The VISES of Garage Journal

[va.grouseman]

Shadow, they look like Morgans and are well made.---I say that the #140 is worth $60.

Here's a few more pics of the 150.

 

[drivesitfar]

VA: how much does your 150 Star N vise weigh? my 6 inch Morgan weighed 142 pounds and your Star N doesn't look like it weighs 100. your Star N looks very clean and thanks for the pictures and the Made in Japan in the cast to maybe help us.

Shadow: that Star N you posted is I think the same vise as was posted earlier by EK. it's probably a 4 inch jaw.

ALL: so Morgan made vises in Japan?? I know they still make vises in the US and several members here have been inside their factory buying vises and parts. DO TELL if you know more about the Japan connection??

 

[ekegelmann]

It's the same one. I'm buying it from the seller. Or am planning on it. Love the look to it

Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

 

[GForceJunky]

Hello all, I'm completely new to this 'vise addiction' and have always wanted to get some vintage vises and floor jacks to add to my arsenal of tools (have many older/vintage/antique hand tools from my grandfather in addition to plenty of modern stuff) but am a little weary of many that I see for sale within a few hours of me. Many of the 'sought after' brands/styles are listed for outlandish prices in unrestored, often less than desirable condition.

Anyhow, I have found a few decently priced smaller vices that I'm looking into but am still searching for a big mama vice.

I stumbled across an ad for one that looks quite old but it doesn't seem to have any location or date stampings on it. I have an email in to the seller to get more info/pictures if possible but the pictures I do have show what looks like the faint outline of a logo of some sort and so I was hoping some of you vise experts could help me figure out what kind of vise it is/where it's made/etc.

Without further adieu...

If anyone has any info or ideas on what I'm looking at it would be much appreciated! Also, an approximate valuation would be great too!

 

[GForceJunky]

Another vise I'm looking at...this one has a little more info on it. Looks like it says Craftsman, but made in England? Is this a rebadged Columbian? Circa ____? I thought all the (older) Craftsman units were USA-made.

What would you guys think is a fair price for this one in this condition?

 

[TreePointer]

I stumbled across an ad for one that looks quite old but it doesn't seem to have any location or date stampings on it. I have an email in to the seller to get more info/pictures if possible but the pictures I do have show what looks like the faint outline of a logo of some sort and so I was hoping some of you vise experts could help me figure out what kind of vise it is/where it's made/etc.

Without further adieu...

Hollands vise. Made in Erie, PA.

Keyword search: HOLLANDS KEYSTONE VISE

 

[GForceJunky]

Hollands vise. Made in Erie, PA.

Keyword search: HOLLANDS KEYSTONE VISE

Awesome! Thanks for the info! Haven't heard of these ones before.

Worth picking her up for $30 I'd assume? Looks to be in pretty good shape.

 

[Fretters]

There is a drawing of one in bits in the catalogue btw.

My memory is getting worse. Couldn't even remember that being in the catalogue.

$40 score the other day. Clean it up a little and put it to work.

That looks in tidy nick, and for a good price.

Another vise I'm looking at...this one has a little more info on it. Looks like it says Craftsman, but made in England? Is this a rebadged Columbian? Circa ____? I thought all the (older) Craftsman units were USA-made.

Although the styling is ever so slightly different, going by the base and the slight dog leg shape at the rear of the body, I'd be tempted to say that may be a Parkinson Handy. Get' bought one a week or two ago:

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5564342&postcount=41827

The general styling makes me more inclined to think it's possibly a Record though.

 

[Lewisthepilgrim]

holly **** 2108 pages? Apparently Vices are a big deal...

Anyone running one that rotate vertically??

 

[PghJKB]

holly **** 2108 pages? Apparently Vices are a big deal...

Anyone running one that rotate vertically??

Pilgrim:

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=228090
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=245875
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=260966
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44782&page=246

The above are a good place to start - BTW based on my research, Parker had the first double jaw vertically rotating vise.

Here is the Barnes patent, assigned to Parker. : http://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageNu...%26S1=0076584.PN.%26OS=pn/76584%26RS=PN/76584

There were quite a number of rotaters that show up in the USPTO database, looks like only a small fraction were either actually made or managed to survive to the present.

JKB

 

[CRSINMICH]

JKB: This is why I love doing research - it keeps leading to more research. When I put your patent number into the site I have been using there was no information except for a notation that the patent had been reissued on October 10, 1876 with the pat number of 7343. That number yielded these images (same images just jiggered around a bit). Chas. Parker was there for that one too. Here's the link to the site I have: http://www.datamp.org/index.php

 

[Jcrapola]

So cool, indeed. Your 104 makes mine wet its self.

