To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

Sub Panel wiring questions...

mike93lx

ALLIANCE MEMBER
Joined
Dec 9, 2013
Messages
37,879
Location
Richmond, VA
I have installed a few plug on surge protectors. I think the largest Square D is 50 kA. When building my current house I spoke to the manager of distribution at my POCO. He said go bigger. So I used this 80 kA unit wired to a breaker:
1741822504929.png
My panels are flush mount, so breaker-style ones were massively simpler, but I doubled up due to their smaller size
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

Norcal

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2008
Messages
13,769
I looked at those but for some reason I thought the Square D Homeline was more recognizable as a quality product (not that Siemens or Easton or GE of CH aren't). When I kick the bucket and my kids are selling the old man's property I feel most handy persons will recognize that.
Eaton BR is the bottom of the line panel, which I call "Zinsco II", ABB (GE) not much better, any other panels are fine.
 
OP
W

WI/MI Border

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 27, 2025
Messages
196
I'm revisiting this thread as I have a question about splicing 1 AWG HXXW wire inside my main breaker enclosure.

I didn't have the forethought to have my sub panel 100a breaker installed in the first slots below the main 200a beaker so that I could install a lock such as this to power my critical loads in the home.

Generic generator interlock kit


I've found simple **** splices. Would these be adequate for extending my sub panel feeds to reach from the bottom of my breakers to the top spot? These...

Alum **** splice
 
Last edited:

dave*99

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2009
Messages
4,278
Location
Coastal NJ
I'm revisiting this thread as I have a question about splicing 1 AWG HXXW wire inside my main breaker enclosure.

I didn't have the forethought to have my sub panel 100a breaker installed in the first slots below the main 200a beaker so that I could install a lock such as this to power my critical loads in the home.

Interlock kit for QO


I've found simple **** splices. Would these be adequate for extending my sub panel feeds to reach from the bottom of my breakers to the top spot? These...

Alum **** splice
There is an insulated option:


Your link to the interlock kit only takes you to Homedepot.com.
 
OP
W

WI/MI Border

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 27, 2025
Messages
196
...

Your link to the interlock kit only takes you to Homedepot.com.
Thanks, I fixed the link. There seem to be a WIDE variety of prices for basically the same thing. From the one in the link for thirteen bucks to some over a hundred. I see very little difference.

I did see the insulated versions. My link shows a cheap splice that I would heat shrink some insulation around. This won't ever be inspected so as long as I do it safely I think it'll work fine.
 

dave*99

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2009
Messages
4,278
Location
Coastal NJ
Thanks, I fixed the link. There seem to be a WIDE variety of prices for basically the same thing. From the one in the link for thirteen bucks to some over a hundred. I see very little difference.

I did see the insulated versions. My link shows a cheap splice that I would heat shrink some insulation around. This won't ever be inspected so as long as I do it safely I think it'll work fine.
I'm not 100% certain I followed post 125. Are you adding a generator inlet connected to the main panel?
Are you looking to move the 100A breaker for the sub to allow the generator breaker to occupy that space?
One word of caution - I try to put the heavy loads closer to the main breaker. Can you move some light loads around to make things work without splicing heavy wires?
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!
OP
W

WI/MI Border

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 27, 2025
Messages
196
I'm not 100% certain I followed post 125. Are you adding a generator inlet connected to the main panel?
Are you looking to move the 100A breaker for the sub to allow the generator breaker to occupy that space?
One word of caution - I try to put the heavy loads closer to the main breaker. Can you move some light loads around to make things work without splicing heavy wires?
Thanks Dave,

I'm happy you asked those questions as I now know that my thinking is messed up. That's exactly why I am here asking questions!

There will be times I want the ability to keep both grid power running into the main panel and also to the sub panel through the 100a breaker. A locking device between the 200a and 100a will eliminate that possibility.

I have to go back to the drawing board...

Thinking out loud... maybe I should put the interlock on the sub panel 100a breaker and install a 50a DP breaker for the "generator" breaker right below that (which is actually my solar/inverter/battery bank that I am building). Ideally I want to be able to feed my off grid power to power the workshop off grid AND occasionally back to the main panel through the 100a sub panel breaker. I know I can just turn off the 200a main and accomplish that but I really wanted a locking device so that 200a won't accidently be turned on while feeding off grid. I think I saw a snap on plastic "locking" device online somewhere to do that. Lots to sort out. Thanks for the questions as I was originally leading to a failure fer sure.

Yes, I can move two SP breakers down and open a space for a DP "generator" breaker. That just seems a bit unnecessary after some thought. Though it might be better to get the 100a closer to the 200a as you mentioned.
 

dave*99

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2009
Messages
4,278
Location
Coastal NJ
Thanks Dave,

I'm happy you asked those questions as I now know that my thinking is messed up. That's exactly why I am here asking questions!

