^5,000th post^...epic thread
I loved your video Jack, well done. Had not seen your ceiling table that is over your car....do you have more details on how that was accomplished?
Between 265 & 485 SQ/FT The 12-Gauge Garage
- Thread starter Jack Olsen
- Start date
Workspaces sized between 265 and 485 squarefeet.
^5,000th post^...epic thread
I loved your video Jack, well done. Had not seen your ceiling table that is over your car....do you have more details on how that was accomplished?
Hemihead2
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Great video, Jack. Your vision of what a work space should mean resonated with me. When I bought a property with a 1200 sq. ft detached garage, it was with the same thoughts I had in making it the place to work on projects. No way is mine as nice or well thought out as yours, but your video described my intent perfectly. Thanks for sharing.
Outlawmws
Well-known member
Jack, that Vid explained a LOT! Your philosophy and approach, and some of the logic behind the 12 ga, Garage. Great production and presentation!
I think that vid has the potential to inspire many more to make headway for their own shop, and I include myself in that number!
In fact, I think it has application for almost any work area, whether its car and fab, arts and crafts in a room in your house, or something as basic as the kitchen!
Thanks for making and posting it!
I think that vid has the potential to inspire many more to make headway for their own shop, and I include myself in that number!
In fact, I think it has application for almost any work area, whether its car and fab, arts and crafts in a room in your house, or something as basic as the kitchen!
Thanks for making and posting it!
larry4406
Well-known member
I too enjoyed the video, very well done and thanks for the quick tour!
Made me stop this morning and rethink the direction my garage is heading. I'm starting to think more about an island like yours and I like how the table saw tucks under the island.
Made me stop this morning and rethink the direction my garage is heading. I'm starting to think more about an island like yours and I like how the table saw tucks under the island.
1949 caddyman
Well-known member
Love the video, love your choice in beer. 805 is a good tool! LOL
Richard Cranium
Well-known member
Jack, I have been following your builds every since I became a member and have loved each and every one of them. Thank you for inviting us into your garage again. Richard
OP
Thanks!
Here's another video -- this one required much less work. It's a no-cost bench for my daughter's kindergarten class. They wanted one to go with the playhouse I brought over there.
Here's another video -- this one required much less work. It's a no-cost bench for my daughter's kindergarten class. They wanted one to go with the playhouse I brought over there.
Ipassgas
Well-known member
Nice bench! I think you deserved the thumbs up.
And green to match the . . . playhouse. Yeah, the playhouse.
And green to match the . . . playhouse. Yeah, the playhouse.
Craptain
Well-known member
Beautiful in its simplicity. Well done Jack.
Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk
Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk
John S
New member
Hi Jack,
You were kind enough to let me and a couple other friends visit the famous 12-Gauge Garage while we were over from Australia for RR V. I was impressed then, but your video demonstrates beautifully just how clever your set up is. My personal favourite, along with the lift, is the welding table. I love the way all the clamps you could ever need are there at the ready as the table unfolds. Very well thought out and executed.
Cheers, John
You were kind enough to let me and a couple other friends visit the famous 12-Gauge Garage while we were over from Australia for RR V. I was impressed then, but your video demonstrates beautifully just how clever your set up is. My personal favourite, along with the lift, is the welding table. I love the way all the clamps you could ever need are there at the ready as the table unfolds. Very well thought out and executed.
Cheers, John
Grizz1963
Well-known member
And another thumbs up for the bench and materials selection Jack.
Well done !!
Well done !!
Dan in Pasadena
Well-known member
Hi Jack! Long time no talk.
I apologize for asking an off-the-current-topic question but I've searched and can't find something I THINK I know you posted long ago. 230 pages is a lot to search.
I remember your deck is made from Ipe but for the life of me I can't remember what finish you used? Some kind of Penta type finish. I need to know this product for the bed wood in my '55 Chevy truck. Are you still happy with your deck finish? How frequently does it require you to re-apply?
Now back to the thread before I rudely interrupted. Again, sorry.
I apologize for asking an off-the-current-topic question but I've searched and can't find something I THINK I know you posted long ago. 230 pages is a lot to search.
