Pliers; How Many Is Too Many?

[ararat]

Three German specialty pliers. From left to right, VC&Co Germany, possibly sadlers pliers. Germany, thin. Ha-----------der, 80- , Germany, spreader pliers. Watchmakers or Jewlers?

In the second picture the pliers on the left look kind of like the wide nose pliers in a leather working catalog https://archive.org/details/FWestpfalAndBroCatalogueNo206/page/n26/mode/1up

 

[four.cycle]

@Eric Brown - https://sharprazorpalace.com/razors/91188-vom-cleff.html

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that's the same "V.C. & Co." that made the mysterious little hand vise:

VOM CLEFF, R
Import agency at 105 Duane St., New York City
Used trademark "DIAMONDINE"
ca. 1885-1926

wait... who else was at 105 Duane? John Graham?

 

[Eric Brown]

Here are my pliers from Sweden. First is a Bahco No 90. Next two are Lindstrom. The middle one has a special memory for me. I bought it new in Stockholm in 1974. It is a model 1719-80 25. Unusually long and thin.

 

[Eric Brown]

Here are a couple specialty pliers from France. Both marked L. Hugoniot-Tissot. W\For watchmaking or jewelry. The needle nose have a smooth copper layer on the tips. Either the copper is soft or not magnetic. Either might be useful. The other ones are missing a steel band that can hold the jaws closed.

 

[Eric Brown]

Here are a couple of Sargent & Co cutters. Not in the 1911 catalog and the stamped steel handles indicate newer construction. Neither has a model number. They both have Sargent on the handles. The smaller pair do not have a spring return, the long ones do. The small ones are for cutting wire. Not sure the use of the long ones.

 

[ararat]

Here are a couple of Sargent & Co cutters. Not in the 1911 catalog and the stamped steel handles indicate newer construction. Neither has a model number. They both have Sargent on the handles. The smaller pair do not have a spring return, the long ones do. The small ones are for cutting wire. Not sure the use of the long ones.

For making shoes apparently

Sargent Industrial and Professional Hand Tools and Miscellaneous Hardware Items : Sargent & Co. : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

16 p., illus., 27.6 cm, trade catalog

archive.org

 

[ararat]

Here are my pliers from Sweden. First is a Bahco No 90. Next two are Lindstrom. The middle one has a special memory for me. I bought it new 1n Stockholm in 1974. It is a model 1719-80 25. Unusually long and thin.

I really like the middle one. I see why you bought them.

 

[Eric Brown]

Need help identifying these cutters. Who made them and what were they for? Early box joint construction and leaf spring.
Cutter is about 1 5/8" long. Very rounded profile. Nice checkering on grips. Owner mark of "U" stamped three places. Murphys law required the only real damage was in the name stamp area. I have taken a bunch of pictures at different angles and lighting. These are the best I came up with. To me, it looks like SHEP ______UDDEY NY So far, I haven't found a maker's name that fits. Thought y'all would like a challenge.

 

[ararat]

Need help identifying these cutters. Who made them and what were they for? Early box joint construction and leaf spring.
Cutter is about 1 5/8" long. Very rounded profile. Nice checkering on grips. Owner mark of "U" stamped three places. Murphys law required the only real damage was in the name stamp area. I have taken a bunch of pictures at different angles and lighting. These are the best I came up with. To me, it looks like SHEP ______UDDEY NY So far, I haven't found a maker's name that fits. Thought y'all would like a challenge.

I guess medical.

Edit: possibly "bone cutting forceps " ouch

 

[ararat]

Here are a couple of Sargent & Co cutters. Not in the 1911 catalog and the stamped steel handles indicate newer construction. Neither has a model number. They both have Sargent on the handles. The smaller pair do not have a spring return, the long ones do. The small ones are for cutting wire. Not sure the use of the long ones.

The smaller pair. "Nibble-nose" Mine don't have a spring either.

 

[Outlawmws]

The smaller pair. "Nibble-nose" Mine don't have a spring either.

