measuredtwice
Well-known member
Pages 2 and 3 of this PDF show the manufacturing of the screwdrivers.
--> https://static.pbswisstools.com/fileadmin/images/News/Tipps_und_Tricks/04_15_in_24_schritten_en.pdf
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Show us your pb swiss tools!
- Thread starter merbie
- Start date
Pages 2 and 3 of this PDF show the manufacturing of the screwdrivers.
--> https://static.pbswisstools.com/fileadmin/images/News/Tipps_und_Tricks/04_15_in_24_schritten_en.pdf
frankieg
Active member
Great thread!
I just received a NOS set of PB Baumann screwdrivers from Germany. Black Multicraft handles, Ph 1 & 2, slotted 4, 5.5, 6.5, 8. Excellent stuff
I just received a NOS set of PB Baumann screwdrivers from Germany. Black Multicraft handles, Ph 1 & 2, slotted 4, 5.5, 6.5, 8. Excellent stuff
dutchgray
Well-known member
There is some play and the blades do rattle a touch, there always will be with an interchangeable system unless it has a method to tighten up the assembly, which would be slow to use.
pizza
Well-known member
i grabbed these from the recent 25% off sale @ TL:
the PB 6510.R-30 is pretty nice.
it's the Insider Pro Ratchet which is i think AKA "Insider 3"
it feels solid. i like the ratchet, the grip, and the overall ergonomics. nothing feels cheap about it. i also like the aesthetics.
i have two complaints however.
when you have the ratchet direction selector in the middle position (non-ratcheting), there is some substantial slop. it's actually annoying when you're trying to use it as a normal, non-ratcheting screwdriver. not a deal breaker, but it's worth mentioning.
my second complaint concerns its 10-bit magazine. i think it is actually a nice design overall. opening and closing it feels nice. removing and inserting bits also feels pretty good. there's an almost magnetic feel as a bit slides in and the plastic retention clip grabs it. however, the bit in the lower left is hard to access! see how it has less clearance around it? that sidewall on the left is right on it. i put an infrequently used bit there (PZ2) as a workaround. i have small fingers, so i think someone with sausage fingers would have even more trouble.
i decided to put these bits in it:
Slotted 3,4
PH 1,2,3
PZ 2
T 10,15,20,25
(added PH 1,3 and removed Hex 3,4)
this is my first exposure to their screwdriver bits. they're next level, tbh. i think these are probably all i'll buy from now on aside from some more specialty drive profiles and impact-ready bits. i'm pretty sure these are not impact ready, so if i start breaking them, i guess i'm going back to wiha terminator (MaxxTor) bits in my impact driver.
one thing though. the slotted size 5 (1.2x8mm) bit in the above pic won't lock into certain locking bit holders because it won't go in far enough. see how the top part is wider than the hex part?
the PB 6510.R-30 is pretty nice.
it's the Insider Pro Ratchet which is i think AKA "Insider 3"
it feels solid. i like the ratchet, the grip, and the overall ergonomics. nothing feels cheap about it. i also like the aesthetics.
i have two complaints however.
when you have the ratchet direction selector in the middle position (non-ratcheting), there is some substantial slop. it's actually annoying when you're trying to use it as a normal, non-ratcheting screwdriver. not a deal breaker, but it's worth mentioning.
my second complaint concerns its 10-bit magazine. i think it is actually a nice design overall. opening and closing it feels nice. removing and inserting bits also feels pretty good. there's an almost magnetic feel as a bit slides in and the plastic retention clip grabs it. however, the bit in the lower left is hard to access! see how it has less clearance around it? that sidewall on the left is right on it. i put an infrequently used bit there (PZ2) as a workaround. i have small fingers, so i think someone with sausage fingers would have even more trouble.
i decided to put these bits in it:
Slotted 3,4
PH 1,2,3
PZ 2
T 10,15,20,25
(added PH 1,3 and removed Hex 3,4)
this is my first exposure to their screwdriver bits. they're next level, tbh. i think these are probably all i'll buy from now on aside from some more specialty drive profiles and impact-ready bits. i'm pretty sure these are not impact ready, so if i start breaking them, i guess i'm going back to wiha terminator (MaxxTor) bits in my impact driver.
one thing though. the slotted size 5 (1.2x8mm) bit in the above pic won't lock into certain locking bit holders because it won't go in far enough. see how the top part is wider than the hex part?
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Nice! I emailed PB a while ago asking about their bits. According to them, they are impact ready. The sales pitch is that they keep it simple with one type of bit that works for everything.
Not sure I believe that a bit can be optimized for both impact and non impact, but that's what they say.
Not sure I believe that a bit can be optimized for both impact and non impact, but that's what they say.