I remember your deck is made from Ipe but for the life of me I can't remember what finish you used? Some kind of Penta type finish. I need to know this product for the bed wood in my '55 Chevy truck. Are you still happy with your deck finish? How frequently does it require you to re-apply?
Now back to the thread before I rudely interrupted. Again, sorry.
HI Jack: This is my first time here. I've been looking through a lot of the thread to find out how the little blue air conditioner worked. I can't locate that discussion. I'm trying to create my own art space in our 2 car garage in FL. It gets super hot, and beyond insulating the metal door, and getting some type of movable fan, I'm stuck. We have HOA rules here, so nothing can show on the outside of the building. The design concepts are very restricting. So, how did/does the AC work out for you?
And thanks for your great, grammatically correct writing. You made my day as a retired English teacher.
KKRascal
And thanks for your great, grammatically correct writing. You made my day as a retired English teacher.
KKRascal
OP
Thanks. Great to hear from you -- now I know you all made it safely back.
Thanks, Grizz!
Hey, Dan. My deck is Cumaru, which is one of Ipe's cousins. I love the wood, but the rosewood oil finish I used, Penofin, is something I'm not thrilled with. To look really good, I'd have to re-apply the stuff every 6 months. I've read about MANY people who are thrilled with Penofin, and many consider it the top of the mountain, when it comes to these hardwood finishes. But then there is a small minority (like me) who get the wood turning gray/flat/ugly too soon. After some additional Internet research, I'm about to try two competitors: Defy and TWP, whose product names escape me now. But they should be easy to find. It might not be helpful for you, with your timeframe, but I'll report back with my results.
Thanks! I'll try to watch my grammar in this reply.
I briefly used a portable air conditioning unit, which I rigged with an intake and an exit through the back wall. It worked all right -- but the frustrating thing for me was needing to anticipate when I'd be in the garage and then remembering to turn it on in advance. In the end, I took it out. My plan is to put in a whole-garage (and adjoining office) system sometime in the future.John S
New member
Thanks. Great to hear from you -- now I know you all made it safely back.
Thank you, yes we did. Coming back for Luft 4 soon, so will look out for you and BB2 if you'll be there.
Cheers John
I know I'm bringing up an old topic, sorry.
But, Jack, how did you secure the fabric around the tubing on your awning?
How's has it held up over the years?
Thanks, take care
Bill
But, Jack, how did you secure the fabric around the tubing on your awning?
How's has it held up over the years?
Thanks, take care
Bill
Yep, that's the Variety building. I'm right off of Miracle Mile, near the Petersen Auto Museum.
Here are three pictures of the completed shade cover. While building it, I kept reassuring my wife that if she didn't like it, it would be no problem to just take it all down. Looking at it from above, it's, uh, well... pretty darn big.
But so far, she likes it.
OP
That was the first time I tried securing shade fabric to a frame, and my method was pretty simple. I bought a bunch of 100 'report clips,' the spring-steel clamps you use to hold a thick stack of paper together. I painted them to match the fabric, and counted on the massive redundancy of a clip every 12" or so to resist the force of wind acting on the fabric. It might be because of the aerodynamic placement of the shade right along the adjoining roof line, but the shade structure has been up for seven years now, with no maintenance, and it's still doing fine. In this picture, you can see the clips when I first placed them. I subsequently removed the little handles, leaving just the spring steel.
I used this kind of clip:
On the subsequent shade structures I made, I did something I felt would be more robust. (I figured I'd gotten away with it once; it might not keep working out so well.) The frame above my the deck is 1-1/4" square tubing. I first use hand clamps to position the fabric, and then put a length of 1/2" square tubing over that, sandwiching the fabric between them -- and drilling holes for little stainless-steel screws to compress the two pieces together. Then (and I think this is key), I run a bead of roofing adhesive, so that the edge of the fabric (which I've trimmed off) is 'globbed up' with enough adhesive that it would be just about impossible to pull the fabric through the gap.