Am I the only one on here without a superawesomecool Reed 104? Dammit! I am consumed by jealousy!!

New goal for 2016: find a fixed base Reed!

 

[PghJKB]

JKB: This is why I love doing research - it keeps leading to more research. When I put your patent number into the site I have been using there was no information except for a notation that the patent had been reissued on October 10, 1876 with the pat number of 7343. That number yielded these images (same images just jiggered around a bit). Chas. Parker was there for that one too. Here's the link to the site I have: http://www.datamp.org/index.php

CRS
I always go to the Horse's Mouth - in this case USPTO. Their search engine is a Royal PIA to use, unlike Google, and Datamp everything is there. There is no text search to fall back on, you just have to use brute force category searches and mine the results - talk about results overload! But, hey, the stuff you see is amazing, incredible and at times, stupefying.

JKB

 

[CRSINMICH]

CRS
I always go to the Horse's Mouth - in this case USPTO. Their search engine is a Royal PIA to use, unlike Google, and Datamp everything is there. There is no text search to fall back on, you just have to use brute force category searches and mine the results - talk about results overload! But, hey, the stuff you see is amazing, incredible and at times, stupefying.

JKB

I played with the USPTO site a bit yesterday and I had the same impression - PITA but full of good stuff if you could figure out how to get to it. Thanks again for the link.

 

[bagged89s10]

Am I the only one on here without a superawesomecool Reed 104? Dammit! I am consumed by jealousy!!



New goal for 2016: find a fixed base Reed!

Haha.
I have a second fixed based Reed. Has smooth faced jaws which are a little beat up. Reed 105R.
I put it up on CL for a high price. If it doesn't sell, il also restore it to match the 104R.


My Reed collection is getting Almost as big as my Parker collection. Now I need to find a replacement for the 5" parker 975 I sold.

 

[MShaw]

"PghJKB: Percy Walker had a long career inventing for Parker apparently. On the 1914 patent you can see the hold down bolt minus the wrench. What an innovator he was. Thanks for the link. That patent information is far more complete than what I had."

I guess this means my vise could have been mads between 1910 and 1914 if the patents were implemented sequentially without overlap. If not, then it could be as new as 1930.

Thanks for the info.

 

[exmaxima1]

Another vise I'm looking at...this one has a little more info on it. Looks like it says Craftsman, but made in England? Is this a rebadged Columbian? Circa ____? I thought all the (older) Craftsman units were USA-made.

What would you guys think is a fair price for this one in this condition?

That has to be a re-badged Record vise. Fairly small, so I would put value at $40-$50 max.

 

[GForceJunky]

Thanks for the feedback on the Crafstman vice everyone! Much appreciated. Hoping I can get it for $20-$25 CAD.

Any input on the Hollands Keystone? I assume $30 for it is plenty reasonable (still waiting to hear back on jaw width, etc from the seller but looks to be fairly big based on the pictures).

 

[Fretters]

Thanks for the feedback on the Crafstman vice everyone! Much appreciated. Hoping I can get it for $20-$25 CAD.

Post some more photo's of it if you do get it. If it is a Parkinson, there'll likely be: "RD No. 689821" embossed on the other side of it, and the nut will be an integral part of the main body casting, instead of a separate piece.

 

[GETRIDAONE]

Here is a shot of the odd cast nut. I am making some progress on the C3 I got last week.

 

[slotard]

The 1910 patent was for the swivel base, Patent #976521.

Here is the USPTO URL : http://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?Docid=...&SectionNum=&idkey=NONE&Input=View+first+page


The 1930 patent was for the swivel base wrench (one of principals of the Swivel Base Wrench War), Patent #1778576.

Here is the USPTO URL : http://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?Docid=...&SectionNum=&idkey=NONE&Input=View+first+page

JKB

Can you give me any more info on the Swivel Base Wrench War?

 

[mike_paxton]

Worked on prepping this Wilton woodworking vise for paint yesterday.

Bagged89S10:

You did a great job of getting the Wilton WW vise ready for paint.

Mike

 

[PghJKB]

Can you give me any more info on the Swivel Base Wrench War?

Slo
Here goes:
On 11 Sep 1928 Harry W. Connell of Baldwinsville, NY, patented "a nut having a wrench retaining means". US patent 1,684,215. His nut/wrench combo ended up on INT's NuTyp vise.

