British Tool Manufacturers
- Thread starter Dave455
- Start date
Ton ton
Well-known member
I'm good with King ****.
twagler
Well-known member
Here's my contribution to this British tool manufacturers thread - another King **** tool kit.
Here's a close up of the larger ones - two 1-5/8", then a 1-3/16" and 1-1/4" combo, and a 1-1/16" and 1" combo. So this is pretty much the most useless set of spanners ever - I don't use any of those sizes! And the tolerances are lousy - they all have significant slop on fitting those nominal sizes.
The set did come in a rather nice kit case though.
The Sykes label refers to a W.E. Sykes lubrication oil testing machine that I purchased by surplus auction from the National Research of Canada laboratories here where I live in Ottawa, Canada. This tool kit was stuffed in the base of this machine along with some other specialty tools and was obviously a custom set of tools specifically intended to fit bolts/nuts on this machine. I arrived on site to pick this machine up with my 4-cyl Toyota Corolla and 5x10 dual axle flat bed. The loading staff started laughing and said the machine weighed 4000 lbs. I ended up calling a scrapper to come to site and take it away. The scrapper paid me $50 and I salvaged the tool kit and the large access doors on the machine base, which were surprising cast aluminum!
Anyways, the tool kit isn't too useful but I still get an immature chuckle everytime I happen to spot these King Dicks sitting on my shelf.
Regards, Tom
Here's a close up of the larger ones - two 1-5/8", then a 1-3/16" and 1-1/4" combo, and a 1-1/16" and 1" combo. So this is pretty much the most useless set of spanners ever - I don't use any of those sizes! And the tolerances are lousy - they all have significant slop on fitting those nominal sizes.
The set did come in a rather nice kit case though.
The Sykes label refers to a W.E. Sykes lubrication oil testing machine that I purchased by surplus auction from the National Research of Canada laboratories here where I live in Ottawa, Canada. This tool kit was stuffed in the base of this machine along with some other specialty tools and was obviously a custom set of tools specifically intended to fit bolts/nuts on this machine. I arrived on site to pick this machine up with my 4-cyl Toyota Corolla and 5x10 dual axle flat bed. The loading staff started laughing and said the machine weighed 4000 lbs. I ended up calling a scrapper to come to site and take it away. The scrapper paid me $50 and I salvaged the tool kit and the large access doors on the machine base, which were surprising cast aluminum!
Anyways, the tool kit isn't too useful but I still get an immature chuckle everytime I happen to spot these King Dicks sitting on my shelf.
Regards, Tom
I'm new here, about 10 minutes new. I found this website and thread when attempting to find out more about a British tool brand I know little about; Swinborne. I bought this set for beer money because I have been restoring a car at a remote lockup and didn't want to lose any King **** or Britool if I had a break in.
These really are good tools the equivalent in many respects of Britool but with a much nicer ratchet. They must have had limited manufacturing capability though; they didn't supply a spark plug socket and the one in the slot provided in the tray is a King **** addition,
These really are good tools the equivalent in many respects of Britool but with a much nicer ratchet. They must have had limited manufacturing capability though; they didn't supply a spark plug socket and the one in the slot provided in the tray is a King **** addition,
RickyPetite
Well-known member
I just finished the book "The Splendid and the Vile" which is about Winston Churchill and WWII. Fabulous book BTW, makes you realize how lame our current politicians are when compared to Churchill. The book also brings you into WWII and makes you realize how amazing the British Air Force (BAF) was in protecting England from German bombing.
In any event as an American, I have renewed respect for British perseverance and the grit of their armed forces. If Britools were good enough for the RAF, they are good enough for me. Think I'll look for a vintage set.
In any event as an American, I have renewed respect for British perseverance and the grit of their armed forces. If Britools were good enough for the RAF, they are good enough for me. Think I'll look for a vintage set.
I must take some time to read this entire thread but I notice King **** and Britool appear frequently in comments. I have a preference for King **** and gave my Britool to my sons. I did however keep one set.
This was bought from the Neill Tools factory shop Sheffield circa 1983, it is a 1/4 drive metric and AF set. It has seen a lot of action and has worn well with the exception of the ratchets. The original on the left was troublesome from new, is relatively unused and is now a rare ratchet. The 90s ratchet addition on the right has done all of the work and failed recently. I discovered, all credit to Britool, that Facom still manufacture a version of that ratchet. It is repaired with a Facom repair kit.
