Wamsutta
Well-known member
I use a guard whenever there's a grinding disc or a cut-off wheel. I don't trust those things to stay together at 11,000 RPM.
For sanding discs, I leave the guard off.
Best Angle Grinders (2024 Edition)
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For sanding discs, I leave the guard off.
I've never used one with a guard because I just throw them in the dumpster. Always, always use a face shield with an abrasive cut-off wheel. If you don't you are an idiot, when they come apart they will take a chunk right out of your face, guard might help but there's no guarantee.
Beerhippie
Well-known member
I had a 3" cut-off wheel on an air die grinder blow up on me. I was wearing a face shield and a piece of the wheel went right through the wheel, piercing my left earlobe, where it wedged. Hate to think what would have happened without the shield.
It was all worth it, 'though, just to see my boss nearly faint when I asked him to pull that piece of wheel out of my ear. I guess he wasn't good with blood. I had to do it myself.
Galvonzo
Well-known member
Dewalt's DWE402 is my go to for a 4 1/2". They come with a feature where you can flip the tab for the grinder guard so you can adjust the guard by spinning it in one direction. It's not their only grinder that has that feature, its the One Touch guard feature. I just personally prefer a paddle switch vs a side switch or trigger type. Even comes with a lock on button to save your forearm.
When it comes to 6" I just got a Metabo WEP 15-150 not to long ago after I found out you can take it and flip the head 180° which for me makes my thumb land right on the safety paddle switch. Way more ergonomic for me since I dedicated the 6" grinder to just cutting wheels or wire wheeling.
Both features learned from RTFM. Who would have known.
Main question is what do you need from your grinder? That'll tell you what grinder you need.
When it comes to 6" I just got a Metabo WEP 15-150 not to long ago after I found out you can take it and flip the head 180° which for me makes my thumb land right on the safety paddle switch. Way more ergonomic for me since I dedicated the 6" grinder to just cutting wheels or wire wheeling.
Both features learned from RTFM. Who would have known.
Main question is what do you need from your grinder? That'll tell you what grinder you need.
Hohn
Well-known member
Good catch-- the brake is indeed mechanical. It works. I love this grinder so much. GA5093 is variable speed.
Hohn
Well-known member
Horses for courses. I have both lock on slides and lock off triggers and they each have their place. The lock on is great for anything I will be using for long sessions. Lock off is safer for sure.
I find I end up with lock on for the small grinders that I'm capable of using for longer sessions. The big stuff always has a lock off because 1) it can do a lot of damage if run away and 2) I can't last long enough on one to benefit from the lock-on anyhow.
Hohn
Well-known member
Yeah, it wasn't until I nearly burned my hands THROUGH the leather gloves that I realized the 5" cup brush I was using to refinish cast iron cookware was 1) too big for my 4.5" Hitachi and 2) oversped as well.
That dang Hitachi just keeps going. And I always check the speed rating of the attachment now. I got away with what I probably shouldn't have. That experience is probably why I have three Hitachis and only two Makitas. (and I'm a makita fanboy).
Hohn
Well-known member
These thinner and thinner cutoffs are indeed more efficient because they remove less material but dang if they don't scare me thinking about how easily they must come apart if you aren't precise in movement. But that's how you make a cordless cutoff tool viable I suppose.
neophyte
Well-known member
A shattering grinding wheel won’t just take a chunk out of your face.
The wheel shrapnel can literally kill a person if it hits the person in the chest.
Years ago, someone posted a link to a Russian website with pictures of grinding accidents, and a bunch of the pictures were dead guys with thin grinding wheels sticking out of their chests and heads and faces, after the grinding wheels broke.
The point of grinding and cutting guards is to direct to shrapnel away from the grinder user.
This is the reason thinner cutting wheels gave specific guards that enclose the wheel on two sides like an envelope, instead of just on top and behind like a regular grinding guard.
This is also the reason guards for cup wheels practically surround the entire cup wheel.
Even with a guard fractured wheel shrapnel can still hit a person and cause injury, but usually because of ricochet, were the velocity is lower.
Modern grinders with more easily removed guards are usually done so so the guard can be switched out to the correct guard for safe grinder usage, whether for cup grinding, or cutting, or when grinding or cutting material requiring dust collection, like masonry.
neophyte
Well-known member
There are diamond coated steel “multipurpose” cutting wheels for cutting steel with a grinder.
