Tools from the old world

[Dave455]

This one pictured is in the plastic case. My other “dueling set” was in the steel case. The plastic red case set I bought first if I recall correctly, even though the red steel cases preceded the red plastic cases in Facom production.

I love the Nano sets!

Don’t fret about the Submariner! I don’t own a Rolex and not my style!!! Ever!

Far better off with an Omega, and if it is a dive watch, you should have a 50 Fathoms!

Wearing an English dive watch today from Elliot Brown. They supply to UK MOD and are top!!! Swiss movement as well and beautiful build- and English!!!

Yes, I remember those plastic cases.

The important thing, is not to spend so much time kicking yourself about the deals you missed back then, that you miss the good deals now.

I bought this set a just over a year ago. I didn’t like the box, but the set includes a palm control ratchet, and the whole thing cost the equivalent of $53.

I don’t mind the boxes now, they provide good protection.


Omega? Nah! Rolex all the way…

 

[CGarage]

Yes, I remember those plastic cases.

The important thing, is not to spend so much time kicking yourself about the deals you missed back then, that you miss the good deals now.

I bought this set a just over a year ago. I didn’t like the box, but the set includes a palm control ratchet, and the whole thing cost the equivalent of $53.

I don’t mind the boxes now, they provide good protection.


Omega? Nah! Rolex all the way…

The newer plastic cases that are black are a lot more stout than the red plastic cases, so I am happy with them.

Omega all the way! Right choice, too. You should feel quite chuffed with that on your wrist!!!

 

[Monte]

Monte:

The Stubai hammer is indeed German made, because of the handle. Hence, why it isn’t stamped or marked “Austria”. Confirmed now by Stubai office. I have another “Swiss” hammer that has a Swiss crest on the handle but that I know was German produced because the Swiss don’t forge hammer heads (none that I am aware of)….not like PB Swiss hammers.

There is a Stubai tools importer in the US:

Sheet Metal & Slate Roofing Tools & Supplies | Stortz Tools

Specializing in sheet metal and slate roofing tools and supplies. Quality seaming, cutting, soldering, & bending tools. Fast Shipping!

www.stortz.com

Thanks for the info. Didn´t know that !

@Monte
Do you know who manufacturers the German made Bondhus screwdrivers?

see your own post

For Monte:

Mauser digital calipers from Germany. Yes, they are slick.

sweet






Fischer blow out pump for cleaning drill holes

 

[Dave455]

The newer plastic cases that are black are a lot more stout than the red plastic cases, so I am happy with them.

Omega all the way! Right choice, too. You should feel quite chuffed with that on your wrist!!!

I do!

I like the ”sword” hands much more than than the later skeleton hands, which are much less legible in my experience. When I bought that, you could choose either!

Sadly I never bought one of the original Planet Oceans. George Daniels, the watchmaker who invented the coaxial movement, told me on two occasions to go and buy one, but I never did! Again, I don’t like the new ones so much.

 

[CGarage]

I do!

I like the ”sword” hands much more than than the later skeleton hands, which are much less legible in my experience. When I bought that, you could choose either!

Sadly I never bought one of the original Planet Oceans. George Daniels, the watchmaker who invented the coaxial movement, told me on two occasions to go and buy one, but I never did! Again, I don’t like the new ones so much.

And that is Doctor George Daniels, to you.

I had to support Elliot Brown because I support English watchmaking in the tradition of Dr Daniels and his protégé, Roger. So happy to see a new English watchmaker turn up, in the south, and not in the Isle of Man!

The coaxial escapement is fantastic. Despite Omega having issues with it due to their fastidious production, relative to George in his workshop.

 

[Dave455]

And that is Doctor George Daniels, to you.

I had to support Elliot Brown because I support English watchmaking in the tradition of Dr Daniels and his protégé, Roger. So happy to see a new English watchmaker turn up, in the south, and not in the Isle of Man!

The coaxial escapement is fantastic. Despite Omega having issues with it due to their fastidious production, relative to George in his workshop.