Mine don't either, and I don't think most Sargent/Bernard tools did unless they were for something like the combo punch/rivet set types.

 

[cody1325]

Did some organizing and packing down. Used to carry a bunch of stuff between a tool roll and a smaller Stack-On plastic box. Recently got an Old Pal PF-4000 that I discovered was in pretty rough shape, so I decided to use it as a low-cost cantilever. The previous owner's modifications to the internal trays really work to my advantage.

Really, basically everything I kept in that roll fit--I think the only thing I ditched was my MegaPro, since I had bits for everything on board. It's going in a much more compact set I'm building.

Tsunoda PCL-150U. Bought originally for pocket carry/small kits, but currently they reside in here.

Klein Water Pump Pliers. Bought as a spare when my 250mm Cobras grew legs.

Knipex 125mm Cobra--retired after nearly a decade of daily carry. The 125mm Pliers Wrench does nearly all the same jobs--but better.

Petersen Vise Grip 6LN. Been a part of various toolboxes since middle school, and they were secondhand then.

Proto 267 w/Klein Kote 70s. My Granddad bought them new, and they spent 30 years in a 4-wheeler before being given to me as a teenager. Late last year, I added the thicker grips. Originally, they were bare, which was uncomfortable. I made do with thin grips from a cheap pair of pliers, then splurged on the Klein Kotes.

Knipex 250mm Combination Pliers--originally, the 267's replacement but now kept alongside it. I have three sizes--140mm (pocket), 160mm (compact toolkit/T-post clip pliers), and then these.

Boker USA needlenose--I am the fourth generation to have used these. Great-Granddad bought them new, and they've been a part of my tools since I was a kid.

Channellock E318. Probably some of the first decent US-made stuff I bought new as a teenager--love them for the long needlenose. Need to dig the even longer Kraeuters I use for the tight jobs out.

Kobalt 6" Pliers Wrench. I really wish I'd bought more than just one set when Lowe's had these last Christmas. While cheap, they're really good for $15, and both have seen tons of use. Eventually, I'm upgrading to Knipex for this size.

Knipex 200mm Cobolt. If you do fencing--BUY THEM. They cut most types of fencing, as well as screws, nails, and small bolts effortlessly. Had them 4-5 years now, and I don't know what I'd do without them (well, drag the bolt cutters and/or ruin linesman's cutters).

Knipex 250mm Twin Grip. Paid way too much off a Mac Truck, but they're amazing pliers. They mostly get used to remove stripped screws and bolts.

Proto 10" Tongue-and-Groove. Been in various kits since I was a kid. Soon to be retired to the collection (besides, they're a little loose) and replaced with one of my spare Channellock 420s.

 

[Eric Brown]

I guess medical.

Edit: possibly "bone cutting forceps " ouch

This looks like it. Thank you very much.

 

[ararat]

Did some organizing and packing down. Used to carry a bunch of stuff between a tool roll and a smaller Stack-On plastic box. Recently got an Old Pal PF-4000 that I discovered was in pretty rough shape, so I decided to use it as a low-cost cantilever. The previous owner's modifications to the internal trays really work to my advantage.

Really, basically everything I kept in that roll fit--I think the only thing I ditched was my MegaPro, since I had bits for everything on board. It's going in a much more compact set I'm building.

Tsunoda PCL-150U. Bought originally for pocket carry/small kits, but currently they reside in here.

Klein Water Pump Pliers. Bought as a spare when my 250mm Cobras grew legs.

Knipex 125mm Cobra--retired after nearly a decade of daily carry. The 125mm Pliers Wrench does nearly all the same jobs--but better.

Petersen Vise Grip 6LN. Been a part of various toolboxes since middle school, and they were secondhand then.

Proto 267 w/Klein Kote 70s. My Granddad bought them new, and they spent 30 years in a 4-wheeler before being given to me as a teenager. Late last year, I added the thicker grips. Originally, they were bare, which was uncomfortable. I made do with thin grips from a cheap pair of pliers, then splurged on the Klein Kotes.