This was bought from the Neill Tools factory shop Sheffield circa 1983, it is a 1/4 drive metric and AF set. It has seen a lot of action and has worn well with the exception of the ratchets. The original on the left was troublesome from new, is relatively unused and is now a rare ratchet. The 90s ratchet addition on the right has done all of the work and failed recently. I discovered, all credit to Britool, that Facom still manufacture a version of that ratchet. It is repaired with a Facom repair kit.
Last edited:
four.cycle
Well-known member
Swinborne / A. Swinborne Ltd., Braintree, Essex /
I am finding nothing on this company. Not even on gracesguide.uk (except for a "Swinborne" jelly mold.)
Cross your fingers. Dave455 might know something.
That set is fabulous.
Welcome to the site!
I am finding nothing on this company. Not even on gracesguide.uk (except for a "Swinborne" jelly mold.)
Cross your fingers. Dave455 might know something.
That set is fabulous.
Welcome to the site!
My classic Mini tool draw contains tools from a number of British tool manufacturers, I think only King **** and Tecalemit are still standing. Represented are:
King ****, my favored tool brand
Britool, 1/4 socket set
Brades, hammer
Tecalemit, grease gun
Spear and Jackson (Bedford), BA spanners
Williams Super Slim, brake and pipe spanners
Eclipse, roll pin drift
PCL, tyre pressure and depth gauges
King ****, my favored tool brand
Britool, 1/4 socket set
Brades, hammer
Tecalemit, grease gun
Spear and Jackson (Bedford), BA spanners
Williams Super Slim, brake and pipe spanners
Eclipse, roll pin drift
PCL, tyre pressure and depth gauges
Last edited:
I regret that I know very little about Swinborne, other than they are obviously very high quality tools. I saw one set that had been used in a workshop environment for years, and the sockets had very little noticeable wear.I'm new here, about 10 minutes new. I found this website and thread when attempting to find out more about a British tool brand I know little about; Swinborne. I bought this set for beer money because I have been restoring a car at a remote lockup and didn't want to lose any King **** or Britool if I had a break in.
These really are good tools the equivalent in many respects of Britool but with a much nicer ratchet. They must have had limited manufacturing capability though; they didn't supply a spark plug socket and the one in the slot provided in the tray is a King **** addition,
The only Swinborne tools I’ve ever seen are 1/2” square drive sockets and accessories, often in sets similar to the one shown. I’ve seen a few different variations, and most look to date between the 60’s and early 70’s.
Other than personal knowledge (and a stupid memory for obscure details) the best way to date patterns of tools is by looking at government contract tools. They all include a date of manufacture, so one can put a certain style at a certain date. Unfortunately, I have only seen 3 or 4 of these sets, and never a government contract one.
In post war Britain there still seemed to be a good deal of regional variation as to the tools commonly available. My family, in the south, tended to use a lot of Britool, King ****, Bedford etc, but there were other makers whose tools were seldom seen.
Different makers were seen in different industries too. My family have always been involved in the automotive, aircraft and small engineering sectors. A friend who’s family have a history of railway work has an extensive collection of Tipco and Garrington, but I seldom saw those.
I really have no idea where, or for which sector, Swinborne tools were made. Yes, there was an A. Swinborne Ltd based in Essex, but if that’s the same firm I’m surprised I haven’t seen more.
The set shown looks to be one of the best examples I’ve seen. You obviously got a fantastic deal on it as the name is relatively unknown, but don’t let that detract from the quality of the set. Given it’s rarity, maybe even uniqueness in that condition, I’d probably be tempted to keep it pristine and maybe get a used Gordon set or suchlike to use?
Very nice! Sir - you have excellent taste!My classic Mini tool draw contains tools from a number of British tool manufacturers, I think only King **** and Tecalemit are still standing. Represented are:
King ****, my favored tool brand
Britool, 1/4 socket set
Brades, hammer
Tecalemit, grease gun
Spear and Jackson (Bedford), BA spanners
Williams Super Slim, brake and pipe spanners
Eclipse, roll pin drift
PCL, tyre pressure and depth gauges
As well as King **** and Tecalemit, I’m pleased to say that Spear and Jackson, Eclipse, and PCL are all still going.
Neither Spear & Jackson or Eclipse produce either the range, and in most cases not the quality, that they used to, although some times one is pleasantly surprised. Eclipse lathe tools and magnetic products are still decent, as were the last saw blades I bought.
PCL (Pneumatic Components Ltd.) produce very decent stuff at reasonable prices.
