30x40 Attached Hot Rod Shop

[mlyonsdc]

Another month has passed and we have made a lot more progress. I originally wanted to get the car done for Sick Week 2023 and now I am shooting for Sick Week 2024 lol! Some might say I grossly over estimated how much time this project takes but I don't think I have I just under estimated how much time family, work and trying to hang on to the last shreds of fitness from my Triathlon days takes lol!!!

We are signed up to do the SE Street-N-Yeet DnD event in SC in Nov again AND it is looking pretty good that this car may actually make it to the event. Whether it makes it down the track is another story BUT I think it will at least be running by then and if it is I am planning to take it.

As of today I have ALL the plumbing done, brakes, fire suppression, oil lines, evac line, fuel lines, trans lines coolant line so many AN lines it is almost dizzying. I did plumb the entire car using Racetronix stuff which is pretty nice. They are in Canada shipping is really reasonable you don't pay tax and their website is pretty easy to use and has an extensive list of fittings adapters etc. I used their PTFE line and fittings for the fuel, std nylon braided rubber for coolant, oil and evac, and hard AN lines for brake and fire suppression. The parts are all high quality and I even used the Clam Shell/Wiggins style clamps for the IC. I am 99% certain they are the same parts as Vibrant produces just re-labeled for Racetronix. Both companies are in Canada and the parts interchange for the clamps

As you can see in the pics the header coating is done and they are finally on the car for good 3 versions later! I used a product from Zycoat that is supposed to be good to 2000* my coater has it on a TT Mustang he said still looks like new. We will see I have not seen a good coating that holds up to the heat a turbo motor makes but this one looks promising. It is a bronze and at least looks good now! I also fabbed a new turbo mount version 6.4 lol. I also mounted the boost solenoids on it which turned out nice and is in close proximity to the WG.

I am pretty happy with how the engine compartment is turning out. I am not sure I am keeping the pressure sensor bar on the pass wheel well yet. I know it doesn't look like a stock GN motor BUT it does keep the same basic layout and stock configuration which is what I am shooting for, a cool hot rod that is stupid fast and not just a race car. Then again you never know what the future brings, a twin turbo Stage 2 head Buick V6 on methanol.........

I bought a pair of Goodmark rear floor pans and Ray did a great job sectioning them in and around the bars. It cleaned up the floor pan and we also raised that area of the floor 2" which will help with the exhaust system whenever we get around to fabbing that mess.

I ended up struggling with the Vacuum pump and evac system and still not sure what I have will work. Crankcase venting in a high pressure high HP turbo motor is never easy. I ended up going with a really nice air/oil separator tank made to mount on the firewall for a G-body. It holds 2 qts and has two -12an fittings with a drain on the bottom and a port for the transmission vent. The jury is out on the whole vacuum pump deal and whether it will work and be able to keep up on my motor. I already had on the car from before so it really didnt take any extra work to hook it up other than a couple of extra AN lines. I am going to give it a go, we struggled to get it to working right back in 2009 but I did have it working. Back then and did not have any crankcase data but I will now as I have 1 Bar MAP sensor wired into the Holley. If I can't get it to work I will just pull it off and run two -12s from the VCs to the tank and be done with it. Might use the mount for the AC compressor lol!

We got a lot more the fab work done this last weekend and started on the inside of the car with the shifter parachute handle etc. I have some work on the dash frame and and have to finish all the electronic mounting then it will finally be time to start wiring which is the final step! Fingers crossed the car may be running by the time I make the next post!!

 

[rattle_snake]

Very clean work!

 

[jon72vega]

That is Bad A$$!

 

[mlyonsdc]

Well my new chariot to carry the GN into battle finally arrived this week. I ordered it in Feburary off a vendor in Georgia. The first one was done in May but they screwed up the black out package. The vendor I dealt with was awesome and agreed to order me a new one with the correct options and threw in an electric tongue jack for the wait. Well worth it!

The trailer is built by Diamond out of Georgia which I spec'ed. Price was more than right and it looks good but fit and finish leaves a lot to be desired. Bones are good it has a nice axle pkg and the frame is a full channel and only C channel on the center floor supports.




The trailer tows really nice and my F150 did a good job pulling it. I have been considering a new truck for awhile now. My current was a lease I bought out in Jan 2020 which I planned to drive for a year and turn in on a new one. Well you couldn't get them in 2021 and now the same truck is $72k with no incentives to lease or buy and interest rates at 8%. I would like a F250 with a 6.7 but damn $90k for a Lariat is just nuts. So I am going to make due with my current truck at least till next spring. I do really like my truck which makes the decision easier but then again a Carbonized Grey Lariat SD diesel with black out package would look fantastic rolling down the road with this lol!

I added air bags to the rear with weight distribution hitch and 10 ply tires at 65 psi it does really well towing probably no significant difference than a 3/4 ton at this point.

 

[Old Man Roger]

Nice

 

[mlyonsdc]

Well I was hoping to have a start video by now but hey

Crimpin Ain't easy.........


I knew the wiring would take some time and like most of this project everything is custom and nothing is straight forward. I am no stranger to big projects and have done more than one frame off total restorations on cars but this project is a new level of difficulty and time. You literally put everything together and take it apart at LEAST 3 times before it is finally installed. Once things start going together stuff you built and designed no longer fit and need redone, sometimes several times!! Wiring has been no different.

While I spent over a year planning how I was going to wire this care, acquiring tools and materials I still find myself completely changing how I thought it was going to work and still finding tooling and materials I still need!

