Spreading the Bonney affliction!

[Private Lugnutz]

All good points, LS. I wish we had more definitive data on typesetting practices and statistics. Or an expert! Seems like alot of work, especially for a relatively obscure company that went out of business shortly thereafter. Or was typesetting already that easy with so many choices that this wouldn't be considered exotic? I obviously don't know. Not that important. But it is curious.

 

[LesserSon]

Picked up this PWA2682 DBE this morning.

 

[WagonHo!]

All good points, LS. I wish we had more definitive data on typesetting practices and statistics. Or an expert! Seems like alot of work, especially for a relatively obscure company that went out of business shortly thereafter. Or was typesetting already that easy with so many choices that this wouldn't be considered exotic? I obviously don't know. Not that important. But it is curious.

However CS Bonney has this letter crafted he probably did so as a commemoration to his late company. Calligraphers, letter writers, signage was a widespread respected profession seems very possible he consigned the copies.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

It has the look of something like that, right, WagonHo? I've been studying the piece in question... Even got the micrometer out. HAHA. It is not as uniform as it looks, but I am not so sure the degree of uniformity is within the realm of possibility even for a master calligrapher, so I am back to neutral on the Notice! Waiting for Todd to show us more of how it was placed in the catalog, and an expert to resolve this for us!

 

[twertsy]

It has the look of something like that, right, WagonHo? I've been studying the piece in question... Even got the micrometer out. HAHA. It is not as uniform as it looks, but I am not so sure the degree of uniformity is within the realm of possibility even for a master calligrapher, so I am back to neutral on the Notice! Waiting for Todd to show us more of how it was placed in the catalog, and an expert to resolve this for us!

Sorry to come in so late in the conversation. It is a page in the catalog. First page inside the cover.

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[twertsy]

My 2 pre-Allentown Bonney pieces (besides VISES), none say Philadelphia. The clamp-on VISES either have a shield or simply say Bonney.

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[LesserSon]

I have to say, the two non-wrench photos, with “BONNEY” in an arc, are the strongest visual evidence I’ve seen linking CS Bonney-patented tools to the jellybean logo.
But I still have a problem terming early production lacking the B-shield, “pre-Allentown” without more evidence. There's a seven-ish-year span between 1906 and 1913 where production may or may not be distinguishable from production before 1906. Maybe we’ll never know, and maybe it doesn’t really matter, but can’t we agree to “pre-1913?”
In addition to dateable illustrations, there may be property transfer records, internal or sales correspondence, news items, etc, which may yet shed some light on this period. Should we not leave the door open to such possibility? Would it not be better to be vague now than wrong later?

 

[akasrick]

Would it not be better to be vague now than wrong later?

The timelines are already vague after a fire they say they moved to Frankford St., today Frankford Ave., more than likely Frankford Rd. then. Leading to an section called Frankford not then part of Phila., off the Frankford creek.
I don't think they were having a good time in Philadelphia though they moved back. Just guesswork here.
Maybe a point in another direction.

akasrick

 

[LesserSon]

It seems likely that the forged-in “B-shield” on the shank is joined by forged in “MADE IN U.S.A.” on shank at about the same time as forged-in two-letter date codes appear, around 1921. I have one example with the forged-in “MADE IN USA” that does not seem to have a forged-in date code, so those two changes might not coincide perfectly. More examples might also establish beyond doubt the absolute first letter used in conjunction with the first “M” date code. Again, discovery of pertinent internal correspondence or records might make it irrefutable that “A” is January or otherwise establish the month in which date codes began. “Bonney Vise & Tool Works” became “Bonney Forge & Tool Works” on 08Feb1921. I’d love to find “BM” on a “B-shield” “MADE IN U.S.A.” “embedded-shield” logo wrench - actually a complete no25 set like that would be killer!
So here are my twenty-four oldest Bonney wrenches - all of them made by “Bonney Vise & Tool Works.” Twenty-three of them bear the forged-in “B-shield” on the shank and the “embedded-shield Bonney” logo. I date those 1913-1920.
One and only one wrench has the “jellybean” logo, so about 4% of my pre-1921 collection. I believe it is pre-1913. In addition to the logo, it is a bit different in style from the “B-shield” S-wrenches next to it. The shank is more flattened, the model number and fractional across-flats sizes are forged-in on the shank, instead of stamped on the faces. So maybe it really was made in a different city a decade earlier, with different ownership, management, labor, equipment. But what goes in between, from 1906 to 1913?