Knipex 250mm Combination Pliers--originally, the 267's replacement but now kept alongside it. I have three sizes--140mm (pocket), 160mm (compact toolkit/T-post clip pliers), and then these.

Boker USA needlenose--I am the fourth generation to have used these. Great-Granddad bought them new, and they've been a part of my tools since I was a kid.

Channellock E318. Probably some of the first decent US-made stuff I bought new as a teenager--love them for the long needlenose. Need to dig the even longer Kraeuters I use for the tight jobs out.

Kobalt 6" Pliers Wrench. I really wish I'd bought more than just one set when Lowe's had these last Christmas. While cheap, they're really good for $15, and both have seen tons of use. Eventually, I'm upgrading to Knipex for this size.

Knipex 200mm Cobolt. If you do fencing--BUY THEM. They cut most types of fencing, as well as screws, nails, and small bolts effortlessly. Had them 4-5 years now, and I don't know what I'd do without them (well, drag the bolt cutters and/or ruin linesman's cutters).

Knipex 250mm Twin Grip. Paid way too much off a Mac Truck, but they're amazing pliers. They mostly get used to remove stripped screws and bolts.

Proto 10" Tongue-and-Groove. Been in various kits since I was a kid. Soon to be retired to the collection (besides, they're a little loose) and replaced with one of my spare Channellock 420s.

I guess I'll have to add the knipex cobalts to the wish list. I really like the twin grips

 

[Eric Brown]

Here is one I could not pass up. It's a pair of Hydrolex hydraulic operated pliers. You close a valve, pump the handle and the jaws close. The jaws are replaceable (they probably offered curved as well) and the handle can be rotated into four different positions 90 degrees. The bottom jaw pivots. Still looking for the patent.

 

[Eric Brown]

Here are a couple of bronze plier-like tools. The first one is unmarked, but it is for killing chickens and draining the blood. The second one is marked "BB". The tips consist of a tapered pointy plug that fits into a curved cup-like socket. I thought at first it could be used for forming a funnel, but it being bronze, indicates maybe a different use.

 

[LesserSon]

I could see that “BB” tool used for coiling wire into rings & springs, or for crimping thin sheet metal (like male ends of stovepipe, round duct/vent). Why nonsparking? Dunno.

 

[four.cycle]

glass blowing?

 

[Eric Brown]

Something interesting These pliers are marked "LINDSAYS", PAT'D JAN 27, 1874 and PAT'D APR 24, 1883. The first patent (146829) was James Lindsay of New York for "elbowed lever" handles. Datamp.org shows this as "Not known to have been produced". Second patent was harder to track down. It was (276417) by John Jencks of Waterbury CT. It is for the removable/replaceable cutters. This set is missing one of the cutters and the one it has is broken. It is also listed on Datamp.org as "Not known to have been produced". Jencks also had a later patent for a different linkage design. #509920, Dec 05, 1893. I show both sides, both open and closed. The four main pices of handle and jaws are stamped 1,2,3,4, probably to assist in assembly. The cutters measure .4" long, .180 wide, and .057" thick. They fit into dovetailed grooves on the sides and back.

 

[Beerhippie]

glass blowing?

Glass working tools I've seen--two friends are pro glassblowers--are either steel or wood--peachwood, specifically.

 

[RTM]

Something interesting These pliers are marked "LINDSAYS", PAT'D JAN 27, 1874 and PAT'D APR 24, 1883. The first patent (146829) was James Lindsay of New York for "elbowed lever" handles. Datamp.org shows this as "Not known to have been produced". Second patent was harder to track down. It was (276417) by John Jencks of Waterbury CT. It is for the removable/replaceable cutters. This set is missing one of the cutters and the one it has is broken. It is also listed on Datamp.org as "Not known to have been produced". Jencks also had a later patent for a different linkage design. #509920, Dec 05, 1893. I show both sides, both open and closed. The four main pices of handle and jaws are stamped 1,2,3,4, probably to assist in assembly. The cutters measure .4" long, .180 wide, and .057" thick. They fit into dovetailed grooves on the sides and back.

