larson0290
Member
I have to say awesome shop. I have read all 216 pages and enjoyed it all. I have also driven by your shop before, taking the back roads to see my buddy at U of I. looks very nice.
Above 1200 Sq/FT Restored 1930's Auto Shop
- Thread starter BB767
- Start date
Wokspaces above 1200 squarefeet.
Continuing with material of interest found in the Tool Shed...
...was this Allen Syncrograph. That's what Allen Equipment called them, but they're distributor machines, none the less. It dates from the 1930's and the newest data card with it is from April, 1942. This is "Barn Fresh" as they say, I've done next to no clean up on it, only wiped the dust away to reveal the meter faces. Those meter housings are I think, "Bakelite" which was an early plastic. Kind of a plastic before there was plastic.
You might note the Art Deco design of the meters. The Contact Angle Meter...
...and the Tachometer...
...Vacuum gauge...
...Vacuum Control lever.
At the top of the face panel, on the left and right are a series of data flip cards held by 2 rings, listing specifications for various distributors. They are protected by either metal or cardboard covers (I can't remember which) that flip down, covering the data cards when not in use. You can see the cover here in the up position at the top. The left series of cards are ones for different advance curves at differing RPM's. Beneath are some of the cards listing test specifications for DELCO-REMY and AUTO-LITE distributors.
On the right side are supplement specification cards for DELCO-REMY distributors, note the date in the upper right corner, 1942, Printed 4-22-42. Except for some dirt the cards are in excellent condition, not bent, torn or faded, very legible and show signs of care, especially considering they will be 70 years old in March.
In this side profile view, at the top left you can see the spec card covers in the up position reveling the cards beneath, and note the nice condition of the machine housing. There are no dents anywhere and from a cursory inspection it seems pretty complete. All the wiring insulation on everything has long gone to that great scrap bin in the sky but this machine would be a good candidate for restoration I should imagine because of its age and relative rarity. I saw a period magazine ad for one of these units that listed the price for it new as $159.00 back in 1944. It was for a type #E-137 ...
...which is what I believe this unit is.
Thomas
...was this Allen Syncrograph. That's what Allen Equipment called them, but they're distributor machines, none the less. It dates from the 1930's and the newest data card with it is from April, 1942. This is "Barn Fresh" as they say, I've done next to no clean up on it, only wiped the dust away to reveal the meter faces. Those meter housings are I think, "Bakelite" which was an early plastic. Kind of a plastic before there was plastic.
You might note the Art Deco design of the meters. The Contact Angle Meter...
...and the Tachometer...
...Vacuum gauge...
...Vacuum Control lever.
At the top of the face panel, on the left and right are a series of data flip cards held by 2 rings, listing specifications for various distributors. They are protected by either metal or cardboard covers (I can't remember which) that flip down, covering the data cards when not in use. You can see the cover here in the up position at the top. The left series of cards are ones for different advance curves at differing RPM's. Beneath are some of the cards listing test specifications for DELCO-REMY and AUTO-LITE distributors.
On the right side are supplement specification cards for DELCO-REMY distributors, note the date in the upper right corner, 1942, Printed 4-22-42. Except for some dirt the cards are in excellent condition, not bent, torn or faded, very legible and show signs of care, especially considering they will be 70 years old in March.
In this side profile view, at the top left you can see the spec card covers in the up position reveling the cards beneath, and note the nice condition of the machine housing. There are no dents anywhere and from a cursory inspection it seems pretty complete. All the wiring insulation on everything has long gone to that great scrap bin in the sky but this machine would be a good candidate for restoration I should imagine because of its age and relative rarity. I saw a period magazine ad for one of these units that listed the price for it new as $159.00 back in 1944. It was for a type #E-137 ...
...which is what I believe this unit is.
Thomas
Last edited:
chevtrux53
Active member
Unreal dude, you are awesome. I would have had the greatest time going through all that good old stuff.
Vette60
Well-known member
Wow.
What a neat find Thomas. Thanks for sharing. The meter housings are really capture the art deco look and the needle on the vacuum gauge is really slick.
It's a never-ending treasure trove!
