Saylor-Beall Rebuild

[9GUY9]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

heres some info.

http://www.freeshipequip.com/PDFs/Saylor-Beall-700-Series-AirCompressor-Pumps-Manual.pdf

This is where I will be getting my parts

http://www.airfloinc.com/item/1033

They were much cheaper than the other places I checked with. Ken was very helpful on the phone and in email.

Pull the valves out and look for broken springs, that is their most common problem. I had my pump off and got a little carried away pulling it apart to check for worn rings. Turns out it was completely fine after pumping away in a auto shop for 10 years. But now since I have it totally disasembled I'm going to powder coat it all and make it pretty.

If you decide to switch to a 7.5hp motor, use a 6.25-6.5" pulley on the motor and it will spin the pump around 600 rpm and put out around 28scfm. These pumps sound great spinning along at those low rpms.

 

[metal4130]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

This comes directly from the Saylor Beall catalog. With the 7.5 HP motor and 707 pump you can spin the pump at 730 RPM which makes 31.2 CFM @ 100 PSI and 26.9 CFM @ 175 PSI.

The pump pulley is 16.75" so I bought a motor pulley (Browning 2TB68) which is 7.15 inches. Do the math and thats 736 RPM at the pump.

 

[Certified]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

I wont offer more that 120$, good luck finding parts and a 3 phase convertor, here is the rule: NOT working = Junk, unless you are a restoration guru, plus you are buying it to use it not to put it in a museum.

 

[DIC]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

I would pass on this one.

 

[CNGsaves]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

I would pass on this one.

See post # 38 . . . . he already bought it $80 and hauled it home!!

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

heres some info.

http://www.freeshipequip.com/PDFs/Saylor-Beall-700-Series-AirCompressor-Pumps-Manual.pdf

This is where I will be getting my parts

http://www.airfloinc.com/item/1033

They were much cheaper than the other places I checked with. Ken was very helpful on the phone and in email.

Pull the valves out and look for broken springs, that is their most common problem. I had my pump off and got a little carried away pulling it apart to check for worn rings. Turns out it was completely fine after pumping away in a auto shop for 10 years. But now since I have it totally disasembled I'm going to powder coat it all and make it pretty.

If you decide to switch to a 7.5hp motor, use a 6.25-6.5" pulley on the motor and it will spin the pump around 600 rpm and put out around 28scfm. These pumps sound great spinning along at those low rpms.

Thank you for the links and information. Did you buy or build the tool to remove the valves? I don't have any tool to remove them.

This comes directly from the Saylor Beall catalog. With the 7.5 HP motor and 707 pump you can spin the pump at 730 RPM which makes 31.2 CFM @ 100 PSI and 26.9 CFM @ 175 PSI.

The pump pulley is 16.75" so I bought a motor pulley (Browning 2TB68) which is 7.15 inches. Do the math and thats 736 RPM at the pump.

Very good to know. 31.2 CFM will be more then enough for me.

I wont offer more that 120$, good luck finding parts and a 3 phase convertor, here is the rule: NOT working = Junk, unless you are a restoration guru, plus you are buying it to use it not to put it in a museum.

He kept the motor so I will buy a single phase.

I would pass on this one.

I got it for $.10 a pound. Thought I would take a chance.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

So I started to work on making a moving stand for it consisting of two 4x4 lumber and proper wheels for the weight load. I also cleaned the feet off so it won't get the lumber nasty and also did a test cleaning on one side of the tank. The part I don't understand is why it started to look like it is crying. I cleaned one part of the right side of the tank and then went to eat some lunch. When I came back some extra cleaner dripped down and left black marks. No matter how hard I scrubbed I couldn't get the discolored drips away. It is clean but stained. What did I do wrong? Now I will make sure I won't walk away if there is anything left that might drip or be sure to clean a larger section at once. But it seems if you don't clean a large section at the same time you will get discoloration differences when you clean the new section as well. And if it drips you are really messed up.

I will try to post some pictures in the next post. It just gave me some token error.

 

[metal4130]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/t...mpaignId=T9F&gclid=CODdkfOygrcCFUNqMgodPCcA1Q


I don't plan on taking apart the valves on mine but I did see this in an MSC catalog and it does seem like this tool would be able to do the job. I don't own one so I can't say for sure but the measurements seem to match.