Edit- nope, I have to take back that last concession. Here is a flat-shanked 503 S-wrench with forged-in fractional sizes and model number - just like the “jellybean” version - but with a forged-in Bonney shield (note it is not a “B-shield”).
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/293029364467
If it wasn’t so pitted around the openings, I’d already have bought it.

 

[LesserSon]

Oops, I missed this 671D. Twenty-five. Also pretty flat, though the marks, other than the Bonney shield (again, not “B-shield”), are stamped.

 

[twertsy]

I have to say, the two non-wrench photos, with “BONNEY” in an arc, are the strongest visual evidence I’ve seen linking CS Bonney-patented tools to the jellybean logo.
But I still have a problem terming early production lacking the B-shield, “pre-Allentown” without more evidence. There's a seven-ish-year span between 1906 and 1913 where production may or may not be distinguishable from production before 1906. Maybe we’ll never know, and maybe it doesn’t really matter, but can’t we agree to “pre-1913?”
In addition to dateable illustrations, there may be property transfer records, internal or sales correspondence, news items, etc, which may yet shed some light on this period. Should we not leave the door open to such possibility? Would it not be better to be vague now than wrong later?

The hollow auger is 1870's, based on what I was told by another collector. There were apparently 2 patents for this, and mine is based on the first which was granted ca. 1873 if I recall.

 

[twertsy]

Oops, I missed this 671D. Twenty-five. Also pretty flat, though the marks, other than the Bonney shield (again, not “B-shield”), are stamped.

That one certainly looks early LS. Certainly later than 1907 when I feel the Princeton shield came into play, but darn near that I'd say.

 

[LesserSon]

Princeton shield in 1907, eh? That would fill the 1906-1913 void! Applaudably plausible.
The 1913 trademarks, as illustrated in the 1914 catalog, include the name “BONNEY” by itself, the Princeton shield with a “B” in the bottom (“B-shield”), and the Princeton shield with the name “BONNEY” in the top (“Bonney shield”). Presumably, the unadorned Princeton shield could have been used before the “first use” date, because it is NOT what was trademarked. Perhaps it could not be trademarked as such.
Particularly, the illustration of the “B-shield” does not exactly match its execution as a forged-in element, where it lacks the horizontal line and chevron. I wonder why the didn’t trademark the “embedded-shield logo?

 

[twertsy]

Princeton shield in 1907, eh? That would fill the 1906-1913 void! Applaudably plausible.
The 1913 trademarks, as illustrated in the 1914 catalog, include the name “BONNEY” by itself, the Princeton shield with a “B” in the bottom (“B-shield”), and the Princeton shield with the name “BONNEY” in the top (“Bonney shield”). Presumably, the unadorned Princeton shield could have been used before the “first use” date, because it is NOT what was trademarked. Perhaps it could not be trademarked as such.
Particularly, the illustration of the “B-shield” does not exactly match its execution as a forged-in element, where it lacks the horizontal line and chevron. I wonder why the didn’t trademark the “embedded-shield logo?

Actually, a little TM research (again!) this morning tells me BOTH the Shield (sans B) and the B-Shield first use dates are 7/1/1913 on all products.

The word Bonney in an Arch lists the first use date as 1876. No luck with the "jelly bean" Bonney logo yet.

 

[LesserSon]

Well, that ***** - looks like we’re back to a gap in the tool examples.
And maybe USPT office wouldn’t approve the jellybean, because it merely adds an outline to the previously trademarked name? As an example of the sometimes arbitrary decisions of the TM office, witness Forged Steel Products’ failed attempt to trademark “Vacuum Grip” surrounded by suction cup marks. It was denied, because the suction cup marks were already design-patented, and “Vacuum Grip” was ruled as “merely descriptive.”

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Here is my oldest dated "Bonney" tool. I use quotes, conspicuously, because this adjustable "alligator" type wrench was patented by C.S. Bonney on May 26, 1903, after he sold Bonney Vise & Tools Works, when he resided in Portsmouth, Ohio, but it was made by Kraeuter. The date, which was put on both pieces of the two-piece tool, refers to 728,842.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

The hollow auger is 1870's, based on what I was told by another collector. There were apparently 2 patents for this, and mine is based on the first which was granted ca. 1873 if I recall.

105,896, August 2, 1870. At the time, C.S. Bonney lived in Syracuse, NY nd hadn't even founded Bonney Vise & Tool Works yet.

