The vintage Blackhawk Thread

[CRTDI]

Took me years on first one. Here is a weird one. Spotted it on ebay for 12$.

Very cool ratchet! There was some discussion in another thread a from a few years ago (which I can't seem to find) that assumes this is a New Britain era ratchet based on the post-war handle style.

 

[930dreamer]

I had keys made for the Blackhawk jacks. If your lock says BL10 on the top like most Blackhawk Jacks i have a couple keys available. If you are interested in one please send me a message. Thanks Josh

I have (5) S4 jacks so I'll check my numbers.

 

[Oldtuleguy]

Very cool ratchet! There was some discussion in another thread a from a few years ago (which I can't seem to find) that assumes this is a New Britain era ratchet based on the post-war handle style.

I am flummoxed so far. It may well be but I have not seen a new britain version. Blackhawk was known for some odd looking ratchets.

 

[joshotto94]

I have (5) S4 jacks so I'll check my numbers.

Your S4 should be the same i polished the parts up Friday. Let me know if your lock is the same and you want one. Thanks Josh

 

[jabberwoki]

Got this sweet old Blackhawk press jack.
Lemme know If anybody needs it for an original application.

 

[RustyShackleford]

...I copied my original post from a new thread and it was suggested to come here...

Hi all...

I've been lurking here for the last day or two trying to gather info on some tools I got a hold of last weekend. My brother gave me a bucket of Blackhawk 7/16 drive sockets and ratchet that he got from someone else.

Anyway, I've been reading old threads and checked out the article on Alloy Artifacts that gives great info on the old Blackhawk stuff, but I've now got a question regarding the ratchet.

It's marked as a 9810 and according to all the info I can find, that model is a 1/2" drive. My ratchet, however is clearly a 7/16" drive. The Alloy Artifact article mentions the 9810 as a 1/2" drive, but doesn't mention anything regarding the 7/16". Has anyone seen/heard of this?

Here's a breakdown of what I got in the set...

9810 7/16 drive ratchet
39964 3/8 to 7/16 adapter
39966 Screw driver bit
39979 Drag link bit
39978 U joint
354xx U Joint sockets (7/16, 1/2, 5/8 x2, 11/16)
352xx 8 pt sockets (3/8, 7/16, 1/2, 5/8, 3/4)
351xx 12 pt sockets (7/16, 1/2, 9/16, 19/32, 21/32, 7/8, 15/16, 1", 1 1/16, 1 1/8
353xx 12 pt deep (11/16, 15/16, 1", 1 1/8)

This is a really cool set but a lot of it needs a good cleaning, as they've been sitting for some time. The ratchet seems to be locked up, but has gotten more loose as I've been soaking it in penetrating oil since yesterday. I was also wondering what the best way to take this thing apart will be so I can try to get it working again. Any suggestions on this would be helpful as well.

Thanks

***Update***
It was suggested that maybe the ratchet was modified/machined down to 7/16" from the original 1/2". I was wondering if anyone has run across any info about this or any sort of retrofit of guts to make the 9810 into a 7/16".

Thanks again!

 

[Private Lugnutz]

***Update***
It was suggested that maybe the ratchet was modified/machined down to 7/16" from the original 1/2".

That was me, guys. But I suggested he find out here if there was a conversion plug I don't know about. Since it's pinned, it doesn't seem practicable except from the factory. But anything is possible I suppose. My money is on the drive plug being machined on every side but the one with the detent ball.

The reverser (not sure proper term :-D) doesn't seem to be functioning either.

I took the liberty of moving this one here rather than having two disjointed conversations...

It can be a bit tricky until you get the hang of it. When you push the button on the back of the ratchet head, you have to turn it in the same direction until you feel it click. Then it will go the other way.

 

[RustyShackleford]

So after a close look, the ratchet has been machined on three sides. Anyway, it's still pretty interesting stuff. I'll keep working with the ratchet to see if I can get it freed up and get all the sockets cleaned up. Thanks for the help!

 

[Private Lugnutz]

So after a close look, the ratchet has been machined on three sides. Anyway, it's still pretty interesting stuff. I'll keep working with the ratchet to see if I can get it freed up and get all the sockets cleaned up. Thanks for the help!