Send a note to the Steward, lower right hand corner of the page has a link, offer to send him pictures he can use, and suggest they change the not known fixed (default answer if no one has seen it)

 

[Eric Brown]

Send a note to the Steward, lower right hand corner of the page has a link, offer to send him pictures he can use, and suggest they change the not known fixed (default answer if no one has seen it)

I tried that for some augers. After trying for six months found out their "steward" was no longer helping them. Still didn't get the information fixed. If you want to send them my pictures go ahead.

 

[RTM]

I tried that for some augers. After trying for six months found out their "steward" was no longer helping them. Still didn't get the information fixed. If you want to send them my pictures go ahead.

Both of those are Stan of AA, so I have faith. It might take I while, but he'll do it. Thanks for permission to use pix.

I'll send him a note soon.--Done

And I am the new Augers guy, forward them to me, will take care of them.

 

[Beerhippie]

Both of those are Stan of AA, so I have faith. It might take I while, but he'll do it. Thanks for permission to use pix.

I'll send him a note soon.--Done

And I am the new Augers guy, forward them to me, will take care of them.

You're in charge of Augury?

I have some market questions....

 

[d42jeep]

Both of those are Stan of AA, so I have faith. It might take I while, but he'll do it. Thanks for permission to use pix.

I'll send him a note soon.--Done

And I am the new Augers guy, forward them to me, will take care of them.

You want me to forward augers?
-Don

 

[RTM]

You want me to forward augers?
-Don

Only patent info missing from DATAMP.

I have 6 or 8 sets of augers in boxes, rolls, and an assorted box. Don't need to add masses to the messes. Maybe one or two gap closers will be admitted.

 

[RTM]

I tried that for some augers. After trying for six months found out their "steward" was no longer helping them. Still didn't get the information fixed. If you want to send them my pictures go ahead.

From: Stan: Thanks for the info. From the info I was also able to find catalog listing, etc. for nippers with the earlier patent date -- at least one form of the nippers was made by Peck, Stow & Wilcox. So perhaps they made the pliers form as well -- found a catalog listing for the pliers as well.
So all in all, a productive couple of hours after getting home from work.

Consider yourself thanked. I pointed him to your message above. Thanks for sharing. Forstner will be this weekend

 

[Eric Brown]

A couple of Channellock 326 needle nose pliers. At first they look identical. However, the one on the left I believe is older due to the model number stamped on the side opposite the name and the handle design seems cruder. The one on the right combined the name and model number 326 on the same side, saving a step. The handle design also looks crisper.

 

[Eric Brown]

A couple of PS&W pliers. The left one has the name stamped onto the arm. The other one is stamped with the 240-6 by the pivot.

 

[Eric Brown]

Some sheet metal plyers for forming seams. These have no name markings. The only design is on the hand grips. Basically, a flat checkering. The jaws are 3 1/2" across and have stop screws to adjust depth. (Screws have been replaced).

 

[Mike'smeatshop]

Some sheet metal plyers for forming seams. These have no name markings. The only design is on the hand grips. Basically, a flat checkering. The jaws are 3 1/2" across and have stop screws to adjust depth. (Screws have been replaced).

I like the stops idea other than the measurements. But I assume the stops could get in the way.

 

[Eric Brown]

I like the stops idea other than the measurements. But I assume the stops could get in the way.

With the screws fully retracted it can bend up to 3/4" deep. Normally seams are less than that. A lot of other similar pliers can handle deeper bends but do not have stops. You must rely on markings and your eyesight.

 

[American Iron]

Just picked these old SuperForm pliers last week. Nice parrot head design. Jaws are offset to allow a grip it tight spots.. Patent # 1866771

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Just picked these old SuperForm pliers last week.

Jealous! Do they have the raised lettering "sUPeRFOrM" grips on the handles? There are more than a few floating around on GJ, but I have yet to be lucky enough to run into a pair in the wild.