Randy
What a neat find Thomas. Thanks for sharing. The meter housings are really capture the art deco look and the needle on the vacuum gauge is really slick.
It's a never-ending treasure trove!
Randy
realvc
Well-known member
That is the best looking Allen Dist. Machine I've had the honor of looking at.
Great find.
Thanks again for all the time you spend sharing the great adventure of your shop.
I look at my shop in a whole new light since I started following this thread.
Great find.
Thanks again for all the time you spend sharing the great adventure of your shop.
I look at my shop in a whole new light since I started following this thread.
landroversforever
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2011
- Messages
- 86
Gee wiz, does nothing get by you guys? Sharp eyes there oberst thanks.
Thomas
Nope, we all have very sharp eyes. Blunt eyes could spot the switch panel though
.Thomas, if you're ever in Oxfordshire, England... You can enjoy a beer on me
Thank you larson0290. Should you ever drive by in the neighborhood and have time to stop in, please feel free to do so. Always like to meet fellow GJ board members.
Thomas
-chevtrux53, I have had the greatest time going through everything. Every time I'm in the Tool Shed or Lean-To I'm still finding new "stuff".
-Randy, that's a good way to put it, a "never ending treasure trove" or at least at times it seems that way. I've been cleaning that property up for over 6 years now, but it'll come to an end one of these times. I acutally have some room to work out there now.
The graceful, delicate lines of that vacuum needle are pure art aren't they?
I bet the pointy ends of the other two meters are visually unique as well. I'll need to power them up and see what what they look like.-Thank you dmull, there is more to come, just check back every so often.
Thomas
I knew it was some kind of test equipment but didn't realize it was an Allen and how solid and complete it is. It's taken several years, literally, to get to the point where I could even get a decent look at it. Patience is a virtue.
Thank you for your interest and support, I do appreciate it.
Thomas
BigDaddyUSMC
Well-known member
Y MANIFOLD GANG
Thomas
Check this out
Fred Lobello's business from the 1970's With the #200 Belly Tank.
This was in my uncle Roger's address book.
Roger worked at San Diego Steel Products
Thomas
Check this out
Fred Lobello's business from the 1970's With the #200 Belly Tank.
This was in my uncle Roger's address book.
Roger worked at San Diego Steel Products
Last edited:
BigDaddyUSMC
Well-known member
Bob, I thought of you immediately when I can across the old Allen. Especially in light of the fact you just recently serviced a newer Allen for me. What are the odds, huh? Your description "dust/dirt preservative" is an appropriate term, it's a very thick coat of it, whatever it is and no doubt it provided some protection of some sort.
I only wiped the meter faces off, took a few photographs and then returned it to it's resting place so I can't answer your question just yet. As old as it is I'd suspect a degree wheel wouldn't you but who knows? Does anyone out there know when strobes started to appear on distributor machines? I'll get back to it and do an in depth look see and let you know.
I tried to do an accompanying history of the Allen Electrical Equipment Company with that post to make the post a little more complete but I could find very little information on them. Basically all I could find was that they were based in Kalamazoo, Michigan.
Thomas
That was the OLD SCHOOL way of flying. Things have sure changed. Reminds me of and old fart of a Captain that had the following sticker on his flight bag:
HAVE YOU FLOGGED YOUR CREW TODAY?
A copy of your picture just might find it's way onto the wall down in the crew room.
Thanks Randy.
Thomas
Nope, we all have very sharp eyes. Blunt eyes could spot the switch panel though
Thomas, if you're ever in Oxfordshire, England... You can enjoy a beer on me
Tough crowd here for sure!! And here I thought it would just quietly fade away from conscious thought.
I think I should make that switch plate a focal point on shop tours from now on. Everyone will want to see it for themselves. Should I find myself in Oxfordshire, England (and that's not outside the realm of possibility) you're on landroversforever. Cheers.
Thomas
Thomas, I think if anyone might have additional information on this tester, it would be Mac Vandenbrink, the gentleman who scored the meters for your Allen tester last year. If I find out any info, I'll shoot it to you.
Here are a couple of pictures showing the front of the shop, I'm guessing taken in the early 1970's. This is when dune buggies were in vogue, even though there aren't any dunes around here. Those buggies were still fun, and cheap.