 

[9GUY9]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

As far as a valve tool. I used a hammer and a punch to remove my valves. I plan to thread a piece of steel for 2 bolts that will line up with the holes in the valves. I'm then going to weld a old socket to it for a drive.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/t...mpaignId=T9F&gclid=CODdkfOygrcCFUNqMgodPCcA1Q


I don't plan on taking apart the valves on mine but I did see this in an MSC catalog and it does seem like this tool would be able to do the job. I don't own one so I can't say for sure but the measurements seem to match.

I was hoping to find something cheaper.

As far as a valve tool. I used a hammer and a punch to remove my valves. I plan to thread a piece of steel for 2 bolts that will line up with the holes in the valves. I'm then going to weld a old socket to it for a drive.

I really need to learn to weld. Maybe I will drill a few holes in a metal bar and thread some bolts in them at the proper spacing.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Here are some pictures. I had many neighbors helping me get this done. One with a trailer I could use, one with a Jeep and another to help lift it off the trailer. It is great to have good neighbors.

In the third picture you can see the pressure valve that is damaged and leaking. I can hear it hiss when I rotate the pump by hand.

In the last picture you can see how we had to drag it to the end of the trailer so the engine hoist could reach it. We had the weight centered over the wheels for the long drive back home. The Jeep came in handy!

 

[CNGsaves]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Holy Toledo Batman . . . . that thing is BEAST . . . .
. . . . . 120 gallon tank and that compressor for $80 . . . . wow!

Once you get the ole girl fully restored, you'll have to make sure you keep an external air hose for all the neighbors to use . . . ie Community Air !!

 

[mrpizza]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

I took an impact socket and cut it down with little teeth and used it for a valve tool on an old Quincy. Worked great. I tried the bolts in a metal bar and it wouldn't work for me.

 

[plow]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Dig It!

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Holy Toledo Batman . . . . that thing is BEAST . . . .
. . . . . 120 gallon tank and that compressor for $80 . . . . wow!

Once you get the ole girl fully restored, you'll have to make sure you keep an external air hose for all the neighbors to use . . . ie Community Air !!

It is big enough for everyone!

I took an impact socket and cut it down with little teeth and used it for a valve tool on an old Quincy. Worked great. I tried the bolts in a metal bar and it wouldn't work for me.

How long was your metal bar? Did it have enough leverage? I was thinking of making it long.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Here are some more pictures. You can see the first part I cleaned up. When I was done it looked great in that one spot then I left to eat lunch and came back and the extra cleaner at the top started to drip down. It left marks that won't clean off now. I don't understand why it won't clean off. So the lesson here is to clean more off at once and don't leave anything behind that can drip down.

I also am still in the process of putting the wheels on. It will make it easier to move around while I am working on it. The 4x4 post will attach to the tank and the wheels will attach to the 4x4.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

With my a little help I finally got the wheels on. It works very well but it was hard to get it off the engine lift and on the ground by itself.

If you look at the first picture you can see that the wood is at an angle because the feet tilt up slightly. I am not sure what is the best way to make this straight. It will wear on the wheels some and may put extra stress on them but I am not sure yet. I need it to move around while I am working on it so I think this will work out.

 

[CNGsaves]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

With my a little help I finally got the wheels on. It works very well but it was hard to get it off the engine lift and on the ground by itself.

If you look at the first picture you can see that the wood is at an angle because the feet tilt up slightly. I am not sure what is the best way to make this straight. It will wear on the wheels some and may put extra stress on them but I am not sure yet. I need it to move around while I am working on it so I think this will work out.

Quick and easy way is shim the wheels that are under board by adding washers between wood and castors.

More difficult way would be cut top of wood at proper angle so that castors would be level, but this would require total removal and re-drilling the holes where feet attach.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Quick and easy way is shim the wheels that are under board by adding washers between wood and castors.

More difficult way would be cut top of wood at proper angle so that castors would be level, but this would require total removal and re-drilling the holes where feet attach.

Thanks for the washer tip. I went out and got some larger fender washers to spread out the load more and will add them to one side of the wheels.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Quick and easy way is shim the wheels that are under board by adding washers between wood and castors.

More difficult way would be cut top of wood at proper angle so that castors would be level, but this would require total removal and re-drilling the holes where feet attach.