On 30 Jun 1930 Lewis L. Turner of Meriden, CT, patented "an improvement in nuts and particularly to nuts which are used in connection with wrenches which it is desirable to hold against complete removal from a nut". US Patent 1,763,021. His nut/wrench combo was assigned to Charles Parker Co. of Meriden CT.

On 14 Oct 1930 Percy H.D. Walker of Meriden, CT, patented an "improvement in clamping devices for various purposes where nuts and bolts are used, with particular reference to providing clamping elements which are to be operated by wrenches and which are particularly designed for use in connection with rotatable vises". US patent 1,778,576. This nut/wrench combo was also assigned to Charles Parker Co. of Meriden CT.

After reading hundreds of patents, and paying particular attention to the claims section, it seems as if the inventors are trying to be specific enough to describe what they had done, but also vague enough that they could cover anyone trying to "invent around" them.

IMHO - Mr. Connell did not make his patent specifically vague enough to be able to sue the pants off Messrs Turner and Walker (maybe even Chas Parker).
Disclaimers:
1. Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one, they all stink.
2. I reserve the right to be wrong.

USPTO Links:
1,684,215
http://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageNu...4,215.PN.%26OS=pn/1,684,215%26RS=PN/1,684,215

1,763,021
http://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageNu...3,021.PN.%26OS=pn/1,763,021%26RS=PN/1,763,021

1,778,576
http://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageNu...8,576.PN.%26OS=pn/1,778,576%26RS=PN/1,778,576

Apologies, no images, but perhaps this will be incentive for those interested to click on the links....

JKB

 

[CwazyWabbit]

Here is a shot of the odd cast nut. I am making some progress on the C3 I got last week.

Good progress sir

I'd say they used a cast in nut as the 'Handy Vise' was the budget vice that they made (at least that's the impression I get from their adverts)

 

[va.grouseman]

PghJKB, images came through on mine.---Thanks for the info and the research.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Cwaz, that's a good link also.---Thanks for yaws time.---I'm banking the info.

 

[dbowling]

Hey everyone just registered so 1st post.. Im getting ready to buy a Rock Island No. 55 from a friend of mine and I can find zero info on it.. Ive only seen it in pictures he sent me but he says its big, 6 in. jaws and at least 24-26 in. long, jaws open to 12 in.. posting a pic of it that he sent me when unloading from truck, hes selling it to me for 65.00 what he paid for it..any information on weight, age etc. would be greatly appreciated..

 

[CRSINMICH]

Hey everyone just registered so 1st post.. Im getting ready to buy a Rock Island No. 55 from a friend of mine and I can find zero info on it.. Ive only seen it in pictures he sent me but he says its big, 6 in. jaws and at least 24-26 in. long, jaws open to 12 in.. posting a pic of it that he sent me when unloading from truck, hes selling it to me for 65.00 what he paid for it..any information on weight, age etc. would be greatly appreciated..

dbowling: Here's a link to information on Rock Island vises.
http://scuttle.dayid.org/wiki/index.php/Rock_Island_Vise

There is no 55 listed but I can tell you that it has a rear swivel jaw and yours looks like the pin is missing. That is NOT a serious problem.

Here's another link to the the vise repair thread in case you need it.
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=252830&highlight=vise+repair+101&page=140

I think you're getting a good deal on a good vise.

Welcome to the thread!

 

[drivesitfar]

DBowling: first off congrats on joining the best forum on the internet and the best thread about vises on the same post.

your Rock Island #55 is an older made one maybe from the 1910's and yours has a swivel rear jaw. not sure if the swivel can be made to work like it was coming out of the factory, but odds are it might. yours is missing the swivel jaw pin and the swivel base that this #52 that is 4.5 inch wide jaws has that was posted on Dayids.org

http://scuttle.dayid.org/wiki/index.php/File:Rockislandno52.jpg

somebody might have more information and a catalog page to give you more, but even though you have a few missing parts if the screw and vise nut and jaws are in good shape and there isn't any huge weld repairs and cracks you have a great vise there.

GF: I have yet to see a Craftsman Heritage badge on an English vise so guessing that badge was just put there by a previous owner. if Record or Parkinson made vices for Craftsman i'm all ears.

JKB: I wish all the history you just posted was about Reed or Rock Island or the 519x's, but thanks for sharing just the same even though I don't have the love for Parker vises like some of the members do. great disclaimer and probably should be used in Free Parking threads where some of the members really get on a rant and maybe don't have a clue.

 

[dbowling]

guys appreciate the welcome and all the information..so its supposed to have a swivel base, how hard is it to replace the swivel jaw pin and can they be bought or do they have to be made?

thanks again.