The red circled object on the left in front of the shop is one of the jigs used to make spiral stairs. Centered at the top, circled in yellow is the chain around a tree limb that was used as a means to pull engines outside when the lift room was occupied and unavailable.
Going forward 40 years and a bunch of clean up later, here is the shop from about the same angle.
This is a picture you've seen before only now I've learned how to make colored circles! This was take from on top of an electrical power pole about 5 weeks after I bought the property in 2005. The yellow circled object on the right is that chain around the tree limb. That tree was removed about 6 months later. The red circled object is a shop made sheet-metal break and just to the left of it is a small, sheet metal storage shed, grafted to the side of the lift room.
Moving around to the rear of the property...
...is the lean-to under construction at the north end of the Tool Shed in the early 1970's. A wood frame was built and then sheet metal was screwed to it.
Here it is 2012 and just a few months away from de-constuction. That square metal pipe at the bottom of the doors is my door lock. The most valuable item left within.........Dickies tricycle.
I hope this spring to finally get it cleaned out and recycle that building along with the Tool Shed.
Thomas
The red circled object on the left in front of the shop is one of the jigs used to make spiral stairs. Centered at the top, circled in yellow is the chain around a tree limb that was used as a means to pull engines outside when the lift room was occupied and unavailable.
Going forward 40 years and a bunch of clean up later, here is the shop from about the same angle.
This is a picture you've seen before only now I've learned how to make colored circles! This was take from on top of an electrical power pole about 5 weeks after I bought the property in 2005. The yellow circled object on the right is that chain around the tree limb. That tree was removed about 6 months later. The red circled object is a shop made sheet-metal break and just to the left of it is a small, sheet metal storage shed, grafted to the side of the lift room.
Moving around to the rear of the property...
...is the lean-to under construction at the north end of the Tool Shed in the early 1970's. A wood frame was built and then sheet metal was screwed to it.
Here it is 2012 and just a few months away from de-constuction. That square metal pipe at the bottom of the doors is my door lock. The most valuable item left within.........Dickies tricycle.
I hope this spring to finally get it cleaned out and recycle that building along with the Tool Shed.
Thomas
Last edited:
buzzworth
Well-known member
Here's a little item I've been using since 1969. It disappeared last year and I had to buy a new one. Then I found it stuck in the washer. It is so dull from the years of use that when I used the new one, I almost cut my finger off.
Here's a little item I've been using since 1969. It disappeared last year and I had to buy a new one. Then I found it stuck in the washer. It is so dull from the years of use that when I used the new one, I almost cut my finger off.
I had no idea Walker made floor jacks AND nail clippers. Who knew??
Thanks buzzworth.
Thomas
Here's something a little interesting that I found amongst everything...
The note written on a scrap piece of cardboard is "this is not my name... My name is Virgil". Mr Johnson used a uniform service to provide shop shirts with name tags attached. I don't know if the service messed up a whole batch of his name tags or just this one but clearly he wasn't happy about it. This name tag is embroidered while the the tag I found in the yard all by its lonesome...
...is just printed on. I have a photograph of Mr Johnson in the shop in the late 1980s, one of the last ones taken of him still working out there with a patch on the right side of his shirt inscribed "Johnson's Welding" and the patch on his left is identical to the correct spelled one above, could even be the same patch for all I know. That little note with the misspelled name tag will get displayed out in the shop, probably along with the name tag I found. After all, it is his shop.
Thomas
The note written on a scrap piece of cardboard is "this is not my name... My name is Virgil". Mr Johnson used a uniform service to provide shop shirts with name tags attached. I don't know if the service messed up a whole batch of his name tags or just this one but clearly he wasn't happy about it. This name tag is embroidered while the the tag I found in the yard all by its lonesome...
...is just printed on. I have a photograph of Mr Johnson in the shop in the late 1980s, one of the last ones taken of him still working out there with a patch on the right side of his shirt inscribed "Johnson's Welding" and the patch on his left is identical to the correct spelled one above, could even be the same patch for all I know. That little note with the misspelled name tag will get displayed out in the shop, probably along with the name tag I found. After all, it is his shop.