I know of Elliott Brown, but don’t know much about them. I’ll have to look ‘em up!

George Daniels and I both used to use the same coachworks. He for having bodywork defects rectified on one of his many classics, and me for having my Saab 900S patched up!

He was an enthusiast of all things mechanical, and would chat to anyone with a shared interest.

When he sold the coaxial escapement to Omega (he wanted the design manufactured by a company big enough to offer it in volume, not remain the preserve of a maker such as Patek) he was convinced they didn’t really understand it!

It all worked out rather well though!

 

[HannibalLecter]

I can recommend also BMI Vario, only problem is they are not very sturdy unlike for example Hoffmann 46 2300/5 (Tajima). But if you need precision, this is it

Yes it was between this and the sola. But the bmi is twice the price

 

[HannibalLecter]

Yes, I remember those plastic cases.

The important thing, is not to spend so much time kicking yourself about the deals you missed back then, that you miss the good deals now.

I bought this set a just over a year ago. I didn’t like the box, but the set includes a palm control ratchet, and the whole thing cost the equivalent of $53.

I don’t mind the boxes now, they provide good protection.


Omega? Nah! Rolex all the way…

That omega is the best reference seamaster in my opinion. The skeleton hands are too 90's , almost cringe in a dive watch. Also the watch is thin, not like the heritage 300m co axial

 

[nutsandbolts]

I do!

I like the ”sword” hands much more than than the later skeleton hands, which are much less legible in my experience. When I bought that, you could choose either!

Sadly I never bought one of the original Planet Oceans. George Daniels, the watchmaker who invented the coaxial movement, told me on two occasions to go and buy one, but I never did! Again, I don’t like the new ones so much.

I was lucky enough to get the original aqua terra seamaster with the co-axial movement when they were first out. I love it, never missed beat.

 

[Monte]

Garland garden tray

 

[Qualitytools]

Hah that is definitely incorrect. Funnily enough a Rolex is also on my list, along with a e30 m3 and a 110 v8, when both were affordable.

Reading thru and saw you mention the e30 M3. I owned 2 at one time an 88 and a 90 and reluctantly I had to sell one of them after my son was born and we needed the money. 14 year later the one I sold, sold at auction for 5 times more than when I sold it. I still own one the 90 and still regretting selling the other one I had.

 

[Jack_K]

Stahlwille 7/16 and 3/8 flare nut spanner.

 

[F-22]

I think these may be the only ones which put the "flat" of the nut on the bottom instead of the corner.

It engages with 4 corners of the nut, while all the rest where the edge points towards the wrench body would engage on 5 corners. However those create a "wedge" into the material right in the middle.

I'd enjoy seeing a comparison, e.g. on torque test channel. I'd assume more engagement is better especially if the flare nut is a bit worn. However the wedge may make them weaker so those spread a bit more easily.

 

[Outahere]

Knipex flush cutting Super Knips for electronics applications. Bought them at Amazon for $29. As expected from Knipex, the jaws are perfectly aligned, and the pivot joint is perfect (neither too tight or too loose).

 

[Monte]

Rakso steel wool

 

[Dave455]

Rakso steel wool

I hope the British market stall traders never find that, they will be selling it as “Genuine Stahlwolle” with a heavy implication it’s made in Wuppertal…

 

[Chrome Vanadium Cody]

Was pumped to find this 15mm Facom angled socket wrench at a local store today. I bought a set (which skipped this size and a few others) a while back but it sat in the box for months because I don’t use metric much. Have finally been working on a big metric project lately so I’ve tried them out and decided I really like them. So far they haven't let me do anything I couldn’t do with another tool but I like how versatile they are. Pass through socket + short socket on extension (with a well integrated way of adding a cheater) is just a well thought out combination to have on one tool. I find I can use it on more same-size bolts in varied locations without putting it down and changing tools than I can with a combo wrench or ratchet.




