Why buy 12-point sockets?
- Thread starter Achilleus
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I can fix anything
Well-known member
why does everyone think a 12 point socket is evil and will round off a fastener by just getting close to it?
yet, when they pick up a combination wrench it is most likely a 12 point and think nothing of using to break loose fasteners.
davesnothere
Well-known member
Some bolts have 12 point heads. Like on ford drive shafts.
muddyjoe15
Well-known member
try taking apart a detriot without a 12 point socket!not-required
Well-known member
why does everyone think a 12 point socket is evil and will round off a fastener by just getting close to it?
yet, when they pick up a combination wrench it is most likely a 12 point and think nothing of using to break loose fasteners.
This.
And this.
muddyjoe15
Well-known member
You should throw them out imeditally i will disspose of them for you. Ill pm you my address!
speed bump
Well-known member
This has been pretty much discussed to death but what the heck.
A couple of reasons I like 12 pt sockets:
1 use them on 12, 6 and 4 pt bolts.
2 its easier to drop them on a crusty bolt than a 6pt
3 as far as rounding off I have never seen a difference above 1/2"
4 tradition
A couple of reasons I like 12 pt sockets:
1 use them on 12, 6 and 4 pt bolts.
2 its easier to drop them on a crusty bolt than a 6pt
3 as far as rounding off I have never seen a difference above 1/2"
4 tradition
GoBlue
Well-known member
Well a 12 point will most definitely round a head faster than a 6. Just today i rounded a head with my snap on 12 point flank drive wrench only to easily break the fastener loose with my craftsman 6 point. The biggest reason in sockets is that some fasteners require a 12 point. Ford rear ends are a great example as are Ford drive shaft bolts for that matter. In a wrench a 12 point should be the go to as it allows for a much shorter swing between engagements. As far as sockets go...everything should be a 6 to start. The need for 12s is few and far between and yes i do wrench for a living. Ultimately you will need both 12 and 6 in wrenches and sockets so you might as well start gathering them now however. Dont believe me? Just wait...you will see.
muddyjoe15
Well-known member
Well, I'm new here so I'm just gonna get all my dumb questions out of the way and then register again as a new improved self. I just gotta get them out though, been inside too long
therealwormey
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i dont much like 12pt sockets but dont mind wrenches so much,no reason other than its just me.i dont really need to justify myself,who cares anyhow.some like fords and some like chevys,its just personal preference but in some cases i must use them,harley evo---> headbolts and 2000--->H-D brake calipers,,,,,,,,theres more but enuff time on the subject
therealwormey
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Well, I'm new here so I'm just gonna get all my dumb questions out of the way and then register again as a new improved self. I just gotta get them out though, been inside too long
thats pretty good,i think i'll create me another one just so i can argue with myself
superautobacs
Well-known member
yet, when they pick up a combination wrench it is most likely a 12 point and think nothing of using to break loose fasteners.
So true.
I would opt for a 6pt wrench/socket if the fastener at hand has been rounded/marred from previous owner(s)/mechanic(s) working on them. If not, I don't see why someone should steer away from using a 12pt wrench/socket. They're much easier to engage a fastener especially when you are accessing a blind spot and especially when using an air ratchet.
The other problem with using 12pt sockets are with those deep length sockets. When torque is applied on the end of a handle (ratchet/breaker bar), quite often the socket tilts on an angle. If you're careful, you'll take note of this and you'll reposition the socket; however, if you don't notice this and you keep applying more torque, you're increasing the likelyhood of the socket slipping off the fastener head. The end result could be painful to your fingers/hands and you created a (possibly) slippery slope to full-on roundness of the fastener. Time to switch to a deep 6pt.
[edit]
The reason why 12pt wrenches (non-deep offsets) are not prone to rounding fasteners is because the torque is linear with the bolt head; it's not offset by the length of a socket, ratchet head, and any attachments that may go in between it.
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balane
Well-known member
I try to buy my shallows in six point and my deeps in twelve point. Not sure why, just ended up that way. For me the greatest gain of 12 points has already been mentioned, it's easier to get one on a dirty fastener.
All of my impacts, however, are six point and I'll always stick with that system.
All of my impacts, however, are six point and I'll always stick with that system.
shampoop
Well-known member
12 point sockets only for 12 point fasteners for me!
Toolhorder
Well-known member
I like em both. Sometimes the angle or limited space causes me to use a 12 point because it's easier to get on the bolt or nut. I can twist the socket to fit but it's just easier with a 12 point.
treasureseeker
Well-known member
If you buy every tool you might need it will be a lifetime affair. I have no 12 point sockets and can usually get away with a 12 point wrench on the few 12 point fasteners I run into.
kams1973
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Why use 12pt sockets?? How about....because they work! I think some people read this board more than they turn wrenches. Makes me sick sometimes..rant over.
therealwormey
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alot of aftermarket bolt kits are 12 point..
head bolts, header bolts, intake bolts, main bolts and like others mentioned they come in handy in tight places where you need to get the socket on first then put the ratchet on , makes it easy to index the socket a little bit at a time ..
head bolts, header bolts, intake bolts, main bolts and like others mentioned they come in handy in tight places where you need to get the socket on first then put the ratchet on , makes it easy to index the socket a little bit at a time ..
shampoop
Well-known member
for 1/2" and 3/8" I use 6 point impact sockets exclusively. I knew i was going to need impact sockets so why not just have a very complete set of impacts? Sure they're a little thicker, but i've never ran into a scenario where the extra thickness has ever got in the way. I also never have to worry about damaging chrome or it flaking off with time! Down the road I'll probably get some full nice chrome 12 point sets as well, so I can have a second set, and 12 point sockets for the rare occasion when 12 or 4 point fasteners pop up.