Step one to wiring a project like this, mount everything first.

I originally bought a Motion Raceworks Holley Dominator roll bar mount that I was going to mount on the dash bar behind the dash. I fabbed a panel that would mount he Racepak Smartwire, Profiler traction control, the EGT Can Bus controller along with the rest of the electronics on top of the Dominator. Spent a day messing with it and it came out really nice and it didnt fit and is now in the trash and the $100 roll bar mount for the Holley is for sale.


It wouldn't fit with the dash and I tried making it work in several ways with no luck. I found a cheap 1.625 roll bar mounts from Summit for $18 each and bought 3/16" alum plate which I was able to fit nicely.



Second step lay out the power and ground wires. Since this car is using a solid state PDM with an ECU and a battery of sensitive transducers and datalogging equipment how you run you grounding is really critical. I set it up with a clean and dirty bus where all sensitive electronics are ground directly through the battery and the high amp draw like fans, fuel pump starter etc are ground through the chassis. I really didn't think it would take two days to do this but it did along with several changes.



I always ran this car on a 16v system and decided to swap back to 12v. I had a XSpower 16v battery so I called them and they had a size series 34 lithium battery that would charge with my current alternator and I could use my current XSpower battery charger with.
Oh yeah it also took 40# off the car!!!!


I am using a Racepak Smartwire PDM for all of my chassis wiring and it is pretty damn slick. I have been following a professional wiring and tuner on youtube Devin Vanderhoof who has been promoting the Holley/Racepak combo and I bought in but it has a steep learning curve and Holley/Racepak tech support is not much help. The SW has 30 outputs 8 20amp and 22 10amp that are totally configurable. It only has 12 hardwired inputs plus you can add a keypad for another 8 which I did. When I started to map out the chassis wiring lighting alone will use 9 hardwired inputs I was quickly running out of inputs. I then figured out that Racepak has a Universal Can Module that will allow me to pull over everything from the ECU as an input. So now all inputs will run to the Holley and pull over to the SW via can and I think I will only need 2-3 of the hardwired inputs. But what is super cool is I can configure any of the outputs based off any of the inputs. I want my tailights to flash at 30psi of boost I can do that lol! It also cuts a lot of wiring out of the car, remember no relays so my headlights turn signals, horn switches are all run into the holley and out of the SW. I am still running a relay for the fuel pump only because it is right next to the battery and is just simpler. The other are the ignition coils which can use A LOT of amperage and also make A LOT of electrical noise so I can completely isolate them and run their own power source.

After you get the power and ground battery cables run it is time to start laying out the chassis wiring. I have the harnesses pinned and ready to be fit in the car which I will probably do in the next day or two.


I also need to finish a few sub harnesses. I did the injector harness awhile ago and had to tackle the ones for the coils. These are a little more difficult as each coil uses 3 different grounds and a power that all have to be spliced together in the harness. Plus I am trying to use a 14g TXL wire for primary gnd and power and 16g is the largest the connectors are made for, fun stuff. The first one took me 4 hours but the second only an hour and it turned out much better than the first which I am considering redoing.



Building a harness that is completely sealed with Tefzel or a quality TXL wire with Duetsch connectors is incredibly timing consuming and expensive but should be worth it when its all done. Once I get the sub-harnesses done and all of the mounting out of the way the actual building of the harness should go pretty smooth. It is getting close and I am really hoping to have it running soon. I did prime the motor and charge the accumulator so as soon as we have power it will be ready to fire!

 

[zmotorsports]

Nice job on the wiring. Looks nice and clean.

 

[PhantomEB]

How did I ever miss this thread!
Just read it from the beginning to now With a great sense of appreciation that goes into a 275x car, even if I ever get back into the street car scene it’s gonna be a fox body platform with 28x10.5 tires max!

 

[mlyonsdc]

I am overdue for an update and it has been pretty busy last couple of months.

Picking up where I left off, wiring is a TON of work and once again I underestimated how much time it takes and how difficult it can be to build harnesses at a professional level. A cool set of crimpers help but my lack of experience and analysis paralysis really added to how long it took. I am happy with the engine compartment and the trunk but the behind the dash looks like **** and I will probably re-do it at some point. In the end it is a functioning, serviceable wiring job with well thought out power and ground sources and shielded cable on all sensitive wiring. In the end you won't see any of it once the interior is together and its going to work well!

Some progress pics, the interior wiring is still not done BUT everything is wired and working. I still have to do lighting and accessories wiring along with windshield wiper motor and bump buttons. Then I can tidy everything up and start putting the interior back together.

I mounted pretty much everything in one location and it is just to much in one spot. It would have turned out cleaner had I mounted the ECU under the passenger seat which I believe I am going to do someday.




Here is the engine harness ECU to bulkhead is done and I am getting ready to build the underhood portion



Here it is with the engine side done. The engine harness is a completely sealed harness.

This is the main harness that runs along the dash bar with the engine side bulkhead. It also has front and rear chassis harnesses that attach to it. I am finishing up the ends and used a woven loom so its not completely sealed like the engine harness.


Once I got these harnesses done I was able to power everything up and actually get the motor fired.

This was end of October and we had some issues with the start up so the car sat for a little while I took care of some other stuff.

