Above 1200 Sq/FT Eastern Washington Workshop
- Thread starter slodat
- Start date
Wokspaces above 1200 squarefeet.
RickP
Well-known member
I really like that pallet system -- it looks like a very good choice for design and quality. Wow, you've had to learn a heckuva lot of CAD skills to get to this point. Nice work! I can't wait to see how you're able to leverage it into increased part density and throughput.
The Pierson stuff has a really solid reputation. A lot of the appeal is the quick change over to keep the spindle running. This isn’t the primary appeal to me today. I already see how it might be once I’ve converted to the pallets. Will depend on how many I’m making of a given part.
Thank you for the words of encouragement. As good as I sounded in the previous posts since I’ve been working on the pallets, I totally got my *** kicked by Fusion last night. Complicated things can be really complicated!!
Back at it this morning!
wasfast
Well-known member
I spent 20 yrs using HP Solid Designer, now Creo Parametric. I've now spent 12 years on Solidworks, literally every day. Overall, I still prefer a parametric approach especially for doing molded plastic parts. The one thing that can really go bad is getting a corrupt part on complex parts. Once it's corrupt, you're going back to a previous version and hope it wasn't corrupted previously. To that end, I've never had this occur with Solidworks. Solidworks does hang in Windows and requires restart but if you have autosave on, you lose very little if any work.
History based modelers like Solidworks do have advantages with bring able to go back, tweak a dimension or function (cut, extrude etc.) and rebuild. Complex parts can really slow things down with the rebuild every time you do something. Solidworks also ***** with complex sketches with lots of entities.
Solidworks benefits from the number of seats/users and there's lots of information to help if needed. I have 2012 at home, use 2022 at work and other than some bells and whistles, the majority of it is really no different. I also do rendering for industrial design and Visualize is great over photoview 360.
I've only recently used the CAM module for CNC and takes some getting used to compared to MasterCam etc. I do find that the post file is a bit bloated with things I don't want and end up doing a fair bit of cleanup in the editor.
All just my experiences
History based modelers like Solidworks do have advantages with bring able to go back, tweak a dimension or function (cut, extrude etc.) and rebuild. Complex parts can really slow things down with the rebuild every time you do something. Solidworks also ***** with complex sketches with lots of entities.
Solidworks benefits from the number of seats/users and there's lots of information to help if needed. I have 2012 at home, use 2022 at work and other than some bells and whistles, the majority of it is really no different. I also do rendering for industrial design and Visualize is great over photoview 360.
I've only recently used the CAM module for CNC and takes some getting used to compared to MasterCam etc. I do find that the post file is a bit bloated with things I don't want and end up doing a fair bit of cleanup in the editor.
All just my experiences
GeddyT
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Why I bring up Creo as an example of being truly parametric is very well demonstrated in this clip:
The workflow seen there is pretty much the same as what I remember it being all the way back in 1999. Every dimension and constraint can be displayed right on the 3D model, and a change to one of those dimensions is possible without having to enter a sketch or roll back history. You can even drag features around and they stay fully constrained. Working directly on the solid model is the bees knees!
That being said, Fusion360 is currently the the most affordable professional CAD/CAM suite in existence, and it's not close. At twice the price if you find a really good sale, you can have the Solidworks Maker subscription and get true parametric modeling, but the bundled DELMIA CAM is terrible and broken (a few trips through their support forum tells me I'm not alone in this opinion). Any workable CAD/CAM solution beyond those two is ridiculously cost-prohibitive for anyone not doing quite a bit of business.
So, in the end, I fell in with Steven's philosophy: You can get the job done with Fusion at a fraction of the cost, so learn to use the tool that's on hand.
The workflow seen there is pretty much the same as what I remember it being all the way back in 1999. Every dimension and constraint can be displayed right on the 3D model, and a change to one of those dimensions is possible without having to enter a sketch or roll back history. You can even drag features around and they stay fully constrained. Working directly on the solid model is the bees knees!
