Subpanel grounding need a second opinion

[Russell_Reid]

Our metal outbuilding project passed the city final inspection this week. So I was trying to get the contractors scope of work closed out. Basically listing what still needed to be done and get final invoicing. During this back and forth my electrician notified me that he forgot to put in the grounding rods for the outbuilding and do i still want them installed. Surprised by this I told him yes and he gave me a price of $355 to perform the work. A bit of background:
My PM had asked the foundation guys to put in a grounding rebar during form installation. They did so. After pour it stuck up through the slab right next to the feeder conduits for the future sub-panel. When the building installers came to put up the shell, it was 'in their way' so they cut it off instead of drilling the frame base for it to poke through (2.5" box tube framing). When it came time for electrical rough we realized that the ground rod was no longer there. So I asked what the solution was and both the electrician and PM said they could install grounding rods outside the slab and bond the building and panel to it. This discussion happened on 3 different occasions, twice with the PM and electrician, and once with the electrician. Still it got forgotten.
Back to now, I contacted the PM about the missing grounding and protested that the electrician wanted to charge me $355 to install the grounding rods and bonding. The PM told me that since it passed final they were not needed. But he would talk to the electrician if i insisted and clear up this cost issue plus another cost issue where i was double charged for some of the other work.
After a bit of searching and reading I began to suspect that the service tie in between the main panel and the sub-panel may have not be properly grounded. So i opened the panel and took a look. There is a 4 wire feeder from the House main to the Sub panel in the outbuilding. 2 hots, neutral, ground. The Sub-panel is not bonded to the building steel. The neutrals and the grounds in the sub-panel are not separated. The grounding screw to the panel box is in place. Since there is no independent grounding rods the panel is currently grounded through the ground wire to the House main.
Everything i have read states that code requires independent grounding rods for an outbuilding, and a sub-panel in said outbuilding needs to have an independent ground bus installed for ground and neutrals to be separate. The grounding screw should be removed.
I would like a second opinion and confirmation about this situation before i talk to the electrician when he shows up Tuesday to install the ground rods. I would like to be able to cite code references if possible. I will be attempting to look them up myself but corroboration would be helpful. Thank you.

 

[mm08822]

Yes you need rods for a subpanel in a separate structure.
Yes you need to remove the green bonding screw in the sub.
Yes you need to add at least 1 ground bar and tie the feeder grd wire to it.
Move all the ground wires to the ground bar.
Why is that white #8 taped black and what is its use? That looks shady!!!
Your PM is wrong, you need the rods.

Edit: Removed unrelated details from my original reply as I confused this OP with another who had a very similar situation.

 

[Russell_Reid]

Yeah, this ask came out of that thread as i began to get suspicious after seeing the 20 amp breakers. Its the same building. That white #8 is a mistake/misunderstanding. I have a 50amp welding outlet in the plan (red/black #8) which is deferred (6-50R). I requested that we add capability for a 50 amp RV shore power outlet in the future paralleled off of the welder outlet if possible. So he ran the welding outlet with #8 hot/hot/neu/ground. But he did not understand that the RV shore power outlet will be wired with 2 hots, neutral, ground (14-50R). So the neutral should be neutral and not hot. Neither receptacle is installed right now. I was pretty surprised by that when i opened the panel. That will get fixed.
I now know that all of my city inspections were useless. Electrical is the one area i am really worried about and i have a list of items now to get fixed. I am putting together the code references to justify my asks. I have an NEC 2002 residential pocket guide. The city uses NEC 1999.
I am debating on purchasing the ground bar myself and presenting it to him but i probably cant get it here by tuesday.
My mistakes were:
Trusting him because he was friendly, responsive and eager to please.
Trusting the city inspector who is overloaded and probably more focused on the million dollar homes getting built rather than my outbuilding.
Trusting the PM, who has bigger Barndominium projects he is working on and isn't making much money off of my outbuilding.
I am beginning to think that GCing the project myself would have been better. But i work a full time job and haven't managed a project like this in 20 years. So i thought it would be better to hire it out. I was wrong.