First I got a new trailer but it needed a winch since you can not get out of the car with the funny car cage and you have to winch it on and off the trailer. I found this super cooler in floor winch mount from Midwest Race Cabinets which is really slick



The other issue I needed to attend to was I still needed to renew my NHRA adv ET license and without it I would not be able to race the car at Sick Week. Since it was November no matter what I had to travel to do it, I had a few buddies in Cincinnati who were willing to let me use their cars but that is a big favor to ask and I didn't feel comfortable doing it. I signed up to do the Frank Hawley drag racing school in Gainesville Florida and I am really glad I did. I really learned a lot and it was a great way to get my *** back in a car since it had been over 10yrs since I had been in something even remotely fast. The class was way more involved than I an anticipated and of the 15 people who started, 11 finished and only 7 got there license!

I was able to make a road trip out of it too, I stopped on the way down in Moorseville NC to attend Pete Harrell and Devin Vanderhoof's Up Arrow school and it was also very well worth it. It is an advanced tuning school and you get to go really in depth with them and they share a lot of really useful knowledge. On the final day we had to tune Beer Money. They gave us an file for the car with the base fuel, AFR and timing tables zeroed out. We had to design all these tables from scratch using what they taught us. The car had to fire on its own and then we had to tune it. We finished with 1100 rwhp!

Michael Chris Lyons commented: Great weekend! Thank you Devin and @Peter Harrell. I learned a ton and highly recommend making a class if you can you will not be wasting your time or money!

Peter Harrell and myself spent the weekend with a great group of guys teaching all the things and stuff about methanol tuning Pretty awesome that these...

www.facebook.com

On the way back from Gainesville I was able to stop in NC again for the start of the Street-n-Yeet DnD event at Shadyside and see my buddy Jim Trettle with his bad *** 69 Firebird with TT LSx motor. He ended up winning the limited class with a 5.04 avg. I was supposed to do this event but ended up making the trip to Gainesville instead.


On the way home my truck blew a turbo just outside Berkley WV about 300 miles from home! I was able to limp the truck another 140 miles to Clarksburg when the turbo completely let go and was dumping a ton of oil out the exhaust. I did make it to an Applebee's and Ray came to get me with the trailer. He was pretty happy he didn't have to go all the way to Berkley, how I haven't used all my friend cards with this guy is beyond me lol!


Since I sold my Audi in June I had no other vehicle to drive. I was going to run this truck till spring but Ford was running deals on a new F150 Lariat so I bought one. This is now my 4th F150 Lariat 3.5 ecoboost! I had ordered a new F250 with a 6.7 but they are not dealing on those and hadnt even started building it yet. Plus the F250 is a truck, the F150 is a SUV that will do cool truck stuff and really makes a much better daily driver.

 

[mlyonsdc]

We went on a family vacation to California over Thanksgiving which was really cool. We flew into San Fransisco and drove down PCH to San Diego staying along the way and then flew back out of SD. It was a super cool trip and a nice break from working on the car. This is my daughter and I on Pfieffer beach in Big Sur.


Once I got back it was back to work on the GN and going through the punch list chasing issues. The big one we overcame was we had the wrong injector data from Billet Atomizer. Once we got that figured out it was just a matter working through all the issues. Leaks, couple things pinned wrong, programming issues etc. Really it hasn't been that bad considering all the work we did.

I had to finish the front rear chassis harnesses along with the trunk harness wiring. I am still chasing issues with the tailights, brake lights and making it work with the dual filament bulbs for brake and turn signals. I was able to drive the car around the block and nothing fell off the car and I made it home, actually it went really well. I still have to clean up the dash and interior wiring which I will do after the dyno which is tomorrow. Yesterday we did our first trans brake 2step check, got all the CO2 plumbed and tested the air chute, air shifter and boost solenoids. I also got to wash the car which it REALLY needed. for as much as we did to the car we managed to avoid any major dents or scratches. It does need buffed and some paint correction mostly from us dragging stuff over the fenders doors etc.

 

[SilverJimmy]

My best friend and I back in 2021 went to Frank Hawley at Maple Grove, it was a great experience. He went because he was getting a 8 second Door Slammer, I went to make sure I wasn’t a squirrel and could handle the high speeds that are hopefully coming in my pursuit of a Bonneville 200 MPH record.

What I didn’t realize was that the last thing Frank was going to teach me was how to drag race, if you’ve been, you know what I mean!

 

[mlyonsdc]

My best friend and I back in 2021 went to Frank Hawley at Maple Grove, it was a great experience. He went because he was getting a 8 second Door Slammer, I went to make sure I wasn’t a squirrel and could handle the high speeds that are hopefully coming in my pursuit of a Bonneville 200 MPH record.

What I didn’t realize was that the last thing Frank was going to teach me was how to drag race, if you’ve been, you know what I mean!

I do know what you mean!! Frank is a great guy and really took my understanding of going fast in a straight line to a new level. He got into a lot of stuff I am also familiar with as a Sports physician which I never expected. He is going to be in Norwalk in July and I think I am going to take my daughter just for the experience and maybe just maybe it will be something she will find interest in to do with the old man lol! I also want to make a pass in a rail and 3 passes and I can get my rail license. Not sure if I will ever use it but it will be worth the experience. I drove the #1 door car which ran 9.10-11 at 145-6 mph. The rails are a full second faster.

