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Plomb tool picture thread - show your stuff!

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LesserSon

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Took a while to research these two 3/8dr sockets - 7/16 & 11/16.
Question - did Montgomery Ward source Speed-Master from other manufacturers than Proto?
 

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LesserSon

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Unnhh. So I STILL don’t know, do I? Are there distinguishing differences?
I found a couple MW threads, but they were very specific. And AA site wasn’t much help.
 

mustangSR70

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Picked this up from eBay, 1" drive 1 7/8" socket, but what's weird is the hole for the cross bar is broached like a 1" 12 pt socket. This is factory, came from Plomb like this as the matte chrome finish covers the edges of the broaching, so it was chromed after the hole was broached.
 

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Private Lugnutz

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Odd, to say the least. That "N" following the usual model number for a 1-7/8" socket ("5760") is just enough to confirm it was intentional. The broaching suggests a 1" service opening, secondary to the 1-7/8" service opening. The 1-inch cross bar would soon round those double-hex teeth off with use, but not if you only turned the 1-7/8" service opening with a ratchet or a hinge handle plugged into the 1-inch square drive opening in the bottom. Technically, you could turn the 1" service opening with the hinge handle. The drive stud would have to be parallel to the beam, you'd need a wide radius, and it wouldn't be very effective on anything that needed some real leverage.

But why, is the question? One answer could be a customer who wanted a 1" service opening in a 1-inch drive set with the smallest socket (5752) having a 1-5/8" service opening. But why the 5760? And if every socket had a broached 1-inch cross-bar hole, it would be overkill, and suggest something other than a service opening. Unless the two smaller sockets had different size holes and broachings. That's where my engineer's mind is going seeing any socket with two service openings. Size and weight reduction. But it's very odd.

Maybe they just thought the bar was more effective in a broached hole. You know how you run into some 3/4- and 1-inch drive stuff (not necessarily Plomb) where either the socket or the bar has warped and no longer seems to fit.

Or maybe the bar itself was splined!

I dunno. Just spitballin. Dang you, mustang. It's 6:10AM here! :lol:
 
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RagTopTA

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Heres few pics of the Box and sockets, Date codes of 1 B looks like
 

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r_olson_06

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Picked this up from eBay, 1" drive 1 7/8" socket, but what's weird is the hole for the cross bar is broached like a 1" 12 pt socket. This is factory, came from Plomb like this as the matte chrome finish covers the edges of the broaching, so it was chromed after the hole was broached.
Nice big socket. I have one with the similar broach but the part number is 8071785. I will try to remember to grab a picture of it. It doesn't have a size stamped on it either from what I remember.
Odd, to say the least. That "N" following the usual model number for a 1-7/8" socket ("5760") is just enough to confirm it was intentional. The broaching suggests a 1" service opening, secondary to the 1-7/8" service opening. The 1-inch cross bar would soon round those double-hex teeth off with use, but not if you only turned the 1-7/8" service opening with a ratchet or a hinge handle plugged into the 1-inch square drive opening in the bottom. Technically, you could turn the 1" service opening with the hinge handle. The drive stud would have to be parallel to the beam, you'd need a wide radius, and it wouldn't be very effective on anything that needed some real leverage.

But why, is the question? One answer could be a customer who wanted a 1" service opening in a 1-inch drive set with the smallest socket (5752) having a 1-5/8" service opening. But why the 5760? And if every socket had a broached 1-inch cross-bar hole, it would be overkill, and suggest something other than a service opening. Unless the two smaller sockets had different size holes and broachings. That's where my engineer's mind is going seeing any socket with two service openings. Size and weight reduction. But it's very odd.

Maybe they just thought the bar was more effective in a broached hole. You know how you run into some 3/4- and 1-inch drive stuff (not necessarily Plomb) where either the socket or the bar has warped and no longer seems to fit.

Or maybe the bar itself was splined!

I dunno. Just spitballin. Dang you, mustang. It's 6:10AM here! [emoji38]
I have found that the N signifies a change from the standard part number there is a few examples of these in the 30XX DOEs where they had custom size combos that didn't fall into the part number sequence. I am unsure if they were a contractual run as I don't remember ever seeing them in the catalogs.

Looking for a Plomb 3061 Pebble Open End.
 

MR.X

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Nice big socket. I have one with the similar broach but the part number is 8071785. I will try to remember to grab a picture of it. It doesn't have a size stamped on it either from what I remember.I have found that the N signifies a change from the standard part number there is a few examples of these in the 30XX DOEs where they had custom size combos that didn't fall into the part number sequence. I am unsure if they were a contractual run as I don't remember ever seeing them in the catalogs.

