisms.
Hope this helps!
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Hi Guys
Bonneyman just asked me to post these. Its a Ward Master I got this last fall.
Its a pretty trippy mechanism. Oh and its just grease, George
yours Scott
I guess I really stepped in it (i.e. the grease)! Sorry!
Hey, I'm just happy I remembered the picture of yours when I saw the other one and could find it. One of the first things to go is the memory.
What were we talking about again?
trout
Well-known member
Yeah, I'm still trying to figure out how that last one works. How does it go back together?
overview of ratchet types: http://www.williamtools.com/Ratchet-Handle-Types.shtml
mrholeshot
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Great Thread!!!!!!!
mrholeshot
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I thought I'd throw in the Harbor Freight composite ratchet
mrholeshot
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From left to right. Kobalt (danaher, Harbor Freight Snap-On handle copy, Craftsman)
JeremyManning
Well-known member
mkdive posted his F80 with what looks like a plastic cover, do most snap on ratchets have available see through covers?
Think you'll find the answer in the link below. Still curious about the brand though.
Those were demo units for dealers or so I was told.
scarrylarry
Well-known member
Bonneyman
Super thread you started here!As a newbie tool type guy I find this thread very informative.It seems you have got quite a few guys motivated to jump on board as well.Good Job!
scarrylarry
Super thread you started here!As a newbie tool type guy I find this thread very informative.It seems you have got quite a few guys motivated to jump on board as well.Good Job!
scarrylarry
ajchien
Well-known member
Anybody willing to compare /contrast / suggest how the different ratcheting mechanisms might affect performance or longevity or strength of a ratchet?
Re: Do you need a Craftsman ratchet?
Collectible? Really?
I've got a long handle 3/8" flex. It's a QR with a double crescent selector and an oil port. It's a V series with a patent number but no model number. 24 teeth. The unique thing I like about it is the QR feature doesn't just retract the ball from the detent, it also extends a pin to pop the socket off. Haven't seen any other ratchets with that style QR.
Collectible? Really?
I've got a long handle 3/8" flex. It's a QR with a double crescent selector and an oil port. It's a V series with a patent number but no model number. 24 teeth. The unique thing I like about it is the QR feature doesn't just retract the ball from the detent, it also extends a pin to pop the socket off. Haven't seen any other ratchets with that style QR.
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trout
Well-known member
Thanks, I'm starting to understand it now. Does that style have a low torque limit? Seems like it would slip a lot.
I'm not sure. It does slip, but I believe that is because one of the metal "springs" is homemade. But, maybe I am wrong.
When I obtain a second example of the ratchet, I will be able to see if it also slips.
glenmore
Well-known member
Ahhhh, I see, one of those gearless zero degree ratchets.
s/o FR-84
That is one nice really rare ratchet!!!!
glenmore
Well-known member
Continually amazing what Snapmom pulls of her toolbox(es).
Here's a vintage Snap-On!
Ever wonder what's in one of those vintage collectable (i.e. expensive) Snap-On ratchets? Here's a FV70 3/8" I recently sold. Before it went out the door, I disassembled it, cleaned it, and snapped an inside pic:
Not much there! Just a ball, spring, batman pawl, and 20 tooth gear.
Ever wonder what's in one of those vintage collectable (i.e. expensive) Snap-On ratchets? Here's a FV70 3/8" I recently sold. Before it went out the door, I disassembled it, cleaned it, and snapped an inside pic:
Not much there! Just a ball, spring, batman pawl, and 20 tooth gear.
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Re: Do you need a Craftsman ratchet?
Let's see some pics - it sounds cool!
I know that the last year of oil port Craftsman rats was 1980 or so. Therefore, any OP rat in your collection/toolbox is at least 30 years old. Luckily - if I recall correctly - those can still be rebuilt with currently available kits. (Though, you'll lose the hourglass selector knob
)
Collectible? Really?
I've got a long handle 3/8" flex. It's a QR with a double crescent selector and an oil port. It's a V series with a patent number but no model number. 24 teeth. The unique thing I like about it is the QR feature doesn't just retract the ball from the detent, it also extends a pin to pop the socket off. Haven't seen any other ratchets with that style QR.
Let's see some pics - it sounds cool!
I know that the last year of oil port Craftsman rats was 1980 or so. Therefore, any OP rat in your collection/toolbox is at least 30 years old. Luckily - if I recall correctly - those can still be rebuilt with currently available kits. (Though, you'll lose the hourglass selector knob
)S.L., I'm glad you're finding this thread helpful. That was my intention - to help folks out (and, drool over ratchet pictures!
)SK "Frankenstein"
Upside down photo of directional rod.
Damn I got same one. How did you get out the rod thing?
bad_religion_au
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not sure if it's the same mechanism that was in my old sydchrome gearless, but if it is, they definately do NOT have a low torque limit. it was my "abused" ratchet for years, before i knew what a breaker bar was... used it with a BIG cheater pipe to SNAP the control arms off a nissan patrol...
hofferwood
Well-known member
Hey guys,
It looks like Stanley figured out they had a problem with auto rev. What was done is put detent balls and detents in the cover plate. This is a new 3/8" that is in the stanley tool box I posted about a couple days ago. The 1/4" is exactly the same, but the balls are smaller.
My suggestion for the older ones would be take it apart, clean all the rll or grease(heavy stuff) from the teeth. Use a very light oil(3in1) or similar. The reason being. look at the pawl to gear fit, very close. So my opinion is with the high viscosity grease, the pawl is actually "glued" to the gear. Look close when you take it apart. I think you will see what I'm saying. I would also stretch that spring out a little. J.M.O.
Porphyre, That "pin" was for quick release extensions that cman made for a minute, They were hollow with a pin that ran thru and released the socket from the ext. They twisted like pretzels. I know I had a few. The Stans above have it too, but don't come close to a socket or extension (the pin, I just checked).
Chuck
stopdroplol
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Re: Do you need a Craftsman ratchet?
My dad uses the 1/2" standard version of that. Bought it for my uncle in 1970. My dad found it cleaning out my Uncle's garage after he passed away two years ago.
His actually has "OIL" stamped above the port.
Collectible? Really?
I've got a long handle 3/8" flex. It's a QR with a double crescent selector and an oil port. It's a V series with a patent number but no model number. 24 teeth. The unique thing I like about it is the QR feature doesn't just retract the ball from the detent, it also extends a pin to pop the socket off. Haven't seen any other ratchets with that style QR.
My dad uses the 1/2" standard version of that. Bought it for my uncle in 1970. My dad found it cleaning out my Uncle's garage after he passed away two years ago.
His actually has "OIL" stamped above the port.