That being said, Fusion360 is currently the the most affordable professional CAD/CAM suite in existence, and it's not close. At twice the price if you find a really good sale, you can have the Solidworks Maker subscription and get true parametric modeling, but the bundled DELMIA CAM is terrible and broken (a few trips through their support forum tells me I'm not alone in this opinion). Any workable CAD/CAM solution beyond those two is ridiculously cost-prohibitive for anyone not doing quite a bit of business.
So, in the end, I fell in with Steven's philosophy: You can get the job done with Fusion at a fraction of the cost, so learn to use the tool that's on hand.
Ran parts over the weekend. While the machine was running I continued working on the pallet CAD work. A good fixture is not a simple thing. So many things to consider and so many ways to make them really useful. A few shots showing the carrier work holding I’m using. OP1 on the right. Held on the bottom 0.060” of the stock by the SerraJaws. OP2 on the left in soft jaws. Beginning of a cycle:
After:
This works well, but I’m wanting to double the number of parts per cycle.
The Pierson stuff arrived.
I’m using E-Z Lok’s coil thread inserts on the pallets. The pricing is really good. I’ve had great results with some of their other inserts in the past.
Carved out a few minutes to get a design done for ironworker tooling storage trays. I made a small test part to check fitment.
Worked out well.
The first tray complete and populated.
The text is 0.20” tall. I’m okay with the small anomalies in the text.
Next one is in progress. These take a while. It’s the max envelope of the X1C.
After:
This works well, but I’m wanting to double the number of parts per cycle.
The Pierson stuff arrived.
I’m using E-Z Lok’s coil thread inserts on the pallets. The pricing is really good. I’ve had great results with some of their other inserts in the past.
Carved out a few minutes to get a design done for ironworker tooling storage trays. I made a small test part to check fitment.
Worked out well.
The first tray complete and populated.
The text is 0.20” tall. I’m okay with the small anomalies in the text.
Next one is in progress. These take a while. It’s the max envelope of the X1C.
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Ironworker punch and die trays are done.
These turned out great. This kind of tooling is a big mess without something to organize them. I reworked the middle tray to hold the snap ring removal tools.
I am legit running out of space. Things are different when the shop makes this sort of transition. So, instead of a dedicated drawer, the trays go in this drawer I was able to make room in.
It never ceases to surprise me how satisfying these little organization projects are. Both making them and over the longer haul. Being able to grab what I need when I need it without any fuss. It makes the shop significantly more satisfying to work in.
These turned out great. This kind of tooling is a big mess without something to organize them. I reworked the middle tray to hold the snap ring removal tools.
I am legit running out of space. Things are different when the shop makes this sort of transition. So, instead of a dedicated drawer, the trays go in this drawer I was able to make room in.
It never ceases to surprise me how satisfying these little organization projects are. Both making them and over the longer haul. Being able to grab what I need when I need it without any fuss. It makes the shop significantly more satisfying to work in.
Love the organization! I need to turn my wife loose in my shop and let her get it organized. She has an eye for it that I sure dont. Love the printer being used to make holders! My fusion skills are not there yet but I plan to get that printer rockin once I figure out how to really model what I want for my tool storage.
Another project for the scanner.
It never ceases to amaze me how the scanning and processing can completely consume the resources of a very well-equipped machine.
The scanning gets a little easier/less fussy each time I use it on an actual project. Scan came out good for what I'm doing.
Then, it all went to ****. I had a hell of a time figuring out how to do the reverse engineering in QuickSurface last night. So, I went home for the day. I'm happy to report I have the model that I need for the project. It actually went really well. It definitely would require a lot more reverse engineering work if I was wanting to accurately model the breaker. Since I only need a few features, this works well.
The rest of the modeling can be done in Fusion. Again, the scan is reference data, and it works SO well for that.
This is the scan and solid model at the same time.
The heat map tells the whole story.
It never ceases to amaze me how the scanning and processing can completely consume the resources of a very well-equipped machine.
The scanning gets a little easier/less fussy each time I use it on an actual project. Scan came out good for what I'm doing.
Then, it all went to ****. I had a hell of a time figuring out how to do the reverse engineering in QuickSurface last night. So, I went home for the day. I'm happy to report I have the model that I need for the project. It actually went really well. It definitely would require a lot more reverse engineering work if I was wanting to accurately model the breaker. Since I only need a few features, this works well.