Part of the confusion with Bonney's history comes from the fact that he left Philadelphia after he sold the company, moved to Portsmouth, Ohio (I believe he followed his daughter and son-in-law, Archie Proctor Goldsmith, there - See pic), but continued inventing tools there which had nothing to do with Bonney Vise & Tool Works. As LS has emphasized.

The word Bonney in an Arch lists the first use date as 1876. No luck with the "jelly bean" Bonney logo yet.

And maybe USPT office wouldn’t approve the jellybean, because it merely adds an outline to the previously trademarked name?

My opinion is that the jellybean version might be considered to be covered by the TM. It is an arching BONNEY, it just happens to also be outlined.

What complicates all this is that the C.S. BONNEY marking (not arching), found on 1903 pliers, as shown on AA, is not Bonney Vise & Tool Works or Bonney Forge & Tool Works, as LS pointed out earlier.

In 1903, C.S. Bonney had nothing to do with the company that was merely carrying on his name, but he had not stopped inventing tools. AA creates confusion by listing these patents in the Bonney section and showing these kinds of tools without clarifying the sale of Bonney Vise & Tool Works to Newkirk, Ritchie, and Bills in 1885. They chased down everything associated with C.S. Bonney and assumed it was BV&TW or BF&TW when it's neither. They missed the fact that Newkirk, Ritchie, and Bills went under, and that Armstead O. Bills became the sole proprietor of BV&TW.

As you guys know, without Bills, there would be nothing for the Princeton grads to pick up and run with!

 

[rickhigginshtbr]

I had no idea where the factory once stood. 30th and Chesnut, that's a parking lot for Drexel University now...

 

[akasrick]

I had no idea where the factory once stood. 30th and Chesnut, that's a parking lot for Drexel University now...

http://www.workshopoftheworld.com/west_phila/west_phila.html

"Although such a concentration of factories, such as the Bonney Vise Works at 3015 Chestnut Street, the Junction Car Works at 32nd and Chestnut Streets, and the Otto Gas Engine Manufacturing Company at 33rd Walnut Streets (which were all demolished), was not typical of West Philadelphia...snip"

akasrick

 

[twertsy]

I had no idea where the factory once stood. 30th and Chesnut, that's a parking lot for Drexel University now...

Yup, my daughter got her masters from Penn and lived in the huge high-rise across the street. I posted a pic of where the factory was when I visited a couple years ago.

 

[akasrick]

I had no idea where the factory once stood. 30th and Chesnut, that's a parking lot for Drexel University now...

Yup, my daughter got her masters from Penn and lived in the huge high-rise across the street. I posted a pic of where the factory was when I visited a couple years ago.

As the property looked then.
https://libwww.freelibrary.org/digital/item/14028

akasrick

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Thanks for posting, akasrick. That's a nice plate!

Pic 1 is a neat summary of the early history and I don't remember seeing the article in Pic 2 before. Both out of a January 1898 issue of the trade journal, Iron Age.

 

[akasrick]

Thanks for posting, akasrick. That's a nice plate!

Glad to have helped!

akasrick

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I have a little surprise for you guys!

Here is the preview!

Todd found a record of it on-line, no digital copies available, but I have an old Army buddy in the area. Scans are on their way to me now!

Note that it's 1886, and Newkirk, Ritchie, and Newkirk. Our hero, Mr. Armstead O. Bills is not yet in the picture. I don't have high hopes for any of the tools in any of the figures bearing any markings, since it's two years older than Todd's 1888 Newkirk, Ritchie, and Bills, and that one didn't have any markings. But fingers crossed anyway.

 

[LesserSon]

I hate to burst your bubble, Lugz, but I think that’s the same catalog, isn’t it? Whatever the filename may say, the title page says 1886.
HOWEVER, you could rescan it so the pdf has all the pages oriented the same direction.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I have no idea what you're referring to, LS. Same as what? Todd's catalog is 1888 Newkirk, Ritchie and Bills. This is 1886 Newkirk, Ritchie and Newkirk. What PDF are you talking about?

 

[LesserSon]

Hmmm. I thought we had the same resource. I thought I downloaded it from Todd’s site. Maybe not. I’ll have to find it again to be able to say where it did come from.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

The oldest Bonney catalog I downloaded from TA is the 1914. I either missed the earlier one or just never got around to looking at it on TA, but according to Todd, it was the 1888 Newkirk, Ritchie, and Bills that contained the letter from C.S. Bonney we were discussing a few pages ago. I suppose it's possible he also had the 1886 Newkirk, Ritchie, and Newkirk and didn't realize it, or forgot about it.