+1, lots of internal engine parts are 12 point, and i've seen some driveline fasteners that are 12 point too. 12 point sockets are only usually NEEDED for relatively very advanced and/or rare work.
Also, have any of you ever seen a 12 point fastener in SAE sizes?
not-required
Well-known member
I think the 90 mustang I worked on used a 12pt SAE for the drive shaft. IDK i could be wrong it was a couple months ago
tinbender 66
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They help fill up those massive tool chests.
ChrisStarks
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12 point sockets slide onto a crusty/undercoated/dirty fastener easier than 6 point. If it probably wants to fight coming off, a 6 point. If it probably wants to give it up easily and theres a build-up of junk on the fastener, 12 point. When it goes back together, 6 point.
During disassembly, 6 point impacts and 12 point chrome. Reassembly, 6 point chrome... unless the fastener is odd. I've seen older metric stuff that must have slightly rounded edges on the bolts/buts - 12 point sockets get them on.
During disassembly, 6 point impacts and 12 point chrome. Reassembly, 6 point chrome... unless the fastener is odd. I've seen older metric stuff that must have slightly rounded edges on the bolts/buts - 12 point sockets get them on.
William Payne
Well-known member
I can completely understand the reasoning behind 6 point sockets but I have funnily enough many a time grabbed a 12 point wrench to swing on a stuck bolt so I guess both have their place, I know some companies like stahlwille sell pretty much only 12 point sockets apart from some specialty sockets. Personally I plan on getting both because with the stuff I want to do in my future I know I am going to be coming across 12 point nuts and bolts.
they are a necessity if you are going to be doing any serious wrenching , alot of 12 point head bolts are recessed into the head or between a valve guide so a wrench wont cut it
Kevin54
MEMBER EMERITUS
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
I bought a second set of English combination wrenches with 6 pt box ends.
As a homeowner/shade tree mechanic, I have not come across a good use for 12 pt.
As a homeowner/shade tree mechanic, I have not come across a good use for 12 pt.
Zebu Fellenz
Well-known member
I have bought some 12pt sockets because I was able to get them much cheaper than the comparable 6pt sockets and they work just as well for me.
I don't have too much of a preference, I'll grab the 6pt first if I have both, but I've never rounded a bolt head with a 12pt so I'm not scared of using them.
I don't have too much of a preference, I'll grab the 6pt first if I have both, but I've never rounded a bolt head with a 12pt so I'm not scared of using them.
diggerrick
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Then you've never installed head bolts on a small block Chevy with 1.55" springs for a roller cam. I'm not sure what the pro's do, but we turned down a 1/2" drive socket to fit between the springs better.
As I recall on the last one, the 12-point nuts for the studs we used (SAE size) required a smaller socket size that we didn't have to modify.
For the record - I prefer 6pt sockets for anything I really have to crank on. I think it makes more of a difference on smaller fastener heads. I'm not even sure Craftsman makes a 6pt 1/2" drive socket set.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ARP-234-4601/?rtype=10
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W650Mike
Well-known member
I didn't know that I was supposed to be anti 12pt until I found this site.
Tell me about it, Mike. Never realized what a handicap I'd been working under. Makes me wonder how I finished so many jobs over the years using 12pt. sockets, not to mention C-man raised panel wrenches & ratchets.TOOL MASTER
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12 go on quicker..
I run 6 point impact 3/8 and 1/2.
Everything else in chrome is 12 point.
The frustration of needing a 12 point and only having a 6 point is terrible!
I'm wrench for a living, and granted I haven't been doing it for 100 years, but I haven't had a problem. The techs I work with use 12 points too.....
Everything else in chrome is 12 point.
The frustration of needing a 12 point and only having a 6 point is terrible!
I'm wrench for a living, and granted I haven't been doing it for 100 years, but I haven't had a problem. The techs I work with use 12 points too.....
A29
Well-known member
How true.
DavidB
Well-known member
Modern day sockets are designed to contact on the faces of the fastener not the points as older sockets were. The difference between 6pt and 12pt is very minimal these days. Go here if you'd like to see some examples: http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=73245
diesel research
Well-known member
I use a few SAE 12pt impact sockets....6pt would simply not fit, or destroy the bolts...wrenches would simply bend.
shampoop
Well-known member
wow, that koken surface drive bite mark is very impressive!