The rest of the modeling can be done in Fusion. Again, the scan is reference data, and it works SO well for that.
This is the scan and solid model at the same time.
The heat map tells the whole story.
cycle61
Well-known member
Looks like somebody dropped it on that side 
Had a fun, challenging project come in the shop. Make these:
Only 10” wider. The near end is removed for measuring in the photo. First step was finding a source for the galvanized material.
That’s 3.3 tons of 16ga. Next was sorting out cutting and forming. I’m happy to say this was rather straight forward. Took some time and tweaking things, but it went rather well. The enclosure has two features on the back that I needed to sort out: the dimple that sets it off the mounting surface and a 1/4-20 thread that is used to mount the interior.
I worked with a tool and die company to get a punch and die made to form the feature with the iron worker.
They nailed it!
Next up was the threaded inserts. I went with PEM nuts. I ordered the SWAG Off-road caster kit for the 50 ton hydraulic press.
Definitely worth the price vs. spending the time sorting it out. This was a rush job. Time was limited. Rolled the press out and used a few things to support the part while pressing in the PEM nuts.
A simple drilled bore made a great tool to hold the PEM nut in place.
Installed.
Final part coming together:
Only 10” wider. The near end is removed for measuring in the photo. First step was finding a source for the galvanized material.
That’s 3.3 tons of 16ga. Next was sorting out cutting and forming. I’m happy to say this was rather straight forward. Took some time and tweaking things, but it went rather well. The enclosure has two features on the back that I needed to sort out: the dimple that sets it off the mounting surface and a 1/4-20 thread that is used to mount the interior.
I worked with a tool and die company to get a punch and die made to form the feature with the iron worker.
They nailed it!
Next up was the threaded inserts. I went with PEM nuts. I ordered the SWAG Off-road caster kit for the 50 ton hydraulic press.
Definitely worth the price vs. spending the time sorting it out. This was a rush job. Time was limited. Rolled the press out and used a few things to support the part while pressing in the PEM nuts.
A simple drilled bore made a great tool to hold the PEM nut in place.
Installed.
Final part coming together:
Side view of the work support in the hydraulic press. This worked surprisingly well and took no time to setup.
Detail of the fitment of the end cap:
Overall of the finished part:
Had a rather comical scrap part arrangement.. bend sequence is something I’m a lot better at than a year ago. Parts with more than four bends can get tricky. Especially toward the end of long days.
When I did this I just laughed. It was hilariously bad.
This is what I was going for:
I don’t love the design of this bracket. It’s what I was able to come up with given all the other considerations and constraints. It’s a vertical support bracket and it won’t see much weight.
The long flanges have a tab to weld to the leg. It worked out well.
I closed up those corners, but forgot to snap a photo.
Detail of the fitment of the end cap:
Overall of the finished part:
Had a rather comical scrap part arrangement.. bend sequence is something I’m a lot better at than a year ago. Parts with more than four bends can get tricky. Especially toward the end of long days.
When I did this I just laughed. It was hilariously bad.
This is what I was going for:
I don’t love the design of this bracket. It’s what I was able to come up with given all the other considerations and constraints. It’s a vertical support bracket and it won’t see much weight.
The long flanges have a tab to weld to the leg. It worked out well.
I closed up those corners, but forgot to snap a photo.
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Finallygotit
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Really nice work! 
How many of those enclosures did you have to make?
How many of those enclosures did you have to make?Thanks, Dan! I’m really happy with how they turned out. I ended up making samples and shipping to the customer’s job site for evaluation. Once they confirm they are happy with them. I have about 75 more to make at some point in the next little while.Really nice work!
Jayman17
Well-known member
Pretty slick job you did on that enclosure. Always some interesting project going on here.
Andrew S
Well-known member
Enclosure looks great!
If you only need a small run of dimples, I've been amazed at how well 3D printed dies will hold up.
If you only need a small run of dimples, I've been amazed at how well 3D printed dies will hold up.
Thank you for the kind words guys!