The advantage is the diamond coated steel wheels will not shatter (or likely not) and don’t become smaller with use.
The disadvantage is most tests seem to show the steel wheels cut slower.
Hohn
Well-known member
I have more time than spare body parts. I might look into those.
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Also the benefit of not putting the material from the wheel into the air
IndyGarage
Well-known member
I have a couple Hitachis and they work almost as well as a similar model Makita. No problem with them (now named Metabo HPT).
It seems you are always faced with trying to cut something with limited access.
Yes I like the thin blades, but they are very delicate. I always try to keep my body out of line with the spinning blade because they are going to let go from time to time when they get pinched. Although they are more durable than you think they are It's always a surprise. What I think is more dangerous is a wire wheel getting out of control. I'd say the angle grinder is one of the more dangerous tools in the shop.
I'd rather spend money on multiple grinders than just one more expensive unit. I think I now have six 4.5" grinders.
I look at least 7-8 amps and a good price. Make my decision and buy it.
1 Cman Professional, 3 DeWalts, a Hitachi, and a Masterforce from Menards.
Not counting the HF $10 coupon grinder bought specifically for CMU cutting as a sacrificial unit and still working.
I look at least 7-8 amps and a good price. Make my decision and buy it.
1 Cman Professional, 3 DeWalts, a Hitachi, and a Masterforce from Menards.
Not counting the HF $10 coupon grinder bought specifically for CMU cutting as a sacrificial unit and still working.
rlitman
Well-known member
Another advantage is far less grinding dust. The only sparks thrown are from the metal, rather than 75% of it being from the wheel. The less sparks do make it appear to be slower, but that doesn't actually mean it is cutting slower.
I think a lot of the cut speed has to do with what you're cutting. For slicing into mild steel, I don't feel much of a difference. But the other day I needed to cut some HSS rods, and the diamond wheel was painfully slow so I switched to an old fashioned abrasive cutoff for that one.
neophyte
Well-known member
Cup brush wheel sizes, and even straight brush wheel sizes, recommended for angle grinders, and usually smaller than the recommended disk size.
2/3 or smaller of the specified disc size when using a wire cup brush probably isn’t a bad idea. (Ie. 3” or less for s 4-1/2” grinder).
Straight wire wheels that are recommended are usually also smaller. Maybe 4” for a 5” grinder.
I have multiple of the Lenox diamond wheels for this purpose. I still use the thin abrasive wheels on my 3" air cutoff tools, with the guard in place, but otherwise prefer the Lenox diamond wheels on larger applications. Yes, they cost a lot more and cut slower, but safety comes at a cost and I'm willing to make that sacrifice. And yes, I wear proper PPE.
So, either the "die grinder" didn't have a guard on it, or?
A "real" die grinder doesn't have a guard as it's meant for carbide burrs- why they're called "die grinders". Yes, I realize you can buy a mandrel and mount an abrasive wheel on it, but... that can come with hazards since there is no guard. Is that what happened?
A proper 3" air cutoff tool made for an abrasive wheel has a ~180* guard around the wheel. For this purpose- abrasive cutoff wheels can explode. And I'm sure we all know this, but just to clarify what exactly happened.
Beerhippie
Well-known member
You, sir, are correct in all essentials. It was the tool I had at the time. I should have started a gauge in the new ear piercing, but let it heal instead.
GaryM909
Well-known member
So, either the "die grinder" didn't have a guard on it, or?
A "real" die grinder doesn't have a guard as it's meant for carbide burrs- why they're called "die grinders". Yes, I realize you can buy a mandrel and mount an abrasive wheel on it, but... that can come with hazards since there is no guard. Is that what happened?
A proper 3" air cutoff tool made for an abrasive wheel has a ~180* guard around the wheel. For this purpose- abrasive cutoff wheels can explode. And I'm sure we all know this, but just to clarify what exactly happened.
I have always used a die grinder with a mandrel and 2" or 3" disc. The type of work I did at the time did not allow any room for any type of guard. One time a disc flew apart and clipped my nose while my welding helmet got hung up on a pipe. Five stitches and hurt like hell. That was back in 1998 and I still have the scar.
