Plomb tool picture thread - show your stuff!

[Ole Slewfoot]

Maybe they weren't flaws at all but a lower priced wrench made for the company store to sell employees at some point ? I have yet to see anything but wrenches though with smooth back grounds.

Perhaps so, but this does not explain the variations at the surface of the recessed field where they would not have been ground, or at least had they done so would be so blatantly obvious that this conversation would not even be occurring.

I don't know what to say.

 

[RagTopTA]

So, how do we find someone that actually worked at the PLOMB factory during pebble production? Any ideas?

 

[48548]

If we emailed proto would they have any info?

 

[DadsTools]

I don't know what to say.

Simply put, if the lack of pebbles in certain variations of these Plomb pebble wrenches were the result of the kind of grinding your photo suggested, an entire section of the beam including all other markings would be ground away also. All these avid tool collectors would not be having this kind of inquiring exchange over such a mutilated wrench--obviously, they've all seen examples of what you're showing, and that's not it. Surely you're not suggesting that, after having read through this extensive discussion with experienced collectors, that you're offering up your ground up wrench as a solution? I don't know how else to explain it.

 

[DadsTools]

So, how do we find someone that actually worked at the PLOMB factory during pebble production? Any ideas?

Nope. Even if any of those folks are still alive, how could you find them? I tried this with the Burke Lures factory that was located in Traverse City MI and operated up until the late 1980s (the location is now a parking lot for a shopping center IIRC). Social media, newspaper ad....nothing. I hold out little hope in the case of a factory worker from the mid- to late-1940s.

 

[DadsTools]

If we emailed proto would they have any info?

Doubtful, but worth a try I guess. You have to get through the front-line layers of office workers who couldn't care less and probably have no idea what you're talking about with a supervisor wondering what in the world he or she is wasting so much valuable time on just to possibly get through to a person who might remotely have a clue.

 

[d42jeep]

Based on my examples, there is no correlation between early pebble production and lack of pebbles. All of the Proto LA that I have came with pebbles although I noted that the smaller the wrench the fewer pebbles I saw, which I guess makes some sense. My one Plomb/Proto transition wrench has pebbles. I have an earlier 1/2" drive ratchet that is more rough in the pebble area rather than having actual pebbles. My wrench with no pebbles at all is a chrome plated short DBE wrench which goes against the early tool = no pebbles theory. Here are some pictures. First are the Proto LA wrenches followed by Plomb examples.
-Don

 

[Private Lugnutz]

My wrench with no pebbles at all is a chrome plated short DBE wrench which goes against the early tool = no pebbles theory.

RagTop and DadsTools were juxtaposing the MADE IN USA and MFD. USA sequence. So their theory is actually the opposite: that the tools with no pebbling are possibly a transition period at the end of the Pebble era. Your chrome-plated and 'MFD. USA' marked DBE with no pebbling actually lends credence to their observation that the tools with no pebbling all seem to be from the late 'MFD.' era.

 

[RagTopTA]

Based on my examples, there is no correlation between early pebble production and lack of pebbles. All of the Proto LA that I have came with pebbles although I noted that the smaller the wrench the fewer pebbles I saw, which I guess makes some sense. My one Plomb/Proto transition wrench has pebbles. I have an earlier 1/2" drive ratchet that is more rough in the pebble area rather than having actual pebbles. My wrench with no pebbles at all is a chrome plated short DBE wrench which goes against the early tool = no pebbles theory. Here are some pictures. First are the Proto LA wrenches followed by Plomb examples.
-Don

The one I found without Pebble is a DBE 1/2 - 9/16 also.