Andrew - Definitely! I had thought I'd use 3d printed dies for the whole order.. I tried 3d printed dies at first. The challenge I was running into was maintaining alignment of the punch and die in the hydraulic press once I started wrestling nearly 1/2 a sheet of 16ga. The punch kept crashing into the die and deforming. And, the feature wasn't deep enough. There's over 300 of these dimples in this order. The custom punch and die were about $300. Well worth it in this case.
Andrew - Definitely! I had thought I'd use 3d printed dies for the whole order.. I tried 3d printed dies at first. The challenge I was running into was maintaining alignment of the punch and die in the hydraulic press once I started wrestling nearly 1/2 a sheet of 16ga. The punch kept crashing into the die and deforming. And, the feature wasn't deep enough. There's over 300 of these dimples in this order. The custom punch and die were about $300. Well worth it in this case.
rmack898
Well-known member
Nice work Steven.
I think I have that exact same model material support stand that you used
I think I have that exact same model material support stand that you used
Graham08
Well-known member
That is super reasonable. I've had Cleveland Punch make a number of punch and die sets for my lever press over the years, but they've all been simple round holes. I've wanted to get a die set that would punch and dimple holes for flush Dzus fasteners but was afraid to ask what the price would be.
Dennis - your math really made me chuckle!
Mac - Thank you! The material support stand is better than the commercially available one I bought.
Graham - I was blown away by their pricing for a custom punch and die. They were great to work with as well. Definitely who I'll go to when the need arises again.
Mac - Thank you! The material support stand is better than the commercially available one I bought.
Graham - I was blown away by their pricing for a custom punch and die. They were great to work with as well. Definitely who I'll go to when the need arises again.
Graham08
Well-known member
Cleveland Punch is located in the town where we used to live in Ohio. I used to order stuff "will call"...they're in a 100+ year old building. I never did manage to get a shop tour, though. It's always been a good experience working with them.
I bought the iron worker to do bus. It has worked out well for the bus fabrication. I make 1/8” MDF templates of the flat pattern on the laser, then that is used to quickly and accurately layout everything on the stock. I picked up some 5xxx aluminum the same size as the copper to test everything.
The aluminum is about 1/10th the price of copper. Happy to have a working, reliable workflow for the bus fabrication.
And getting ready to ship..
I do my best to pack things securely so they make the journey to the client unscathed.
The next project was making some “top hats” taller. They were ordered 10 and 15” tall. Turns out they need 25”. First order of business was getting the corner posts made.
This was a process. I got excited prematurely when I had a 7” coupon dialed in. Then the fun started. I made a lot of scrap. A lot.
I ultimately figured out the back gage on the press brake was out of parallel with the tooling by 0.036” over ~40”. I got it down to about 0.002”. Then some more test parts and adjustments. Now we’re getting somewhere!
This shot gives an idea of what’s going on:
More progress:
And…
I thought this was worth sharing as well..
This is my metal prep station. Super simple and very effective. The part is sitting on an inexpensive magnetic vise. The mag vise does an excellent job of not only holding the part, but it holds it flat. If you’re working with sheet metal or smaller plate parts, this was a huge improvement over trying to hold parts any other way I had tried.
The die grinder has a 2” 36 grit ceramic roloc and the sander has 80 grit Diablo sanding nets from Home Depot. This is how I prep all my parts. Works well for me.
The aluminum is about 1/10th the price of copper. Happy to have a working, reliable workflow for the bus fabrication.
And getting ready to ship..
I do my best to pack things securely so they make the journey to the client unscathed.
The next project was making some “top hats” taller. They were ordered 10 and 15” tall. Turns out they need 25”. First order of business was getting the corner posts made.
This was a process. I got excited prematurely when I had a 7” coupon dialed in. Then the fun started. I made a lot of scrap. A lot.
I ultimately figured out the back gage on the press brake was out of parallel with the tooling by 0.036” over ~40”. I got it down to about 0.002”. Then some more test parts and adjustments. Now we’re getting somewhere!
This shot gives an idea of what’s going on:
More progress:
And…
I thought this was worth sharing as well..
This is my metal prep station. Super simple and very effective. The part is sitting on an inexpensive magnetic vise. The mag vise does an excellent job of not only holding the part, but it holds it flat. If you’re working with sheet metal or smaller plate parts, this was a huge improvement over trying to hold parts any other way I had tried.