I decided to shop around for the couple other sizes I’m missing. Does anyone have other brands they especially like for these? I know Sam also makes nice ones but they are hard to get in the US.

 

[F-22]

Heard good things about the Toptul ones. Possibly even made in the same factory as Facom (Rotar group).

I assume Hazet, Stahlwille and Beta sell nice ones. Probably also Bahco. I have some made by unior and am not too impressed by those (rough manufacturing).

Found some cool older Stahlwille wrenches on ebay that were made in France. Interesting smooth taper to the curved end:



But I think today, SAM is the most interesting for being made in France.

 

[dukefx]

Knipex flush cutting Super Knips for electronics applications. Bought them at Amazon for $29. As expected from Knipex, the jaws are perfectly aligned, and the pivot joint is perfect (neither too tight or too loose).

Next time (soon once you start using it) have a look at Piergiacomi or.... rebranded as Hakko or something like that in the US. Last time I bought one it was about 5 bucks and is totally on par with a Knipex.

Heard good things about the Toptul ones. Possibly even made in the same factory as Facom (Rotar group).

I assume Hazet, Stahlwille and Beta sell nice ones. Probably also Bahco. I have some made by unior and am not too impressed by those (rough manufacturing).

Beta isn't Beta anymore. Everything that is decent costs an arm and a leg, everything else is mostly terrible. Just a few days ago some guy bought a Beta wire stripper, the pistol grip type, to replace his China garbage. The Beta was so bad that he went back to his China garbage. Unfortunately it isn't the 90s anymore.

 

[F-22]

Beta isn't Beta anymore. Everything that is decent costs an arm and a leg, everything else is mostly terrible. Just a few days ago some guy bought a Beta wire stripper, the pistol grip type, to replace his China garbage. The Beta was so bad that he went back to his China garbage. Unfortunately it isn't the 90s anymore.

Yes I agree, I have some Beta circlip pliers that are very mediocre.

But these wrenches do look neat.

 

[Chrome Vanadium Cody]

Heard good things about the Toptul ones. Possibly even made in the same factory as Facom (Rotar group).

I assume Hazet, Stahlwille and Beta sell nice ones. Probably also Bahco. I have some made by unior and am not too impressed by those (rough manufacturing).

Found some cool older Stahlwille wrenches on ebay that were made in France. Interesting smooth taper to the curved end:



But I think today, SAM is the most interesting for being made in France.

Are the Uniors functionally bad or just cosmetically rough? I have a soft spot for no frills industrial tools so that might be right up my alley.

The Stahlwilles look nice, I checked and they are discontinued but I’ll keep an eye out for used ones. Same with Hazet.

I actually ordered one of these from Beta to bump a Zoro order over the free shipping threshold. It is fine but made in China which isn’t ideal.

Sam, I haven’t been able to find any distributors that ship to the US. I did get one of these from a Dutch surplus website and it’s really nice but they only had one size. Definitely interested in getting more if there’s a way.

 

[KnurledNut]

New tool arrival but I figured it would feel more at home in this thread.
Love the whole black widow look.
Dual component handle: black is hard, red is soft.
Feels like a Wera but square and less bumpy. Quite comfortable. Good balance.
Magnetic retention is very strong.
Im a sucker for unique bit holders.

 

[nutsandbolts]

Are the Uniors functionally bad or just cosmetically rough? I have a soft spot for no frills industrial tools so that might be right up my alley.

The Stahlwilles look nice, I checked and they are discontinued but I’ll keep an eye out for used ones. Same with Hazet.

I actually ordered one of these from Beta to bump a Zoro order over the free shipping threshold. It is fine but made in China which isn’t ideal.

Sam, I haven’t been able to find any distributors that ship to the US. I did get one of these from a Dutch surplus website and it’s really nice but they only had one size. Definitely interested in getting more if there’s a way.

I've a set from Gedore, very nice and comparable to Stahlwille and Hazet.

GEDORE 1527312 - 25 PK-012​

 

[Chrome Vanadium Cody]

I've a set from Gedore, very nice and comparable to Stahlwille and Hazet.

