Show your "Long C" Craftsman!

[Patrick Eubanks]

Ok guys I finally received the snappy looking New Britain ratchet. There are definately differences. Attached are pics of the ratchet sitting adjacent to the longer version of the c-97. The c-41 is considerably longer. The tooth construction on the gearing is much heavier on the NB and, well I didn’t count but the NB has fewer teeth. All other construction aspects do look identical. I guess it’s just a seldom seen NB. Attached are photos.

More

 

[Steven 33]

You can see how the craftman handle is all one piece but the nb one clearly had those side pieces on the ratchet head added later and the Handle knurling is off I would compare to early be ratchet with same handle type. I would wager the face plate is identical to the early nb ratchet if you compare that which if that's the case its likely a hybrid (officially made I would guess) and this theory is further supported by the fact that it would have been made during the period when new Britain was under contract by sears and only had 1/4 And 3/8 Drive Ratchets that were deemed acceptable, and also had major financial issues starting around 1933 so a beefed up version of what they already had would make sense especially with their being c series sockets. But there's a lot more to the story there. Just not worth going into

 

[Smokeshow69]

Ok guys I finally received the snappy looking New Britain ratchet. There are definately differences. Attached are pics of the ratchet sitting adjacent to the longer version of the c-97. The c-41 is considerably longer. The tooth construction on the gearing is much heavier on the NB and, well I didn’t count but the NB has fewer teeth. All other construction aspects do look identical. I guess it’s just a seldom seen NB. Attached are photos.

This is an interesting development.
Looks to be an undocumented version not prior seen ?

 

[Patrick Eubanks]

You can see how the craftman handle is all one piece but the nb one clearly had those side pieces on the ratchet head added later and the Handle knurling is off I would compare to early be ratchet with same handle type. I would wager the face plate is identical to the early nb ratchet if you compare that which if that's the case its likely a hybrid (officially made I would guess) and this theory is further supported by the fact that it would have been made during the period when new Britain was under contract by sears and only had 1/4 And 3/8 Drive Ratchets that were deemed acceptable, and also had major financial issues starting around 1933 so a beefed up version of what they already had would make sense especially with their being c series sockets. But there's a lot more to the story there. Just not worth going into

Glad you deemnitnunworthy

 

[Patrick Eubanks]

This is an interesting development.
Looks to be an undocumented version not prior seen ?

I have certainly never seen one. It’s an unmolested example of New Britain but definately different than c-97. It’s a cool ratchet though. The construction standards look similar.

 

[3baygarage]

I also have the C-41, and funny, have also compared it to the C-97. It’s been a while, but I remember it’s longer than the C-97. I don’t have both lengths of the C-97 though.

The C-41 may not come up often. I don’t have much else to add about it. Early NB, not sure if it has to do with Sears at all, or where it was offered.

 

[Steven 33]

Glad you deemnitnunworthy

No need for dirty laundry. I talked to the guy and almost bought it. only didn't because It's not in my wheelhouse and I didn't want to be stuck with it. But it should be no surprise to you of all people that I still felt compelled to compile all possible information with any clues. There's countless little things that are not worth bringing up here. Like speculation on the implications of Snap-on trying to sue a hardware store that sold New Britain and none better and HUSKY tools because they were also selling cabinetry made by "Snap-on cabinet co" or something. So that's what I meant. The ratchet is sweet and could mean any number of things. It's probably just as likely that Sigmund mundl caught a glimpse of the prototype and told Joe Johnson about it so they could beat them to the punch. Who knows man mysteries are fun and I obviously miscommunication my semi self depreciating statement

 

[d42jeep]

I found quite a few Moore Drop Forge made =v= Craftsman wrenches at a Minden, NV estate sale on Saturday. This long C one was in with them and I grabbed it.
-Don

 

[Patrick Eubanks]

I found quite a few Moore Drop Forge made =v= Craftsman wrenches at a Minden, NV estate sale on Saturday. This long C one was in with them and I grabbed it.
-Don

Must have been some old =v= stuff. this was 40s wartime or shortly thereafter.

 

[Oldtuleguy]

They are usually af or ci, I think billings

 

[GarageHobbyist]

Ended up with this 7/16 N4 CI in an auction lot this weekend



Recently sold this ratchet from an Estate sale

 

[Patrick Eubanks]

Ended up with this 7/16 N4 CI in an auction lot this weekend



Recently sold this ratchet from an Estate sale

I like the wrench. I have always intended to assemble the entire wrench set with the N4 markings.

 

[d42jeep]

These formerly rusty 8 point BE sockets came out of the evaporust yesterday looking much better. I’ll need to compare them to ones in my sets to see if they are an improvement. The 3/8” is 3/8” drive and the 1/4” is 1/4” drive. They were included in a Duro set for some reason.
Before and after pictures.