Looking for a Plomb 3061 Pebble Open End.

Rileysan posted pics of the 8071785 version (post 2876 on pg. 144 of this thread) There's also a Proto version on AA. That # 8071785 shows up on those sights where you can buy parts and tools by their NSN#'s ( in this case 5120-00-235-5833 )though in my very brief search I didn't see anything still present in the specs about the crossbar hole.
 

r_olson_06

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Rileysan posted pics of the 8071785 version (post 2876 on pg. 144 of this thread) There's also a Proto version on AA. That # 8071785 shows up on those sights where you can buy parts and tools by their NSN#'s ( in this case 5120-00-235-5833 )though in my very brief search I didn't see anything still present in the specs about the crossbar hole.
Thank for the insight. I will have to do some reading in the subject matter.

Looking for a Plomb 3061 Pebble Open End.
 

Private Lugnutz

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That's the NSN for a standard 1-inch drive 1-7/8" socket. The 80xxxxx number is a mfgr's number that has been most recently used by GM, but it goes way back. What's interesting about Rileysan's 1-inch drive lot is that is the only socket in the bunch with the broached cross-bar hole. And the Proto socket is the same size socket. So the user went from 40's through 50's at least, and the broached cross-bar hole only seems to apply to the 1-7/8" socket. What is it about that size socket vs the others? And why not use a 1" socket in 3/4- or 1/2-inch drive? Nobody else has a hunch, speculation or SWAG?
 

MR.X

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Yeah, I was just adding clues, extending to Proto era, additional examples known and the additional (current) evidence that it's exclusive to 1 7/8", though I wouldn't read too much into it being the only one of Riley's lot broached like that other than exactly what it is, the pictured items were acquired at different times from different places.
 

MR.X

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Picked this up from eBay, 1" drive 1 7/8" socket, but what's weird is the hole for the cross bar is broached like a 1" 12 pt socket. This is factory, came from Plomb like this as the matte chrome finish covers the edges of the broaching, so it was chromed after the hole was broached.

Hi. So just to make sure, the cross bar hole is exactly a 1" hex? You measured it? or fit a 1"AF hex nut in there? Thanks!
 
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MR.X

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So are we looking for some kind of vehicle or machine kit that has the need for both a 1 7/8" socket and also maybe a long arm 1" hex key for something else like a female plug and they figured the hex key could turn the socket in lieu of a dedicated cross bar?
 
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3baygarage

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Okay, so I mentioned something was on the way. How about another mystery? A 5449 female contract rat of some sort, painted in Army green, stamped B-202582. It came with a couple friends also painted in that color. A Lowell, and a Green, Tweed & Co..

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Not to drag the thread off track with these other wrenches, but the significance here isn’t just the paint. The Green Tweed & Co has what appears to be a similar contract # stamped down the side of the handle: B 197765. I can’t find one on the Lowell.
 

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3baygarage

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The really interesting thing is the number on the 1/2” Plomb is followed by none other than the strange 1” drive short ratchet I posted a while back.

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Pic showing all three contract numbers, the two Plombs, and the Green,Tweed.

Green Tweed B 197765
Plomb B-202582
Plomb B-202583

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r_olson_06

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Here is mine. Notice the user mod to adapt the drive size. The socket size does appear to be 1-7/8" AF.

Also scored this early 1/2" Plomb Tee (DT) pre 1930. Also picked up this flooring chisel.

I have something big in the works that has me super excited. I feel like a kid on Christmas Eve night just waiting for morning.IMG_20200506_210348441.jpegIMG_20200506_210352106.jpegIMG_20200506_211142832.jpegIMG_20200506_211158873.jpeg

Looking for a Plomb 3061 Pebble Open End.
 

Ole Slewfoot

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Anyone have any Kopr-Klad drive tools? I have only wrenches till now with the nonspark coating.
Super late reply, but I did post the WF hinge handle that would go with that some time even further back. I even shiney'ed it up a little the other day, but no pic yet.
 

Ole Slewfoot

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I've had some extra time lately for things like regrinding old screwdrivers, luckily I went into lockdown with 3000 grit sandpaper in stock.

forgot a before picture of this stubby, but a white mushroom with a broken tooth sticking out the end would not be far off. Based on internet wisdom, I tried acetone dipping the handle. As fast as you can is not fast enough...maybe acetone fumes...It does take off white stuff, and passably clarify the finish, but also orange peels it. I had to go back to 600 sandpaper, and almost lost the markings. Also if you do dip, clean very well first, as every bit of contamination will be permanently embedded in the pyralin. Trying to figure out a way to fill missing areas...