 

[Cruzan80]

I would also question exactly how it passed inspection with these violations. Passing inspection and up to code are not the same (as you have seen). They should be, but are not.

 

[Russell_Reid]

I am pretty sure i know how it 'passed' inspection. The city inspector did a 'passing' inspection. Meaning he passed by to leave a passed inspection form on my front door. If he even went to look at the outside of the building i would be surprised. Example attached. This was typical of all the inspections I received. I stressed about every one of the inspections. Now i know i was stressing about the wrong thing.

 

[Cruzan80]

If it were me, I would going down to the permitting office with pictures, and asking exactly how this passed. Hold them accountable for their actions.

 

[kngelv]

I agree with everything mm08822 said. That's a weird looking inspection sheet. It says the electrical is a rough and the buildiing itself is a final. You should clarify. You need two ground rods unless you can prove one gets you less than 25 ohms resistance - just do two at a minimum 6' apart. Make sure the panel is grounded from the ground rods. Panel can then be bonded to building steel. BONDING and GROUNDING are not the same thing!

James

 

[sparky 1971]

Yeah, this ask came out of that thread as i began to get suspicious after seeing the 20 amp breakers. Its the same building. That white #8 is a mistake/misunderstanding. I have a 50amp welding outlet in the plan (red/black #8) which is deferred (6-50R). I requested that we add capability for a 50 amp RV shore power outlet in the future paralleled off of the welder outlet if possible. So he ran the welding outlet with #8 hot/hot/neu/ground. But he did not understand that the RV shore power outlet will be wired with 2 hots, neutral, ground (14-50R). So the neutral should be neutral and not hot. Neither receptacle is installed right now. I was pretty surprised by that when i opened the panel. That will get fixed.

Even if he didn't know that a 50 amp RV uses a 14-50, he should know that 120 volt anything is going to need a neutral, and that isn't there since he's using the white for a hot. The guy is a flipping idiot, I don't care how nice his work looks. (My electrician did great work. Very clean and he was responsive and helpful. Even with the change orders (very few).) taken from your other thread.

I now know that all of my city inspections were useless. Electrical is the one area i am really worried about and i have a list of items now to get fixed. I am putting together the code references to justify my asks. I have an NEC 2002 residential pocket guide. The city uses NEC 1999.
I am debating on purchasing the ground bar myself and presenting it to him but i probably cant get it here by tuesday.
My mistakes were:
Trusting him because he was friendly, responsive and eager to please.
Trusting the city inspector who is overloaded and probably more focused on the million dollar homes getting built rather than my outbuilding.

From what I've seen, most inspectors usually know one thing well (plumbing, HVAC, framing, concrete, electric, etc) but don't know much about anything else, trusting that the trades know what they are doing. In one city and the areas where the state does inspecting, they know what they are looking at, but the inspection from them will be electric only, they aren't coming in and looking at every facet of the job. The guys that inspect in the suburbs or counties are pretty much clueless and that's probably what you had. If someone is going to look at a subpanel and see the neutral bonded, absence of a GEC, or 14/2 switch legs coming off of a 20 amp circuit and not realize something is wrong, he needs to either find another job or get some training. All of them will miss something at one time or another, but the mistakes on your job are too blatant to let go.

Trusting the PM, who has bigger Barndominium projects he is working on and isn't making much money off of my outbuilding.
I am beginning to think that GCing the project myself would have been better. But i work a full time job and haven't managed a project like this in 20 years. So i thought it would be better to hire it out. I was wrong.

PM's don't know all the rules and shouldn't have to. They are there to coordinate everyone while trusting that the subs know what they are doing.

 

[Bert_]

I'm kind of amazed that someone would take time and effort to make it look that nice, but still be so clueless about wiring.