 

[Old Man Roger]

I’ve gone 9.80 at 140, it moves your eyeballs back in your head a little..lol

 

[mlyonsdc]

I’ve gone 9.80 at 140, it moves your eyeballs back in your head a little..lol

It does, Frank's cars go low 1.20's in the 60 which plants you pretty good in the seat but they are extremely easy to drive. What makes the course interesting and challenging is Frank puts you in a car you've never been in and in a psychologically challenging environment. If you can't follow his rules under those circumstances you won't pass. In my situation I had a lot of experience driving MY car and following MY procedures and had to "unlearn" that in order to do everything I needed to do to demonstrate I could truly handle a race car in a stressful environment. Not everyone can do that, and many who attend the class that "think" they can and find out quickly they really can't. It was a true learning experience for me and feel I will be a better and safer driver as a result.

 

[Old Man Roger]

It does, Frank's cars go low 1.20's in the 60 which plants you pretty good in the seat but they are extremely easy to drive. What makes the course interesting and challenging is Frank puts you in a car you've never been in and in a psychologically challenging environment. If you can't follow his rules under those circumstances you won't pass. In my situation I had a lot of experience driving MY car and following MY procedures and had to "unlearn" that in order to do everything I needed to do to demonstrate I could truly handle a race car in a stressful environment. Not everyone can do that, and many who attend the class that "think" they can and find out quickly they really can't. It was a true learning experience for me and feel I will be a better and safer driver as a result.

I can see that, my car actually got pretty boring at the track, because I had a routine. I probably wouldn’t do too well in his class, I don’t like change.lol

 

[SilverJimmy]

What I loved was the “Walk of Shame” Frank would send us on after every session. He would flat out tell everyone that some of us hadn’t advanced to the next level and you didn’t know for sure if he was talking about you till you walked out to the board and saw where you were. I think that was another lesson he was teaching us, humility….

 

[mlyonsdc]

What I loved was the “Walk of Shame” Frank would send us on after every session. He would flat out tell everyone that some of us hadn’t advanced to the next level and you didn’t know for sure if he was talking about you till you walked out to the board and saw where you were. I think that was another lesson he was teaching us, humility….

Lol, everything with how that class is set up is well thought out by Frank and meant to get in your head. He had us seated in U shaped table which I had come to figure out was based on your experience. This put me at #1, I had to go first in the #1 door car and I was also the first video to review. Good times lol! I completely murdered the first run left in second gear on a foot brake but got a time slip! I was able to progress after that but was sweating it since you need 6 time slips and 5 runs that count so I couldn't screw up another one. I knew what mistakes I was making and would have sit and wait for the video and wonder the rest of the time if he was going to progress me to the next round! I did not have a groove to line the car up in since I was first up and had to use the cut in the pavement. I screwed it up again the second day too. We started with 15 two were asked to leave after mis-handling the car, 2 didnt return the next day and 1 did not make it past the 1/8 mile pass.

Just to re-iterate for people who "don't know", Frank is not really a **** and the overall experience was a very positive one lol. I feel I came away a higher skill set than I had going in and I highly recommend taking the class if you get a chance it is well worth it. Just not as easy as you think it will be.

BTW did you make Bonneville? That is another bucket list event I would love to do someday.

 

[ctandc72]

On the way home my truck blew a turbo just outside Berkley WV about 300 miles from home! I was able to limp the truck another 140 miles to Clarksburg when the turbo completely let go and was dumping a ton of oil out the exhaust. I did make it to an Applebee's and Ray came to get me with the trailer. He was pretty happy he didn't have to go all the way to Berkley, how I haven't used all my friend cards with this guy is beyond me lol!

It's not like he didn't get anything out of it. I'm surprised that picture of a GM towing a broken down F150 hasn't become meme fodder yet. I'm sure he will likely remind you of this for a long time to come.

Just saying.

 

[mlyonsdc]

It's not like he didn't get anything out of it. I'm surprised that picture of a GM towing a broken down F150 hasn't become meme fodder yet. I'm sure he will likely remind you of this for a long time to come.

Just saying.

I thought it was funny too, my Ford salesman didnt when I sent it to him and said I needed a Chevy to get home lol!!

They all break down, here is Ray to the rescue again in 2008 when my Duramax injectors **** the bed and the dealer in Columbus tried screwing me on the warranty repair. You should have seen the service managers face when we rolled out of there with the dually loaded up on a 3/4 ton truck lol!! I can't believe I was able to find this pic! I switched to the 3.5 F150 in 2011 and never regretted it. I am a long time GM guy but Ford does make a nice truck


Here are some race pics of the GN from back then too, these are 2007-8ish

 

[SilverJimmy]

Frank definitely is not a “****”! When class was over I thanked Frank for everything he had taught me. He asked me if I thought what I had gotten out of the class would make me a better racer, I told him most definitely, but what I really got from the class was how to hopefully be a better husband. He didn’t say a word, he just smiled, cuz he knew I had been paying attention.
Here are my last two timing slips. Both of these were after using what Frank had taught me about vision and actually seeing something. Check out the lights I cut!
Maybe I should try drag racing!

 

[SilverJimmy]

BTW did you make Bonneville? That is another bucket list event I would love to do someday.

My 85 Firebird with a GMC Jimmy Inline 6, after a run in 2016 at SpeedWeek. Went 174 thru the 3 mile with an exit speed of about 190! That’s my sweet Jodie Dog enjoying the cool salt! Bonneville is the Coolest Place on Earth! Do It!

 

[cad70]

Just stumbled across this and will continue following. I have a buddy with a GN that runs 540s in the eighth on 29x10.5s. Anything beyond that is definitely moving.

I am close to finishing the rewire on my S10 bracket car. Im taking my time since there isnt much else to do in Nebraska until March.