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This set was underappreciated on the auction site, except the ratchet I already owned.
Missing the 1/2", and I don't have any like that. I thought the box was a repaint, but the wrinkle coat is too good. Dont worry, I have a sad paint fail story to make up for it. All components seem to be era matched at least. A few have xC date codes, most are unmarked. The FC rat was a natural here.

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I dont normally go hard on collecting Craftsman, but this 3/8 ratchet looked so sad in the import junk bin at the local tool store. I talked them down a little because it was rusty, and only ratcheted one way not very well. Full of hardened grease, but a good cleaning didn't fix it. the selector was wobbly, so I drove the handle a bit deeper onto the shaft and repeined it. That action was now minty but it still hung up all the time. After much careful observation, taking it apart 9 times, and experimenting with harsh language, I concluded the the pawls were 0.002" too long, and the off side one was fouling the gear on the backswing.
Dressed the gear side tips with a file, and it works like a brand new tool. Now i'd say that this was a fluke, or a fix using the wrong kit...there is very little wear, its probably worked like **** for 50 years. But that wold be a wrong theory. I have a WF-21that was in daily use on my service truck for over a year, till it started hanging up. I got that out, filed the tips of the pawls, and it works perfect again too. So in conclusion, I don't know if the pawls lengthen with age, or the handles are shrinking, but it seems to be a real problem.

I also noticed the square drive is lower profile than any other ratchet I own, nicely chromed, and not ground down.

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before, after coming soon
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RubiconJK

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The really interesting thing is the number on the 1/2” Plomb is followed by none other than the strange 1” drive short ratchet I posted a while back.
:headscrat 3bay that is really interesting. Some sort of contract number? Did the 1/2" and 1" ratchets come from the same geographic area?
I have something big in the works that has me super excited. I feel like a kid on Christmas Eve night just waiting for morning.
All you guys and your "big deals in the works" have me feeling like I'm missing out on some cool stuff! Can't wait to see it!
 

d42jeep

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This set was underappreciated on the auction site, except the ratchet I already owned.
Missing the 1/2", and I don't have any like that. I thought the box was a repaint, but the wrinkle coat is too good. Dont worry, I have a sad paint fail story to make up for it. All components seem to be era matched at least. A few have xC date codes, most are unmarked. The FC rat was a natural here.

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Slew,
I don’t think a 1/2” socket was originally included in the 1/4” drive sets. You just seem to be missing the two 8 point sockets. I had a box that came with similar original paint.
-Don
 

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Private Lugnutz

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Green Tweed B 197765
Plomb B-202582
Plomb B-202583
Those look like they might be Ordnance Dept Drawing Numbers to me. Supply people used the drawing numbers as a stock numbering system, before the so-called "TAXI" numbering system, which preceded the use of Treasury Dept Federal Stock Numbers (the 41-X-XXXX) numbers). The drawing numbers are more typically prewar and early war, but all the stock numbering systems can be found throughout the war. The letter corresponds to the drawing size. Drawing numbers for very small parts all start with A, medium with B, and so on. Seeing them on tools is less common than other things, such as armorer's tool boxes, and usually they don't have a hyphen. Hence my "might be" caveat. But I have a feeling. It is consistent with the paint, too. Thought to be an Interwar/early war thing. The only wartime tools I have with that kind of OD green paint job are things like single end offset socket wrenches, lug wrenches, and cranks. And they may have been used as cranks. If not cranks, then as ratcheting wrenches for large bolts on large vehicles and equipment. Not for sockets.

This set was underappreciated on the auction site
It's funny how that works. If anything, probably because the paint looks 'too good' or 'off', somehow, as you alluded to, but only because we're used to seeing finishes that have faded and worn. I love that the finish on every piece in the set is a very close match.
 
