Tools from the old world

[Private Lugnutz]

First time posting on this thread, gents, suggested by the esteemed humber2.

I picked up a partial matching set of DBE wrenches today at the flea market. No OEM markings, and no idea on the manufacturer, but it's clearly European, with "CHROM-VANADIUM" steel composition and 'for "BSW" (British Standard Whitworth) and "BSF" (British Standard Fine) nut and bolt' size markings. I was thinking late 30's or late 40's, or perhaps after the war but before Metrification, but humber2 thinks they're 1950's.

I'd really like to know who made these, and your thoughts on when. The style, heft in the hand feel, workmanship, and finish is excellent in my opinion. I don't normally collect European tools, but I was impressed with these, and, besides that, I sort of have an unwritten rule about never leaving partial sets of anything vintage behind.

 

[Dave455]

Hi Lugz,

I’m thinking those wrenches are German. The pattern is a standard German one, subtly different to British or U.S. wrenches, and ‘chrom’ is the German spelling of Chrome!

As to the maker, well it’s easier to start with who didn’t make them. They’re not, based on the wrenches I’ve seen, Stahlwille, Hazet, Elora or Saltus. That leaves Gedore, which has to be a possibility, or Matador. My money is on the latter!

I’ve seen Matador wrenches of that exact pattern, in Whitworth sizes, and in a very similar (if not identical) finish. They also had, as far as I can recall, exactly the same markings with the sizes, written the same way! The bad news, is that they were also clearly marked ‘Matador’ - I’ve never seen any exactly the same so we’re still guessing!

Edit - Just had a search online and found some very similar - the size marking especially. You might need to search on ‘Matador ring spanner’ to find ‘em!

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Thanks, Dave. Matador is exactly what humber2 came up with, which I should've included in my post, but now I'm glad I forgot. More strength of conclusiveness in the same independent assessment!

I'd like to find the wrench missing in the sequence - 7/16 BSW / 1/2 BSF x 3/8 BSW / 7/16 BSF, I think. That will be the proverbial needle in the haystack in the wild. Lucky enough to find these. I may have to resort to fleaBay.

 

[Blöckw@rt]

 

[outdated]

I can't believe I didn't order a Hazet bottle opener when I got my set of spanners recently!

Does SnapOn and other companies make bottle openers or is it just a German thing? Just about every big German (hand tools at least) brand I can think of has one.

 

[Qualitytools]

I can't believe I didn't order a Hazet bottle opener when I got my set of spanners recently!

Does SnapOn and other companies make bottle openers or is it just a German thing? Just about every big German (hand tools at least) brand I can think of has one.

Snap-on makes them as well as others

 

[Dave455]

I'd like to find the wrench missing in the sequence - 7/16 BSW / 1/2 BSF x 3/8 BSW / 7/16 BSF, I think. That will be the proverbial needle in the haystack in the wild. Lucky enough to find these. I may have to resort to fleaBay.

Yes, maybe a difficult task in the U.S.

I’ll keep an eye out here in the U.K. where used Whitworth abounds! It’s the sort of thing that might turn up at a second hand tool shop, but you probably have to hunt through loads!

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Thanks. On the bright (and functional) side, the opening sizes on the wrench are covered in the adjacent wrenches.

 

[Cynical huckster]

New video from SAM YouTube channel (yes, they have one).

 

[mr.lemons]

Combination pliers. CK 180mm from their Classic range. Disappointingly no coo markings so unsure if they are made in Germany. Orbis 160mm new old stock. The seller said they were made in 'West Germany.' Fit and finish on both is very nice.





Both have a flower shape pivot similar to Knipex. Hard to see in the pic.

 

[mr.lemons]

Halfords 72 tooth flex ratchet spanners. For anyone outside of the UK, Halfords is a car accessory store that sells their own brand of tools. Their tools are of varying quality and there is much discussion over who manufactures them. Probably not what most people would consider top quality tools but they are nice enough for the price.

Compared to Facom they are a little unrefined and heavy.

Torx to tighten the flex head when it wears loose. Facom lacks this feature.

 

[node105]

First time posting on this thread, gents, suggested by the esteemed humber2.

I picked up a partial matching set of DBE wrenches today at the flea market. No OEM markings, and no idea on the manufacturer, but it's clearly European, with "CHROM-VANADIUM" steel composition and 'for "BSW" (British Standard Whitworth) and "BSF" (British Standard Fine) nut and bolt' size markings. I was thinking late 30's or late 40's, or perhaps after the war but before Metrification, but humber2 thinks they're 1950's.

I'd really like to know who made these, and your thoughts on when. The style, heft in the hand feel, workmanship, and finish is excellent in my opinion. I don't normally collect European tools, but I was impressed with these, and, besides that, I sort of have an unwritten rule about never leaving partial sets of anything vintage behind.