The die grinder has a 2” 36 grit ceramic roloc and the sander has 80 grit Diablo sanding nets from Home Depot. This is how I prep all my parts. Works well for me.
Bob Heine
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Steven, it's really great to see your business grow. It's also great to see a M12 die grinder helping you make money. I hesitated for a long time but as soon as it arrived I started using it for more and more tasks. Made adding a straight one an easy decision.
MadeByMiller
Well-known member
4 FN 27
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Nice work!!!
I ask myself somedays on here how the F do I not see some of these threads???
Bending metal is tricky business. I have designed, laid-out and programmed 31 Bends in a single part using (3) 14 foot rails (Press Brakes) to hold the tooling...2 machines dong the first 22 bends feeding 1 doing the last 9...not for the faint of heart.
Back to you bending yourself into a corner on the Vertical Support Brackets...make those 4 bends all 45° flipping and spinning the parts as required then come back and restrike them to 90°...saves the thinking time of which one goes first...been there doing that!!!
Pems are an issue if you don't have a Pem Setter. We have 10 or so of them at the Plant...and once and a while I bring parts up there to set the Pems. Most of the time I try to make it work in the Press Brake using flattening dies. So far it work pretty good. Getting a good set is a challenge because you don't know if the machine is actually applying tonnage or if it is the weight of the ram pushing them in??? My Press Brakes have a little backlash in the ram which make light hits a challenge messing with angles and setting Pems.
I am hitting the subscribe button!!!
I was wondering why Pat hadn't been posting on this thread. It has been a treat watching the progress and passion Slodat has for this work!
Bob - Thank you!! I use the hell out of that little M12 die grinder. I hit the thermal shutdown on bigger part runs. When I do, I reach for the pneumatic. The M12 is superior to the pneumatic in every other way. I recently figured out the reason I was hitting the thermal limit is because I wasn't spinning it very fast. Hasn't happened since I turned the speed up.
Thank you, Austin! I have a new packaging addition I'll post here in a few. I've been hoping Pat would chime in at some point. Looks like you helped catalyze that!
Ron - thank you! It hasn't killed me, so I think I'm doing alright
There's a lot going on in that 12x12x18 box.. It's 275lb double wall. Good eye on the lining. It's 1/8" mdf. I have lots of it laying around. My thought was the thin MDF would help keep things from poking through the cardboard if it got hit hard. There's a tight fitting chunk of 3/4" plywood in the very bottom that holds the two bus stacks hard against the outer wall. That whole layer has a MDF topper, then the hardware box on top of that surrounded by rigid foam. And a layer of MDF on the top. All stapled and taped up. It weighed 107lb and made it there looking like it did when it left, UPS ground.
Thanks, Logan! The mag vise is sweet for this. I bought an inexpensive one on Amazon. It has been great.
Pat! It's so nice to see you checking out the goings on in my shop. I would love to hear what you have to say about the stuff I'm doing. I'm self taught, and have been making a lot of "tuition" payments lately in the form of time, scrap metal, and head scratching. I don't have flattening dies (yet). I plan to get some at some point.
Strangely, it looks like I'm adding another press brake to the mix. I want to keep the one I have. Two sounds like a great way to make more parts.
Good call on the PEM nuts. I have a pressure gauge on the hydraulic press. I did a little testing and found ~4T on the gauge yielded a good set based on my experiments. I've been on the lookout for a deal on a simpler PEM setter.
I just learned about die sensitivity (it's what Cincinnati called it in a instructional video I found of theirs. Helped me understand an issue I was having last week that lead to me finding the backgauge about 0.036 out of square with the tooling over about 40". Got that dialed in and things went a lot better on the longer part with the six bends.
Thanks for checking out the thread!
Thank you for the kind, encouraging words! I appreciate it!
4 FN 27
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Seriously how do I miss these threads???
You are welcome and I am impressed!!! I need to go back 75 pages and check it out.
I have a peer group meeting tomorrow and a haircut...I'll see if I can't get a few pics of a Indicator set-up I use to check my back-gage almost every time I move my stops left to right...you'll get the idea real quick...