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r_olson_06

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This PWA 3/8” drive hinge handle arrived today.
-Don
That bar is amazingly clean.
I've had some extra time lately for things like regrinding old screwdrivers, luckily I went into lockdown with 3000 grit sandpaper in stock.

forgot a before picture of this stubby, but a white mushroom with a broken tooth sticking out the end would not be far off. Based on internet wisdom, I tried acetone dipping the handle. As fast as you can is not fast enough...maybe acetone fumes...It does take off white stuff, and passably clarify the finish, but also orange peels it. I had to go back to 600 sandpaper, and almost lost the markings. Also if you do dip, clean very well first, as every bit of contamination will be permanently embedded in the pyralin. Trying to figure out a way to fill missing areas...

attachment.php


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This set was underappreciated on the auction site, except the ratchet I already owned.
Missing the 1/2", and I don't have any like that. I thought the box was a repaint, but the wrinkle coat is too good. Dont worry, I have a sad paint fail story to make up for it. All components seem to be era matched at least. A few have xC date codes, most are unmarked. The FC rat was a natural here.

attachment.php


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I dont normally go hard on collecting Craftsman, but this 3/8 ratchet looked so sad in the import junk bin at the local tool store. I talked them down a little because it was rusty, and only ratcheted one way not very well. Full of hardened grease, but a good cleaning didn't fix it. the selector was wobbly, so I drove the handle a bit deeper onto the shaft and repeined it. That action was now minty but it still hung up all the time. After much careful observation, taking it apart 9 times, and experimenting with harsh language, I concluded the the pawls were 0.002" too long, and the off side one was fouling the gear on the backswing.
Dressed the gear side tips with a file, and it works like a brand new tool. Now i'd say that this was a fluke, or a fix using the wrong kit...there is very little wear, its probably worked like **** for 50 years. But that wold be a wrong theory. I have a WF-21that was in daily use on my service truck for over a year, till it started hanging up. I got that out, filed the tips of the pawls, and it works perfect again too. So in conclusion, I don't know if the pawls lengthen with age, or the handles are shrinking, but it seems to be a real problem.

I also noticed the square drive is lower profile than any other ratchet I own, nicely chromed, and not ground down.

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before, after coming soon
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Can't wait to see your work on that long Plomb screwdriver.

Looking for a Plomb 3061 Pebble Open End.
 

3baygarage

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Nice and interesting pieces guys.

Lugz, thanks. I appreciate your knowledgeable input as always. I was hoping you or someone would have an idea about those numbers.

I don’t consider the 2 non-Plombs ratchets (in fact I typically ignore Lowell stuff, although nothing against them!), but ratcheting wrenches as you said. In fact, the Green, Tweed is a 9/16” opening.

Rubicon, the 1/2” rat was in Florida. The large rat, had to do some real digging through past purchases until I found the seller. I believe it came out of Ohio. I was curious myself so I’m glad you asked that.
 

bmwrd0

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Here is my little mail present to myself:




The box was in better condition than I thought it would be, only issue there is a bit of delamination on the bottom. Nothing a little glue won't fix. The flare tools were a bit more rusty than I would like, but a night in evaporust did its job, and now they sit in a light oil rub. Between the box and the rarity, I couldn't pass them up after I saw what the hex sockets went for. They were also used in a trade I studied so I have that going for me. Which is nice.
 

r_olson_06

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Here is my little mail present to myself:




The box was in better condition than I thought it would be, only issue there is a bit of delamination on the bottom. Nothing a little glue won't fix. The flare tools were a bit more rusty than I would like, but a night in evaporust did its job, and now they sit in a light oil rub. Between the box and the rarity, I couldn't pass them up after I saw what the hex sockets went for. They were also used in a trade I studied so I have that going for me. Which is nice.
Dang that box is in much better shape than the pictures depicted. The flaring set looks much better after clean up. That is a nice piece to have. I think Ragz has a set of those as well. Is there any date codes on the tools?

Looking for a Plomb 3061 Pebble Open End.
 

Private Lugnutz

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Here is my little mail present to myself
Neat acquisition, Beemer! I have to admit I have never seen that type of flaring kit before. Whether screw or hammer type, I am used to seeing a clamp. I'm guessing those threads on the tool are for the fitting/connector on a line? So you essentially put that ******-shaped anvil on the opening at the end of a tube and slide the fitting up and screw the fitting on to the tool to stabilize everything and square the tool up to the line, then use the crossbar to make the flare with screwing force? Then screw the tool back off?
 

r_olson_06

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A couple more for the wall. A large Plomb slide hammer. Most pieces are LA. Also a set of 1/2" drive swivels. These are a tough find.

Found out my big Plomb surprise is going to be here on Monday. Can't wait to see it in person.IMG_20200507_214327607.jpegIMG_20200507_214345561.jpegIMG_20200507_214355635.jpegIMG_20200507_214359771.jpg

Looking for a Plomb 3061 Pebble Open End.
 

bmwrd0

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So, here is the catalog listing:

Its kind of a neat system. You slide the nut over the end, insert the tool into the tube and then tighten the nut down on the threads. Perfect flare! The cross arm is to unscrew it when done.
 
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