Very nice PL, I particularly like the very clear size markings. The finish has held up remarkably well.

 

[Ganymedes]

Hi guys! I think I'm in need of your expertise. Was visiting my grandfather earlier today, and we started talking about tools, not so strange since he after all spent his whole life working in the tools selling business.
After talking some about power tools, Walter and Hazet he started talking about an Italian tool manufacturer situated in the northern parts of Italy. I can't seem to recall the name of them, but I know it's not Beta or USAG. He said they made some nice high quality tools, but wasn't the biggest manufacturer, since they "where quite slow" in manufacturing.

So I'm wondering if anyone knows whom the manufacturer might be, even if they no more are in business, my curiosity will probably not last until I can talk to him again.

Pastorino? Osca? Bossini-Ingo? Alessandro Ciceri & Figli? Fumasi? FAR? Maybe

 

[OMMP]

Today's flea market catch...
Open end wrench 25-28 Stahlwille... 1 euro!

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Very nice PL, I particularly like the very clear size markings. The finish has held up remarkably well.

Thanks. 'Zackly some of my thoughts when I bought them.

 

[Alava]

Hello,

I'm considering about buying one pocket knife, like the Victorinox swiss ones... can someone give me brands or companies? here in Spain they are plenty of them but I dont know in the rest of Europe... Monte? Solingen brands?

Thanks to all

 

[OMMP]

Photos of Stahlwille's wrench...

 

[mr.lemons]

Hello,

I'm considering about buying one pocket knife, like the Victorinox swiss ones... can someone give me brands or companies? here in Spain they are plenty of them but I dont know in the rest of Europe... Monte? Solingen brands?

Thanks to all

Heinne Haynes is a good place to look. Not always the best price but good range. Not much rivals Victorinox for non threatening knives. Svord, Opinel, Fallkniven.

https://www.heinnie.com/

 

[Kasal]

Hello,

I'm considering about buying one pocket knife, like the Victorinox swiss ones... can someone give me brands or companies? here in Spain they are plenty of them but I dont know in the rest of Europe... Monte? Solingen brands?

Thanks to all

I think Victorinox did not disappoint you, I have one years ago and it is a good companion, being able to open it and close it with one hand is a good system.

 

[Dave455]

Hello,

I'm considering about buying one pocket knife, like the Victorinox swiss ones... can someone give me brands or companies? here in Spain they are plenty of them but I dont know in the rest of Europe... Monte? Solingen brands?

Thanks to all

You can’t really go wrong with Victorinox. The blades are superbly ground, the overall quality is high, and the prices are reasonable. Worth hunting down the ‘alox’ models with metal scales though.

Solingen turn out some fine knives. For years the biggest, and perhaps best, maker was Puma. Sadly however, their quality has declined over the years and I wouldn’t touch any of their products now. Boker make some nice stuff, some of their blades are beautifully ground, but you have to be careful to get German made Boker, not Boker ‘plus’.

I prefer the slightly smaller makers. My favourite being Hubertus, who produce a huge range of top quality knives. For smaller knives, I’d probably vote for Hartkopf, who excel at certain styles. There are many other makers, but these two are my favourites.

You will find decent quality knives from other countries too. Italy and the U.K. come to mind, but the best stuff is hard to find online. Same applies to Spain. If I lived there I’d probably acquire some nice pieces from Toledo that you would struggle to find online!

 

[Monte]

Is this really German made? How is the quality?

i think they forge in India...

I don't know. Maybe Renault Samsung?

oh no...when you think it can´t get worse...
PS: www.Ford-Tools.com

One more try at asking if anyone knows where Tooxem tools are made??? Thanks!

They look like the typical imported tools from China or Taiwan.

Hello,

I'm considering about buying one pocket knife, like the Victorinox swiss ones... can someone give me brands or companies? here in Spain they are plenty of them but I dont know in the rest of Europe... Monte? Solingen brands?

Thanks to all

Victorinox knives are pretty good.I think it will be difficult to find a better multifunction knife for the price. I´m not sure if there are many german counterparts, i found this one though: http://www.otter-messer.de/shop/Mercator-Knife/Mercator-Multi-Klein-10-402rg--571.html
but it´s expensive and only has a few functions. However if you only look for a simple knife with a blade there are several german companies like Otter, Hartkopf, Herbertz, Böker, Schlieper, Klaas or Richartz.
(more multifunction knives: http://www.richartz.com/de/produkte/kategorie-1/)
PS: I own 2 Victorinox Alox models and they are amazing.