Thomas
ZRX61
Well-known member
I notice on the correctly spelled patch they pretty much copied his handwriting...
Interesting you bring that up Rick. I noticed the very same thing but then thought I was just looking too hard at it. Since we both see that, there might be something to it, especially since that one is printed on and not embroidered. I don't know how that printing process is done.
Thomas
onewaydave
Well-known member
I am more inclined to recall that back in the day schools actually taught handwriting. Today, there are elementary schools that have stopped teaching handwriting. Now they have classes in keyboarding.
I'll save you the rant on calculators.
Cursive writing:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cursive
Palmer method:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmer_Method
Always the odd ball, I went for italic and to this day my written documents look more like printing than cursive.
Bet that Terraplane motor of yours is so quiet you can't even tell its running.
Dave, who drops by now and again to say Hi.
Superlifted06FX4
Well-known member
I talked to my shop teacher, he said he'll take anything you're willing to donate if you want. He's a really old school guy and when I told him about your shop, he said that you find what he'd love to get his hands on.
steve ottinger
New member
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2012
- Messages
- 1
The photo above was copy'ed from facebook,Its one of my ****** scans! the copyright and info is on the back of the real photo. Anyway, this is a photo of my Dad,he was a Harley Davidson expert and won meny awards at the paradise mesa strip and was a member of the S.D.T.A, and a member of the Chula Vista Hi-Way Haunts car club 1950s. He raced a 1939 knuckel head harley with a fuel ijection system he designed him self, almost 50yrs befor Harley Davidson came out with fuel injection. He defenitly was a man ahead of his time.Here is a photo Lou Bingham sent to me of another Jeraulds car..
Someone from the San Diego Roadster Club gave it to him years ago. We have NO INFO on the car , driver or years this photo was taken. Only thing we know for sure is it was taken at Paradise Mesa Drag Strip. This photo was taken by Bob Hardee. A San Diego LEDGED at the local race tracks as Official Track Photographer
The body work on this car reminds me of those fenders I hammed out in a hour for Fred Lobellos Tank for Bonneville this year, Ain't nothing smooth about them ... but they work...
Randy Chenowth
Last edited:
The photo above was copy'ed from facebook,Its one of my ****** scans! the copyright and info is on the back of the real photo. Anyway, this is a photo of my Dad,he was a Harley Davidson expert and won meny awards at the paradise mesa strip and was a member of the S.D.T.A, and a member of the Chula Vista Hi-Way Haunts car club 1950s. He raced a 1939 knuckel head harley with a fuel ijection system he designed him self, almost 50yrs befor Harley Davidson came out with fuel injection. He defenitly was a man ahead of his time.
Hello Steve and thank you so much for posting that information. It fills in some more of the gaps. Once again the power of the internet used for good is demonstrated. How else would we have known about your father and his racing history? He was a pioneer for sure and by the looks of all those trophies a very successful one at that! If you have any other photographs of him or his machines please feel free to post them here or on another thread. It's all a part of history that intrigues me and others here.
Congratulations on your rich family automotive heritage.
Thomas
This is to follow up on some inquiries about the concrete floor in the barn. I had Morton install metal interior walls and they provide a lip on the bottom of the walls...
...seen circled in yellow and red. This lip is the surface that the concrete is poured to and it gives a more finished appearance and when concrete is used provides a continuous seal around the perimeter of the building. Also seen in this photograph are gray electrical conduit used as a means of getting power from the power panel to various parts of the building since I didn't surface mount the electrical on the walls. Hiding the wiring just gives a much cleaner appearance. More on the electrical later.
The concrete is 6" (15.2 cm) thick. The red circled object is one of three electrical outlets installed in the floor. The yellow circle is around a grade stake. That will be the top of the concrete and is used as a reference while it's being poured. Eventually those will be driven down into the concrete. Clearly seen everywhere is the white of the the insulation I used under the concrete. It's 1/4" (.6 cm) thick styrofoam that is vinyl covered on both sides to provide a vapor barrier as well. It's specially designed for this use and more can be found here: http://www.thebarrier.com/
Here you see on the right where the floor insulation hasn't been laid down. The grey tube sticking up in the back is a drain line that goes to a large french drain I installed in opposite corners of the building. Those are what my dehumidifiers drain into.