There will be times I want the ability to keep both grid power running into the main panel and also to the sub panel through the 100a breaker. A locking device between the 200a and 100a will eliminate that possibility.

I have to go back to the drawing board...

Thinking out loud... maybe I should put the interlock on the sub panel 100a breaker and install a 50a DP breaker for the "generator" breaker right below that (which is actually my solar/inverter/battery bank that I am building). Ideally I want to be able to feed my off grid power to power the workshop off grid AND occasionally back to the main panel through the 100a sub panel breaker. I know I can just turn off the 200a main and accomplish that but I really wanted a locking device so that 200a won't accidently be turned on while feeding off grid. I think I saw a snap on plastic "locking" device online somewhere to do that. Lots to sort out. Thanks for the questions as I was originally leading to a failure fer sure.

Yes, I can move two SP breakers down and open a space for a DP "generator" breaker. That just seems a bit unnecessary after some thought. Though it might be better to get the 100a closer to the 200a as you mentioned.
Just remember, the interlock is the legitimate way to prevent back feeding the utility co service from your generator. To accomplish that, it must be in the main panel. Not in the sub. The point of that interlock is to make it impossible to back feed the utility. That only happens when it's is the right spot (main) panel.

If you put it in the sub panel, your generator can power the garage (everything on the sub). But a generator on an interlock on a sub can't power the main panel upstream.
 

wyliesdiesels

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 14, 2012
Messages
20,071
Location
Modesto, CA
Just remember, the interlock is the legitimate way to prevent back feeding the utility co service from your generator. To accomplish that, it must be in the main panel. Not in the sub. The point of that interlock is to make it impossible to back feed the utility. That only happens when it's is the right spot (main) panel.

If you put it in the sub panel, your generator can power the garage (everything on the sub). But a generator on an interlock on a sub can't power the main panel upstream.

this is incorrect if all of his loads that need backup gen power are in the subpanel.
 
OP
W

WI/MI Border

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 27, 2025
Messages
196
Just remember, the interlock is the legitimate way to prevent back feeding the utility co service from your generator. To accomplish that, it must be in the main panel. Not in the sub. The point of that interlock is to make it impossible to back feed the utility. That only happens when it's is the right spot (main) panel.

If you put it in the sub panel, your generator can power the garage (everything on the sub). But a generator on an interlock on a sub can't power the main panel upstream.
Gotcha. I understand the first part. I don't think I need an interlock on the sub panel. The sub panel has a 100a (probably redundant) that I can open and lock somehow to power the workshop and prevent feeding back to the house main panel. I saw a "snap on" lock but haven't found one for a main breaker. I'll have to search for that again if that idea makes sense. I understand the concept of interlocking the breakers. I'm hoping that won't be needed.

So let me try to summarize what I currently have and then what I hope to do.

First, so your head isn't spinning wondering how I plan to feed my home panel off grid... This scenario involves powering the workshop and home with my off grid solar/inverter/battery system which is in the process of being built. So far it's a 1.8kw solar array (to be enlarged to 3kw this summer), 6.5kw off grid inverter (two phase) and 32kWh battery bank. We conserve, it's in my blood, so I'm not concerned about it's size. Yes the battery bank is large. I hope to have plenty of cushion for weather challenges. The entire solar system will handle all or most of our daily needs except possibly in mid November through January or early Feb.

Our main panel is a 200a service. At the moment there are two SP breakers just under and on the right leg of the 200a home panel. I can move those down to another location fairly easily to make room for a Gen DP breaker (amperage tbd) with an interlock. However, if I want to power my home main panel without feeding back into the grid I can just open the main 200a breaker and lock it open; again with a "snap on" locking device. Then the 100a breaker which was feeding the sub panel can back feed to the main without connection to the grid.

Adding an interlock on the 200a main breaker and locking the 100a feed to the workshop would mean I couldn't power the workshop with the grid. Leaving the 100a where it is and adding a separate Gen breaker in the interlock position would be complicated.

If anyone is concerned how the solar feeds works check out some youtube videos about off grid solar "backup" systems.

Here's an example
 

wyliesdiesels

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 14, 2012
Messages
20,071
Location
Modesto, CA
yeah thats not gonna be kosher. you will not have a way to positively prevent feeding the grid with solar power. your solution relies on someone opening the main breaker. people can forget to do things and then oppppsss power is backfeeding onto the grid.

this is why interlocks and transfer switches are necessary

your PoCo may even cut your drop in an outage if they get wind of you having alternate power sources without the proper interlocks or transfer switches.

the way to solve this is to bring the solar power feed to the main panel. connect a transfer switch to a breaker labeled backup power source, then connect the genset inlet and solar power feed to the transfer switch.

This way you can lock out the 200a main with the interlocked backup power source breaker, then use the transfer switch to select which backup power source you want.

I cant think of any other way to do this
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!
Top Bottom