 

[DGersic]

Everything i have read states that code requires independent grounding rods for an outbuilding, and a sub-panel in said outbuilding needs to have an independent ground bus installed for ground and neutrals to be separate. The grounding screw should be removed.

This is correct.

I would like a second opinion and confirmation about this situation before i talk to the electrician when he shows up Tuesday to install the ground rods.

If your electrician does not know the basics of his job, and can’t be bothered to go find out, I’m not really sure why you’re paying him. Tell your PM to get somebody competent to finish the job.

You should not have to provide code citations to get the work done properly.

 

[mm08822]

Even if he didn't know that a 50 amp RV uses a 14-50, he should know that 120 volt anything is going to need a neutral, and that isn't there since he's using the white for a hot. The guy is a flipping idiot, I don't care how nice his work looks. (My electrician did great work. Very clean and he was responsive and helpful. Even with the change orders (very few).) taken from your other thread.

The guy is clueless!! The way that 8-3 is connected in the panel would put 240v across where 120v is expected, 0v where 120v is expected, and he got lucky that 240v would be across both hots on the 14-50R.

So he gets to smoke an RV as a future booby trap!!

What possible rationale could one dream up to use 2 50A cbs and then use a 20A cb??

BUT, it looks perdy

 

[Russell_Reid]

The guy is clueless!! The way that 8-3 is connected in the panel would put 240v across where 120v is expected, 0v where 120v is expected, and he got lucky that 240v would be across both hots.

So he gets to smoke an RV as a future booby trap!!

What possible rationale could one dream up to use 2 50A cbs and then use a 20A cb??

BUT, it looks perdy

I agree. Before I opened the panel I wondered what the heck the 20 amp breaker labeled 'RV' was for. Now I know what he did. I am really glad he told me about forgetting the ground rods otherwise I may not have found everything else until it was too late. No telling what could have happened after we 'moved in'.

 

[Chuckster in NJ]

My professional advice: OP needs to hire a QUALIFIED electrician to make it right.

 

[Racer_X]

If it were me, I would going down to the permitting office with pictures, and asking exactly how this passed. Hold them accountable for their actions.

I would probably go to the person who oversees all the inspectors, if there is such a person.

 

[mm08822]

Yeah, this ask came out of that thread as i began to get suspicious after seeing the 20 amp breakers. Its the same building. That white #8 is a mistake/misunderstanding. I have a 50amp welding outlet in the plan (red/black #8) which is deferred (6-50R). I requested that we add capability for a 50 amp RV shore power outlet in the future paralleled off of the welder outlet if possible. So he ran the welding outlet with #8 hot/hot/neu/ground. But he did not understand that the RV shore power outlet will be wired with 2 hots, neutral, ground (14-50R). So the neutral should be neutral and not hot. Neither receptacle is installed right now. I was pretty surprised by that when i opened the panel. That will get fixed.
I now know that all of my city inspections were useless. Electrical is the one area i am really worried about and i have a list of items now to get fixed. I am putting together the code references to justify my asks. I have an NEC 2002 residential pocket guide. The city uses NEC 1999.
I am debating on purchasing the ground bar myself and presenting it to him but i probably cant get it here by tuesday.
My mistakes were:
Trusting him because he was friendly, responsive and eager to please.
Trusting the city inspector who is overloaded and probably more focused on the million dollar homes getting built rather than my outbuilding.
Trusting the PM, who has bigger Barndominium projects he is working on and isn't making much money off of my outbuilding.
I am beginning to think that GCing the project myself would have been better. But i work a full time job and haven't managed a project like this in 20 years. So i thought it would be better to hire it out. I was wrong.

Remove the white from the 20A CB now and relocate to neutral bar......that's just a recipe for eminent trouble. The 20A cb can be a spare or move everything up one space.

These are the reasons you want an inspection, a thorough inspection. However, inspectors should not carry the burden of teaching fundamentals to tradesmen.

Edit: Removed unrelated details from this reply as I confused this OP with another who had a very similar situation.