During the pour. You can see the "highway mat" reinforcement used which is much superior to consumer grade concrete matting. It's literally the same matting used in road or highway construction. This doesn't come in rolls, rather it comes in sheets, it's too stiff to roll up. This mat is lifted to mid point of the thickness of the concrete or about 3" above the insulation once the initial pour is done. There are special "hook" tools which grab the mat and it's worked up from the bottom. The critical thing is to have the mat stationed at the mid point of the thickness. Also note the plastic sheeting taped to the walls. Concrete will splatter when poured and it's a stinker to remove from the finished surfaces. Easier to let to splatter on plastic and then just remove the sheeting later and throw it away later.
Another view of everything. Boards were placed on either side of the electrical conduit to keep it from being crushed by the truck when it was driven over. I had 25% "fly ash" added to the concrete mix to whiten the color up. I wanted to lighten it up for better light reflectivity. That did't quite work out as I had planned.
Here the concrete is being finished with a power troweler. The gentleman to the left is sprinkling concrete dye onto the concrete as it's being troweled. The idea was to sprinkle a little bit in to create swirls in the floor to help hide the tire marks. Big mistake!!!
In theory it should have worked.........but I neglected to tell them a little black dye goes a looooonnnng way. They had never used dye before so they just used heaps of it. I was doing another project right about then and by the time I remembered to tell them to use the dye sparingly it was too late!
Here you can see dye residue on the trowel operator. That stuff was a fine powder and it went everywhere. Remember the 25% fly ash I added that would whited and lighten the color up?? It was completely overwhelmed by the black dye. As a consequence...
...the floor I took pains to try to lighten up turned out very dark.
As it cures it is getting lighter, from almost black to now grey but still not what I had in mind. It does hide tire marks though so I was successful with that.
The "mottled" appearance on the surface was from...
...Kure-N-Seal, 5 coats of it. To strengthen concrete you want to slow down evaporation and sealing the surface really helps with that. The first coat went on just a few hours after the concrete was finished and I could walk on it. Other coats went on every 4-6 hours until all 5 were applied. The Kure-n-Seal will eventually wear away and the mottling will go away as it does.
Here's a better look at the lip detail on the bottom of the walls. It stops wind infiltration and also keeps little creatures (think mice) from burrowing under the walls and getting in.
The floor insulation works exceptionally well. I use ceiling radiant heat and once the floor is warmed up it doesn't conduct cold into the building since it's insulated from the cold ground. The floor isn't a big cold plate now but a warm thermal mass. Highly recommended if you plan on heating the building.
Thomas
...seen circled in yellow and red. This lip is the surface that the concrete is poured to and it gives a more finished appearance and when concrete is used provides a continuous seal around the perimeter of the building. Also seen in this photograph are gray electrical conduit used as a means of getting power from the power panel to various parts of the building since I didn't surface mount the electrical on the walls. Hiding the wiring just gives a much cleaner appearance. More on the electrical later.
The concrete is 6" (15.2 cm) thick. The red circled object is one of three electrical outlets installed in the floor. The yellow circle is around a grade stake. That will be the top of the concrete and is used as a reference while it's being poured. Eventually those will be driven down into the concrete. Clearly seen everywhere is the white of the the insulation I used under the concrete. It's 1/4" (.6 cm) thick styrofoam that is vinyl covered on both sides to provide a vapor barrier as well. It's specially designed for this use and more can be found here: http://www.thebarrier.com/
Here you see on the right where the floor insulation hasn't been laid down. The grey tube sticking up in the back is a drain line that goes to a large french drain I installed in opposite corners of the building. Those are what my dehumidifiers drain into.
During the pour. You can see the "highway mat" reinforcement used which is much superior to consumer grade concrete matting. It's literally the same matting used in road or highway construction. This doesn't come in rolls, rather it comes in sheets, it's too stiff to roll up. This mat is lifted to mid point of the thickness of the concrete or about 3" above the insulation once the initial pour is done. There are special "hook" tools which grab the mat and it's worked up from the bottom. The critical thing is to have the mat stationed at the mid point of the thickness. Also note the plastic sheeting taped to the walls. Concrete will splatter when poured and it's a stinker to remove from the finished surfaces. Easier to let to splatter on plastic and then just remove the sheeting later and throw it away later.