As I said in your first thread, I have never seen an example of that before with Blackhawk 1/2- and 7/16-inch drive ("Nuggets" was their branding name), but my intuition was good. In this hobby, sometimes the anomalies and one-offs and user mods are just as interesting (and sometimes, just as coveted) as the factory tools. I think it's neat that you have a 9810 to turn those Nuggets with! It's unique, and it will always make for a good story whenever the set comes up in conversation.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Thanks again Lugz for your insight and knowledge. I have zero knowledge with these old Blackhawks and had never heard of 7/16 drive prior. I'm really looking forward to getting everything cleaned up and get that ratchet working again.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

They envisioned 7/16-inch drive as a way for guys to save money, on the rationale that they wouldn't need a set of 1/2- and 3/8-inch drive tools, with 7/16-inch drive as a 'tweener option. It was introduced in 1937, scuttled during the war (as redundant), and resumed in 1946, produced through at least early 50's. Interesting concept. VERY popular with collectors. Sets came in a few different sized standard boxes, but the largest and most popular set with collectors came in a torpedo-shaped box, also sometimes called a bomb box. If you search this thread and/or the WWW on some combination of 'Blackhawk' '7/16' 'Nuggets' 'Torpedo' and 'Bomb', you will find them.

Here is a catalog excerpt from 1939 with a cut-away view of a freewheeler so you can see what you're dealing with. No gears, but those rollers can get gummed up I suspect. I don't have a 9810, but I have a 39977 and a 49997, and both of them have a marking on the shank of the ratchet encouraging frequent oiling. There are no oil ports, but if you keep soaking it in oil and working the drive stud, you may free it up. Good luck.

 

[RustyShackleford]

It freed up quite a bit overnight. I was able to make a few turns with it, but its still catching a lot. It will just be an effort in patience to get it fully free. I'm hopeful I don't have to tear into it, but the next few days will tell me.

I saw a bunch of the pics/etc regarding the torpedo boxes and the bullet handle ratchets. Such a cool design.

I know I have a bunch of older tools in my garage, this little project has sparked an interest in me to at least get them all found and out of the tubs with all the Indian/Chinese junk I've picked up over the years.

I may just need to find myself a nice old vintage tool box to store them!

 

[RustyShackleford]

Hey guys...

I’m back to bother you all...

So I got my custom machined 9810 more or less freed up, but the directional control wasn’t working. So, being a *******, I tore it down. After I pulled all the pins out, the guts exploded all over my bench and floor. I’m relatively certain that I recovered all the pieces. I was wondering if anyone’s got an exploded view of the ratchet mechanism so that I can be sure to get it all back together correctly now that I’ve got it all cleaned up.

In case anyone’s interested, here’s a pic of the nuggets all cleaned up. They’re still in their work clothes, but cleaned up pretty nice.

I found an Indestro 9/16, Plomb 3/4, and an unmarked 25/32 in the bucket as well. Bonus!

Thanks and good day!

 

[Oldtuleguy]

Patent 2003155, has pics of mechanism

https://patents.google.com/patent/US2003155A/en

 

[thehorse13]

Hey guys...

I’m back to bother you all...

So I got my custom machined 9810 more or less freed up, but the directional control wasn’t working. So, being a *******, I tore it down. After I pulled all the pins out, the guts exploded all over my bench and floor. I’m relatively certain that I recovered all the pieces. I was wondering if anyone’s got an exploded view of the ratchet mechanism so that I can be sure to get it all back together correctly now that I’ve got it all cleaned up.

In case anyone’s interested, here’s a pic of the nuggets all cleaned up. They’re still in their work clothes, but cleaned up pretty nice.

I found an Indestro 9/16, Plomb 3/4, and an unmarked 25/32 in the bucket as well. Bonus!

Thanks and good day!

It looks like my advice is arriving too late for you. When I read that you intended to tear this ratchet down, I was going to warn you to do it inside of a gallon plastic bag. This would have kept all the parts from the explosion all in the bag.

Your particular ratchet is a pain to break down and reassemble. You've already learned this though. You have earned your first vintage tool stripe.

 

[y'sguy]

Patent 2003155, has pics of mechanism

https://patents.google.com/patent/US2003155A/en

AHH…drawn by hand. very satisfying. Cad systems certainly have changed the world, but this is still the best.

 

[Shelbylex]

In post 1839 I posted my Red Rover

Can somebody educate me how to determine the proper age of sockets and wrenches I will need to find to eventually fill it?

Please post couple of sockets and wrenches which you know for sure are from 1937-39 period.

From my understanding they will have a single line around and Lock On feature

As an interesting finding -this is a picture of a box from Caterpillar museum. Sorry, forgot from which site,

 

[Oldtuleguy]

That box is nice!