End views before and after

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Snagged a baker's dozen different bore cutters at the flea market this morning, all NOS, never been used, in NOS wax paper and boxes. Given the Long C branding on the boxes, the Chrome Vanadium alloy markings, and the part numbers, all 23xx, I assume they go with the Shaper (P/N 99 PTM 2309) shown in all the late 1930's, 1940, and 1941 power tool catalogs.

 

[Smokeshow69]

Snagged a baker's dozen different bore cutters at the flea market this morning, all NOS, never been used, in NOS wax paper and boxes. Given the Long C branding on the boxes, the Chrome Vanadium alloy markings, and the part numbers, all 23xx, I assume they go with the Shaper (P/N 99 PTM 2309) shown in all the late 1930's, 1940, and 1941 power tool catalogs.

I believe you are correct about them being for that shaper! Those are so cool that they are still in their boxes.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Those are so cool that they are still in their boxes.

Agreed! I don't have a Long C shaper (or any other shaper or any other Craftsman machinery with a 1/2-inch spindle), but they were too hardware time capsule-y cool to leave behind. Did you see the price tags? Ranging from $1.60 ($35.98 in 2024) to $3.75 ($84.32) per in c. 1940, I will be moving them on to someone who needs or will appreciate them more than me, someone who has a Long C shaper, or someone who just has to have everything Craftsman, for considerably less than their original value adjusted for inflation!

 

[Beerhippie]

Here's an interesting discovery I made today while tinkering with my "new" ShopMaster DP603:



Motor sheave stack. It's at least a decade older than the DP.

I guess it makes sense as it was on this motor:



Now, where's the rest of the damned Craftsman DP?

 

[Smokeshow69]

Picked up this lone flat tip today for 50 cents

 

[Oldtuleguy]

Here's a golden jubilee cigar box

 

[Outlawmws]

Now that is an awesome box!

 

[Smokeshow69]

Now that is an awesome box!

Yeah he *****!

 

[Oldtuleguy]

If it only had some cigars! Looks like they were cubans.

 

[Outlawmws]

Not sure 88 YO cigars would smoke very well...

 

[Oldtuleguy]

Hey I'll be smoking when I'm 90, and I'm not even cuban

 

[AntiqueBen]

WrenchGuy and I were discussing this, and I know we have threads like this for the Heritage and Crown marked tools, which are mostly power tools and boxes, (the tools generally having =V= or -V- markings...) but we were unable to find one for the older "Long C" Craftsman tools.

Backgrond:

Most of the "Long C" marked tools were from the early thirties (about 1933 based on catalog evidence), and mostly ended by late 40's, but there were still a few so marked going into the early 50's or so.

For this thread any tools from this era are OK to post. However please post Crown and Heritage (red oval) tools in their respective threads.

For the "Long C" markings, the key is the full or partial underline extending from the front "C"; but there were also some markings that omitted the underline, or it was just a tiny half letter width long, but the Letter styling was also distinctive, with an angular font:

EDIT: I guess for clarification showing some of the variants: No underline just the geometric type font, a short one letter variant on the crescent, the half underline adn the full:

Note the geometric angles on the C, R, A the S. This is often much more sharply defined than on this example, which was picked to show a "short" Long C...

What started me down this path?

I personally have long collected the Long C tools starting with a 1/2" drive socket set that took me about 30 years to complete, one socket at a time. When I first set them aside I had four total IIR, and simply added as I ran across them at fleas, and yard and estate sales. This was also my very first stab at "collecting" a tool, rather than buying users!

I acquired other Long C's of course, and only after I completed the last socket (The 3/4" seemed to evade me for ages - I finally traded for it here on GJ!), did I find a complete boxed set a couple of years ago with not only the 1/2" set, but 3/8's and all the ratchets and extensions as well (Ratchets also evaded me for YEARS). As many find, you only find them lot AFTER you find that elusive first one!


This is the set today, and has all the sizes from 7/16 to 1-1/16

I eventually went after the period correct boxes for the tools... And this is the roller of the stack I have (the top is somewhat buried) and a sampling of what is in the three drawers of the roller. I have MANY more Long C tools, but got to leave some for later, (and don't have time to fully photo-document them)

I got the top box with the assistance of a an East coast GJ member, who bought and picked it up for me, then shipped it to me, (Fully paid for by me)

The roller was a local CL buy.

This box set has all of my early tools Sears sold in it (including Dunlap etc.) but no "Vee" series (that is another carry box..), and here are the contents of the three drawers of the roller, aerial shots:

There is at least one "None Better" (New Britain) ratchet that is the same as the Long C ratchets, (not surprising as they were the MFG for Sears then)

That blue box was a find with "junk" in it. I had three of the wrenches:

I recently purchased this Craftsman 1/2" Underlined set. It's missing the ratchet, but I have one to replace it. It has 10 sockets sizes 7/16, 1/2, 9/16, 5/8, 11/16, 3/4, 13/16, 7/8, 15/16 & 1". I also have a 9/32, 1-1/16 & 1-1/8 to add to it. That would be 13 total sockets. I noticed you have 15 sockets. I'm just curious how many is supposed to be in a complete set or which ones am I missing?