Clark

 

[mlyonsdc]

My 85 Firebird with a GMC Jimmy Inline 6, after a run in 2016 at SpeedWeek. Went 174 thru the 3 mile with an exit speed of about 190! That’s my sweet Jodie Dog enjoying the cool salt! Bonneville is the Coolest Place on Earth! Do It!

That's super cool, I would love to do that some day.

Frank is a super guy, he actually appolgized to me after the class for being so hard on me, I told him no need that's what its about I came to learn and I did!

 

[mlyonsdc]

Just stumbled across this and will continue following. I have a buddy with a GN that runs 540s in the eighth on 29x10.5s. Anything beyond that is definitely moving.

I am close to finishing the rewire on my S10 bracket car. Im taking my time since there isnt much else to do in Nebraska until March.


Clark

Very nice, wiring looks great too. I really over complicated mine with the Smartwire, I sometimes think a basic street relay board would have been easier but the Racepak has other benefits too.

 

[mlyonsdc]

Well Dyno did not go well. We got it set up and ran the car making progress with cleaning up the base fuel map and cleaning up some drive-ability issues.


Before making our first pull we decided to check and see if the fuel pump was activating on high. The fuel pump is a 5gpm in tank Aeromotive that uses an external controller which uses two inputs one that turns the pump on and runs it at 30% for street idle etc.
The other can be set up to run off MAP, TPS or in my case just a 12v switch to go 100% at 12psi.


The first time we activated it it blew a fuse. Second time it pulled the screw out of the top of the pump and blew the top of the pump off. It looks like the screw just pulled the threads out of the bracket inside and can easily be fixed but we still don't know why it happened to begin with. I have a theory but will talk to Aeromotive later today. It is an $1800 pump and I didn't want to mess with it till I talk to them so our day was cut short.

 

[Old Man Roger]

Ugg.

 

[mlyonsdc]

Happy New Year everyone!

Well it has been 21 months since we tore the car apart and started this project and we are in the final stages and it is starting to come around. The first trip to the dyno ended with the fuel pump blowing its lid, literally. Once I got the car home and tore it apart I found the issue which of course was me. I am not sure how but I seemed to manage putting the fuel filter in the housing backwards deadheading the pump. It worked with the pump on low but when we went to full power it literally blew the top off and we found the screw in the parking lot.


The pic shows the filter installed correctly I somehow managed to get it in backwards when it really only goes in one way. How it even ran is beyond me but it did. I had it in and out of the car so many times fitting stuff who knows.

I called Aeromotive and they wanted the pump back to inspect and repair. Problem is I am running out of time and was half tempted to repair the threads my self. We were heading into the Holiday's and Aeromotive was shutting down to move so it could be awhile before I saw the pump again. Buying a second $1800 fuel pump was not really an option either. I still needed to dyno the car and have a mile long punch list to get done to still make Sick Week which is now only 5 weeks away!

I discussed this with the tech and he insisted on getting the pump back to inspect it and even though I deadheaded the pump it still should not have done what it did. He told me he would be in the next 2 days and 2 days the following week after x-mas so I shipped it overnight. It left on Wed at noon, I got an email Thurs afternoon they were repairing it they were going to test it next. At 5:30 I got an email it was on its way back and Friday by noon the car was running again! That is absolutely unbelievable customer service. I bought the pump December of 2021, I am the one that screwed it up to begin with and Aeromotive fixed it turned it around in a day. They did not charge me for the repair or return shipping either which I fully expected to have to pay. That was quite a Christmas gift!

So the day after Christmas it was back to the Dyno for round two. I will start with saying we made 12 pulls on the dyno with 5 hard ones and drove the car on to the trailer which is/was an success in its self but the process left use with a new set of issues and more questions than answers and me disappointed with the results. We did make 5 pulls at 1000+ hp but only managed a 1079rwhp as the best.



To me dyno numbers are a tool and nothing more, I have seen cars make a ton of power on the dyno and lay an egg on the track and I have seen cars make poor power on the dyno and fly at the track. What disappointed me was how the motor responded to changes in the tune and with adding more power. Actually the only pull on the dyno we made that impressed me was the first one on the WG spring at 12psi of boost it made 660hp lol!

While I was on the only one in the room disappointed with a V6 making almost 1100hp on a Hub dyno, I am also the only one that realized we were not making any more power than it did in 2009 and we had a MUCH better turbo and fuel mgt system than we had back then. We were running a new different ignition system and a different fuel which is also significant.

We had several issues first the vacuum pump seized up and we had to run the car with a less than optimal evac system and it was pushing oil out of the dipstick tube making a mess. I installed a restrictor in the Turbo oil feed line as it was also pushing oil past the seal and leaking which is a lot of the smoke you see in the video. We were running really low timing and a fairly rich fuel mixture to stay on the safe side until we got most of the boost out of the turbo. In this case we made the 1079 on 37psi but we were still at 15.5* of timing which is REALLY conservative for the cylinder head and slow combustion chamber and from past experience 19-21 degrees is where this combo liked to be. Problem is when we put more timing in the motor did nothing. After we made the 1079 we put 1.5 degrees in for 17 and made 1072 BUT the motor also picked up 1 psi of boost at the same dome pressure which I feel is a pretty good clue to what the issue is that is causing this.

After getting home and picking through the data logs for the fine details I did find some things shed some light on why the car didn't perform well as I anticipated.