Ton ton
Well-known member
Welcome to garage journal.I must take some time to read this entire thread but I notice King **** and Britool appear frequently in comments. I have a preference for King **** and gave my Britool to my sons. I did however keep one set.
This was bought from the Neill Tools factory shop Sheffield circa 1983, it is a 1/4 drive metric and AF set. It has seen a lot of action and has worn well with the exception of the ratchets. The original on the left was troublesome from new, is relatively unused and is now a rare ratchet. The 90s ratchet addition on the right has done all of the work and failed recently. I discovered, all credit to Britool, that Facom still manufacture a version of that ratchet. It is repaired with a Facom repair kit.
Thank you @Dave455 for sharing your understanding of Swinborne. My felling is that the company was initially a supplier of industrial impact sockets. The standard socket range I have always assumed was aimed at the DIY market, probably in the 60s / 70s.
Like yourself I have only ever seen 1/2 sockets and I have never seen a breaker or spark plug socket. The quality is very good though. I paid £28 for my set delivered, it showed no signs of having being used and it has served me well on a full nut and bolt restoration of a Golf. I'm not a tool collector but I do look after my tools. The set's next task is a full restoration of a classic Mini.
Like yourself I have only ever seen 1/2 sockets and I have never seen a breaker or spark plug socket. The quality is very good though. I paid £28 for my set delivered, it showed no signs of having being used and it has served me well on a full nut and bolt restoration of a Golf. I'm not a tool collector but I do look after my tools. The set's next task is a full restoration of a classic Mini.
Last edited:
I'm not sure King **** are as British as they make out. I've bought King **** spanners and sockets new in recent years and have had a small number of warranty claims. The customer service is excellent and on occasions I've dealt directly with the Managing Director.
I hope I've not got this wrong but the forgings are currently Chinese, the tools are finished here in UK. In other words part UK manufactured. When I questioned never in the past having had any issues with forgings I'm certain I was told that the early tools I bought would have been German forgings. Again the tools were finished here in UK.
I think you have to go back a good number of years for King **** tools to be fully UK manufactured.
Ton ton
Well-known member
Interesting info.
vssjim
ALLIANCE MEMBER
I agree a lot of newer as in the last twenty years King **** tools look more Taiwan and less British period some do not but a lot due and it's not like they show a video of production and like things that I know of.
Well, if you read my post carefully, I said that King **** tools are “made in the u.k. FOR THE MOST PART! Some items are definitely not made in the U.K. (screwdrivers and pliers) and other items are undoubtedly forged elsewhere. I was told Germany too!
About 20 years back I had to source some BS ring spanners (box end wrenches) for a colleague. He’d bought Gedore, and they were shite - dog rough and dreadfully broached. I sourced some King **** from my supplier at the time, and they were lovely. Unfortunately, that was more than you could say for the buying experience.
You had to order from a catalogue, and if you wanted, say, a swivel handle, there was no picture of the actual tool, but rather a “generic” picture of several accessories. You had to guess what you were buying and hope for the best. Not great in 1952 (Britool did better) totally **** in 2002!
While the wrenches were nice (and the sockets were o.k.) the ratchet’s were awful. They were a round head thing, fairly rough, and outdated even then.
Fast forward a few years, and the last King **** wrenches I saw were still decent. You could go online and see them being broached etc, and they were still nicely finished. (Miniature ones excepted).
But… go online, look at ratchets and accessories, and it was the same ****** picture from years back, If you actually ordered a ratchet guess what, it was the same ****** ratchet as years back!
Now I know that King **** have their industrial customers, and they probably make up the bulk of their business, but you cannot offer discerning end users this stuff in the modern world and expect them to buy it. The only reason you might (apart from laziness) is that you are so far removed from using and buying tools, that you have no idea that things like 80 tooth ratchets, hexavalent chrome, and multiple lengths / styles of ratchets even exist!
Personally, I think King **** have the smell of death about them (corporately speaking). If they are buying Chinese forgings then the only reason is they have some accountant driving them to reduce costs without any idea of the quality implications, and the end is probably nearer than I previously thought
Most “up and coming” tool manufacturers seem to have one man behind them who understands tools and drives the company to make better products. Think of Soichiro Yamashita at KoKen or even Bobby Hu at Hi Five in Taiwan. If you don’t have such a person, and you do what’s easiest (or what your accountant says) you’re probably stuffed!
