Show your "Long C" Craftsman!

[BFBOB]

You might want to thank your wife again, as your 1/2" Butterfly (Flying V) you have may be quite rare.

Does it have:
- Stainless Steel socket stud (it isn't painted black)
- Stainless Steel snap ring (only on the back)
- Frosted looking selector [yours has it!]
- A rounded Craftsman marque [yours has it!]
- An abnormal amount of rounding on the ratchet head and handle compared to other Butterfly (Flying V) ratchets you've seen?


If you can say yes to all of these, you've got a ratchet that is worth quite a

I think the answers are Yes, but since I have only two other FlyingV examples and they're both 3/8 drive, I can say the socket stud is not black, and all my other Craftys are. Likewise, head curvature - perhaps yes; the head is more barrel shaped than the 3/8, which are nearly cylindrical.

Here are some fotoz; hopefully they'll shed some light.

 

[Gear Wolf]

Yep, that is it! Time to celebrate! ^_^

 

[r_olson_06]

Yep, that is it! Time to celebrate! ^_^

Might have to check the stash.

Looking for the following Plomb Pebbles Wrenches 3061, 3070,

 

[BFBOB]

Yep, that is it! Time to celebrate! ^_^

Woo Hoo!
Who Knew?!!

 

[Gear Wolf]

Woo Hoo!
Who Knew?!!

Howdy,

I'm honestly happy for you! Now the real challenge is finding the other pieces.

You can find this specific variant in 1/2", 3/8", 1/4", 3/8" Flex, and the 3/8" Speeder. The 1/2" Flex for the Butterfly (Flying V) was only released 1 year in 1965, so it unfortunately not included in this "Frost Butterfly" family.

The standard sizes of the Butterfly (Flying V) were first made in late 1958 and the 3/8" Flex and Speeder were first being made in mid to late 1959.

Only examples made in that narrow window will have that hardware, those features, and that additional machine work.


I'm still finding new things years later! I hope that my effort, as well as that of others, will actually be useful for those who want to pursue collecting these pieces. Despite Craftsman's ubiquity, I'm still shocked at how little understood the brand and its products really is.

 

[wrenchguy]

Free trash day pick up while traveling to breakfast in town, paint spraying compressor, motor i believe is dated 2-54.

 

[Smokeshow69]

Free trash day pick up while traveling to breakfast in town, paint spraying compressor, motor i believe is dated 2-54.

Why would someone throw that out ? In glad it went to a great home ! You **** !


Sent from my iPhone using The Garage Journal mobile app

 

[wrenchguy]

Why would someone throw that out ? In glad it went to a great home ! You **** !


Sent from my iPhone using The Garage Journal mobile app

2me its kinda sad... they're older couple in late 80's i believe. old farmhouse and rural area. i think someone is slowly cleaning out the place. i drive by often.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Picked up another Long C Craftsman ball-pein hammer this morning at the flea market. 4 oz head. I'm almost positive it's been re-handled, though probably a long time ago. Perhaps even using the original handle, but cut down below the shoulder, maybe after it cracked. At just under 7" long, it's really stubby looking. (I kinda like it ike that though!) 1942 Craftsman catalog does not list handle lengths, but these were made by Vlchek, and in 1942 a 4-oz Vlchek ball-pein hammer had a 11-1/2" handle. Shown with some Long C bigger (16 and 24 ozs) brothers.

 

[Outlawmws]

I have a number of "shorty" ball peens and those are often my first grab.

 

[RagTopTA]

I guess this Long C vise should go in here as well. My new user!

 

[Glen Vassallo]

Hey Private Lugnutz. Cool hammer!! I can't understand how you guys recognise who actually made certain tools. If the hammer says Craftsman, how do you know that it was made by Vlchek? Did Craftsman ever make their own tools or were they always sourced out? Thanks
Glen

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Hi Glenn,

Craftsman was a brand name owned by Sears & Roebuck, which had no production facilities.

As for identifying makers, when you collect a lot of tools, and you read a lot of vintage catalogs or do a lot of research to support your hobby, they become very recognizable, like birds to birdwatchers. With Craftsman and their codes it also became a little bit of a challenge and a game and a badge of honor among collectors, although typically with wrenches and other tools, nobody pays much attention to hammers in that pursuit.