 

[DadsTools]

Based on my examples, there is no correlation between early pebble production and lack of pebbles. All of the Proto LA that I have came with pebbles although I noted that the smaller the wrench the fewer pebbles I saw, which I guess makes some sense. My one Plomb/Proto transition wrench has pebbles. I have an earlier 1/2" drive ratchet that is more rough in the pebble area rather than having actual pebbles. My wrench with no pebbles at all is a chrome plated short DBE wrench which goes against the early tool = no pebbles theory. Here are some pictures. First are the Proto LA wrenches followed by Plomb examples.
-Don

I'm grateful for the photos. These are excellent and very instructive. And I would agree that these examples alone falsify the notion that earlier=no pebbling. Here's my read on them:

The last two photos of the end wrenches show both a no-pebbling and what I'm calling for the moment a heavy-pebbling varieties. Both bear the MFD mark, which makes them of a later minting than the MADE marking. The no-pebbling wrench seems to have a uniform patterning across the high areas of the beam as well as in the recess. I think this is a good 'control' wrench for comparison sake, at least for now.

Three of the ratchets have the MADE marking which is earlier. These appear to have what I've been calling the light-pebbling variety. While the 5449 is less distinct, the relief inside the recess has a much greater resemblance to the the two smaller ones in the photo, so from where I'm viewing it I'd still say it's a light-pebbling variety. It certainly doesn't resemble the no-pebbling end wrench in the last two photos. But the larger ratchet having the MFD mark has the heavy-pebbling.

If we were to formulate a premise just on these examples, we might say that:

--The light-pebbling is characteristic of the earliest pebble wrenches.
--The heavy pebbling is characteristic of the later MFD varieties.

This would still leave us with trying to place the later MFD marked wrenches with no-pebbling.

I still hold out the possibility that there may indeed be a chronology to the no-pebbling vs heavy-pebbling variety, but it would have to be contained within the MFD period.

In any event, I think your photos of just these few wrenches are enough to begin narrowing the possibilities.

 

[RagTopTA]

I wish I would have known to ask my Dad these questions while he was alive. He worked At Plomb during the development of the Pebble design as a tool designer, and he was in charge of all product design. Before that he was a tool and die maker.

Do you know any of your dad's friends/coworkers that worked with him at PLOMB that may still be alive? Or maybe a roster from his work of people on his shift maybe?

 

[DadsTools]

RagTop and DadsTools were juxtaposing the MADE IN USA and MFD. USA sequence. So their theory is actually the opposite: that the tools with no pebbling are possibly a transition period at the end of the Pebble era. Your chrome-plated and 'MFD. USA' marked DBE with no pebbling actually lends credence to their observation that the tools with no pebbling all seem to be from the late 'MFD.' era.

Yes, indeed.

I think we are making progress in narrowing down the possibilities of what these variations might or might not be.

There is still a possibility that the no-pebbling variety is a late transitional version, at the end of the pebble era as you suggest. Without strong evidence to the contrary, I still am skeptical that the no-pebbling is just some random aberration sewn willy-nilly among the heavy-pebbled versions with no rhyme nor reason. It certainly appears to be a distinct, bona fide design change, however brief a period they may have been produced during the pebble timeline.

let's put it another way--it's less probable to me that the no-pebbling is a random occurrence introduced arbitrarily into the production stream. It seems to me more probable that they represent a distinct and intentional design change.

 

[RagTopTA]

Looking at pics in the FB Plomb group, I see... yet another DBE 1/2 - 9/16 non pebble in the drawer of this guys box. I blew it up and rotated it and inset at top of the picture.

 

[DadsTools]

Looking at pics in the FB Plomb group, I see... yet another DBE 1/2 - 9/16 non pebble in the drawer of this guys box. I blew it up and rotated it and inset at top of the picture.

Nice catch.

If we keep looking at enough wrenches, I think a pattern will begin to emerge. If nothing else, we've established that there is indeed something to look for that was previously unrecognized.

 

[RagTopTA]

Agreed. I looked at all 20+ of my ratchets, all my breakers and non are missing pebble at all. So I have been looking at Ebay listings here and there.

 

[Ole Slewfoot]

Anyone getting in on this action?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/PLOMB-1920...-14-PIECE-7-16-1-1-8-VINTAGE-USA/152755633414

D42's 1/4" and my 1/2 rat have the heavy grinding. I looked at all the ones listed now on the bay as 'plomb ratchet' and not one is plated, nor do I remember seeing one that was. anyone got one that is? I think we can say for sure these are made after wartime 1 pass grind rule had expired.