 

[mm08822]

My professional advice: OP needs to hire a QUALIFIED electrician to make it right.

The problem is, during the courting session, everyone claims Qualified.

 

[sparky 1971]

If this sub-panel is in the same building as the other thread where you showed the 200A sub-panel (with funky feeder), then only one set of ground rods are needed. If the meter/main is on the other side of the wall from that 200A sub-panel, then the 2 grd rods should tie into the meter/main enclosure and none needed for the sub-panels as they are part of the same structure. (Maybe I have this confused??)

Remove the white from the 20A CB now and relocate to neutral bar......that's just a recipe for eminent trouble. The 20A cb can be a spare or move everything up one space.

I thought this electrician was fired. Now you're having him come back? Hopefully, it's not the PM doing this either.

These are the reasons you want an inspection, a thorough inspection. However, inspectors should not carry the burden of teaching fundamentals to tradesmen.

It might just be me and my simple mind, but I think that you are getting two different effed up jobs done by two different incompetent shock jockeys mixed up. The thread with the funky feeder is this one:

New garage wiring issue.

Woman plowed into my garage, $70k worth of damage. Having it completely rebuilt, almost done. Had to do some welding on a bracket for my air compressor, 220v isn't wired yet, so I used my little 110v welder plugged into a regular wall outlet, 15A breaker (I think). Overhead LED lights flicker...

www.garagejournal.com

but I'm willing to admit that there may be something I missed.

 

[sparky 1971]

The problem is, during the courting session, everyone claims Qualified.

But doesn't having a license make them qualified?

 

[mm08822]

It might just be me and my simple mind, but I think that you are getting two different effed up jobs done by two different incompetent shock jockeys mixed up. The thread with the funky feeder is this one:

New garage wiring issue.

Woman plowed into my garage, $70k worth of damage. Having it completely rebuilt, almost done. Had to do some welding on a bracket for my air compressor, 220v isn't wired yet, so I used my little 110v welder plugged into a regular wall outlet, 15A breaker (I think). Overhead LED lights flicker...

www.garagejournal.com

but I'm willing to admit that there may be something I missed.

Not the same OP?

 

[mm08822]

But doesn't having a license make them qualified?

Just like inspections bless the mess!!

 

[sparky 1971]

Not the same OP?

Not unless one person has two different user names.

 

[mm08822]

Oops.......similar mess, wrong thread. My bad.............

Maybe the same electrician making the rounds!!!

Edit: Ok, I fixeded it! No mo co-mingled mess......just 2 smaller piles.

 

[Chuckster in NJ]

The problem is, during the courting session, everyone claims Qualified.

Very true!
There are some licensed electrical contractors that I have ran across who know very little about electrical fundamentals and theory.…… They were good test takers.

 

[sparky 1971]

I took the SBCCI journeymans test in 1996, the Bloc journeymans test in 2000, and whatever we have for a masters test in 2008, passing all three. I don't know what it's like now, but other than a few blueprint questions, every one of the rest of the questions were pretty much word for word out of the code book so if someone had a clue about how to use the index it would be an easy thing to do. There were questions about things I had never heard of and probably will never see but finding the answer was pretty easy. Here in IA, there isn't a test for an Electrical Contractors license, we just need insurance. The contractors doesn't mean squat without a masters though, it requires both to pull a permit but the same person doesn't need to have both, the owner needs the contractors and at least one employee needs a masters; I have both since there are no employees other than me.

 

[Chuckster in NJ]

I took the SBCCI journeymans test in 1996, the Bloc journeymans test in 2000, and whatever we have for a masters test in 2008, passing all three. I don't know what it's like now, but other than a few blueprint questions, every one of the rest of the questions were pretty much word for word out of the code book so if someone had a clue about how to use the index it would be an easy thing to do. There were questions about things I had never heard of and probably will never see but finding the answer was pretty easy. Here in IA, there isn't a test for an Electrical Contractors license, we just need insurance. The contractors doesn't mean squat without a masters though, it requires both to pull a permit but the same person doesn't need to have both, the owner needs the contractors and at least one employee needs a masters; I have both since there are no employees other than me.

