Homemade electrolysis. What do you use?

[drivesitfar]

Unruh: so would you consider using an E Tank again if the need to remove some rust showed up? I think you posted the Rock Island pics on the vise thread, but maybe a few of the members would love to see a couple before and after pics here too if you have time. thanks!!

you probably would have been ok with that small amount of galvanized wire, but best not to chance it and just use the regular bailing wire (or some call it rebar tie wire).

 

[Outlawmws]

Unruh: so would you consider using an E Tank again if the need to remove some rust showed up? I think you posted the Rock Island pics on the vise thread, but maybe a few of the members would love to see a couple before and after pics here too if you have time. thanks!!

you probably would have been ok with that small amount of galvanized wire, but best not to chance it and just use the regular bailing wire (or some call it rebar tie wire).

I totally disagree... Drives, that's about like being "just a little bit pregnant".

Toxic heavy metals and E tanks should NEVER mix.

 

[drivesitfar]

Outlaw: I actually sent a text to Unruh before he posted on this thread that i mentioned to him to do. I advised him to get bailing wire and not use galvanized.

that said I thought it was determined that some metals were still ok to put into a E tank like copper, nickel, chrome and stainless or did you and Fretters and others decide that wouldn't be good at any level?

I'm pretty sure some members have used stainless steel anodes without any issues. so wondering if you've tried or maybe read or heard that galvanized is an issue?

 

[Outlawmws]

Drives, go re-read those posts. You are mis-remembering what was said almost 180 degrees out.

While there is some dispute about SS it's a bad idea unless you are willing to spend the $$ on testing to see if the grade of SS you may have laying around WON'T create a haz mat mess.

Electrolysis is a very safe process, IF you keep with Iron, steels and not Stainless Steels. ANY other metals are NOT. You can't tell at home if its "dangerous levels" or not. It doesn't glow or do anything obvious. You have to have that lab tested. Big Bucks...

There are so many Haz mat and even super fund sites in this country from people doing sloppy, irresponsible, things; so ask yourself this: do you WANT a haz mat site in your back yard?

 

[Shiftless]

(Retired Chemistry teacher here...)
Don’t use stainless steel in your electrolysis tank. Read up on hexavalent chromium and see if you want that stuff around your house.

 

[Outlawmws]

(Retired Chemistry teacher here...)
Don’t use stainless steel in your electrolysis tank. Read up on hexavalent chromium and see if you want that stuff around your house.

Bingo!

 

[Ole Slewfoot]

Hm, my water naturally has 14x the national average of hexavalent chromium already.....
Sadly steel does not come out of my tank plated.

 

[drivesitfar]

ALL: i'm happy that I told Unruh to get some uncoated bailing wire and i also referred him to this thread so he could get more information on why not to use galvanized wire to hold his projects (a vise in this case) in the E tank. I he'd survive, but forgot about the bi products of the hazardous waste that none of want to deal with once the project is done and we'd need to dispose of the water.

that said I think it's safe to say that while we shouldn't drink the water out of our E tanks if we don't put in anything but steel it should be ok to dispose of in our gardens or flower beds.

OR is there any issues if paint has been removed of an old tool or vise and should we maybe filter the waste products off before dumping it?

 

[PCMusicGuy]

The main problem with sourcing wire for E-tanks is when you want to buy it locally. Even in a market area as large as Houston, you simply cannot find uncoated wire at any hardware store. It is impossible. The two things that I have used successfully is chain link fence tie, plain steel, uncoated, and concrete rebar ties, plain steel, coated, but I used some abrasive to strip the coating before use.

 

[Outlawmws]

PC; re-bar tie wire is sold in rolls wherever re-bar is sold, so the big box stores all have it...

Also, coat hanger wire will also work which is nice for really heavy parts. just scrape any paint off. (I can't recall ever seeing a plated wire coat hanger)

 

[Outlawmws]

Drives I think you can safely put the water and orange skunge off the top, but the sludge should get dumped on some newspaper and allowed to dry, then put that in the garbage.

Even if not lead based paint, you don't want other paint residue in your garden as who knows what all that is. If lead based, I don't think lead would leach out of the paint as it rolls off the part.