I used this kind of clip:
On the subsequent shade structures I made, I did something I felt would be more robust. (I figured I'd gotten away with it once; it might not keep working out so well.) The frame above my the deck is 1-1/4" square tubing. I first use hand clamps to position the fabric, and then put a length of 1/2" square tubing over that, sandwiching the fabric between them -- and drilling holes for little stainless-steel screws to compress the two pieces together. Then (and I think this is key), I run a bead of roofing adhesive, so that the edge of the fabric (which I've trimmed off) is 'globbed up' with enough adhesive that it would be just about impossible to pull the fabric through the gap.
bczygan
Well-known member
Jack,
What bender is that, that you used for the bench?
Bill
What bender is that, that you used for the bench?
Bill
OP
Harbor Freight Roll Bender with a Harbor Freight pipe threader turning it.
I bought extra dies for it from Swag Offroad.
I bought extra dies for it from Swag Offroad.
dgithens1
Well-known member
Watched your video this weekend, what a great place to work in, amazingly well thought out! 
OP
Thanks!
For more-recent thread visitors, here's a link for this new page.
For more-recent thread visitors, here's a link for this new page.
hobie1dog
Well-known member
I must have missed a reply to my question. What stereo and speakers do you use?
ajohno
Well-known member
Fantastic garage and video Jack. I also like having everything in its place. 
bagged89s10
Well-known member
Thanks!
For more-recent thread visitors, here's a link for this new page.
Great video! Your garage has been the inspiration to mine but I'm nowhere near as organized as yours yet. Hopefully one day.
G20-Budo
Well-known member
Jack,
I enjoyed the video, and how you told the story of building the garage and it's functions.. Good stuff! As I've looked at your garage over the years, I really do the see the utility in it.
I enjoyed the video, and how you told the story of building the garage and it's functions.. Good stuff! As I've looked at your garage over the years, I really do the see the utility in it.
drivesitfar
Well-known member
Jack: i can't believe i haven't made one post on your thread. i owe you a lot of WELL DONES over the years and your recent video is just another one.
1) stronghold cabinets and cutting them up and re designing them for your use.
2) general garage layout
3) deck
4) playhouse (over the top cool)
5) new video
just to name a few that i can remember. i guess if you had more vintage tools i'd probably have more to say, but at times you do leave me SPEACHLESS which as you can see by how many posts i have isn't easy.
keep up the great work and again WELL DONE SIR!!
1) stronghold cabinets and cutting them up and re designing them for your use.
2) general garage layout
3) deck
4) playhouse (over the top cool)
5) new video
just to name a few that i can remember. i guess if you had more vintage tools i'd probably have more to say, but at times you do leave me SPEACHLESS which as you can see by how many posts i have isn't easy.
keep up the great work and again WELL DONE SIR!!
OP
Thanks guys -- and especially drivesitfar.
On the other side, #3 contains a piece that I haven't done well. Or maybe it falls into the 'fool me once, shame on you, fool me every April in the same way, shame on me' category.
I built a deck for our place four years ago. I splurged for Brazilian hardwood for it, and in almost every way, I've been very happy with that decision. I've never even had to sand the stuff, and the kids can run around on it barefoot all day and never get a sliver.
But the Penofin (rosewood oil) I stained it with has the annoying problem of going to a flat, dark color after maybe six months of exposure to the rain and sun. I oiled the wood in 2013, and then have repeated that every April since then. It's not a huge amount of work -- I just move the furniture off, mop it with an oxalic acid wash, and re-apply a coat of the Penofin stuff. This is what it looked like when I finished it.
Eventually, it got a little darker, which I was fine with.
But here's a snapshot of every April's ugliness and subsequent 'refresh.'
But after year four, I've decided it's time to try something other than Penofin. So today I tested a new stain made by TWP on an old cut-off. Here it is sitting on the currently-grayed deck, which suffered even more this year (I think) because of our record rains.
My question: does anyone out there have experience with TWP's stains? I don't figure things can get any worse than with the Penofin. And I understand that outdoor wood will need a freshening up once a year -- but I'd like it to look good for a longer piece of that year if it's at all do-able.
Advice?
On the other side, #3 contains a piece that I haven't done well. Or maybe it falls into the 'fool me once, shame on you, fool me every April in the same way, shame on me' category.