 

[dbowling]

heres some more pics of it he just sent me..its apart but he says its about 27-29 in. long opened up.

 

[drivesitfar]

DB: swivel pin can be made or bought from one of the members here if you aren't a machinist or know one. you can also use a bolt and just grind it to fit in the hole. I just noticed your swivel jaw is not seized so putting a bolt in the hole to just hold it in place will work fine until you want something that looks maybe a bit better.

that vise is pretty big so you might not want to use a swivel base on it anyway. unfortunately it only has two holes drilled in the base so 2 bolts won't be ideal for using it as a non swivel. if it's going on a steel bench maybe you can weld the base to the bench like some have done or make a stand. it should be ok with 2 screws mounting it to the bench if you are not using really heavy items in it's jaws or pounding on something in the jaws (probably shouldn't pound on it anyway).

you might be missing the sleeve the holds the main screw in the dynamic jaw so shoot some pictures and show us or maybe it is there and just loose. there is also a Vise Repair 101 thread if you need more information on pins and vise repairs in the vintage tool section so have a peek over there too.

good luck

nice looking vise

 

[dbowling]

I was planning on putting a piece of pipe set in the ground in concrete outside my shop and mounting vise to a plate out there after its been painted and rust proofed..will be using it for bending metal to be welded and holding larger items to be welded or ground on.

 

[bluebolt]

Thanks for the feedback on the Crafstman vice everyone! Much appreciated. Hoping I can get it for $20-$25 CAD.

Any input on the Hollands Keystone? I assume $30 for it is plenty reasonable (still waiting to hear back on jaw width, etc from the seller but looks to be fairly big based on the pictures).

I was wondering if you were in Canada, explains why a Craftsman badge would be on a made in England vise.

 

[drivesitfar]

DB: those old swivel jaw vises are pretty stout, but i'd still be a bit careful when bending or hammering on it. where are you located and I or another member might have a swap for you for a maybe better outdoor vise so we can maybe save that swivel vise for a use it might have been made for?

you can go in your GJ profile and put in your location or area like I do and while you are in there you can click on Avatar and download one of your favorite pictures to stay under your DBowling handle like I now have a Bison made out of scrap steel and old tools.

 

[dbowling]

I'm in Rockville, Indiana in the far western part of the state about 15-20 minutes from Illinois.
I haven't picked up the vise yet.. did not see a Avatar tab in my profile section.

 

[CRSINMICH]

dbowling: This 1907 ad should interest you. Notice the swivel base and the pin in the rear swivel jaw. The pictures also illustrates what a swivel jaw was for - to hold odd shaped pieces. This is not your vise but it's close. Here's a link to the GJ page I stole...um..uh...got this ad from. Member B100 has a bit of information about RI history. It's post #4

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=124285

 

[CRSINMICH]

TO ALL VERSA VISE FANS: SEE POST ABOVE. B100 also posted this picture of a Jacobson Machine Mfg. Co vise. This company sold their vise making business to Rock Island.

 

[GForceJunky]

I was wondering if you were in Canada, explains why a Craftsman badge would be on a made in England vise.

Born and raised, but living in the Detroit area now for work. That being said, I go back home (Toronto area) nearly every weekend so I do keep any eye out for stuff in both areas. Unfortunately, Detroit and Toronto seem to be bad markets if you actually want vintage stuff at a bargain/reasonable price...everyone thinks their hunks of junk are worth their weight in gold.

 

[dbowling]

thanks for the pic now I see where the pin goes.. my buddy Im getting it from said he could make me a pin hes a machinist, said he was going to make one for it if he kept it anyway..just not sure if I should get it now that I know they were not really made to be banged on or used to bend stuff.

dbowling: This 1907 ad should interest you. Notice the swivel base and the pin in the rear swivel jaw. The pictures also illustrates what a swivel jaw was for - to hold odd shaped pieces. This is not your vise but it's close. Here's a link to the GJ page I stole...um..uh...got this ad from. Member B100 has a bit of information about RI history. It's post #4

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=124285

 

[CRSINMICH]

thanks for the pic now I see where the pin goes.. my buddy Im getting it from said he could make me a pin hes a machinist, said he was going to make one for it if he kept it anyway..just not sure if I should get it now that I know they were not really made to be banged on or used to bend stuff.

My 2 cents: You won't have too much trouble finding another beater but it will be hard to find another vise like this one. Is there any reason you can't have two vises? That's what passes for logic on this thread.