Thank you for your helpful tip. It now is true and even moves much easier now.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Could someone with a Saylor Beall 707 Pump listen to this video I made? I want to compare the sounds it makes with a known working pump. I manually turned it while doing an audio recording and added some pictures of it to make a video.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/InCcYS0sUwM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[mayday0017]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Not sure why you ran the boards long ways, it would be stronger and not lean if you did them width way's on the tank instead. You wouldn't need any washers or anything special really, just cut your 4x4's down.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Not sure why you ran the boards long ways, it would be stronger and not lean if you did them width way's on the tank instead. You wouldn't need any washers or anything special really, just cut your 4x4's down.

That was my plan at first but then I found out it wouldn't work. I am using two fixed wheels and if you mount them sideways the bolt holes would be too close to the edge of the wood if using a 4x4. So I decided to run it the other way. If I used swivel wheels on both sides I could mount it sideways but since I wanted two fixed wheels for more stability I couldn't do it. I guess I could of upgraded to 6x6 but I just kept the 4x4. Maybe some advantage will reveal itself about the way I did it but I don't know what that is yet.

Edit: I just found out that I was not the first person to do it this way. Here is a picture.

 

[mayday0017]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Awesome, makes sense! Didn't know if you had a simple brain fart like I commonly have.

 

[CNGsaves]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Could someone with a Saylor Beall 707 Pump listen to this video I made? I want to compare the sounds it makes with a known working pump. I manually turned it while doing an audio recording and added some pictures of it to make a video.

Listened to your sounds on YouTube . . . . doesn't sound good. May be piston flopping around in cylinder or hitting some obstruction. Also could be wrist pin loose, or broken piston. Sounds like just one of cylinders though. Have someone else rotate the crank while you use hollow tube next to your ear (like an empty paper towel roll) and other end by cylinder head to determine which cylinder has the knock.

I'd start by dis-assembling the suspected problem head from top. Won't do any harm turning it over later with just one side compressing. By tearing down, you'll find out what parts you need. Might just be rings and bearings, or could need new piston and some cylinder work.

Good luck . . . you're now entering the compressor mechanic phase!!

 

[metal4130]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Agree, sounds like some kind of knock. Personally, I would leave the heads on but remove one of the inspection covers on the side. You will learn more that way. Shake the 4 connecting rods and you'll see the problem right away.

Drain the oil first of course and look for metal flakes or anything unusual.

Even still, a compressor with a knock would build pressure so I suspect there is more going on...

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Listened to your sounds on YouTube . . . . doesn't sound good. May be piston flopping around in cylinder or hitting some obstruction. Also could be wrist pin loose, or broken piston. Sounds like just one of cylinders though. Have someone else rotate the crank while you use hollow tube next to your ear (like an empty paper towel roll) and other end by cylinder head to determine which cylinder has the knock.

I'd start by dis-assembling the suspected problem head from top. Won't do any harm turning it over later with just one side compressing. By tearing down, you'll find out what parts you need. Might just be rings and bearings, or could need new piston and some cylinder work.

Good luck . . . you're now entering the compressor mechanic phase!!

Yes, I don't mind this part of it. Fixing it is the fun part. Thank you for your tips, I need to fashion up a valve removal tool first. I want to have as much torque available as possible and remove the valves while it is still on the pump before breaking it down. That way I have 800 pounds holding the pump stationary.

Agree, sounds like some kind of knock. Personally, I would leave the heads on but remove one of the inspection covers on the side. You will learn more that way. Shake the 4 connecting rods and you'll see the problem right away.

Drain the oil first of course and look for metal flakes or anything unusual.

Even still, a compressor with a knock would build pressure so I suspect there is more going on...

That is a good idea since they have those there. You know someone was in there before and did not use a proper gasket. It looks like they used some kind of silicone or something as it is messy and coming out the side of the inspection port. Not to mention there is oil all over the thing. I need make a funnel and something to hold it so I don't make a big mess when I drain the oil. After I drain the oil I will filter it through a screen and look for metal.

As for the more going on as you suggested I hope that is the leaking pressure valve on the top you hear in the video or the loose drain on the bottom. After I fix the pump I need to do some kind of pressure test on the tank with a small compressor.

I hope to be able to get to this on Friday. I will drain the oil first and open those ports up to have a look around.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Listened to your sounds on YouTube . . . . doesn't sound good. May be piston flopping around in cylinder or hitting some obstruction. Also could be wrist pin loose, or broken piston. Sounds like just one of cylinders though. Have someone else rotate the crank while you use hollow tube next to your ear (like an empty paper towel roll) and other end by cylinder head to determine which cylinder has the knock.