I built a deck for our place four years ago. I splurged for Brazilian hardwood for it, and in almost every way, I've been very happy with that decision. I've never even had to sand the stuff, and the kids can run around on it barefoot all day and never get a sliver.
But the Penofin (rosewood oil) I stained it with has the annoying problem of going to a flat, dark color after maybe six months of exposure to the rain and sun. I oiled the wood in 2013, and then have repeated that every April since then. It's not a huge amount of work -- I just move the furniture off, mop it with an oxalic acid wash, and re-apply a coat of the Penofin stuff. This is what it looked like when I finished it.
Eventually, it got a little darker, which I was fine with.
But here's a snapshot of every April's ugliness and subsequent 'refresh.'
But after year four, I've decided it's time to try something other than Penofin. So today I tested a new stain made by TWP on an old cut-off. Here it is sitting on the currently-grayed deck, which suffered even more this year (I think) because of our record rains.
My question: does anyone out there have experience with TWP's stains? I don't figure things can get any worse than with the Penofin. And I understand that outdoor wood will need a freshening up once a year -- but I'd like it to look good for a longer piece of that year if it's at all do-able.
Advice?
rlitman
Well-known member
First off, Jack, as usual, your spaces look magazine cover / HGTV (strike that, too good for HGTV) ready. I remember wowing over the that original picture of when you applied the Penofin.
I would suspect that the graying is from two factors.
1) Pigment bleaching from UV. The red dyes will weaken over time, and you lose color saturation. You could consider applying a UV blocking treatment to your canopy.
2) Mildew. That's the black stuff you're bleaching. Mildew does not degrade the wood, but it feeds on many oil based stains. It's a surface condition, and you can reduce it by adding mildewcide to your stain. Something like this:
http://www.homedepot.com/p/M-1-1-5-oz-Advanced-Mildewcide-AM1-5B/202967359
But before doing that, I'd give the 800 number on the back of the can a call. They might have some useful advice. Especially because, when it comes to coatings you need to be careful about compatibility issues before you mix something in.
As for bleach, I would suggest you try Oxiclean before going to oxalic acid. It's a little less harsh (less damaging to the wood), and should accomplish everything you need.
For my own outdoor wood projects, I've had good luck with Cetol. I stained my kids' playground once, in 2011, and it still hasn't gotten that gray, though it is in pretty bad need of a re-stain since last year. Can't say I have any experience with TWP products. Sorry.
I would suspect that the graying is from two factors.
1) Pigment bleaching from UV. The red dyes will weaken over time, and you lose color saturation. You could consider applying a UV blocking treatment to your canopy.
2) Mildew. That's the black stuff you're bleaching. Mildew does not degrade the wood, but it feeds on many oil based stains. It's a surface condition, and you can reduce it by adding mildewcide to your stain. Something like this:
http://www.homedepot.com/p/M-1-1-5-oz-Advanced-Mildewcide-AM1-5B/202967359
But before doing that, I'd give the 800 number on the back of the can a call. They might have some useful advice. Especially because, when it comes to coatings you need to be careful about compatibility issues before you mix something in.
As for bleach, I would suggest you try Oxiclean before going to oxalic acid. It's a little less harsh (less damaging to the wood), and should accomplish everything you need.
For my own outdoor wood projects, I've had good luck with Cetol. I stained my kids' playground once, in 2011, and it still hasn't gotten that gray, though it is in pretty bad need of a re-stain since last year. Can't say I have any experience with TWP products. Sorry.
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OP
Thanks for that. I just looked it up, and the Penofin I've used for the past four years boasts 99% UV protection (via 'trans-oxide pigments') and a 'high-grade mildewcide' for mold/mildew protection. Of course, they wouldn't be the first manufacturer to promise something they weren't actually delivering.
rlitman
Well-known member
Well, for UV protection, you can get SPF 8 sunblock, or you can get 85.
And a little mildewcide prevents mildew from consuming the oils in the stain, but if enough mildewcide is used that it leaches out on the surface and kills mildew growing there, remember that it is also getting on your feet.
It's all a little give and take too, because UV also kills mildew. So blocking more UV may protect the red dye, but speed up the blackening. The north facing side of my solid PVC fence grows more mildew than any other side. Though the parts of that fence nearest my rose bushes stay sparklingly white because of the fungicides I spray on the roses.