With the hammers in particular, I cut my teeth as a collector on WWII tools, specifically Jeep and GMTK tools, so I have collected a lot of machinists' style ball-pein hammers, especially 4-, 16-, and 32-ozers, and I know the category well. (EDIT: See pics )

I can't look at any ball-pein hammer and identify it immediately, but I can distinguish several brands from each other just from the shape and features of the head, without seeing a logo, and Vlchek is one of those brands. To add a dose of modesty, I am certainly not alone in this ability. Also, I have had Dunlap hammers with the BE code, which is a known Vlchek code, confirming my suspicions on Sears & Roebuck's supplier (Dunlap was an economy brand to Craftsman).

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I have a number of "shorty" ball peens and those are often my first grab.

Interesting you should mention that, Outlaw. They do feel good in the hand! Vlchek sold three "lines" of ball-pein hammers: Special Hammer Steel, Standard, and what they alternately called "Equipment Pattern" or "Toolbox Pattern". The latter were all shorties, with handles made of ash instead of hickory, all many inches shorter than the length of the handle on their Special or Standard counterparts. They didn't make their shorties smaller than 10ozs though, and I still suspect someone made a shorty for themselves with this one.

 

[LesserSon]

I still suspect someone made a shorty for themselves with this one.

I don’t have any doubt of that. Probably like you say, from a damaged original - it’s missing the swell below the head.
Some machinist handles do flare at the end like that one (claw and rip hammer handles more so), but also looks like a riveting hammer handle (cut down), too.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

- it’s missing the swell below the head.

'Zackly. That's what I meant by "shoulder" in this statement...

Perhaps even using the original handle, but cut down below the shoulder.

Since the neck is the part of a handle inserted through the eye of the head, I've always called the part you are calling the swell the shoulder. But now that I think about it, I don't know if this is one of those technical terms up I have picked up from reading vintage documents or I just inferred my way into it.

 

[drivesitfar]

RAG: glad to hear you found a Long C Craftsman bench vise made by REED and you've got a similar transitional model that has the big hub on the newer design. I've got a good idea how big yours is and if you don't mind would you confirm the width of the jaws and the weight of yours when you get some time.
it will make a great vise for your shop and it has that look too in my opinion.

ALL: here's my 5 inch and probably close to 75 pound Long C craftsman vise made by reed. my guess is it could have left the factory at the end of the 1930's cause it's meatball/hub is the older one than the smooshed one with this vise's main body design. or maybe it left REED'S factory after WWII cause a lot of vise companies were scrambling to stay in business and old parts maybe were taken off the shelf to make vises they could sell. Wilton seemed to be doing that with their PAT. PEND. vises and stamping them 1945 & 1946 when they were produced in 1941.

I'll check and see if there is any date stamp or #'s on mine when I take the jaw covers (Parker like aren't they) off and show the like new pretty sharp jaws on mine.

keep posting up all the good pics and information on this great old brand of tools.

 

[Glen Vassallo]

Thanks Private Lugnutz. It's a lot clearer now! So did Vlchek ever make a hammer exactly like that one and stamp it Vlchek instead of Craftsman? Or did they just make them for other companies? Thanks again for taking the time to answer my questions.

 

[d42jeep]

Here are a couple of Vlchek hammers that I’ve re-handled.
-Don

 

[Outlawmws]

Vlchek and most tool companies made tools under their name and others. Sometimes for each other in non competitive areas, or during WWII, to complete a gov. order. The Proto empire for example, was built starting with cooperative mfg, then acquisition.

Lugz, I know what you mean on the head styles, and many heads have NO Mfg name stamped. Many copied basic styling as well, as you have the style with the round boss sides, and the more tapered or balloon style, to name the two more common styles. Lugz box of heads and D42's pics shows both.

D42 funny that Vlchek made both styles. I wonder if one was a war time thing to fill an order with another Mfg?

 

[Private Lugnutz]

...funny that Vlchek made both styles. I wonder if one was a war time thing to fill an order with another Mfg?

Their Special Hammer Steel hammers had the oval pattern, their Standard hammers had the round pattern. Willys was buying the Special Hammer Steel (oval pattern) hammers for their jeep toolkits. I suspect the Ordnance Dept was as well for their needs. But they were selling both types commercially as well in the late 1930's and in 1941.