 

[Rlapointe87]

You could also get a roll of weld wire. Harbor freight sells it cheap in a few different sizes er90s I believe. That should do the trick

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

[6PTsocket]

Sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) is easily converted to sodium carbonate (washing soda or soda ash). About an hour in a 200° oven is all it takes. As baking soda is already used in the oven for baking, it is a non toxic process that should not get you into trouble with your wife for mad scientist experiments The other biproduct is harmless carbon dioxide gas.

That's about right. Some types of paint will literally flake off in the vat, whilst others seem to resist at all costs. I've found applying a little brake fluid or paint stripper several hours before popping something in the vat helps for paint.

Regarding grease, you're better off trying to remove that beforehand. White spirit, (mineral spirit), or paraffin, (kerosene), which is my favourite degreaser.

Don't use a metallic container btw, even if it is enamelled. It only needs one pin ***** in the enamel and it will start to corrode at a rate of knots from there on in. Tested it out last year with a metallic container. It only managed a few days before it tripped out the relay I'd put on it for the specific purpose of disconnecting the supply if there was leakage.

I personally use Sodium Bicarbonate for the solution. Sodium Carbonate seems to be the most recommended option though. Both work fine. About one tablespoon to a gallon of water is all you need. You don't need to chuck shedloads of current at the process either. You'll just degrade your anodes more quickly for little to no gain. Even with large stuff, 1.5A is ample. I normally vary current between 500mA to 1.5A max.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

 

[Ole Slewfoot]

True, but hardware and grocery stores sell washing soda for half the price of baking soda.

 

[6PTsocket]

True, but hardware and grocery stores sell washing soda for half the price of baking soda.

You are correct. I found it in Wally World but for some reason, over the years, I have seen a lot of posts complaining that they could not find washing soda.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

 

[n8n]

You are correct. I found it in Wally World but for some reason, over the years, I have seen a lot of posts complaining that they could not find washing soda.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

I'm completely unable to find it in stores anymore - it was a challenge before - but pH booster intended for swimming pools is the same stuff, soda ash AKA sodium carbonate.

 

[engineer2]

Last time I bought tri-sodium phosphate it was labeled "contains no phosphates" (WTF!). The ingredient list said it was sodium carbonate.

If you know somebody who works at a glass factory, they use sodium carbonate by the hopper car load. They won't miss a pound or two of it.

 

[Ole Slewfoot]

In the hippie stores it's labeled 'laundry booster'

 

[mikegt4]

I'm completely unable to find it in stores anymore - it was a challenge before - but pH booster intended for swimming pools is the same stuff, soda ash AKA sodium carbonate.

For years I have bought Washing Soda at Kroger, all the local stores have it on the shelf. I used a couple of boxes for my last electrolysis project, see post #678.

 

[Sobdog1]

Hi all I am new to this forum and this is my first post and really need help before I lose the plot, I have been trying to strip the chrome of some motorbike parts using electrolysis, I have a tank set up and it's full of acid and I have tried several types of battery chargers for the power but none of them will work so I have 3 batteries that I keep charging and using for the power, it works great but I am only getting about 5 mins from each battery before it needs recharging, I have even tried plugging in a battery charger to charge a battery and then jump leads from the battery to the tank but that wont work either, I also bought a variable 12v power supply and that wont work either, can anyone tell me the correct power source item I need to buy. Many thanks.

 

[Outlawmws]

1. DO NOT use Electrolisis to strip plating! The byproducts are NOT harmless and could get you a nasty visit from the EPA...

2. "full of acid" Means What?

 

[Shiftless]

Outlaw is absolutely correct.
Don’t use electrolysis to strip chrome plating.

 

[The Cobbler]

X3 yes, and what's with the acid ?

 

[Shiftless]

X3 yes, and what's with the acid ?

I suppose 30% hydrochloric acid would remove the chrome plating but how would you safely get rid of the resulting liquid?

 

[RTM]

The correct choice is usually a 1980s vintage car battery charger, before they became smart. The incorrect load of your tank will turn most smart chargers off. I think 5a was the range desired, been too long since I've read up on it. Mine is from About 1986

I suspect the batteries are putting out way too much amperage, and thus draining quickly.

 

[Outlawmws]

But again, your real issue is getting plating or any heavy metals into the soup, E tanks are great, safe, and non-toxic ONLY if you keep to cast iron, wrought iron and carbon (not Stainless) steels.