GEDORE 1527312 - 25 PK-012​

Good to hear! Are these the current era made in India ones? These are the lowest priced name brand ones I've found available in the US so far so they are a top contender.

 

[Qualitytools]

New tool arrival but I figured it would feel more at home in this thread.
Love the whole black widow look.
Dual component handle: black is hard, red is soft.
Feels like a Wera but square and less bumpy. Quite comfortable. Good balance.
Magnetic retention is very strong.
Im a sucker for unique bit holders.

I like that. it says right on it WERA, thanks for sharing.

 

[lardy1]

New tool arrival but I figured it would feel more at home in this thread.
Love the whole black widow look.
Dual component handle: black is hard, red is soft.
Feels like a Wera but square and less bumpy. Quite comfortable. Good balance.
Magnetic retention is very strong.
Im a sucker for unique bit holders.

Where might one find this? I like that handle a lot.

 

[KnurledNut]

Where might one find this? I like that handle a lot.

Mine was a one off find. I would love a set as I find the handles very comfortable. If Wera offered them they would probably do well. Their are no distributors in the US. Amazon.de has them but wont export. Im fairly certain their is someone in EU that would sell and ship these but without searching I cant provide a source.

The euro guys following this thread probably get a kick out of us getting excited over what are cheap and common place for them. Kinda like @Monte recently posting his USA Estwing hammer.

 

[lardy1]

Appreciate that, man. As you can probably tell I like to experience a variety of driver handles. I have a lot of drivers but only a couple of small sets because I like to try different ones. If I don't like it all I'm out is the price of a screwdriver.

 

[nutsandbolts]

Good to hear! Are these the current era made in India ones? These are the lowest priced name brand ones I've found available in the US so far so they are a top contender.

They are the current ones, and I noticed no reference made to Germany or any other country of origin. So that would point to India. Although as I said they are nice and well finished to a high standard.

 

[DAustin]

Good to hear! Are these the current era made in India ones? These are the lowest priced name brand ones I've found available in the US so far so they are a top contender.

I don't think Gedore makes tools in India anymore. The Gedore Red line is made I think somewhere in asia.

"GEDORE, which is based in Remscheid in Germany, is represented in more than 70 countries across the world. Its approximately 2300 members of staff manufacture tools for life at six German sites and production facilities in Brazil, England, Austria and South Africa."

 

[Chrome Vanadium Cody]

They are the current ones, and I noticed no reference made to Germany or any other country of origin. So that would point to India. Although as I said they are nice and well finished to a high standard.

Sweet, thank you! I think I’ll get these ones then.

I don't think Gedore makes tools in India anymore. The Gedore Red line is made I think somewhere in asia.

"GEDORE, which is based in Remscheid in Germany, is represented in more than 70 countries across the world. Its approximately 2300 members of staff manufacture tools for life at six German sites and production facilities in Brazil, England, Austria and South Africa."

Good to know. I was basing this off the listing from KCtool’s website which is one of the most trusted euro tool distributors in the US. But they may have some older items in stock or something

 

[Monte]

I hope the British market stall traders never find that, they will be selling it as “Genuine Stahlwolle” with a heavy implication it’s made in Wuppertal…

maybe it´s made out of stahlwolle er Stahlwille factory seconds wrenches
btw: the british german stahlwolle: www.trollull.com





there are various tools with the Wera Kraftkant handle available from "Format" tools:
If you google Format Schraubendreher e.g. you might find a seller which ships to the US.

 

[KnurledNut]

 

[Outahere]

Made in Switzerland jigsaw blades.