 

[twertsy]

Anyone getting in on this action?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/PLOMB-1920...-14-PIECE-7-16-1-1-8-VINTAGE-USA/152755633414

D42's 1/4" and my 1/2 rat have the heavy grinding. I looked at all the ones listed now on the bay as 'plomb ratchet' and not one is plated, nor do I remember seeing one that was. anyone got one that is? I think we can say for sure these are made after wartime 1 pass grind rule had expired.

Wow! What an incredible set. I think that'll bust the $1k mark.......

 

[RagTopTA]

I ve been watching that its really taken off! Dont see that stuff much.

 

[davethorik]

I've been wanting one of the Plomb/Proto keychain screwdrivers for a while now, but I have never seen one in the wild, and the examples on ebay are usually a little rich for my blood.

Patience paid off, and I just won the auction for this on ebay a few minutes ago. I got it for the $9.99 opening bid, with no other bidders. The seller listed it as a 'Plumb' keychain screwdriver, which I believe is why no one else bid.

It appears in good shape and doesn't have any advertising stamped on the reverse. Can't wait for it to show up!

 

[Smokeshow69]

I've been wanting one of the Plomb/Proto keychain screwdrivers for a while now, but I have never seen one in the wild, and the examples on ebay are usually a little rich for my blood.



Patience paid off, and I just won the auction for this on ebay a few minutes ago. I got it for the $9.99 opening bid, with no other bidders. The seller listed it as a 'Plumb' keychain screwdriver, which I believe is why no one else bid.



It appears in good shape and doesn't have any advertising stamped on the reverse. Can't wait for it to show up!

Yep, you ****! Although I did just score a nos p&c version ! Love those key chain drivers!


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[RagTopTA]

I've been wanting one of the Plomb/Proto keychain screwdrivers for a while now, but I have never seen one in the wild, and the examples on ebay are usually a little rich for my blood.

Patience paid off, and I just won the auction for this on ebay a few minutes ago. I got it for the $9.99 opening bid, with no other bidders. The seller listed it as a 'Plumb' keychain screwdriver, which I believe is why no one else bid.

It appears in good shape and doesn't have any advertising stamped on the reverse. Can't wait for it to show up!

great deal! I got one on my keychain also. bout 15$ off Ebay here

 

[four.cycle]

gah! I saw that, but went right past it because of the asking prices on those things!
Some people think they're made out of solid gold or platinum, I guess:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Nice-Vinta...094336?hash=item1c96250b00:g:Zx0AAOSwiHpZ9FRj

Great score there.

I've got a chromed Proto that a guy gave to me... I'd been driving all over town looking for one for my camp stove.... I guess by the time I got to his shop I was wearing the exasperation and frustration like a neon sign. He pulled out his key ring, pulled it of the ring, and said "Here you go!"

 

[SuperCat]

Wow! Winner @ $595.05 today.
PLOMB 1920s 9/16" DRIVE HEX SOCKET SET 14 PIECE 7/16-1 1/8" + VINTAGE USA
https://www.ebay.com/itm/152755633414?rmvSB=true

 

[RagTopTA]

gah! I saw that, but went right past it because of the asking prices on those things!
Some people think they're made out of solid gold or platinum, I guess:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Nice-Vinta...094336?hash=item1c96250b00:g:Zx0AAOSwiHpZ9FRj

Great score there.

I've got a chromed Proto that a guy gave to me... I'd been driving all over town looking for one for my camp stove.... I guess by the time I got to his shop I was wearing the exasperation and frustration like a neon sign. He pulled out his key ring, pulled it of the ring, and said "Here you go!"

hey there you are fourcycle! Been looking for you!

 

[four.cycle]

^ that is bizarre. 90 bids and almost all of them are from the same buyer. nutty.

 

[DadsTools]

Wow! Winner @ $595.05 today.
PLOMB 1920s 9/16" DRIVE HEX SOCKET SET 14 PIECE 7/16-1 1/8" + VINTAGE USA
https://www.ebay.com/itm/152755633414?rmvSB=true

Probably found them in an old junk box at a garage sale and paid $5 for them.