 

[American Iron]

No they just have the plain handles.. Would really like to find a pair of the raised letter handle type myself.

 

[RTM]

From: Stan: Thanks for the info. From the info I was also able to find catalog listing, etc. for nippers with the earlier patent date -- at least one form of the nippers was made by Peck, Stow & Wilcox. So perhaps they made the pliers form as well -- found a catalog listing for the pliers as well.
So all in all, a productive couple of hours after getting home from work.

Consider yourself thanked. I pointed him to your message above. Thanks for sharing. Forstner will be this weekend

@Eric Brown

Further reply from Stan:

2nd reply.
To the extent the "available record" is informative -- an 1894 catalog listing together with an 1883 American Machinist write-up provide some "back story." The original Lindsay patent did not include a "return spring." Neither does the 1883 patent. The 1883 write-up [ https://flic.kr/p/2qRWbvW ] notes a Chicago company making the Lindsay Nippers with a form of return spring -- no mention of the cutting pliers form. The attached 1894 catalog listing shows Lindsay "side cutters" conforming to the 1883 patent. The 6" & 8" versions have springs; the 18" version does not. At some point in the late 1890s, P,S. & W. was making a version of the LINDSAY nippers -- they apparently tried several forms of return spring. Not a definitive history, but some progress towards one.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

No they just have the plain handles..

Still a cool find. Well done.

 

[Eric Brown]

There are other Reinhard McCabe wrenches like this one on GJ but thought I would take one apart and clean for those that are curious. When I got it the sliding section would only move about an inch before stopping. It was still about an inch from the rivet in the handle that acts as a stop. Some PB Blaster and effort got it to slide better, but there was still a tight spot. Removed the rivet and got the sliding section removed. Found the real problem was that it had rusted between the laminations creating bulges on both sides. As the laminations had been spot welded in a row down the handle, I decided against trying to take the laminations apart. Instead, I put more PB Baster into the bulged areas. Next day I cleaned and then tried squeezing those areas in a vice. If that helped it wasn't much. So I used a flap wheel on my Dremel and reduced the bumps. Now the sliding section moves easily with just one thumb. Decided to replace the stop rivet with a stainless #12 10-24 nut/bolt.

 

[Eric Brown]

Here is a comparison of a couple of pliers that spread. The one on the left is a O.P. Shriver patent 1320547 (Nov 04, 1919) for working on chains for hanging things. Note that these also have notches for squeezing the wire. The right pair are J.A. Caldwell patent 191026 (May 22, 1877) for tightening and fastening straps for hoses. Note how similar the size and construction are. The tips on the Caldwell are a little wider, but I bet the Schriver would also work on the Caldwell straps. Patents were 42 years apart. My guess is that Schriver found a pair of Caldwell's and modified the design for his purpose.

 

[four.cycle]

I tried that for some augers. After trying for six months found out their "steward" was no longer helping them. Still didn't get the information fixed. If you want to send them my pictures go ahead.

As noted above, GJ member @RTM is now the datamp.org steward for all things "auger" and "brace".

Mr. Schulz is anywhere from one to three years behind, depending upon which batch of emails he is currently working on. I have recently received emails from Stan responding to emails I sent to him in 2021.

Mr. Joslin, the site administrator, told me his "inbox" contains emails dating back at least two or three years.

datamp.org and VintageMachinery.org are both in need of volunteer talent to deal with the backlog they currently have. If you are interested in becoming a datamp.org steward, you need to get in touch with Mr. Joslin. Familiarity with current application programs, particularly those used by mobile devices, are much desired skills.
I have declined to become one of their stewards multiple times because my work on the list eats up so much of my time.

Do try to bear in mind that every item you have posted on this site thus far for which the patent was not posted at datamp.org has been submitted to the appropriate steward for inclusion (or correction, as the case may be.) I spend hours combing through these threads looking for that sort of thing - a good part of your "collection" is slowly finding its way to the datamp.org database.

BK