 

[LesserSon]

Just a sighting, not a purchase, today. Yes, the brass plumb bob was in there. Judging from the tangle of line, I don’t think it was NOS. Sorry, can’t recall precise price, but it was high, maybe $30-ish.

 

[hotroddeuce]

few of mine that where handy

 

[JoCoSawdust]

I think she'll clean up well. Has anyone tried re-wrapping the leather handles?

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Replacement is your best bet. Vintage suitcase handles are a very good option. They are made exactly the same, look very close, and they are easy to salvage if you can find them cheap at a flea market or yard sale.

 

[JoCoSawdust]

Thanks Lugz. I'll start keeping my eyes peeled for one.

 

[JoCoSawdust]

Some recent Long C acquisitions.

 

[BFBOB]

Replacement is your best bet. Vintage suitcase handles are a very good option. They are made exactly the same, look very close, and they are easy to salvage if you can find them cheap at a flea market or yard sale.

Be careful- I tried this and got a very close lookalike, but it didn't have a steel reinforcing strip or wire going aroung the bails. I'm pretty sure it'll rip right out with the weight of a tool box. I'm going to try to work a wire through. Won't be easy and might tear up the handle in the process. Then I'll be searching anew, this time for one with steel reinforcement.

 

[Provincial]

From an Estate sale today, all Circle-H:

First photo is 3/8 drive stuff.
3/8 and 3/4 sockets
3" extension
Hinge handle with cross-bar
T-Handle

Second photo is 1/2 drive stuff.
Speeder
Crossbar
Bent T-Handle
Universal
Sockets 1-1/8, 1-1/16, 1, 7/8, 13/16, 3/4, 11/16, 19/32.

I rarely see cross-bars, so this was a treat.

 

[JoCoSawdust]

Be careful- I tried this and got a very close lookalike, but it didn't have a steel reinforcing strip or wire going aroung the bails. I'm pretty sure it'll rip right out with the weight of a tool box. I'm going to try to work a wire through. Won't be easy and might tear up the handle in the process. Then I'll be searching anew, this time for one with steel reinforcement.

Thanks for the heads up. I'm on the fence as to wether or not to try to replace the handle at all. I picked up another case with leather handle (slightly better condition but still pretty ragged). I'm leaning towards just conditioning what's left of them and leaving things as history has them. Please let me know how the wire threading attempt goes.

 

[JoCoSawdust]

I rarely see cross-bars, so this was a treat.

Nice snag and yes, I'd love to know where all the crossbars are hiding.

 

[JoCoSawdust]

few of mine that where handy

Nice! I'd love to find more deep wells.

 

[JoCoSawdust]

Picked these up today. Maybe the T-bar eating demons are on vacation as both of these sets have them. Liberal coating of BLO or some other type of rust prevention coating both sets.

 

[JoCoSawdust]

Picked up a 50s stack yesterday filled with tools. Turned out to be 95 percent Long C stuff. A lot of fun sorting through it when I got it home. Here's some highlights.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Holy Mother of Long C Amber Craftsman! Love the punch and chisel sets, too! Dang.

 

[JoCoSawdust]

Those pics don't even put a dent in it Lugz but those are my picks of the litter. It's been an extremely fun past 24 hours!

 

[3baygarage]

Wow! What a haul.

 

[r_olson_06]

Picked up a 50s stack yesterday filled with tools. Turned out to be 95 percent Long C stuff. A lot of fun sorting through it when I got it home. Here's some highlights.

That is just insane. Digging the original packaging on the stubby boxes and the cases for the punches and the Amber handles and the well everything. Think this deserves a you ****. Keep up the good work and keep posting pics for us to drool over.

Looking for the following Plomb Pebbles Wrenches 3061, 3070,

 

[Outlawmws]

JoCo, YOU ****!

That is I believe, the most amber in one place yet seen!

 

[PFSard]

Picked up a 50s stack yesterday filled with tools. Turned out to be 95 percent Long C stuff. A lot of fun sorting through it when I got it home. Here's some highlights.

Unbelievable. What are the odds? You definitely **** big time.