Another view of everything. Boards were placed on either side of the electrical conduit to keep it from being crushed by the truck when it was driven over. I had 25% "fly ash" added to the concrete mix to whiten the color up. I wanted to lighten it up for better light reflectivity. That did't quite work out as I had planned.
Here the concrete is being finished with a power troweler. The gentleman to the left is sprinkling concrete dye onto the concrete as it's being troweled. The idea was to sprinkle a little bit in to create swirls in the floor to help hide the tire marks. Big mistake!!!
In theory it should have worked.........but I neglected to tell them a little black dye goes a looooonnnng way. They had never used dye before so they just used heaps of it. I was doing another project right about then and by the time I remembered to tell them to use the dye sparingly it was too late!Here you can see dye residue on the trowel operator. That stuff was a fine powder and it went everywhere. Remember the 25% fly ash I added that would whited and lighten the color up?? It was completely overwhelmed by the black dye. As a consequence...
...the floor I took pains to try to lighten up turned out very dark.
As it cures it is getting lighter, from almost black to now grey but still not what I had in mind. It does hide tire marks though so I was successful with that. The "mottled" appearance on the surface was from...
...Kure-N-Seal, 5 coats of it. To strengthen concrete you want to slow down evaporation and sealing the surface really helps with that. The first coat went on just a few hours after the concrete was finished and I could walk on it. Other coats went on every 4-6 hours until all 5 were applied. The Kure-n-Seal will eventually wear away and the mottling will go away as it does.
Here's a better look at the lip detail on the bottom of the walls. It stops wind infiltration and also keeps little creatures (think mice) from burrowing under the walls and getting in.
The floor insulation works exceptionally well. I use ceiling radiant heat and once the floor is warmed up it doesn't conduct cold into the building since it's insulated from the cold ground. The floor isn't a big cold plate now but a warm thermal mass. Highly recommended if you plan on heating the building.
Thomas
Last edited:
landroversforever
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2011
- Messages
- 86
I like the finished floor, but I think having it lighter would have made the place feel much bigger. But hey, you have plenty of space for it to not feel small (looking through the eyes of the internet).
For some reason, I had about 55 email notifications about this one post
For some reason, I had about 55 email notifications about this one post
I like the finished floor, but I think having it lighter would have made the place feel much bigger. But hey, you have plenty of space for it to not feel small (looking through the eyes of the internet).
For some reason, I had about 55 email notifications about this one post
I initially was planning on a very light, natural colored floor with occasional dark marbled streaks.........here and there. It was going to be beautiful................sigh...........all light and airy............just beautiful..............Really inviting to the eye and warmth to the soul............
Not sure why the multiple post notifications. Guess the system wanted to make sure you didn't overlook another goof I did out there? Like the switch plate wasn't enough right?
Thomas
landroversforever
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2011
- Messages
- 86
I initially was planning on a very light, natural colored floor with occasional dark marbled streaks.........here and there. It was going to be beautiful................sigh...........all light and airy............just beautiful..............Really inviting to the eye and warmth to the soul............
Not sure why the multiple post notifications. Guess the system wanted to make sure you didn't overlook another goof I did out there? Like the switch plate wasn't enough right?
Thomas
Even the forum Server is against you now
Its not letting us down keeping an eye of the...err.... well... not-as-perfect-as-the-rest-of-it 
Thinking about it... with the floor and the thing used for controlling electron flow that must not be named, they are maintaining equilibrium against the bench, Walker and the rest of the shops! Every action has an equal and opposite reaction and all that
type47fan
Member
Hello all,
My wife works with Thomas as a crew member and mentioned that I might be interested in reading about his activities, off duty in Illinois. This was right before this past Christmas. Today, I finally completed reading (and re-reading some parts) of the entire 218 pages. I had no idea!
I cannot say it any better than all of you have already written. This is a journey of epic proportions. Thomas and Chris have made us a part of the journey. His photo journalistic style is vivid and breathtaking. I can close my eyes and navigate my way around the buildings and property during the various periods reported. To me the story is an emotional roller coaster and is as compelling as any historical, archeological search can be.