HenryAZ
MEMBER EMERITUS
How does one create an account at Tool Lady? I used to have a login account prior to the site's redesign, but now it is unrecognized. I have made two orders since the redesign, and the opportunity to create an account was not offered.
pizza
Well-known member
awesome, thanks for letting me know, lemons.
you may be able to do it here, but i'm not sure how functional it is:
https://toollady.com/store/signIn
TL's site is, imo, a complete joke. it's a broken patchwork travesty, and my experience with it has been miserable.
it appears that there's a base site (toollady.com) with its own store and cart system in the upper right (toollady.com/cart) that they couldn't figure out how to use or remove, and then they gave up and stuck another store (toollady.com/store) and cart system (a floating element in the lower right that goes to toollady.com/store/cart) on top of it.
^ two independent cart systems, lol.
notice how the cart in the upper right is empty, but there's 2 items in the lower right.
very annoyingly, the functional cart clears itself. i don't know if it's a time based thing, or if navigating around the site in a certain way causes you to lose your session.
but i've learned my lesson, and now i copy links to each item i want and paste them in a text editor as i go. then when i'm ready, i add everything to my cart and immediately check out.
but hey, support small business, am i right?
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measuredtwice
Well-known member
Toollady changed ownership. I think I've ordered from both the old and new owners. The website could use some improvement. I can say that the customer service is good. During the ownership transition, a mistake in the website description led to me receiving an older out of production item instead of the newer item shown. I notified them and they were quick to make it right and to correct the website description.
pizza
Well-known member
agreed, the CS is good under the current ownership.
one of the screwdriver bits they sent me was wrong. i emailed them, and they got back to me within a day and are sending me the right bit.
one of the screwdriver bits they sent me was wrong. i emailed them, and they got back to me within a day and are sending me the right bit.
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dede2897234
Well-known member
My Entire PB Swiss Collection Bought From Amazon and Only Quality Tools (UK)
100 Degree Metric Hex Key Set
IMG_20201018_162014983 by david_edelman_ohio, on Flickr
100 Degree Metric Hex Key Set
IMG_20201018_162014983 by david_edelman_ohio, on Flickrdede2897234
Well-known member
dede2897234
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3/8" Drive Security Torx and Regular Hex Sockets
IMG_20201213_160154767 by david_edelman_ohio, on Flickr
IMG_20201213_160154767 by david_edelman_ohio, on Flickrdede2897234
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macgee
Well-known member
Got a bunch of PB but these just arrived the other day. Take a hard look at the #0 screwdriver and the #1 screwdriver in foreground and tell me if you notice anything odd about them?
Long hex ball metric set
Long hex ball metric set
measuredtwice
Well-known member
I traced the serial number to the end of the day on Friday and was able to locate factory video footage showing the screwdrivers being manufactured.
Here's a short clip from that video -->
Are they reversed or completely different sizes?
bmwpowere36m3
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2012
- Messages
- 1,125
I traced the serial number to the end of the day on Friday and was able to locate factory video footage showing the screwdrivers being manufactured.
Here's a short clip from that video -->
Are they reversed or completely different sizes?
PH0 appears bigger than PH1
measuredtwice
Well-known member
Yah. It looks like they reversed the markings so he still got a PH0 and PH1. Or maybe the sizes are completely different. I'm not 100% sure but I think they just reversed the markings.
Draftpick1
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- Mar 22, 2018
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- 326
How long have you had these? The current pics don’t show hex at the base of the handle.
macgee
Well-known member
Yes and no, they're significantly different and it doesn't show how much in the pic. I was scratching my head when reaching for a #0 in tool drawer, I grabbed the new driver and then realized I had grabbed the #1. It set off a whole comparison of other drivers form other companies to compare, scratching my head but not too surprised since I had recently found a similar issue from another company.
ISO 8764-1 specs states that the nominal (min) diameter for a #1 is 4.5mm, #0 is 3.0mm. You're allowed by the spec's to go bigger in dia., just not smaller than the nominal per ISO.
These drivers I just received are NOS old version of PB drivers and no longer being made and may have been made prior to ISO 8764 spec requirements stated?
The #1 in pic measured 3.5mm (1.0 mm lower than allowed per ISO spec) and the #0 measured 4mm (+1.0mm over).
I have a PB Swiss Soft Grip #1 version and it measured 4.99mm dia.
I just took a bunch of measurements and photo's that I'll post later another thread, didn't want to go off too off topic here.
I will say Kyle at Tool Lady is great and very pleasant to work with; I will be ordering more bits and other tools soon from her. The 50mm bits are really well made, best I've seen.
NOS #0 on the left & #1 on the right
Both of my PB Swiss #0 drivers, NOS #0 measurement shown
PB Swiss PH #1 NOS measured 3.48mm under the ISO 4.5mm
PB Swiss Soft Grip #1 measured 4.99mm
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Some pics posted previously. Both PH0, but look like different sizes. I think the part of the tips that goes into screws may be the same, just the shaft/shanks are different thicknesses.