If somebody was telling me how to run a tool company, first thing I’d want to see is his qualifications - by which I mean his personal tool chest, posted here on GJ for all to critique! When we’ve established that person owns and uses tools, has some taste, and has made some above average quality / price choices, we’ll talk!
Last edited:
I believe King ****'s Managing Director is a motor bike enthusiast and mechanic. He certainly knows his tools and the standards that apply to them. He was able to explain to me why some tools that I wanted are not made by King ****. it was all to do with compliance with standards. I don't recall the exact details but a 3/4" female to 1/2" male adapter does not exist because the 3/4" tools are capable of exceeding some specification of the 1/2" tools. When I expressed an interest in 12 point deep sockets he immediately informed me of the tools limitations, he was right you have to be careful with them.
I'm reasonably confident King **** is not run by accountants. I'll post some pictures of my King **** tools starting with the oldest and coming right up to date I have all sizes except 1" drive.
I'm reasonably confident King **** is not run by accountants. I'll post some pictures of my King **** tools starting with the oldest and coming right up to date I have all sizes except 1" drive.
Delighted to hear such positive things about the management! If the people involved are practical people that certainly explains why the online presence is so dreadful.
Yet despite all that, I go online and see this.
While other serious manufacturers are offering multiple lengths of ratchet and flex heads, I see two styles and basically one length. This tool doesn’t match the extensions or sockets and I can well believe that it’s simply bought in. And still only generic pictures.
And talking of standards, the fact that a supposedly British tool is advertised as meeting German standards rather than British ones is quite frankly an insult.
I’m glad that 3/4 to 1/2 adaptor can’t be made, that sounds dangerous.
Don’t get me wrong, I don’t dislike King **** tools. I have a fair collection myself and have generally been very satisfied. The spanners I own have been superb and the sockets are certainly up to the job. I might post some pics myself, and yes, please add yours!
But… I wish King **** would embrace their position as the U.K.’s only remaining manufacturer of mechanics tools. I wish they would get the DETAILS right - if you’re selling ratchets, get off your **** and MAKE the ratchet. Make a decent tool, in the U.K. and make it match the rest of your range.
Last edited:
@Dave455 and if you order the ratchet in your post this is what you get. Possibly bought in?:
I agree the web site needs some attention. I made a call to them before I ordered to check what I would receive. Not my favorite King **** ratchet though. I'll start telling my King **** story; been buying their tools new and used since 1980.
I agree the web site needs some attention. I made a call to them before I ordered to check what I would receive. Not my favorite King **** ratchet though. I'll start telling my King **** story; been buying their tools new and used since 1980.
Well that’s just typical! Two different ratchets shown on the website, but if you order one you don’t get either!@Dave455 and if you order the ratchet in your post this is what you get. Possibly bought in?:
I agree the web site needs some attention. I made a call to them before I ordered to check what I would receive. Not my favorite King **** ratchet though. I'll start telling my King **** story; been buying their tools new and used since 1980.
Look forward to hearing your experiences and seeing your tools!
Last edited:
King **** has been my preferred tool brand since I got into DIY car maintenance in the early 80s. My tools were initially sourced from Halfords, the largest UK motor factor with high street stores back then. The very first spanners I bought were manufactured by Gordon Sheffield and branded Gordon or Halfords.
Halfords started sourcing spanners from KIng ****. I much preferred the length, feel, finish and durability of King **** products. They were sold hanging from racks in roll up display packaging that lasted well in use. You could inspect the product before you purchased. Halfords metric open ended spanners, circa early 80s, supplied by King **** in display pack:
Halfords started sourcing spanners from KIng ****. I much preferred the length, feel, finish and durability of King **** products. They were sold hanging from racks in roll up display packaging that lasted well in use. You could inspect the product before you purchased. Halfords metric open ended spanners, circa early 80s, supplied by King **** in display pack:
Back in the early 80s King **** tools were also stocked by hardware stores and sold as individual items. There were displayed on a rack behind the counter so you could inspect the tools before purchase. This set was bought one piece per week over several months. The A/F sockets that were bought at the same time have since been sold on. King **** 1/2" ratchet and accessories early 1980s:
This is my oldest King **** socket set. I have older individual components but this is the oldest set. It's an 1/2" drive BSW set.
These are the only tools I keep for the sake of keeping them. I have tried using them but the external ratchet is uncomfortable, the tommy bar is too small and the T bar too short. The quality though is very good. Speculating about year; 1950s?