A "real" die grinder doesn't have a guard as it's meant for carbide burrs- why they're called "die grinders". Yes, I realize you can buy a mandrel and mount an abrasive wheel on it, but... that can come with hazards since there is no guard. Is that what happened?
A proper 3" air cutoff tool made for an abrasive wheel has a ~180* guard around the wheel. For this purpose- abrasive cutoff wheels can explode. And I'm sure we all know this, but just to clarify what exactly happened.
I have always used a die grinder with a mandrel and 2" or 3" disc. The type of work I did at the time did not allow any room for any type of guard. One time a disc flew apart and clipped my nose while my welding helmet got hung up on a pipe. Five stitches and hurt like hell. That was back in 1998 and I still have the scar.
Wamsutta
Well-known member
Can we get back to talking about high end, electric right angle grinders?
What do you think about the Metabo W 13-150 Quick ?
6-inch disc at 10,000 RPM. No variable speed. No electronic speed control. Simple basic grinder with no electronics.
What do you think about the Metabo W 13-150 Quick ?
6-inch disc at 10,000 RPM. No variable speed. No electronic speed control. Simple basic grinder with no electronics.
Can we get back to talking about high end, electric right angle grinders?
What do you think about the Metabo W 13-150 Quick ?
6-inch disc at 10,000 RPM. No variable speed. No electronic speed control. Simple basic grinder with no electronics.
looks nice, but aside from longevity concerns, is electronic speed control (not variable) actually bad? i like bells and whistles, lol.
the most compelling 'dumb' 5" grinder i've seen so far is the one that @scooby074 mentioned.
the most interesting (to me personally) 5" grinders that i've seen are:
- makita 9005B -- $190, 6.6lb, 12krpm, canada. seems super bulletproof, but main downside is the weight at 6.6lb.
- metabo WEV 15-125 Quick (600468420) -- $270, 5.5lb, 2.8–11krpm, germany. seems to have most or all of bells and whistles including variable speed with no real downsides except for the $270 price (and longevity concerns inherent to the bells and whistles)
- metabo hpt G13VE2 -- $170, 3.75lb, 1500W, china. brushless, very lightweight.
i'm still leisurely browsing, though.
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is there a model number guide somewhere for metabo's grinders?
i get some things like V is variable, P is paddle. some of the other letters elude me. like idk what precisely E means.
but what about the numbers?
ok, so e.g. 15-125, the first number is the motor size or something like that. bigger's better. but what about the second number?
and then there are models like 1500-125... where does 1500 fit into the above lineup? lol
i get some things like V is variable, P is paddle. some of the other letters elude me. like idk what precisely E means.
but what about the numbers?
ok, so e.g. 15-125, the first number is the motor size or something like that. bigger's better. but what about the second number?
and then there are models like 1500-125... where does 1500 fit into the above lineup? lol
Wamsutta
Well-known member
looks nice, but aside from longevity concerns, is electronic speed control (not variable) actually bad? i like bells and whistles, lol.
the most compelling 'dumb' 5" grinder i've seen so far is the one that @scooby074 mentioned.
pretty universally praised as heavy duty and abuse resistant. old design, very battle tested, looks like all metal housing, possibly made in canada...
the most interesting (to me personally) 5" grinders that i've seen are:
the last two are variable speed which i think is nice for versatility, and i don't think they're gimped. i really do wonder which is the most powerful and could cut fastest with a 5" disc. i somehow suspect the brushless one could win but idk. it's the most powerful on paper...
- makita 9005B -- $190, 6.6lb, 12krpm, canada. seems super bulletproof, but main downside is the weight at 6.6lb.
- metabo WEV 15-125 Quick (600468420) -- $270, 5.5lb, 2.8–11krpm, germany. seems to have most or all of bells and whistles including variable speed with no real downsides except for the $270 price (and longevity concerns inherent to the bells and whistles)
- metabo hpt G13VE2 -- $170, 3.75lb, 1500W, china. brushless, very lightweight.
i'm still leisurely browsing, though.speed
I'm afraid if I had electronic speed control, I wouldn't know how much pressure I'm applying to the implement. I try not to put too much pressure on a grinding wheel because I'm trying to keep the metal as cool as possible. Metal doesn't grind well when it gets softened up from the heat. When I hear the RPMs drop, I let up on the pressure so that I can keep the metal cool.