PS...the best way to check a Pem is to tap on the edge of the part. It can look seated but if not seated all the way they will rattle in the hole...I did in process inspection for 4 years while going to college. Old timer showed me that one back in the day.
When I package up my steel parts for shipping, I’m always wondering how the bottom of the box is supposed to be be stapled with the dam stapler. The outer flaps rarely succeed in attaching to the inner flaps. The inner flaps need something to push them against the outer flaps.
The 107lb box of copper was what it took for me to look into it. Turns out there’s a box bottom stapler.
This one is now mine..
Made in Sweden.
$1667 shipped from ULINE. Or over $1300 less on Craigslist. I was so excited to pick this thing up today.
Why? You may ask… the tall post is the anvil. It presses the inner flap against the outer.
The end result:
Turns out the other stapler I have is called a carton closer. All makes a bit more sense now.
And, yes I did say another press brake… haven’t pulled the trigger yet.. but I’m close.
Additionally, I’m close to getting the initial powder coating setup coming. I think I’m going with the Electron E-Coat+3 Master with the vibrating box feed. Looking like the oven is going to come from Ted’s Fabrication. 4x6x8’ inside dimensions with 24kw of heater. And the application booth from Cook Manufacturing. They made the spray booth I have now and I’ve been really happy with it.
Still some details to work out.. but this is looking like where things are headed. This will begin the growth into “Building 2” as @cycle61 and I are calling it.
The 107lb box of copper was what it took for me to look into it. Turns out there’s a box bottom stapler.
This one is now mine..
Made in Sweden.
$1667 shipped from ULINE. Or over $1300 less on Craigslist. I was so excited to pick this thing up today.
Why? You may ask… the tall post is the anvil. It presses the inner flap against the outer.
The end result:
Turns out the other stapler I have is called a carton closer. All makes a bit more sense now.
And, yes I did say another press brake… haven’t pulled the trigger yet.. but I’m close.
Additionally, I’m close to getting the initial powder coating setup coming. I think I’m going with the Electron E-Coat+3 Master with the vibrating box feed. Looking like the oven is going to come from Ted’s Fabrication. 4x6x8’ inside dimensions with 24kw of heater. And the application booth from Cook Manufacturing. They made the spray booth I have now and I’ve been really happy with it.
Still some details to work out.. but this is looking like where things are headed. This will begin the growth into “Building 2” as @cycle61 and I are calling it.
Hey @MadeByMiller Steven needs a nice little sign that says Building 2. Otherwise it's not real.
Ron
Otherwise it's not real. Ron
@slodat Steven quick question about your cheapie mag plate. Does that need to be bolted to your work table or does it stick magnetically on both sides with enough force to stay put? The mag chucks I'm seeing online seem to indicate they need to be mechanically attached on the bottom.
thanks - Ron
thanks - Ron
Ron- I bought an inexpensive import 6x16 magnetic chuck from Amazon. It weighs about 45 pounds. It doesn’t move around much at all. The magnet is only on the top. Like you mentioned, it is designed to be clamped down. That’s more for its intended use in a machine tool/grinder. I’ve had no issue with it only sitting on the plastic top folding table I use it on.
4 FN 27
ALLIANCE MEMBER
A day late...but here are the Tools I made to align the Back Gage to the Ram of the machine.
The 2 indicators are set to the same zero using a height gage on a Surface Plate.
I mount those to 2 smaller hunks of Punch Tooling mounted in the upper Rail on the Ram. Had to drill holes thru the tooling. Spread them the width of the Back Gage and moved the Back gage up to them until one of the indicators is zero. Then adjust so the Back Gage is parallel.
I made a test bend and see how far off the flange length is from where I wanted it. Then adjust the Back Gage in or out that same amount while keeping it parallel and now I have a Zero.
On some of the newer machines you can do this as and offset in the control. My machine is old enough it is all manual.
The Indicator screwed to the junk piece of Die is simply set on the rail and slid to a position in front of the stop. I can tune the stops to be parallel and zeroed for fine tuning. I can also adjust the face of the wider stops to make them parallel to the Ram too.
Saves me a lot of time setting up.