These are the only tools I keep for the sake of keeping them. I have tried using them but the external ratchet is uncomfortable, the tommy bar is too small and the T bar too short. The quality though is very good. Speculating about year; 1950s?
You could well be right, nostalgia may be driving the purchase of new tools. However back in 1976 UK military sourced their BSW 3/8" drive socket sets from King ****. They would not source inferior tools.
I don't have much use for the sockets but the ratchet and accessories are excellent when teamed up with A/F and metric sockets. Crow foot 3/8" BSW military socket set 1976:
I don’t think anybody is viewing them as anything special. They never really were. Firms such as Britool always represented the top end.
What King **** offer is good quality, durable tools. The emphasis is on the materials, manufacture and hardening, rather than a flashy finish on “so so” tools, which is increasingly common.
King **** offer all that while selling tools at a very reasonable price. I can’t speak for the prices in America or whatever, but in their home market they are reasonable.
Sure, I’ll give ‘em a hard time for a crappy website, or if I think they’re on the wrong side of the drag curve updating a tool, but ultimately they offer good servicable tools at fair prices. Pretty much what Craftsman used to be to the U.S.
Early 80s manufactured by Gordon, Sheffield.I found a metric Halfords DBE today, it looks like a Bedford product to me.
16 x 18 mm, England on back, HALFORDS.CRO.VAN atop.
Any date estimation?
This is the oldest socket set I have that still sees action. King **** 3/8 drive Imperial A/F socket set:
King **** aluminum ratchets are a strong, comfortable to use but coarse tool. I've just now counted 16 heavy clicks for one rotation. I call these ratchets suspension ratchets, they allow me to tackle rusted nuts with confidence.
King **** aluminum ratchets are a strong, comfortable to use but coarse tool. I've just now counted 16 heavy clicks for one rotation. I call these ratchets suspension ratchets, they allow me to tackle rusted nuts with confidence.
Last edited:
This is a second 3/8 drive King **** Imperial A/F socket set. It was bought from new old stock but judging by the socket design must have been in stock for some time:
This is my favored King **** ratchet design, it is a fine but strong ratchet with a 60 tooth mechanism. Operates nicely on clean nuts on clean threads without needing a second hand to hold the socket, it also operates well in confined spaces.
This is my favored King **** ratchet design, it is a fine but strong ratchet with a 60 tooth mechanism. Operates nicely on clean nuts on clean threads without needing a second hand to hold the socket, it also operates well in confined spaces.
Ton ton
Well-known member
Pwardy, I didn't know king **** made ratchets prior to you posting. Please keep it coming.
Yes, they supply steel round heads and pears and historically supplied aluminium pears. King **** steel round heads, my favorite ratchets:
Industrial customers get a different class of tool. That 3/4 ratchet has shifted some stubborn fasteners.
Last edited:
Enjoying your posts Pwardy!
I have never seen one of those flat aluminium ratchets in 1/4” drive. I consider those ”flat” ratchets to be quite a practical tool. If you look at the current ratchets from Wera, they place some emphasis on the flat design, but it’s really only a modern interpretation of an old idea.
That 3/4” ratchet looks very impressive. King **** always did industrial grade tools very well.
I have never seen one of those flat aluminium ratchets in 1/4” drive. I consider those ”flat” ratchets to be quite a practical tool. If you look at the current ratchets from Wera, they place some emphasis on the flat design, but it’s really only a modern interpretation of an old idea.
That 3/4” ratchet looks very impressive. King **** always did industrial grade tools very well.
King **** steel pear head ratchets 2 of each 1/2", 3/8" and 1/4":
The industrial looking 1/2" ratchet is my longest owned King **** ratchet, bought new in the early 80s. King **** back then had a good reputation for supplying industrial tools. The robustness of the ratchet is almost visible compared to the modern offerings. When you handle them the confidence the old product inspires for heavy work is unmissable.
The industrial looking 1/2" ratchet is my longest owned King **** ratchet, bought new in the early 80s. King **** back then had a good reputation for supplying industrial tools. The robustness of the ratchet is almost visible compared to the modern offerings. When you handle them the confidence the old product inspires for heavy work is unmissable.
Last edited:
King **** 1/2" Metric, Imperial A/F and Whitworth socket set:
This was a mid 80s King **** sales representative's sample set so I guess it is well traveled. What it wasn't was well used, only one socket had slight traces of grease on it.
This was a mid 80s King **** sales representative's sample set so I guess it is well traveled. What it wasn't was well used, only one socket had slight traces of grease on it.