The contributions, suggestions, and effort everyone offers speak volumes about the quality of the group. Can't wait to see what is next. . . .
Here's a link to a site with more belly tank, lakester info:
http://www.cb750cafe.com/bikes.php?cat=24
Thanks,
Wayne (type47fan)
My wife works with Thomas as a crew member and mentioned that I might be interested in reading about his activities, off duty in Illinois. This was right before this past Christmas. Today, I finally completed reading (and re-reading some parts) of the entire 218 pages. I had no idea!
I cannot say it any better than all of you have already written. This is a journey of epic proportions. Thomas and Chris have made us a part of the journey. His photo journalistic style is vivid and breathtaking. I can close my eyes and navigate my way around the buildings and property during the various periods reported. To me the story is an emotional roller coaster and is as compelling as any historical, archeological search can be.
The contributions, suggestions, and effort everyone offers speak volumes about the quality of the group. Can't wait to see what is next. . . .
Here's a link to a site with more belly tank, lakester info:
http://www.cb750cafe.com/bikes.php?cat=24
Thanks,
Wayne (type47fan)
Last edited:
hobbitss
Well-known member
This is to follow up on some inquiries about the concrete floor in the barn. I had Morton install metal interior walls and they provide a lip on the bottom of the walls...
...seen circled in yellow and red. This lip is the surface that the concrete is poured to and it gives a more finished appearance and when concrete is used provides a continuous seal around the perimeter of the building. Also seen in this photograph are gray electrical conduit used as a means of getting power from the power panel to various parts of the building since I didn't surface mount the electrical on the walls. Hiding the wiring just gives a much cleaner appearance. More on the electrical later.
The concrete is 6" (15.2 cm) thick. The red circled object is one of three electrical outlets installed in the floor. The yellow circle is around a grade stake. That will be the top of the concrete and is used as a reference while it's being poured. Eventually those will be driven down into the concrete. Clearly seen everywhere is the white of the the insulation I used under the concrete. It's 1/4" (.6 cm) thick styrofoam that is vinyl covered on both sides to provide a vapor barrier as well. It's specially designed for this use and more can be found here: http://www.thebarrier.com/
Here you see on the right where the floor insulation hasn't been laid down. The grey tube sticking up in the back is a drain line that goes to a large french drain I installed in opposite corners of the building. Those are what my dehumidifiers drain into.
During the pour. You can see the "highway mat" reinforcement used which is much superior to consumer grade concrete matting. It's literally the same matting used in road or highway construction. This doesn't come in rolls, rather it comes in sheets, it's too stiff to roll up. This mat is lifted to mid point of the thickness of the concrete or about 3" above the insulation once the initial pour is done. There are special "hook" tools which grab the mat and it's worked up from the bottom. The critical thing is to have the mat stationed at the mid point of the thickness. Also note the plastic sheeting taped to the walls. Concrete will splatter when poured and it's a stinker to remove from the finished surfaces. Easier to let to splatter on plastic and then just remove the sheeting later and throw it away later.
Another view of everything. Boards were placed on either side of the electrical conduit to keep it from being crushed by the truck when it was driven over. I had 25% "fly ash" added to the concrete mix to whiten the color up. I wanted to lighten it up for better light reflectivity. That did't quite work out as I had planned.
Here the concrete is being finished with a power troweler. The gentleman to the left is sprinkling concrete dye onto the concrete as it's being troweled. The idea was to sprinkle a little bit in to create swirls in the floor to help hide the tire marks. Big mistake!!!
Here you can see dye residue on the trowel operator. That stuff was a fine powder and it went everywhere. Remember the 25% fly ash I added that would whited and lighten the color up?? It was completely overwhelmed by the black dye. As a consequence...
...the floor I took pains to try to lighten up turned out very dark.
The "mottled" appearance on the surface was from...
...Kure-N-Seal, 5 coats of it. To strengthen concrete you want to slow down evaporation and sealing the surface really helps with that. The first coat went on just a few hours after the concrete was finished and I could walk on it. Other coats went on every 4-6 hours until all 5 were applied. The Kure-n-Seal will eventually wear away and the mottling will go away as it does.