In NJ you need hands on experience and need to pass the Electrical Contractors exam in order to obtain a NJ Electrical Contractors License (business permit) and you are "good to go" after getting insured and bonded.
There are a few guys out here that offer "EC exam prep Courses" that teach you how to navigate the NEC along with other common test questions in order to pass the EC exam. Basically get your experience pulling romex and doing residential electrical work and "IF" you pass the exam you will be a EC who can do the electrical work on a high rise building.
When I got my EC license in 1975 (after serving a 4 year apprenticeship and graduating Vo Tech high school) it was very hard to pass and had a 5% pass rate.….. There were 50 code questions and 50 theory questions and you had three hours to take both parts. I passed the exam on the 2’nd time after I failed the first time. Nowadays since they "watered down" the exam because of how tough the test was (along with low pass numbers) so most people pass the exam who are NOT really qualified or had a formal electrical education.
Most of my early years were spent in an industrial and commercial work environment so I had to learn about swimming pools and residential wiring.…… I failed my first residential job as a licensed EC because I did not use #12 in the dining room (20 amp circuit) because I never really used Romex except in high school. The electrical inspector who failed me on my first residential job broke my balls for years and I told him to come into "my world" with Class 1 Division 1 and see what he knew.

 

[sparky 1971]

In NJ you need hands on experience and need to pass the Electrical Contractors exam in order to obtain a NJ Electrical Contractors License (business permit) and you are "good to go" after getting insured and bonded.
There are a few guys out here that offer "EC exam prep Courses" that teach you how to navigate the NEC along with other common test questions in order to pass the EC exam. Basically get your experience pulling romex and doing residential electrical work and "IF" you pass the exam you will be a EC who can do the electrical work on a high rise building.
When I got my EC license in 1975 (after serving a 4 year apprenticeship and graduating Vo Tech high school) it was very hard to pass and had a 5% pass rate.….. There were 50 code questions and 50 theory questions and you had three hours to take both parts. I passed the exam on the 2’nd time after I failed the first time. Nowadays since they "watered down" the exam because of how tough the test was (along with low pass numbers) so most people pass the exam who are NOT really qualified or had a formal electrical education.
Most of my early years were spent in an industrial and commercial work environment so I had to learn about swimming pools and residential wiring.…… I failed my first residential job as a licensed EC because I did not use #12 in the dining room (20 amp circuit) because I never really used Romex except in high school. The electrical inspector who failed me on my first residential job broke my balls for years and I told him to come into "my world" with Class 1 Division 1 and see what he knew.

Our journeymans license requires 8000 hours of work experience along with passing the test. The masters requires so many years or hours of working as a licensed journeyman, but I don't know how many; I do know that I had plenty of hours when I took the test out of boredom from not having any work due to 2008. There wasn't any incentive for me to get a masters at the time, it's not worth more money when being an employee unless you are THE master for the company, I just needed to get out of the house. The night before the exam I realized I didn't have a 2008 code book, had to leave extra early and go by the shop to borrow the bosses. It worked out ok, about a year after I got my masters, the boss called me up and told me he decided to retire and asked if I would like to buy all the equipment from him cheap. Saying yes might have been the biggest mistake of my life.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

oh boy another hot mess.... where do i begin???....

Our metal outbuilding project passed the city final inspection this week. So I was trying to get the contractors scope of work closed out. Basically listing what still needed to be done and get final invoicing. During this back and forth my electrician notified me that he forgot to put in the grounding rods for the outbuilding and do i still want them installed. Surprised by this I told him yes and he gave me a price of $355 to perform the work. A bit of background:
My PM had asked the foundation guys to put in a grounding rebar during form installation. They did so. After pour it stuck up through the slab right next to the feeder conduits for the future sub-panel. When the building installers came to put up the shell, it was 'in their way' so they cut it off instead of drilling the frame base for it to poke through (2.5" box tube framing). When it came time for electrical rough we realized that the ground rod was no longer there. So I asked what the solution was and both the electrician and PM said they could install grounding rods outside the slab and bond the building and panel to it. This discussion happened on 3 different occasions, twice with the PM and electrician, and once with the electrician. Still it got forgotten.