Sort of looks the same on yours. The tip on the PH1 looks larger thicker than the PH0, but with a thinner shank.
Hope that makes sense. If you look at the end of the tips on your pic, they look correct. Finer tip on the left.
Sort of looks the same on yours. The tip on the PH1 looks larger thicker than the PH0, but with a thinner shank.
Hope that makes sense. If you look at the end of the tips on your pic, they look correct. Finer tip on the left.
Boring_toast
New member
Out of curiosity, how does the swissgrip hold up to dirty hands? I'm not talking full on grease, but they look like anything more than home electronics work would tear them up. Do they have some longevity when working in not pristine enviroments?
macgee
Well-known member
Some pics posted previously. Both PH0, but look like different sizes. I think the part of the tips that goes into screws may be the same, just the shaft/shanks are different thicknesses.
Sort of looks the same on yours. The tip on the PH1 looks larger thicker than the PH0, but with a thinner shank.
Hope that makes sense. If you look at the end of the tips on your pic, they look correct. Finer tip on the left.
Makes some sense, thanks for the photos.
Like like said, I don't think its a major issue, other than always grabbing the wrong size between the two without squinting my eyes.
Another possible (and big) issue that I learned recently with an important #2ph torque setting blade I had to deal with was that it too was undersized like the PB Swiss #1, causing damage to the tip and screw prematurely and cam'ing out easily.
The diameter of tip plays a big part on how well it fits inside the female socket and how much that tip can handle torque. All PH tips are suppose to have approx 52.5 >- (26+ x2) degree angle on all 4 flanges that flair out far enough to make contact with the screws female socket and the flanges entire length are suppose to go all the way to the top of screw (sometimes beyond), the flanges can continue to keep flairing out beyond the screw but flanges shouldn't stop below the screw top, The max diameter of the flanges dictate this, when the diameter is under the spec'd size then the flanges can stop short of the screw top (depth wise). So less material touching each other that compared to larger diameter one; making it more prone to leveraging out, promoting cam outs. Under sized tips have to take more load for the area touching compared to a standard size one spreading the torque load over a larger area.
The other big factor is tips shape and how blunt it is or how pointy (see pic above). This will dictate how well the flanges meet up in the socket. Can the tip go down enough so all four male and female flanges meet up or does the point stop the tip going further down enough to match the socket? The thickness and side taper of flanges also matter, The female Phillips socket in a screw has 21 compound angles that all have to match, when one is the wrong sizing or wrong angle, it can throw off all the other angles effecting how well they match up and fit with the male. A bad or worn screw also does this. Such an exciting topic, isn't?
Sorry, my apologies I went AWOL on this threads topic. The topic above needs another thread.
Carry on and lets see some more PB Swiss tools and not talk about screw tip shapes.
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measuredtwice
Well-known member
Strange. I have some old and new precision drivers and will take a look at them. Iirc mine don't have such a variation.
That picture makes me think of watermelon jello. The green is OK, but the green caps on the pink handles looks like a Karmann Ghia that had problems in the paint booth!
dede2897234
Well-known member
Dave455
Well-known member
They don’t work that well I’m afraid! At least not as well as the others.
I have very few of the Swissgrips, and they are really not good in dirty environments. Grease and grime gets ground in, they’re hard to clean, and then they pick up grit. They last o.k. if you keep em clean, but they don’t wipe down easily, and they’re not nice to use.
They’re great in a clean environment. Fine for electronics, o.k. for woodworking, just not great for automotive work - at least on the sort of vehicles I work on!
The Multicraft handles (same shape, but hard CAB) are better. The classic handles better still, as they don’t have the texture of the Multicraft.
What would be better still would be a opaque hard material, but PB Swiss, love ‘em as I do, are just not designed for an automotive (or heavy engineering) environment.
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SwissGrip is soft, reminds me of EVA from running shoes. It's definitely faster wearing than dense rubber or hard handles and cuts easily if you catch the handle on sharp metal edges (in my case, PC cases). It also gets grubby very quickly and stays grubby looking (apart from the black Swissgrip).
Despite this, they are my favourite drivers for 'clean' use.
Pics show about two years of daily use at work (electronics lab). The once knobbly parts have mostly worn smooth, and it started to peel in places at one point, but that's smoothed over too. I've worn out many driver tips, but never worn a handle like this before. Still using it though, and the tip is still great.
**** camera at work.
Despite this, they are my favourite drivers for 'clean' use.
Pics show about two years of daily use at work (electronics lab). The once knobbly parts have mostly worn smooth, and it started to peel in places at one point, but that's smoothed over too. I've worn out many driver tips, but never worn a handle like this before. Still using it though, and the tip is still great.
**** camera at work.