There is also the question of what the mildew is growing on. Even if the oil stain itself is mildew resistant, dust and dirt carried down by wind and rain can deposit enough to allow mildew to get a foothold.
My gut tells me that if you can deal with the UV fading, the mildew issue can be dealt with by just cleaning, rather than a cleaning followed by re-staining.
And a little mildewcide prevents mildew from consuming the oils in the stain, but if enough mildewcide is used that it leaches out on the surface and kills mildew growing there, remember that it is also getting on your feet.
It's all a little give and take too, because UV also kills mildew. So blocking more UV may protect the red dye, but speed up the blackening. The north facing side of my solid PVC fence grows more mildew than any other side. Though the parts of that fence nearest my rose bushes stay sparklingly white because of the fungicides I spray on the roses.
There is also the question of what the mildew is growing on. Even if the oil stain itself is mildew resistant, dust and dirt carried down by wind and rain can deposit enough to allow mildew to get a foothold.
My gut tells me that if you can deal with the UV fading, the mildew issue can be dealt with by just cleaning, rather than a cleaning followed by re-staining.
Ipassgas
Well-known member
Jack, forgive me if this is off putting, but I just got a lift that'll need paint.
Somewhere, once upon a time, you showed a blue that complimented J.O.G (Tarragon).
I can't find that post. I'd like to paint the lift that blue, for two reasons.
1. Because I liked it.
2. As an homage to the 12 gauge garage, doing more than people expect is possible.
Somewhere, once upon a time, you showed a blue that complimented J.O.G (Tarragon).
I can't find that post. I'd like to paint the lift that blue, for two reasons.
1. Because I liked it.
2. As an homage to the 12 gauge garage, doing more than people expect is possible.
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OP
rlitman, it's odd, the whole deck is covered with shade fabric, so there's reduced UV to begin with. The blackening definitely seems related to the rain. But maybe that's what's feeding the mildew/mold and whatever poison is in the Penofin is just not the right one for the stuff I've got growing -- although I've read about other Penofin users experiencing the same blackening. Some of them attribute it to tannins in the wood. But I simply don't know.
I'm doing some tests with a couple of different stains now, and I'll run some long-term tests in parallel with whatever I end up putting on the deck itself.
Ipassgas, it's not off-putting at all. I'm flattered. But I don't remember a blue I matched to the Tarragon. Can you give me some more context? It might trigger my old brain to recall it. My Vestil lift was originally blue, but I took care of that.
I'm doing some tests with a couple of different stains now, and I'll run some long-term tests in parallel with whatever I end up putting on the deck itself.
Ipassgas, it's not off-putting at all. I'm flattered. But I don't remember a blue I matched to the Tarragon. Can you give me some more context? It might trigger my old brain to recall it. My Vestil lift was originally blue, but I took care of that.
Outlawmws
Well-known member
Jack, I think you are on to something with it being mold related rather than sun damage. Generally the sun bleaches wood. I don't see it darkening it. The fabric could be contributing two ways: Shade and higher humidity...
My long fence, while only cedar, is bleached near white on one side, and is black with mold on the shade side as an example.
My long fence, while only cedar, is bleached near white on one side, and is black with mold on the shade side as an example.
rlitman
Well-known member
Ok, here's a question. If you scrub the deck down with Oxiclean or TSP, does the blackening come off, or do you really need to bleach it?
Tannins in some woods can react with iron to leave a black stain that is fairly permanent, but can be bleached with oxalic acid. However, that's something I've only seen take streaky patterns where water runs off of steel onto wood. I've not heard of this causing an overall dark cast on wood.
I think you'd have more luck with a percarbonate cleaner, as that does a better job at actually killing mildew.
Tannins in some woods can react with iron to leave a black stain that is fairly permanent, but can be bleached with oxalic acid. However, that's something I've only seen take streaky patterns where water runs off of steel onto wood. I've not heard of this causing an overall dark cast on wood.
I think you'd have more luck with a percarbonate cleaner, as that does a better job at actually killing mildew.