 

[Cynical huckster]

oh no...when you think it can´t get worse...
PS: www.Ford-Tools.com

What have I done to you? *rips out the eyeballs and screams*

Well, I've already seen their site, as well as their range. I'm definitely sure that I will not send them any inquiries

But I met with USAG representative on this Wednesday. I hope she can give me an extra discount If so, I will please you with USAG pics from time to time.

 

[shanny19]

They look like the typical imported tools from China or Taiwan.

That's what I've decided. The parent company appears to be an Ironside tool with HQ in Belgium. The hammers I bought, several pains were taken to make them LOOK like Gedore. Actually quality is sub-Harbor Freight. Now the flip side is that several of the Amazon ads, listed under Ironside, say something to the effect "Tooxem tools are designed to be good enough" which is refresingly honest.

 

[Ruxpin]

After looking for somewhere to purchase this set (and failing) I decided to query directly with PB Swiss and received the following answer from them:

This 140 Year Anniversary version of Hose Plucker is a special edition for our partner in Japan.



If you are interested you can contact them directly:



The Kiichi Tools Co. Ltd.

8-14, 3-chome, Itachibori
Nishi - ku
550-0012 Osaka
Japan



Contactdetails

+81 6 65 32 00 31
+81 6 65 32 86 16
[email protected]
http://www.kiichi.co.jp

 

[DEEBO]

After looking for somewhere to purchase this set (and failing) I decided to query directly with PB Swiss and received the following answer from them:

If you can live without the anniversary writing, I got this set here; really good!

https://www.pbswisstools.co.uk/catalog/PB_Swiss_Tools/PB_7674.CN.html#PB_7674.CN


Sent from my iPhone using The Garage Journal mobile app

 

[Lofthouse]

Carolus Strap Wrench
Made in Austria

 

[Tomasz_W-wa]

Hazet 163-220/13 in box SmartCase L - Hazet 165-L










I have bought a HAZET 163-119-L stamping before and the keys will be transferred to it.
A few are still missing, but they will be gradually bought.

 

[hautpot]

After looking for somewhere to purchase this set (and failing) I decided to query directly with PB Swiss and received the following answer from them:

Yup PB Swiss offers many exclusive items only in Japan or at the Factory Gear in Taiwan and Thailand. I was able to get a hold of some exclusive red non rebound hammers from Factory Gear.

 

[outdated]

Had an epiphany with my torque wrench collection. Years ago when I only had 1/2" drive sockets I bought a nice 1/2" drive 20-100Nm Norbar wrench primarily for motorcycle work. A couple of years back I also got a 2-20Nm Norbar 1/4" drive for the small stuff, this came in very handy when rebuilding a BMW M54 engine and doing all the Vanos stuff etc. But I felt I'd like a 3/8" drive "tweener" so I wasn't operating at the extreme of each wrench and for those size fasteners 3/8" is nicer tro use now I have those sizes. So I was considering one of the new Taiwanese Weras on special recently, maybe Hazet, or another Norbar...

This was partly because since joining GJ I have been buying tools like a crackhead!

Anyhow, I had totally forgotten a Gedore wrench my missus bought in Austria when we had a small toolkit there. I remember it was 1/2" drive but when I pulled it out I was surprised to see it was a 7-54Nm which was pretty much the range I wanted. Being Gedore I figured it's pretty good quality so I wondered about trying to get a rebuild kit to convert it to 3/8 drive, which meanwhile I have sockets in and is my preferred size for this range. Then I realised <facepalm> that it was a push through type and some googling later I found I could get a 1/2 - 3/8 stepdown "mushroom" for it. Win!

The 3 wrenches:
View media item 83499
Some googling and I found the stepdown 'mushroom' and an ebay vendor in the UK with a reasonable price incl shipping.
View media item 83500
Oddly, the stepdown mushroom is the same length as the straight 1/2" drive one, which means it's too long. The first detent is further down the shaft so it either protrudes like this:
View media item 83501
.... or if you seat the detent in the wrench properly the upper mushrom sticks up a little bit like this (weird):
View media item 83502
Here it is with the 1/2" mushroomand a 1/2-3/8" adaptor, plus a 13mm socket:
View media item 83504
And now with the stepdown mushroom and same socket:
View media item 83503
Only downside is the head is very large for a 3/8" drive wrench, but the upside of this push-through type is you can torque left hand threads if you need to do that (would have been perfect for the oil pump on the M54 BM motor).

 

[JBH]

Koken flex head bit ratchet.

It just arrived today so I've not really used it. First impression is that it's practically as smooth as a Wiha Topra clutch-ratchet and has as good as no slop. It is quite large for a bit ratchet. Compare to Wera and Felo.

And, rather less shiny, soft-touch black tempered drinking glasses by the French company Duralex.