 

[Monte]

Pfeilring tweezers made in Solingen

 

[Zewnten]

Not showing off tools but I have a question. Looking for long AF/ imperial wrenches. Stahlwille only offers the 14 series in metric, is this correct? Hazet offers them in the 600 series, I’ve heard poor things about Gedore, Elora is ridiculously expensive in the US. Any made in Europe brands I’m missing? (I earn a living with my tools and my wrenches see the most use so I need top notch quality)

 

[Pexto]

Not showing off tools but I have a question. Looking for long AF/ imperial wrenches. Stahlwille only offers the 14 series in metric, is this correct? Hazet offers them in the 600 series, I’ve heard poor things about Gedore, Elora is ridiculously expensive in the US. Any made in Europe brands I’m missing? (I earn a living with my tools and my wrenches see the most use so I need top notch quality)

@Dave455 will be along shortly with an authoritative answer. In the meantime, I'd suggest Facom or USAG.

 

[F-22]

Are the Uniors functionally bad or just cosmetically rough?

They're "okay" but it seems they do not have any off-corner engagement. Like very old tools... I think functionally a Facom OGV will surely round off less fasteners. For low cost I think Toptul is probably the best.

Not showing off tools but I have a question. Looking for long AF/ imperial wrenches. Stahlwille only offers the 14 series in metric, is this correct? Hazet offers them in the 600 series, I’ve heard poor things about Gedore, Elora is ridiculously expensive in the US. Any made in Europe brands I’m missing? (I earn a living with my tools and my wrenches see the most use so I need top notch quality)

Best you can get in my opinion is the Facom 440XL for general use, and USAG 285X for anti-slip design with the 6 sided box end.
These are likely the best wrenches on the market today, and they can be found for a great bargain. Both owned by Stanley B&D. They're made from the same blanks, but the Facom has a 12 point box end and milder anti-slip that does not damage fasteners (still works extremely good). The USAG wrenches are the exact same as the MAC RBRT which cost about 3 times as much.

They're made in Asia. I'd still probably put them ahead of European brands.
Gedore is not bad at all. Unior long type is made in central europe and quite good as well, and in the last decade or two they seemed to have branched out a lot to the USA (especially as a high end bicycle tool brand). I don't like their "cle-a-pipe" style wrenches but those are more of an afterthought for the company - the regular wrenches are well made and have off corner engagement nowadays.


Can't go wrong with the Williams Supercombo or Wright Wrightgrip wrenches from the USA either, definitely top notch quality...

 

[DAustin]

Not showing off tools but I have a question. Looking for long AF/ imperial wrenches. Stahlwille only offers the 14 series in metric, is this correct? Hazet offers them in the 600 series, I’ve heard poor things about Gedore, Elora is ridiculously expensive in the US. Any made in Europe brands I’m missing? (I earn a living with my tools and my wrenches see the most use so I need top notch quality)

How much are you looking to spend? A 12 pc. set of Elora SAE long 1/4 to 7/8 is around $207.

 

[Dave455]

Not showing off tools but I have a question. Looking for long AF/ imperial wrenches. Stahlwille only offers the 14 series in metric, is this correct? Hazet offers them in the 600 series, I’ve heard poor things about Gedore, Elora is ridiculously expensive in the US. Any made in Europe brands I’m missing? (I earn a living with my tools and my wrenches see the most use so I need top notch quality)

Correct!

I think the No.14 may have been available in SAE sizes historically, but not for some years.

Hazet are excellent, I’d probably go for those if I could live without the offset.

Gedore are variable. The No. 7 XL is actually one of their better tools. A friend has a set and I have to admit they are not bad.


They are much better than the Gedore No. 1, which I find dog rough, though I admit I don’t like Gedore much.

Elora shouldn’t be ridiculously expensive, they are generally very competitive. They can certainly offer what you want, even Whitworth of you want it! Can you order direct from Europe? I have a few Elora tools and they’re pretty decent.

Apart from that, I’m struggling. Bear in mind that historically, European countries didn’t have the love of the combination wrench that the U.S. did. Especially the long pattern, as a long open end would be considered of limited use.

A further problem is that the market for new Imperial tools is dominated by the aerospace world, which tends not to use long combination wrenches either.

Hence, so many manufacturers tend to offer standard length combination wrenches, long double box end, then extra long double box end, in SAE sizes.