I wouldn't recommend a rat tail grinder. The reason why is you have a limited area from which to hold the grinder from. With my little side switch Bosch, I'm changing my grip placement all over the place to get in the most comfortable position.
Then there's the trigger on the rat tail grinder. You have to squeeze the trigger and then press a separate button to lock it on. That's two steps every single time. With the side switch, on and lock on are all done in one step.
Wamsutta
Well-known member
I went to the welding store today to look at Metabo. Oh man. 
You know how when you pickup a tool and you immediately feel the quality?
The 5-inch felt right at home, but the 6-inch, that thing is heavy as a mother-effer.
You know how when you pickup a tool and you immediately feel the quality?
The 5-inch felt right at home, but the 6-inch, that thing is heavy as a mother-effer.
KnurledNut
Well-known member
I’ve used Dewalt, B&D, Makita, Hilti, Hitachi, Metabo, and others.
The only one I wouldn't recommend was Milwaukee (bearings and gears).
The only one I wouldn't recommend was Milwaukee (bearings and gears).
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Wamsutta
Well-known member
I forgot to mention the spring loaded guard adjustment lever is sweet! Super smooth. Snick-Snick.
scooby074
Well-known member
is there a model number guide somewhere for metabo's grinders?
i get some things like V is variable, P is paddle. some of the other letters elude me. like idk what precisely E means.
but what about the numbers?
ok, so e.g. 15-125, the first number is the motor size or something like that. bigger's better. but what about the second number?
and then there are models like 1500-125... where does 1500 fit into the above lineup? lol
As best as I can tell about Metabo's naming convention. I could find no official list
W= Angle Grinder or Winkelschleifer
E= Electronic. Soft start and Constant speed under load.
V= Variable speed
P= Paddle {?)
B= Brake
A= Aerial Lanyard Connection for overhead work (not 100% sure.). Might be Autobalancer system instead
DS= Deadmans switch
M-Brush= Metabo lifetime brush system
HT= High Torque, low speed
15= Wattage in 100's
125= Disk diamater in mm
Quick= Quick change disk
RT= Rat tail
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scooby074
Well-known member
Agree with his grinder conclusions 100%. Also agree with his grinding wheel opinions 100%
The Metabos are high performance, high luxury, that might not take abuse, like a Mercedes and the Makitas are just tanks that keep going in the shittiest conditions.
Those small, cheap, low power Bosch are just that, small, and cheap. But do serve a purpose. I have the same ones.
I dont have any Rigid grinders, but I do have a Milwaulkee cordless, which I assume is very similar to the Ridgid cordless he had. I agree, handy for quick work but for the real heavy stuff, its hard to beat corded. Mine gets used for deburring 90% of the time.
you guys ever check out the fein cg 15 series ('premium series')? seems like an ultimate bells and whistles grinder, but holy **** $320
CG 15-125 BL (72226760120)
CG 15-125 BL (72226760120)
scooby074
Well-known member
you guys ever check out the fein cg 15 series ('premium series')? seems like an ultimate bells and whistles grinder, but holy **** $320
CG 15-125 BL (72226760120)
Not familiar with that model, but I have looked at Fein grinders in the past. One thing that I remember about them was that they were supposed to be very safe. The electronics wouldnt start unless you had the wheel against the metal and two hands on the tool. Seemed like a solution looking for a problem at that time. Plus they were extra expensive.
I have a Fein multitool and IMHO its the best out there, so Im sure their grinders have the same build quality and smoothness. Just the price puts them out of contention for a tool like a grinder.
scooby074
Well-known member
I think those models are no longer made. Pretty sure that only the most extreme safety **** jobsites bought them. Youre required to touch the 2 gray pads to start then maintain contact with one set to keep the machine running. A real PITA.
Wamsutta
Well-known member
you guys ever check out the fein cg 15 series ('premium series')? seems like an ultimate bells and whistles grinder, but holy **** $320
CG 15-125 BL (72226760120)
That slide switch at the top-center won't work for me. I gotta have it on the left side.
what a major PITA that would be. just like my hand held blender, gotta press 2 buttons using 2 hands to start it. I wish I had my old one .I think those models are no longer made. Pretty sure that only the most extreme safety **** jobsites bought them. Youre required to touch the 2 gray pads to start then maintain contact with one set to keep the machine running. A real PITA.