After the Pem Nut discussion I was thinking we took a Hardware Machine out of service quite sometime ago and was thinking; what happened to that machine?
After the All Company Meeting I took a stroll to the far back corner of the shop where the 5S area is and there it is sitting. We had converted it to a Metal Stamping Machine but it did not have a enough tonnage when stamping. The guys and gals in the Hardware Department do not want it because we use the Haeger Brand Inserters.
On Monday I am going to inform my Brother it is coming home with me.
I'll put it to work!!!
As I ventured farther into the 5S Area I see they purge Press Brake Tooling again placing there for disposition...I took it upon myself to disposition them on to a cart and into my truck. Based on the amount of dust on them they have been out of service for a while.
Time is perfect...I needed to borrow a length of Acute Dies for an over 90° Bend.
Thanks to @MadeByMiller for linking me to this Thread and thanks to @slodat for the content and topics in this Thread...I found these gems!!!
@4 FN 27 Pat - thank you for the photos and explanation! I really appreciate it.
Quick note before I get into forming.. I really like these Milwaukee drill taps.
I use them for all sorts of fabrication related tapping. They are pretty robust and work well. Made a tray to make them easy to get the right size first try:
I'm sure there's something I could do in my model to get the . to print. I'm happy with the result, nonetheless.
On to some forming stuff.. My flat patterns out of Fusion are always off a little when the part has a bend referenced from another bend, or two on the same axis. I'm starting to understand that (I think) this is because my bend radius isn't as consistent as my 2" wide coupons reveal. I've worked with a consultant that really seems to know his stuff. With all that said, I'll say this.. forming metal is not easy. Especially when working from CAD. The parts in question on this project are two pieces of full round edge silver plated copper bus bar with PEM nuts in them. I've found 5xxx aluminum is a great material for getting things setup. It is bending almost exactly like the copper and costs at or less than 10% of the price of the copper.
Straight out of the Fusion flat pattern the part was 0.118 short. The part in the foreground is the first test part.
I made an over correction, and then nailed it.
Three test parts of one and two of the other and I was good to go with the copper. The upper right in the photo with the over bend was what happened when I tried to use some die tape I had bought. It's definitely not the good stuff.
In this photo you can see the sample part has a bit tighter bend radius. My punch radius is 0.5mm (a touch over 1/64").
A family photo:
I had to shorten the PEM nuts 0.150" on the lathe prior to pressing them in. These are 1/2-13. I wasn't able to find the shorter PEM nuts in stock when I looked. Didn't take long to shorten them.
Customer should be really happy with these. I know I am.
Quick note before I get into forming.. I really like these Milwaukee drill taps.
I use them for all sorts of fabrication related tapping. They are pretty robust and work well. Made a tray to make them easy to get the right size first try:
I'm sure there's something I could do in my model to get the . to print. I'm happy with the result, nonetheless.
On to some forming stuff.. My flat patterns out of Fusion are always off a little when the part has a bend referenced from another bend, or two on the same axis. I'm starting to understand that (I think) this is because my bend radius isn't as consistent as my 2" wide coupons reveal. I've worked with a consultant that really seems to know his stuff. With all that said, I'll say this.. forming metal is not easy. Especially when working from CAD. The parts in question on this project are two pieces of full round edge silver plated copper bus bar with PEM nuts in them. I've found 5xxx aluminum is a great material for getting things setup. It is bending almost exactly like the copper and costs at or less than 10% of the price of the copper.
Straight out of the Fusion flat pattern the part was 0.118 short. The part in the foreground is the first test part.
I made an over correction, and then nailed it.
Three test parts of one and two of the other and I was good to go with the copper. The upper right in the photo with the over bend was what happened when I tried to use some die tape I had bought. It's definitely not the good stuff.
In this photo you can see the sample part has a bit tighter bend radius. My punch radius is 0.5mm (a touch over 1/64").
A family photo:
I had to shorten the PEM nuts 0.150" on the lathe prior to pressing them in. These are 1/2-13. I wasn't able to find the shorter PEM nuts in stock when I looked. Didn't take long to shorten them.
Customer should be really happy with these. I know I am.
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