First issue is the TQ converter is completely WRONG. We knew this cause it was wrong for the PTE 4788 we had on it in 2009 too, but with the larger turbine in the NLX88 it was even worse. I did start testing spool up using the Spool Assist dump valve in the trans and it was slow but I was starting to get it up on the chip and building boost. On the dyno though we noticed that the motor made peak power at 7030 rpm but in the data log the motor was not reaching peak boost until a whooping 7400 RPM! The converter is WAY to tight and there is a REALLY good chance at 7k we are at the tail end of the power curve. If we got the boost in at say 6k rpm the peak numbers would likely occur in the 66-6800 rpm range which is more in line with the cam profile and cylinder head that is on the motor. But this doesn't explain why the motor was not responding to more timing.

The timing issue I believe is related to the plug gap which we had to wide for the ignition we are now running compared to the CDI ignition I ran previously. I beleive and have been told the IGN1a needs a much tighter plug gap than we ran with the CDI ignition. This would make sense why the motor picked up a pound of boost from the timing but made less power.

I also found an issue with the oil pressure, it is to high and causing issues with the turbo, hopefully a few turns on the bypass fixes that.

The coolant pressure sensor and pan vac sensors are reading goofy, I think the coolant pressure is just air in the line which should be an easy fix.

I smoked the Vacuum pump vanes due to changing the fitting to a black one from blue. The new one stuck out into the housing and destroyed the vanes. I ordered a new kit to rebuild it so I should have that back up and running soon and hopefully get it working to help with pan evac.

I also need to get the Back-pressure sensor hooked up along with another one to check turbo outlet pressure to get an idea of what the pressure drop is across the IC. My turbo outlet temps were only 270 degrees and my inlet temps were a paltry 88 degrees. The IC kicks *** at cooling but it may come at a price with pressure drop so we need to check it and get an idea where we are with the turbo.

It is a process and we are still thrashing and making progress. We still have a lot on our punch list but knocked a bunch out this weekend. Ray fabed up a trailer hitch that mounts in the parachute mount.


I made a bracket to mount backpressure and intercooler inlet pressure sensors and ran the wiring.



I also installed Map lights with a latching switch in my switch panel. I wired these direct to the battery the rest of the interior lights will work off the Smartwire.

I am ready to actually start putting the interior in the car and wrapping up the wiring. I found most of the bugs and programming issues but still tracking down a few. I need to address the grounds in the factory front and rear light harnesses and get the lights all working the right way I think I have a ground feedback loop making it do goofy stuff.

We are scheduled to head back to the dyno on the 12th to further sort some stuff out plus we need to work more on staging and spooling the turbo. I have a new TQ conv coming which is a bolt together PTC and should be the ticket for what I am running. I am getting it on an extremely expedited schedule, it is nice still having friends in the business. It is supposed to ship by the end of this week.

We leave for Florida on the 18th to test in Orlando that weekend and I may stay the whole week, I have a buddy with a shop that is an hour from Orlando Speedworld so if we need to work on the car we will have access to a fully equipped shop plus I can leave the truck trailer there if we fly back to work that week. A flight from Orlando to Pittsburgh is $40 each way on Spirit we are coming back to work and return on Friday for the Cadillac Attack at Orlando Friday/Saturday and Sick Week starts Sunday the 28th.

Still a lot to do before we leave but at this point it looks like we are well on the way and have a car that should run pretty well on a really safe conservative tune.

 

[Old Man Roger]

What? You mean you can’t just put in a bigger turbo? Lol

 

[Paul_VR6]

One other issue I have seen with the IGN1a coils is that they pull some big current and often get wired with too small gauge 12v and ground wiring. A car I tuned had the 12v feed dropping to only 7v at full load, never broke up but down on power. Usually I see gap issues as high power misfires, but usually don't gap larger than 20. Good luck getting to sick week!

 

[mlyonsdc]

One other issue I have seen with the IGN1a coils is that they pull some big current and often get wired with too small gauge 12v and ground wiring. A car I tuned had the 12v feed dropping to only 7v at full load, never broke up but down on power. Usually I see gap issues as high power misfires, but usually don't gap larger than 20. Good luck getting to sick week!

Thanks, we figured we would see something like a mis-fire on the dyno and never saw anything to suggest it was blowing out the spark. Its just a theroy BUT my buddy Dusty at PTC told me he had the same issue with his BBC with a 118mm turbo. He was stuck at 157mph in the 1/8 no matter what he did. Tightened up the gap from 21 to 14 after someone told him to and went 165 next pass.

Wiring is good, Tefzel 12g from battery to coil harness and 14g tefzel all the way to the plug. My fingers are still sore from stuffing 14g in that IGN1a plug lol!

 

[mlyonsdc]

Just a quick update. We leave Thurs to start testing in Orlando and will be there for the Cadillac Attack the following weekend before Sick Week starts on the 28th.

Still thrashing and sorting issues which seems never ending with a new build. We did make it back to the dyno on Saturday with the new TQ converter and a few other tweaks to test and it went really well.


I also finished putting the car back together and got the interior all back in, it was surreal having the entire car back together and looking like a GN again.

Once the car was back together I was able to get a final weight and re-plotted the suspension and adjust the ARB to neutral with a driver. Weights are race ready with driver



I almost bagged going to the dyno I was still working on it Saturday morning. I did find a loose fitting on the WG that was leaking and probably contributing to our spool issues we were having. This was a full 3 gear pull off the trans-brake. I am pleased with the results and everything we did was better this time around the motor responded and even sounded better. We only made a couple of pulls to get here. Even better this is a very mild tune that we should be able to run repeatedly at Sick Week. This was 16* of timing at 35psi of boost, dome pressure was only 32psi and backpressure was 44psi so it is no where near the end of what the turbo is capable of producing.