 

[akasrick]

Our hero, Mr. Armstead O. Bills is not yet in the picture.

Those fellas certainly got around in that time. I believe I read that Bills kept a residence in Moorestown NJ. Must have been less humid during summer. Trivia

akasrick

 

[twertsy]

Ok Guys, a little research this morning that could yield some more information with further research.

Information from the Philadelphia City Directories.
1882
- Charles - Secretary/Treasurer
- Henry G. - "Chairman"
- J. B. Newkirk - Eaton & Newkirk
- MacCarroll Brothers - also listed at 3015 Chestnut

1886
- Bonney Vise & Tool Co. Listing
- John B. Newkirk, Henry G. Bonney, Cornelius Ritchie listed as owners
- Charles S. Bonney is listed as "Chancellor"
- Firm of Newkirk & Ritchie is listed at 2126 Vine

1887
- Bonney Rapid Vise Co. Lists Charles S. & Henry G. Bonney as owners at 3130 Chestnut
- Bonney Vise & Tool Works Lists John B. Newkirk & Cornelius W. Ritchie as owners at 3015 Chestnut

** From Newspapers: Bonney Rapid Vise Co. was in discussions in 8/1887 about moving to Clinton Iowa, which they did. There's mention in 1890 about finding another location in Huntington, IN but I don't think that ever happened. In 1906, Charles formed Bonney-Velshage in NJ.

1896
- George W. Turner listed as Sec.

1904
- Lewis J. Bowman - Pres.
- A. O. Bills - Treasurer

 

[akasrick]

** From Newspapers: Bonney Rapid Vise Co. was in discussions in 8/1887 about moving to Clinton Iowa, which they did. There's mention in 1890 about finding another location in Huntington, IN but I don't think that ever happened. In 1906, Charles formed Bonney-Velshage in NJ.

I had read Clinton Iowa also which puts them on the other side of the Mississippi.
Someone posted this in one of the vise threads I don't remember who.

akasrick

 

[twertsy]

I had read Clinton Iowa also which puts them on the other side of the Mississippi.
Someone posted this in one of the vise threads I don't remember who.

akasrick

So it looks like they did make to move to Indiana. Interesting.

Here's another interesting read. Date is the name of the file.

 

[LesserSon]

AKASRICK,
Was that already trimmed below the rapid vise illustration? This sentence does not continue at the top of the second column, so there’s some text missing.

 

[akasrick]

AKASRICK,
Was that already trimmed below the rapid vise illustration? This sentence does not continue at the top of the second column, so there’s some text missing.

I snagged that off of GJ maybe the original poster will show up with the missing text and cuts. If not there is a dated heading.
Tools, wrenches, vises it's boggling.

akasrick

 

[LesserSon]

Date is the name of the file.

I’m on an unhelpful/too helpful iOS device, so I’m not entirely sure, but I think the file name changes when you post it.

 

[twertsy]

I’m on an unhelpful/too helpful iOS device, so I’m not entirely sure, but I think the file name changes when you post it.

It's still correct: 7-17-1912

 

[akasrick]

Here's another interesting read. Date is the name of the file.

Supposedly their was a Bill Of Ladling or something of such for steel to a railroad with the Bonney name. On the internet.

akasrick

 

[twertsy]

AKASRICK,
Was that already trimmed below the rapid vise illustration? This sentence does not continue at the top of the second column, so there’s some text missing.

The article continues below the graphic:

https://books.google.com/books?id=G...IMTAB#v=onepage&q="Bonney Rapid Vise"&f=false

 

[akasrick]

The article continues below the graphic:

That is certainly more complete. WTG Twertsy

akasrick

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Those fellas certainly got around in that time.

You can say that again! The anniversary article Todd posted doesn't even mention the Clinton, IA and Marion, IND residences they were so short. And those were before Portsmouth, OH, where he settled long enough to patent a few things.

All,

Looks like LS has a PDF of the same exact catalog I just had my friend snag at the St Paul Historical Society Library. He texted me the title page. The library pencil markings are the same. So they must have scanned it for someone already. Either for you, Todd, and you forgot you had it on TA, or perhaps for someone else and LS downloaded it from somewhere else. It doesn't look like it's available on the St Paul Historical Society website. Regardless, point is, it's not new. If it contained anything relevant, I am sure LS would've told us.