Google Hexavalent Chromium - https://www.osha.gov/SLTC/hexavalentchromium/

An E-tank is equivalent to "Operating chrome plating baths"

Even the wire used in the tank needs to be iron. ( rebar tie wire is cheap and available everywhere)

 

[Halbert]

Does anyone have experience with only light rubbing of the piece after electrolysis. So leaving most of the magnitite (spelling?) in place to harden? If left black, can it then be painted?
Thanks for any advice.

 

[dogdog]

Does anyone have experience with only light rubbing of the piece after electrolysis. So leaving most of the magnitite (spelling?) in place to harden? If left black, can it then be painted?
Thanks for any advice.

???

 

[Outlawmws]

That might be an interesting experiment? Maybe a test piece or three?

Try simple drying, another with baking, etc...

Mostly it seems to come off like carbon black, but that's when it's fresh and wet?

 

[Dipnetfan]

Great info guys. Has anybody tried to do half of something, then the other half. I’ve got a 48”kimkin jack that is really frozen. I can’t get it into small pieces so thought I would do half at a time in a plastic trash can. How about using two battery chargers?

 

[Outlawmws]

I've done things half at a time, - it works, just make sure the done part doesn't rust while your doing the second part.

Two chargers are not needed.

 

[dogdog]

I have done my large radiator in 1/2 at a time or rather 1/4 (quadrants) ... the fresh light rush are manageable with a pressure washer or an extra step before painting with rust converters, maybe that was TSP...

as far as two battery charger... I have notice mine only draws about 10amp initially and drops to about 3AMP and stay there till it just draws almost 0 amp... not sure if two battery charger is beneficial... try with more anodes connected to the positive leads, I have notice it draws more power than just 1 anode... or try with higher voltage, I have used 24V@12Amp power supply which it seems to work better than the manual 2/10/50/200 amp Craftsman manual charger setting at 50AMP... heck even the HF 2/10/50 charger is better than the Craftsman... probably cheap or broken capacitor inside that unit.

 

[paulsomlo]

Great info guys. Has anybody tried to do half of something, then the other half. I’ve got a 48”kimkin jack that is really frozen. I can’t get it into small pieces so thought I would do half at a time in a plastic trash can. How about using two battery chargers?

My experience has been that electrolysis is a "line of sight" sort of thing. If you've got fasteners that won't come out, I'm not sure how much it will help you.

 

[Ike Carlson]

I have used electrolysis to clean parts and have had excellent results. Plastic container, non-smart battery charger. I used it on my air compressor. The previous owner left it in a snowbank all winter and it was rusted up and would not turn. I had to drive the pistons out of the cylinders. The crank, case, cylinders, and high pressure piston were covered in rust. I put them in the tank and left them for several days. I used washing soda and dawn soap. There was some foam, but it didn't overflow. The parts cleaned up to "almost new" and everything was in usable condition! I was shocked. I polished the crank journals, put new bearings in it, and put it together with new gaskets. I am working on the head now.

Electrolysis is amazing. I would not have been able to recover the compressor without it.

 

[drivesitfar]

for any of you that think de rusting steel or old cast iron is hard you might try this method. this might be the best Electrolysis thread on the internet and it's fairly simple to do. parts can be found almost anywhere too.

good luck and post up your pics of the derusting bubbling mix if you start an E tank.

 

[mingiunate]

Are there any issues with leaving the part submerged in the vat for an extended period of time (~1 day, or more) with the power off?
Would it make the black sodium carbonate coating be harder to remove?

 

[The Cobbler]

not sure, good question. but why would you leave it in there?

 

[mingiunate]

not sure, good question. but why would you leave it in there?

Have to make a quick trip and don't want to leave it unattended with the power running.

 

[dogdog]

Have to make a quick trip and don't want to leave it unattended with the power running.

I leave mine running for 14 days at a time on bigger stuff. just need to pay attention to the safety... like make sure the electrode are secure and no way for it to touch... once it have certain amount of buildups it just stop conducting.

 

[Shiftless]

I leave mine running for 14 days at a time on bigger stuff. just need to pay attention to the safety... like make sure the electrode are secure and no way for it to touch... once it have certain amount of buildups it just stop conducting.

Stop conducting… that’s my experience as well