We also did some T-brake/2-Step tuning. With the new TQ we are 2 sec to the chip at 4k which is unbelievably fast for a turbo car yet one with a really small engine and really LARGE turbo! It was a little over 4 sec to full boost and ready to launch. This was without using the internal dump valve in the trans too which will make this process even faster. Right now 4 seconds is pretty damn good for no assist.



Following the dyno session there was another set of issues and problems which we are currently working through. We had oil on the #3 plug and baffled as to why but it seems the intake gasket may have been leaking but we did not see any indication of it. We pulled the intake and re-sealed it. Did a leak down and compression check and everything looks great with the motor.

We also have some issues with the temp sensors for oil and trans that don't seem to be reading right which are added to the long punch list of things we continue to thrash to finish.

Next up Orlando testing!

 

[Old Man Roger]

That torque converter looks like a piece of art..lol 1159 hp on a mild tune sounds pretty damn good. Hopefully the oil issue doesn’t come back.

 

[zmotorsports]

Great job. Looks like it is coming together nicely. The interior is really looking nice and that torque converter is nice piece of workmanship.

 

[mlyonsdc]

Thanks guys, yes its coming together but still fighting me all the way!

Dusty and PTC really nailed on the converter. I still have to see how it acts on the track as it is usually different than the dyno but this was a hub dyno and is supposed to be pretty damn close.

Racepak has a manufacturing issue with the Vnet dongle that controls the $800 keypad that renders it pretty much useless and I use it for everything. I sent it in to be repair with no word back on when I am going to get it. To make it run for the dyno I had to re-program the Smartwire to use the horn button to start the car and the parking light switch for ignition along with a few other changes. I wont be able to drive the car like this so I had to buy another $800 keypad to get a dongle in time to make it. Its not a total loss I can use two and may get rid of the Racewire Solution column light switches and use a second keypad instead.

After the dyno the #3 plug looked like it had oil on it everything else looked great other than #3 and there was no indication on the datalogs or in the way the motor ran there was any kind of issue.



The intake was also leaking so I pulled it off to reseal it and further inspect.

Care to guess which one is #3?

The intake gasket looked like it may have been seeping oil into the bottom of the port but I was also worried about a bad injector which is a bigger deal as it can wash out the rings. A compression test on 1-3-5 showed 155, 175, 160 and a leakdown showed 93% cold so the cylinder wasn't hurt so I suspected it an just a oil leaking into the port.

I still decided to have the injectors tested care to guess which one is #3?

I put a call into Jack at Billet Atomizer, super nice guy and excellent customer service. These are older set of injectors I got off a friend second hand and he is still helping me out and going to send the parts to rebuild the injector tomorrow so I can make it.

So in fixing this I will likely have to re-tune the entire fuel map which I will hopefully be doing on the track this weekend. I also need to raise the base fuel pressure as I am starting to run out injectors. I am at 79% with a base FP of 55 so Jack told me to go to 70 base and keep DC to 70% or lower.

My punch list keeps getting longer instead of shorter!

 

[Old Man Roger]

Damn your busy..lol

 

[mlyonsdc]

Good News:
We made it to Sick Week
We passed Tech for 7.50 for run group A
We made a pass on race day
Car still runs, is shiney and in one piece

Bad News
I am home typing this post!

Well we thought we had the issue with #3 sorted out before we left but that wasn't the case and in the end the cause of our demise.

The original plan was to leave Thursday Jan 18 for Orlando to be there to test Fri/Sat/Sun then fly home Monday morning to work Tues/Wed/Thurs and then fly back Fri morning to test that weekend before the race. Of course mother nature had different plans for us.


On Thurs we were still scrambling to get stuff done on the car on top of packing and loading the race trailer. We test fit the trailer and figured out the hitch we made was to high so we bought some parts to make a new one at my buddies shop once we got down there.



By 1pm Thurs the weather was moving in and it was to late to leave without getting trapped in a blizzard in the Mountains of WV an Virginia so we pushed it to Friday. We finally got on the road Friday evening and headed South via 71/75 in stead of 79/77 which is a few hours longer but will avoid the mountains and really bad snow storms. Well Akron and Columbus were not much better and it was not a pleasant ride. We stopped at the KY/TN border to get some rest to finish the rest of the tow on Saturday. the temp was 5* and I almost jack knifed the truck/trailer trying to park it going up a small hill that was a sheet of ice. I ended up sliding all the way back down the hill with the trailer and narrowly missed a row of parked cars. Good times.

We first noticed the smoke returning after loading the car and figured it could be related to the turbo again so we made an emergency stop at Summit Racing in Ga which we were driving right past. We live 45 min from one in Ohio and the inside it looked EXACTLY the same. Yes that's my brand new truck and trailer covered in salt.


We got in late Saturday and went straight to Orlando so we could get some track time in Sunday. We rolled into the track Sunday with the hopes of at least making a pass and the problems started with the oil being a complete milk shake. I was freaked we froze the block but Ray put an entire gallon of antifreeze in before we left. We changed the oil and installed the new oil pressure regulator for the turbo and started getting the car ready to make a pass. Our first attempt at a run was cut short due to the fans not turning on due to an issue we were dealing with concerning the Racepak. We did stage the car and get it up on the 2 step so it was a success. Since we were so late getting to Florida we pushed out flights back till Tues evening to try and make it back to the track.