 

[davethorik]

gah! I saw that, but went right past it because of the asking prices on those things!
Some people think they're made out of solid gold or platinum, I guess:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Nice-Vinta...094336?hash=item1c96250b00:g:Zx0AAOSwiHpZ9FRj

Great score there.

I've got a chromed Proto that a guy gave to me... I'd been driving all over town looking for one for my camp stove.... I guess by the time I got to his shop I was wearing the exasperation and frustration like a neon sign. He pulled out his key ring, pulled it of the ring, and said "Here you go!"

The seller I bought my Plomb keychain screwdriver from also had a Herbrand like in your link, but without advertising. It sold for $22.50

 

[oldmantaylor]

Do you know any of your dad's friends/coworkers that worked with him at PLOMB that may still be alive? Or maybe a roster from his work of people on his shift maybe?

No, I'm afraid not.

 

[d42jeep]

I found kind of an unusual Plomb item at an estate sale in Berkeley yesterday. I'll let the pictures speak for themselves.
-Don

 

[Smokeshow69]

I found kind of an unusual Plomb item at an estate sale in Berkeley yesterday. I'll let the pictures speak for themselves.

-Don

That is a really good find ! I have never seen one in the wild and body files in general are rare nowadays ! The wood handle looks really nice! Very well done !


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[twertsy]

I found kind of an unusual Plomb item at an estate sale in Berkeley yesterday. I'll let the pictures speak for themselves.
-Don

Very cool Don! I'm even more amazed that given its origin, it can speak for itself!

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[r_olson_06]

I found kind of an unusual Plomb item at an estate sale in Berkeley yesterday. I'll let the pictures speak for themselves.
-Don

Very impressive.

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[Sunset_Z28]

Came across an oddball plomb socket yesterday. Looks to be 1/2 whitworth. It was in a bunch of tools I purchased from the estate of an old aircraft pilot. It is stamped 1/2W. 919-AT8040.

 

[d42jeep]

It likely out of a Merlin/Packard toolset like the one Snapmom is putting together. Take a look at this thread.
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=370395
-Don

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I found kind of an unusual Plomb item at an estate sale in Berkeley yesterday.

Nice find, Don! I have a slightly more modern NOS Heller example of the same tool.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

It is stamped 1/2W. 919-AT8040.

Interesting. Fairchild Ranger tools, which Plomb made on contract, also had an "AT" prefix in the model number. I'm not sure if either set (Merlin, as Don mentioned, or Ranger) had socket drive tools, though.

 

[oldmantaylor]

Interesting. Fairchild Ranger tools, which Plomb made on contract, also had an "AT" prefix in the model number. I'm not sure if either set (Merlin, as Don mentioned, or Ranger) had socket drive tools, though.

I have one 3/8" ratchet that is dual marked: AT-175/5249.

 

[drivesitfar]

ALL: guys a member posted up old PLVMB factory tool pictures on the (old pictures thread) and here's the link:

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=317387

if any of you want to cut and paste them over here i'm sure that would be ok too if they are not already on the thread.

also if you might have old family or auto, garage or railroad pictures to post on that thread please do.

cheers

 

[3baygarage]

ALL: guys a member posted up old PLVMB factory tool pictures on the (old pictures thread) and here's the link:

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=317387

if any of you want to cut and paste them over here i'm sure that would be ok too if they are not already on the thread.

also if you might have old family or auto, garage or railroad pictures to post on that thread please do.

cheers

Thanks Drives. Just so happens it was oldmantaylor who posted right above you here.

Great picture OMT! Worth moving over here too!

Let's see that ratchet too. I have a Ranger wrench somewhere. Had a second different one but sold it on accident years ago not realizing they went together.

 

[drivesitfar]

3bay: i actually saved the pictures to my laptop so was going to post them here if somebody asked and i'll do it before i head out right now.

is that a crate full of 1 inch Plvmb ratchets without their guts in the one picture? OMG!!!