I discovered these glasses at a London cocktail bar, the Alchemist. I'd never seen a soft-touch finish on glass before. I recognized them immediately because we use the taller, clear version daily. I think Duralex originally designed this style for French schools.

I searched for them for a little while, and finally found them and ordered them from the MOMA store. They've become our go-to espresso glasses at home (tempered glass, remember), replacing a set of the old detachable plastic-handle Bodum beaker-style glasses.

 

[Monte]

Well, I've already seen their site, as well as their range. I'm definitely sure that I will not send them any inquiries

But I met with USAG representative on this Wednesday. I hope she can give me an extra discount If so, I will please you with USAG pics from time to time.

Anyhow, I had totally forgotten a Gedore wrench my missus bought in Austria when we had a small toolkit there.

I think your Gedore is a Norbar with Gedore head....

 

[Qualitytools]

Has anyone seen or had a chance to compare side by side the socket wrenches or "clés à pipes" as they call them made by Facom vs. SAM? Supposedly both made in France but I know Stanley purchased Facom so it may no longer be the case. Any input from our friends overseas or here in the sates would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[JBH]

Amazon.de order arrived today.

Organization stuff: two inserts/lid sets for L-BOXX 102.

Gedore-cobranded L-BOXX 136 with tool card.

The pouch configuration is slightly different from the one sold separately. This one must be old stock, because it has the old Gedore logo.

Gedore 3093 GU-3 3/8" drive flex-head ratchet. I bought my first metric 3/8" drive sockets recently (the Proto "hot deal" set), and don't like the Proto ratchet or the 3/8" drive flex-head Toptul I bought after ordering the Proto set. As a nice bonus, this Gedore ratchet is currently super cheap on amazon.de.

I was a little surprised that it's exactly the same dimensions as the 1/2" drive model 1993 GU-3. I just assumed it would be a little more compact. Maybe that's why there's no 1/4" drive model in this series. It's not quite as perfect feeling as the 1/2" drive one, which works like a Koken with finer steps. Comparatively it's just as precise but a little stiffer. But it's also 7 years newer. I'll revisit in a year or two.

Felo precision screwdriver set (PZ/PH/SL), and "R-go" bit ratchet set for the portable toolbox.

Lastly, I'd been wanting to try the Wiha Picofinish-handle precision screwdrivers. Amazon had the PZ1 as an add-on, and that's a commonly-used size for me.

 

[outdated]

I think your Gedore is a Norbar with Gedore head....

That is highly likely, and is supported by the fact there is no COO making at all on the wrench or the box.
It was bought new at Schachermayer which is a really nice toy shop!

 

[losvre]

From a neighbour. Do you think they still make these?

Sent from my SM-A510F using Tapatalk

 

[mr.lemons]

Bought these to use on small circlips. Find the design with inserted tips makes them a bit fat so it's hard to see what I'm doing.

Tried these and find them much more functional. Not sprung and feel less premium but the thinner jaws don't obscure viewing the tips as much. Thinner over all give them a more nimble feel. Found cheap on ebay. Not sure if they still come in a cardboard box. May be used or NOS.

Tip comparison.

Facom. Approaching from the only angle available it's hard to see where the tips are going.

Gedore from a similar angle.

Gedore's thinner jaws allow working from a much wider angle so the tips can be seen clearly.

Not tried Knipex yet. Wonder if the 'precision' design on their premium circlip pliers makes them inherently less precise to use. I rarely use circlip pliers so not in any way an expert.

Gedore are made in Austria. Not sure about Facom.

 

[plumber84]

Dowidat No.73-12” adjustable wrench, £11 off flea-bay, looks used once with minor storage rust. My new favourite adjustable, super lightweight tightest tolerances I’ve seen on an adjustable, almost identical to my Gedore 62p adjustable wrench

 

[Bogdan M.]

 

[dutchgray]

mr.lemons
Circlip pliers are a tool which you can really never have too many options, I don't use them that much but I reckon I must have 20 pairs of them, with a fair bit of duplication, one because they do vary quite a bit for a given size and two because they are quite easy to break and you don't want to have to go buy another to finish.
The Gedore ones are nice though, got a couple of those and examples from Wiha, Knipex, Stahlwille, Hazet, Facom.
All the good makes are fine and the really cheap ones are best avoided.

 

[mr.lemons]

More cheap Chinese stuff. Not really in keeping with this thread but they are 'old world' and are what's readily available in the UK. I have to carry my sockets out to the street to work on my car so use a tool bag. Been using metal socket rails for a long time and hate them. Sockets fall off and the sharp edges get caught on nitrile gloves. Didn't want to spend more on rails than sockets so bought the cheapest on ebay.

Not generally a video maker but thought it was a better way to show the rails. Not sure if they will last and I think they will break if dropped but first impressions are quite good.