Here's a better look at the lip detail on the bottom of the walls. It stops wind infiltration and also keeps little creatures (think mice) from burrowing under the walls and getting in.
The floor insulation works exceptionally well. I use ceiling radiant heat and once the floor is warmed up it doesn't conduct cold into the building since it's insulated from the cold ground. The floor isn't a big cold plate now but a warm thermal mass. Highly recommended if you plan on heating the building.
Thomas
The floor looks good... Did you keep it wet and cool after it set and before applying the sealant??.. Being inside and out of the
should have helped keep temperatures down..The special Hook tool used to be made out of scrap Re-Bar bent to shape with a hook on one end and a handle on the other... We also used to use broken bricks to hold up the mesh during the pour.. On some jobs they specify wire towers or bridges to ensure the wire reinforcing material is properly positioned in the slab for optimum strength...
The lamp black appears to have worked better as a surface treatment rather than being added to the mix before being poured...
What strength mix did you order?...
Hello Wayne, you made it to the ATP, congratulations! Somehow your wife got wind of what I was doing here with the shop and told me you'd be interested. Guess she knows you pretty well.
Thank you for the very kind words and also for the great link about lakesters, good stuff that. Those are the kinds of items the group here provides plus they really keep me on my toes. You must know by now there always seems to another project or two in the works so stand by.Welcome my friend.
Thomas
Last edited:
The floor looks good... Did you keep it wet and cool after it set and before applying the sealant??.. Being inside and out of the
The special Hook tool used to be made out of scrap Re-Bar bent to shape with a hook on one end and a handle on the other... We also used to use broken bricks to hold up the mesh during the pour.. On some jobs they specify wire towers or bridges to ensure the wire reinforcing material is properly positioned in the slab for optimum strength...
The lamp black appears to have worked better as a surface treatment rather than being added to the mix before being poured...
What strength mix did you order?...
Joe, the timing of the whole project was weather related. Sept is usually the best time of year for outdoor building projects. Mild, pleasant temperatures, dry and still fairly long sunlight. The concrete was done in mid Oct and being inside it was easy to control the temperature and moisture. You are spot on about the "special hook tool". Just a bent piece of re-bar but it works. As for the mix, I use to know but I've slept since then. My concrete guy would know I'm sure. Might have been 6 bag if that sounds right?
More is coming at ya!Thomas
Firefighter315
Well-known member
Thanks for the update on the floor Thomas! I've been quietly waiting over here in the corner to hear the story on that finish. I like the darkness and think it works great in such a large space. Understanding the benefits of a very light floor for lighting purposes and finding dropped fasteners, it is nice to see something a little different from time to time.
Thanks again!
Erik
I like the darkness and think it works great in such a large space. Understanding the benefits of a very light floor for lighting purposes and finding dropped fasteners, it is nice to see something a little different from time to time. Thanks again!
Erik
old salt racer
Active member
Hey Thomas, glad you& Chris survived the holidays. I hope Randy& Jacob view the post by "type47fan" the pic of Jeraulds belly tank. The circle just keeps going. best wishes, LOU
Thanks for the update on the floor Thomas! I've been quietly waiting over here in the corner to hear the story on that finish.
Thanks again!
Erik
Oh it's different all right, I doubt very much that there is another one like it anywhere. It's just so ironic that I wound up with almost the complete opposite of what I set out to do. Honestly, after the first couple of coats of sealer, the floor was all glossy black, highly reflective and all - it was stunningly cool contrasting with the white walls and ceiling. I starting thinking this isn't so bad after all. Maybe everyone will think I did this on purpose, kind of a designer floor and all.
Over time I've just accepted it and moved on. Here's a very recent photo showing the floor...
...and you can see how it's really lightening up. I don't have any tire marks to contend with and after all, that was the main goal of the exercise. It is after all, just a barn.
Thanks Erik for your patience. As you can see I'm coming down the home stretch with the Barn Bench Build. Just a liiiiittttllle bit more sanding and tweaking. I'm waiting for the hot tub and sauna installation at the moment and wait till you see how the anvil was incorporated.
I should have the final on this post soon.Thomas