 

[RustyShackleford]

If ya ain't learnin', ya ain't doin!

 

[RustyShackleford]

Thanks OldTuleGuy and thehorse!

 

[joshotto94]

Did you have a chance to check out your jacks? Please let me know either way. Thank you Josh

 

[joshotto94]

I have (5) S4 jacks so I'll check my numbers.

Did you have a chance to check out your jacks? Please let me know either way. Thank you Josh

 

[twertsy]

My new Blackhawk area. I have more but ran out of room for now....

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I've been in that room upstairs and hearing about your 'Blackhawk shrine' plans ever since! Well done, Todd. And there was zero doubt in my mind on what was going to be featured at the top and center.

 

[twertsy]

I've been in that room upstairs and hearing about your 'Blackhawk shrine' plans ever since! Well done, Todd. And there was zero doubt in my mind on what was going to be featured at the top and center.

Thanks Lugz………….I couldn't justify luggin' all those jacks up there!!

 

[Shelbylex]

Nice collection, Twertsy! Please make a close up picture of the roller if you have time.

I recently created a readable word file for all possible sets for the Red Rover. The scanned catalog resolution available online was suboptimal for some size identification. I can not attach it as GJ site keeps telling me that it is too big. If anybody needs them, send me the message with the email and I will try to email it after work.

 

[twertsy]

Nice collection, Twertsy! Please make a close up picture of the roller if you have time.

I recently created a readable word file for all possible sets for the Red Rover. The scanned catalog resolution available online was suboptimal for some size identification. I can not attach it as GJ site keeps telling me that it is too big. If anybody needs them, send me the message with the email and I will try to email it after work.

My roller was not badged. However, I did find it in one of the '30s catalogs. Problem is, it's also in a 30's Bonney catalog. It's just a cabinet, no drawers at all.

 

[Oldtuleguy]

My new Blackhawk area. I have more but ran out of room for now....

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

I respect your disorder!

 

[Shelbylex]

My roller was not badged. However, I did find it in one of the '30s catalogs. Problem is, it's also in a 30's Bonney catalog. It's just a cabinet, no drawers at all.

I wonder if the remnants of original paint somewhere under the bottom or the draws might put you in the right direction.

 

[twertsy]

I respect your disorder!

Yes, some of us have a problem...……….but I love Blackhawk...

 

[r_olson_06]

Yes, some of us have a problem...……….but I love Blackhawk...

Problem, what problem. Seems like you have it figured out from my prospective. We are talking about finding Blackhawk right?
Looking good sir.

Looking for a Plomb 3061 Pebble Open End.

 

[CRTDI]

My new Blackhawk area. I have more but ran out of room for now....

Nicely done..

 

[don long]

Wow
That's a very nice set up. The more I see of the blackhawk hand tools and chests the more I wish I'd stayed in touch with them back in the early 90's
I was friends with the CEO Of Blackhawk.

THese work stations are blackhawk that he gave to me back then!

006 by don long, on Flickr

Just the bench's not the Snap on boxes on the walls.
It would have been nice to have blackhawk tools there.

 

[3baygarage]

Nice to see your display, thanks for sharing.

That salesman set, what a stellar find. Lots of cool stuff there.

 

[Oldtuleguy]

Cool stuff donlong

 

[twertsy]

Wow
That's a very nice set up. The more I see of the blackhawk hand tools and chests the more I wish I'd stayed in touch with them back in the early 90's
I was friends with the CEO Of Blackhawk.

THese work stations are blackhawk that he gave to me back then!

006 by don long, on Flickr

Just the bench's not the Snap on boxes on the walls.
It would have been nice to have blackhawk tools there.

That wall is beautiful Don. When I "retire"...........

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

 

[LesserSon]

My roller was not badged. However, I did find it in one of the '30s catalogs. Problem is, it's also in a 30's Bonney catalog. It's just a cabinet, no drawers at all.

Are you guys talking about this roller? It’s probably original gray, right? So if it’s not badged and you matched it in both cats, it can be whatever you want it to be.
I suppose you might find it in other brand catalogs, too.

 

[erimille]

Cross posting from another thread i started before finding this one ... curious if anyone might have a knob for a Blackhawk S4 jack?



thanks in advance! --e

 

[twertsy]

Are you guys talking about this roller? It’s probably original gray, right? So if it’s not badged and you matched it in both cats, it can be whatever you want it to be.
I suppose you might find it in other brand catalogs, too.

Yup...………...I'm torn between Bonney and Blackhawk....

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Eenie meenie minie moe.