The foundation guys should know better. it is their fault and they should be back charged by the electrician or GC to pay for it.

Back to now, I contacted the PM about the missing grounding and protested that the electrician wanted to charge me $355 to install the grounding rods and bonding.

The electrician should be charging the GC or foundation sub NOT you. Why is this so hard for people to understand (not referring to you.

The PM told me that since it passed final they were not needed.

He is wrong. its required by code. inspectors miss stuff all the time. just because it passed a ****** inspectors inspector doesnt mean its not needed. the PM is using flawed logic. Tell him to open his code book that i doubt he has.

But he would talk to the electrician if i insisted and clear up this cost issue plus another cost issue where i was double charged for some of the other work.
After a bit of searching and reading I began to suspect that the service tie in between the main panel and the sub-panel may have not been properly grounded. So i opened the panel and took a look. There is a 4 wire feeder from the House main to the Sub panel in the outbuilding. 2 hots, neutral, ground. The Sub-panel is not bonded to the building steel.

mistake #1

The neutrals and the grounds in the sub-panel are not separated. The grounding screw to the panel box is in place.

Mistake #2 and #3....

you absolutely do not want the neutral bonded in a sub.

Since there is no independent grounding rods the panel is currently grounded through the ground wire to the House main.

Sort of. 2 different things going on here. The EGC between main (or sub in another building) and this building is required but electrodes are also required. The EGC and electrodes are different animals and perform different functions.... see my link below for references.

Everything i have read states that code requires independent grounding rods for an outbuilding, and a sub-panel in said outbuilding needs to have an independent ground bus installed for ground and neutrals to be separate. The grounding screw should be removed.

This is all correct. If you need a diagram, check the electrical FAQ sticky here

Electrical FAQs

Welcome All I have started this sticky as an FAQ thread for info on the basics that are encountered countless times every week on here. Hopefully this will help some. If u have a topic request, go ahead and post it. And if you have an FAQ you would like covered let me know.... Or if you...

www.garagejournal.com

I prefer 2 ground bars, one on each side, along with 2 neutral bars, to keep the panel clean.... no crossing over from side to side...

I would like a second opinion and confirmation about this situation before i talk to the electrician when he shows up Tuesday to install the ground rods. I would like to be able to cite code references if possible. I will be attempting to look them up myself but corroboration would be helpful. Thank you.

Print the charts at the above link. If you need code references, we need to know which code cycle your AHJ is on. Im not feeling very well so I would have to look later.

BTW this sparky is an idiot and does know basic electrical 101 fundamentals. he should go back to school and be fired. He is creating a potential for shock on every panel he wires like this....

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I'm kind of amazed that someone would take time and effort to make it look that nice, but still be so clueless about wiring.

mustve flunked electrician school and crammed for the tests

 

[sparky 1971]

Yeah, this ask came out of that thread as i began to get suspicious after seeing the 20 amp breakers. Its the same building. That white #8 is a mistake/misunderstanding. I have a 50amp welding outlet in the plan (red/black #8) which is deferred (6-50R). I requested that we add capability for a 50 amp RV shore power outlet in the future paralleled off of the welder outlet if possible. So he ran the welding outlet with #8 hot/hot/neu/ground. But he did not understand that the RV shore power outlet will be wired with 2 hots, neutral, ground (14-50R). So the neutral should be neutral and not hot. Neither receptacle is installed right now. I was pretty surprised by that when i opened the panel. That will get fixed.
I now know that all of my city inspections were useless. Electrical is the one area i am really worried about and i have a list of items now to get fixed. I am putting together the code references to justify my asks. I have an NEC 2002 residential pocket guide. The city uses NEC 1999.
I am debating on purchasing the ground bar myself and presenting it to him but i probably cant get it here by tuesday.
My mistakes were:
Trusting him because he was friendly, responsive and eager to please.
Trusting the city inspector who is overloaded and probably more focused on the million dollar homes getting built rather than my outbuilding.
Trusting the PM, who has bigger Barndominium projects he is working on and isn't making much money off of my outbuilding.
I am beginning to think that GCing the project myself would have been better. But i work a full time job and haven't managed a project like this in 20 years. So i thought it would be better to hire it out. I was wrong.