I'd start by dis-assembling the suspected problem head from top. Won't do any harm turning it over later with just one side compressing. By tearing down, you'll find out what parts you need. Might just be rings and bearings, or could need new piston and some cylinder work.

Good luck . . . you're now entering the compressor mechanic phase!!

Agree, sounds like some kind of knock. Personally, I would leave the heads on but remove one of the inspection covers on the side. You will learn more that way. Shake the 4 connecting rods and you'll see the problem right away.

Drain the oil first of course and look for metal flakes or anything unusual.

Even still, a compressor with a knock would build pressure so I suspect there is more going on...

I uploaded a video with a update on what I found. There were some metal shavings in the bottom. I hope the cylinder wall is OK. Is there a sleeve inside or is it all cast iron?

 

[ford33]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Metal shavings? Looks like large metal parts of the connecting rod and bearings pieces.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Metal shavings? Looks like large metal parts of the connecting rod and bearings pieces.

You can blame my Dad for my twisted sense of humor.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Here are some pictures of what I found today. You can also see a short video here.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/JktRNcoGUek" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[930dreamer]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

The carnage.

 

[metal4130]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Thats not bad at all. Is the piston still up in the cylinder? Were the remains of the one conn rod still bolted to the crankshaft or did you remove them? Also on the one connecting rod that is left on that side the cap on it is broken. It is supposed to have a long "oil dipper" on the end which I can see has broken off. This picks up the oil and slings it around to lubricate.

From what I can see the crankshaft will probably be salvageable.

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Thats not bad at all. Is the piston still up in the cylinder? Were the remains of the one conn rod still bolted to the crankshaft or did you remove them? Also on the one connecting rod that is left on that side the cap on it is broken. It is supposed to have a long "oil dipper" on the end which I can see has broken off. This picks up the oil and slings it around to lubricate.

From what I can see the crankshaft will probably be salvageable.

Yes, the crankshaft does look good. Everything in the picture is just how I found it. I just hope I didn't damage the intercooler when I dropped it.

There is one piston on one side stuck up there with no rod attached and the other side has a piston and half a rod attached.. The piston rod with the broken oil dipper is just resting inside the cylinder wall.

 

[CNGsaves]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Well problem it wouldn't build pressure found . . . .ie down at least one cylinder . . . if not down two!!

Just a "few metal shavings" found . . . funny !!

Considering that connecting rod was trashed, the low rpm of that compressor limited the overall carnage. Looks like there was "some" oil in there (not sure the quality), so wonder what caused shattering of connecting rod? Was it low on oil overall??

Post up pics/YouTube of top side tear down as well. Curious what you find on top of piston(s) in bad cylinder(s).

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Well problem it wouldn't build pressure found . . . .ie down at least one cylinder . . . if not down two!!

Just a "few metal shavings" found . . . funny !!

Considering that connecting rod was trashed, the low rpm of that compressor limited the overall carnage. Looks like there was "some" oil in there (not sure the quality), so wonder what caused shattering of connecting rod? Was it low on oil overall??

Post up pics/YouTube of top side tear down as well. Curious what you find on top of piston(s) in bad cylinder(s).

The oil was full but the quality was questionable. I am not sure why it failed. It looked like it had a hard life in a very dirty and hot factory. It does not look like it was well loved. The only two pistons working were the small ones.

 

[930dreamer]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Now you have the opportunity to go through it all and make it right.

 

[metal4130]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Good thing you got it for scrap price because I bet the seller knew EXCATLY what was wrong with it!

 

[930dreamer]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Good thing you got it for scrap price because I bet the seller knew EXCATLY what was wrong with it!

^X2 on that^

 

[jonathan75]

Re: Should I buy this Saylor-Beall?

Okay there is good and bad today. The bad is I still can't get the valves off. So this leaves me stuck because I don't want to continue the break down until I get the valves off. I need the weight of the unit to assist in removal so I don't want to take the heads off yet. I took the time and measured right and drilled my holes in metal and used bolts to fit the valve holes and the metal rod gave way before the valve did. Also the bolts made the valve look ugly because it is slightly smaller and digs into the holes making marks.

The good is that I looked up inside and the cylinder walls looked good for the most part. The aluminum rod that was running up and down the cylinder wall made some color difference but it did not look like it gouged it or made any significant damage. Good thing the rods are made of a softer metal. But the pistons looked damaged so I will need new rods and pistons.

Back to the valve tool I am hoping I can get a tool welded this week for not too much or I will buy one online.