Squez
Well-known member
All 5 of my grinders are Makita…
neophyte
Well-known member
Fein generally makes really good tools, at least if the models are the ones made in Germany, or at least Europe.you guys ever check out the fein cg 15 series ('premium series')? seems like an ultimate bells and whistles grinder, but holy **** $320
CG 15-125 BL (72226760120)
I’m not familiar with their current offerings and motor tech though.
Fein used to be, and may still be, primarily an “Industrial” manufacturer aimed at high end industrial and professional use, were performance and safety is the main concern, although they do have some lower cost tool models available nowadays.
Their “lower cost” tools are basically trying to compete with Milwaukee, Dewalt, Bosch, etc. rather than Black & Decker, or Harbor Freight.
If you think $320 is expensive, their basic small 4-1/2” angle grinders used to have a list price of $300, and a street price of at least $200 if you could even find a dealer discounting the tools, and this was 25 years ago.
neophyte
Well-known member
This grinder was introduced to the market right before the 2008+/- recession.I think those models are no longer made. Pretty sure that only the most extreme safety **** jobsites bought them. Youre required to touch the 2 gray pads to start then maintain contact with one set to keep the machine running. A real PITA.
I think this was around the time Hilti had their “high end” “fancy”, tool models that were made in Europe, and that Hilti tried to sell in a display at Home Depot.
Both manufacturers got screwed by the recession, and simplified their tool models for a decade or more afterward.
Hilti moved the production of most lower cost tool models to China.
Fein is very concerned with safety features, and a bunch of the grinders they manufacture and have manufactured in the past had safety features that were uncommon, or unavailable on other manufacturers tools.
There was a series of grinders with guards that could basically not be removed without special tools, to prevent idiots from removing the guards.
Most if not all tools had safety electronics to shut of the tool in case of power interruption, and electronics to maintain tool speed etc.
There were usually dust collection guards available for most tools well before they were offered by other manufacturers.
The standard Fein vacuums were always designed to be safe for asbestos, once outfitted with a Hepa filter, well before the standard was common in shop vacs.
As far as the grinder with the touch pads.
I think it was designed to prevent accidental startup by idiots, and to shut off the grinder quickly if dropped.
The touch pads also shouldn’t be affected by dust, or by by material getting stuck in the slide switch or paddle, which could sometimes be an issue with a lot of other grinders when using the grinder on material like wood.
(Having a grinder with a chainsaw type blade, or wire brush, that won’t shut off without unplugging the grinder is a major safety issue)
The motor design also had unusual brush placement to prevent issues that must have happened in older designs.
A bunch of people hot really good deals on this Fein grinder model when Fein basically clearanced it.
it's a weird spot, but i'm sure i can get used to it.
i ended up getting it – that fein CG 15-125 BL (72226760120)
got it from zoro along with three lenox metalmax diamond discs:
2x 5" type 1 (1972922)
1x 4.5" type 27 (2044467) (can do some light grinding)
all in for $317 after a 20% off coupon.
i had never heard of these discs that are suitable for steel. i've only used the masonry ones which were not really good for that. maybe there's some new binding process.
i'm on board. i don't need the fastest cuts possible. safety's more important to me. i also didn't realize that the normal cutoffs (fiber with thin layer of abrasive around circumference) go bad over time and can get more dangerous. not that i've ever had a disc of any kind explode on me, i've always been a little worried, lol. i'll toss all my old, mid- and low-brand ones and buy top-brand thin kerf cutoffs if i ever really need to. but honestly, these metal diamond cutoffs are probably fine for me.
speaking of cutting discs, i have read remarks about the annoyance of some type of disc shrinking over time and cutting slower due to reduced radius. i've never heard of such a cutoff disc. what's up with those?
Wamsutta
Well-known member
Why? Everything that could be wrong with a grinder is wrong with that grinder. The slide switch is on top; plus, it looks like the side handle is 90 degrees to the barrel. That's going to tear your wrist up. All modern grinders have the side handle at an angle to facilitate an ergonomic angle for the wrist. Even Makita does that now. For $300 you could've bought any of the German Metabo's. I'm disappointed as all hell and back.