I missed this first time through. I have a hard time believing the city is that far behind, but if it really is the case, a three wire feeder with a bonded neutral in the sub panel would have passed. Ground rods would have still been required. Even if they are on the 1999, the guy that did the wiring doesn't know it since he pulled a four wire feeder and managed to screw it up.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

that would be crazy if theyre still on 1999 code cycle. i call BS

 

[Russell_Reid]

that would be crazy if theyre still on 1999 code cycle. i call BS

Accessory outbuilding permit app from the city. Applicable codes are at the bottom. City has one guy who does both permit review, approval and inspections. He has been working for the city in this capacity for 10 years. FYI 6000 sq ft million dollar homes are being built in parker under this code regime and reviewed, approved and inspected by this one guy.

 

[PCustoms]

Well, the document is from 2017, but it does indeed call out 1999 NEC

@Russell_Reid when did you get your permit?

Edit: wrong Parker

 

[wyliesdiesels]

wow thats insane.... regardless the install does not meet 1999 code or any code for that matter. the guy who installed it has no clue what he is doing...

 

[Russell_Reid]

Well, the document is from 2017, but it does indeed call out 1999 NEC

@Russell_Reid when did you get your permit?

Looks like the jumped to 2023 NEC in January. Not sure what was in between...

Building Codes | Town of Parker - Official Website

Access Parker's adopted building-related codes and code amendments.

www.parkerco.gov

Wrong Parker. I am in Parker TX not CO.

City of Parker, TX - Official Website | Official Website

www.parkertexas.us

 

[PCustoms]

Wrong Parker. I am in Parker TX not CO.

City of Parker, TX - Official Website | Official Website

www.parkertexas.us

Woops Google done me wrong!

 

[wyliesdiesels]

even the electrical permit doc lists 1999 NEC

someone is way behind there

 

[sparky 1971]

Wow. All I can say is wow. And I wish we were still on the 99.

 

[yatg]

I have a 50amp welding outlet in the plan (red/black #8) which is deferred (6-50R). I requested that we add capability for a 50 amp RV shore power outlet in the future paralleled off of the welder outlet if possible.

You need 6/3NM copper for a full 50A RV circuit.

That 8/3 is only good for 40A, which is more than plenty for a welder only circuit.

He should have known that too, but that's the least of your problems.

Easy future upgrade to run a new circuit and add an RV panel instead of a single receptacle.

 

[Russell_Reid]

You need 6/3NM copper for a full 50A RV circuit.

That 8/3 is only good for 40A, which is more than plenty for a welder only circuit.

He should have known that too, but that's the least of your problems.

Easy future upgrade to run a new circuit and add an RV panel instead of a single receptacle.

Well, that point is moot. I dont have an RV right now as our travel trailer was destroyed by a hailstorm in march. Whether we buy another one in the future is up in the air. And even if we did it wouldn't be as big Our old 30ft only needed 30 amp so i doubt the one we buy would need more. I am not going to worry about this as an issue.

 

[Codyboy]

If it were me, I would going down to the permitting office with pictures, and asking exactly how this passed. Hold them accountable for their actions.

Personally I would not open that can of worms.

You want to get failed on all the things?
This is how you get failed on all the things.

GC should pay the electrician to install the ground rods ot notified the framing crew of what that rod was for and to not cut it off.