We continued to have issues with oil in #3 cyl. We spent the next two days chasing that and a bunch of other issues at a friends shop up near Ocala. In out attempt to trouble shoot and fix the oil issue with Cyl #3 we created more problems when I broke a rocker shaft and adjuster by mis-aligning the pushrods. Do I have spare to fix this, YES, did I bring them...NO!! Forturnately Champion Racing Heads is in Largo and I know the owner who is another long time Buick racer. He met us at the shop at 9pm that night

We got a new hitch made for the trailer and spent Tuesday driving it around and continuing to sort stuff out with plans to be at the track Friday when we returned. We never made it back to the track on Monday or Tuesday but got a lot done and were ready for Friday, at least we thought we were.


Friday and Saturday we were back on the struggle bus. I started Friday with 2-step and T-brake testing and blew a trans line out in the pits. We fixed it added a bunch of heat wrap and went to make a pass and blew it on the starting line and then proceeded to oil down the track as I didn't realize it blew. Again very lucky to not wreck or catch the car on fire. But I was now "that guy" who oiled down the track.

Saturday we woke up on the move and tracked down a shop in Orlando JDM Express who was open AND had PTFE lines and fittings along with heat wrap so we were back in action. it was 2pm by the time we got the car back together and ready to make a pass. We missed the one and only qualifying pass for the Sick Shootout so we elected to get into the TnT group. Due to multiple oil downs we never got to make a pass and gave up at 830 that evening.

We got there early on Tech day and got the car ready for tech with the trailer. We got in line early so we wouldn't be there all day since we still did not have a clean run on the car. Tech went pretty smooth I had my horn button wired to engage the starter and also sound the horn which still passed lol. We got the 7.50 cert which put us in A group.



We were finally ready to make our first test hit. Everything went well car hooked went straight. We are running the car on on WG spring with CO2 turned all the way down which is as slow as we can make it. I ran it out about 400 feet and it went well no issues what so ever. Data log looked good we made a few changes and decided to make a full pass again on WG. Next pass again went really smooth, suspension was working and the car went straight and to 9.90@135. This is essentially as slow as we can make the car go and were pretty happy. It was the end of the day and race day was next.

We showed up early again on Monday and started looking stuff over, We were dealing with multiple issues at this point, #3 cyl was a mess the car would smoke on start up and idle sometimes very little sometimes a lot, the Racepak keypad was still a mess and after looking at the datalog from our first full pass there is an issue with oil pressure after 2nd gear, not good but nothing that was hurting anything either We cut the oil filter open and it was spotless so we decided to make a hit. I turned up the dome pressure just a bit to 19psi of boost.

We were ready at 2 and made another A to B pass with zero issues running 9.40@148 with a REALLY soft 1.49 60'.



At this point we had to make a decision to turn in a slow 9.40 time slip and get on the road to Bradenton which was a 5-6 hour drive with the route they selected OR wait around for second pass and turn up the power some. We decided to wait and make a second pass. An 8 sec timeslip would put us in the lead pack for our class while a 9.40 might hurt us in the end.



We didn't get called to the lanes till after 4 and when I started the car it was smoking really bad. We got to the lanes and the track officials were a little more than concerned I was going to oil down the track. After some discussion with Ray we agreed the issue had gotten worse since the last pass and putting 30psi of boost to it on this pass was not going to make it any better. We decided to pack up to try and leave for Bradenton and possibly try to tackle this issue there. We went back to look the car over and it became apparent we were not going to be able to drive the car like it was. We change the plug and a tried a few other things and confirmed it was cylinder #3 and not the turbo making all the smoke. At this point with the motor having a hurt cylinder and having tried multiple things to fix it the only thing left was to pull the cylinder head and the #3 piston and rod to figure out WTH the issue is. With it being to late in the day to do this in Orlando and having a car that we could not drive to Bradenton like it was we had little choice but to call it.

In all it was a hard decision, despite all the issues the car really runs well and we made an a lot of ground up in sorting the car out. We came a long way with the car and got a lot done in Florida. While we did not accomplish our goals of a 7sec DnD GN at this event we have a clear vision of what we need to finish to accomplish this and will be back again next year or maybe at Sick Summer or Drag Week this year.

 

[Old Man Roger]

You thinking it’s a valve guide issue? Or a ring issue?

Did you do a dry/wet compression check on #3?

 

[Paul_VR6]

Quite the adventure! I am sure it doesn't feel good but packing it in, but with the car still shiny, rods still inside the block it makes sense to not go crazy. Good luck figuring this one out. Think #3 was so rich that the ring never bed in?

 

[mlyonsdc]

We started dealing with the issue before we even left. We were right that It is oil in the intake track and not an issue with the cyl. I suspected possibly the #3 injector wiped out rings BUT it had 93% on a cold leakdown and 175psi cranking compression. If it was an oil control ring installed wrong or the second ring upside down it could cause this BUT why is the #3 intake port squeaky clean?

I got the motor out yesterday and took it my machinist. And the problem is now obvious

That hole wasn't there when I pulled the intake off before we left and was probably just a small crack we missed. The material is thin where the pushrod goes through and probably blew out on the last pass. After sitting around waiting to make that second pass a ton of oil went down that hole and is why the car was smoking so bad when we went to make that last pass. Either way we were done even if we could fix the car there (which we could have done at Champion) we would not have been able to make the drive to Bradenton like it was.

 

[cad70]

Props to you and your friends for making it there, and making a pass.