 

[four.cycle]

19/32, 21/32, 25/32, 1-1/4

but then, the 1941 Craftsman catalog shows their largest 1/2" drive set as only containing ELEVEN sockets.

 

[Outlawmws]

As four.cycle alluded to, how many do you want to go after? For me I use almost every size (not generally the 32nds...), So I go for them all. this is often way more than the catalog "sets".

 

[ratcheted]

I recently purchased this Craftsman 1/2" Underlined set. It's missing the ratchet, but I have one to replace it. It has 10 sockets sizes 7/16, 1/2, 9/16, 5/8, 11/16, 3/4, 13/16, 7/8, 15/16 & 1". I also have a 9/32, 1-1/16 & 1-1/8 to add to it. That would be 13 total sockets. I noticed you have 15 sockets. I'm just curious how many is supposed to be in a complete set or which ones am I missing?

That is a nut spinner set, did not have a ratchet, only breaker and crossbar. Also these had 10 sockets.

 

[AntiqueBen]

19/32, 21/32, 25/32, 1-1/4

but then, the 1941 Craftsman catalog shows their largest 1/2" drive set as only containing ELEVEN sockets.

Typo, I meant 19/32. So I'll look for the other 3 sizes you mentioned. I suppose the 1/2" set didn't go much above 1-1/4." If you need bigger than that you'd probably go with a 3/4" drive set. I would like to find every size in the 1/2" underlined sockets. These are one of my favorite socket sets of all time. Made to last.

 

[AntiqueBen]

If there is a 21/32, 25/32 & 1-1/4, that would make me 16 total. That would seem as complete as it could get for 1/2" it seems. I'll have to maybe look at some Craftsman catalogs to see every size they made in a BE or circle H socket in 1/2" drive.

 

[AntiqueBen]

That is a nut spinner set, did not have a ratchet, only breaker and crossbar. Also these had 10 sockets.

My box looks different than the nut spinner set. Same number of sockets though. I haven't received my set yet. The 1" fits in the box & the nut spinner set only goes to 15/16. I'll post more pics once it shows up.

 

[Outlawmws]

This is the check list of the ones I have, with gaps showing -I'm not convinced all the 32nd's were made, but I have nt searched catalogs either:

C 7/16
C 1/2
C 17/32
C 9/16
C 19/32
C 5/8
C 21/32
C 11/16
23/32
C 3/4
25/32
C 13/16
C 7/8
29/32
C 15/16
C 31/32
C 1
C 1-1/16
C 1-1/8
C 1-3/16

 

[AntiqueBen]

This is the check list of the ones I have, with gaps showing -I'm not convinced all the 32nd's were made, but I have nt searched catalogs either:

C 7/16
C 1/2
C 17/32
C 9/16
C 19/32
C 5/8
C 21/32
C 11/16
23/32
C 3/4
25/32
C 13/16
C 7/8
29/32
C 15/16
C 31/32
C 1
C 1-1/16
C 1-1/8
C 1-3/16

Wow! That brings the count to 20. Thanks for the info. I don't think they made all the 32nds either.

 

[cosmokenney]

These formerly rusty 8 point BE sockets came out of the evaporust yesterday looking much better. I’ll need to compare them to ones in my sets to see if they are an improvement. The 3/8” is 3/8” drive and the 1/4” is 1/4” drive. They were included in a Duro set for some reason.
Before and after pictures.
End views before and after

Now that you have evaporust them, nickle plate them. I've watched videos on how to do it. It seems easy and I intend to try it some day...

 

[d42jeep]

Please let us know how that comes out.
The only long C tool I found at sales yesterday was this circle H 1/4” drive flex handle.
-Don

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I'll have to maybe look at some Craftsman catalogs to see every size they made in a BE or circle H socket in 1/2" drive.

I know this one by heart.

In 1942 - in the heyday of the NB-supplied Long C era, Sears still offered Craftsman sockets with openings of 19/32" (servicing 5/16" U.S.S. nuts/bolts), 21/32" (servicing Ford Model A and B V8-60 connecting rods), and 29/32" (servicing 1930's Chrysler shackle bolts) in 1/2-inch-square drive, leaving anyone needing to turn 7/16" and 9/16" U.S.S. nuts/bolts (requiring 25/32" and 31/32" openings, respectively) in the lurch.

By 1948 they were only offering the 19/32".

 

[ratcheted]

Was going thru what Vanadium socket sets I have, and found this socket, which seems a bit of an oddball, as it would not have been IMO in the Vanadium box sets that I know of. Owner added I think. A 3/8" drive 21/32".

 

[Oldtuleguy]

I have 2 loose ones for some reason

 

[ratcheted]

I have 2 loose ones for some reason

Not so odd as I thought.....

 

[Oldtuleguy]

Not sure if ad ons or were in a larger set, but not in this smaller set.