Spreading the Bonney affliction!

[rickhigginshtbr]

Random thought. So Bonney originally started off in Philly, has anyone found any Bonney marked Philadelphia yet? I have a few marked Allentown, but never seen anything marked Philly.

 

[LesserSon]

Sweet catalog! I’d like to find one lol.

There are two 1957s and one 1960 on eBay right now.

If you focus on the shank instead of the heads, the 701rats are Streamlined styled, and the 707rats are Outlined styled (until 1963). Not the 3/4dr and 1dr, of course.

A Philly-stamped Bonney wrench - yeah, I’d like to find some of those.

I finally decided how to arrange my H-series wrenches in a picture frame and wired them in tonight. I used Utica pliers; seemed appropriate.
Now where did I put that glass...

 

[Mikeske]

Nice drawer of tools!

BTW all of my Bonney tools are working tools and used as such. They are NOT drawer queens and I use them a lot. Since these are now getting older I still like the feel of all my Bonney wrenches, pliers, sockets and extension and speciality tools, my ratchets well I don't use them much as I prefer my Snap-on ratchets but my Utica torque wrenches are used a lot also. Some of these tools will have pieces of chrome flaking, surface rust but I kept these tools spotless. They are cleaned after each and every use. Just last week I used my Bonney set when I was doing a brake job on my 1966 Falcon and then hopped over and replaced the shocks absorbers on my 2004 Dodge Ram 2500 4WD.

 

[bonneyman]

BTW all of my Bonney tools are working tools and used as such. They are NOT drawer queens and I use them a lot. Since these are now getting older I still like the feel of all my Bonney wrenches, pliers, sockets and extension and speciality tools, my ratchets well I don't use them much as I prefer my Snap-on ratchets but my Utica torque wrenches are used a lot also. Some of these tools will have pieces of chrome flaking, surface rust but I kept these tools spotless. They are cleaned after each and every use. Just last week I used my Bonney set when I was doing a brake job on my 1966 Falcon and then hopped over and replaced the shocks absorbers on my 2004 Dodge Ram 2500 4WD.

10-4
Some of my pristine Bonneys are kept in storage, but most of mine are on the shop pegboard and get used regularly. Even though they can't be replaced when worn out of damaged. They're tools - not models.

And yet 40 years on most of them still look gorgeous. Can't say that about swimsuit models after 40 years....usually!

 

[akasrick]

Random thought. So Bonney originally started off in Philly, has anyone found any Bonney marked Philadelphia yet? I have a few marked Allentown, but never seen anything marked Philly.

I've not seen any of the small clamp-on vices marked Philadelphia and only one with the Bonney name on. FB Marketplace, person doesn't message back.

akasrick

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I have been able to identify some of my oldest Bonney pieces (a small Champion vise and a couple wrenches) only in the 1914 catalog, and while I suspect that they were probably being made in the Philadelphia plant prior to the move to Allentown in 1906, they aren't marked with any address, Philadelphia or Allentown. I've never seen a Bonney catalog earlier than 1914, or a tool marked "Philadelphia", even on-line. I remember seeing a tool - can't remember what or where - with a 1903 patent date that would've proven Philadelphia manufacturing, but that's the kind of thing you would need, I think. The question, a good one, is prompting me to do an early inventory.

As for use, if only to balance things out here with the utilitarians, and not to cause trouble (I respect everyone's prerogatives), I wouldn't dream of using any of my collectibles, including and maybe especially my Bonney, when a contemporary tool will do the same job. To me, and I emphasize that, it would feel like putting my 91-year old mother to work when she visits while my son sits around watching TV. They are cleaned, fixed, polished, admired, and handled with kid gloves in the Lugzsonian.

There are a few vintage specialty tools I have used because it was the only tool for the task at hand for an equally vintage vehicle.

 

[akasrick]

I have been able to identify some of my oldest Bonney pieces (a small Champion vise and a couple wrenches) only in the 1914 catalog, and while I suspect that they were probably being made in the Philadelphia plant prior to the move to Allentown in 1906, they aren't marked with any address, Philadelphia or Allentown. I've never seen a Bonney catalog earlier than 1914, or a tool marked "Philadelphia", even on-line. I remember seeing a tool - can't remember what or where - with a 1903 patent date that would've proven Philadelphia manufacturing, but that's the kind of thing you would need, I think. The question, a good one, is prompting me to do an early inventory.

As for use, if only to balance things out here with the utilitarians, and not to cause trouble (I respect everyone's prerogatives), I wouldn't dream of using any of my collectibles, including and maybe especially my Bonney, when a contemporary tool will do the same job. To me, and I emphasize that, it would feel like putting my 91-year old mother to work when she visits while my son sits around watching TV. They are cleaned, fixed, polished, admired, and handled with kid gloves in the Lugzsonian.

There are a few vintage specialty tools I have used because it was the only tool for the task at hand for an equally vintage vehicle.

Very faint patent date on this one.
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=6995591#post6995591
link updated 3/30/2019
akasrick

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Nice vise. Great example of a Philly tool and probably the only sure way to ID one. I have one of those "I-Beam" style (Standard line) vises, 2" jaws, EDIT: but no markings other than the "2."

 

[twertsy]

I have been able to identify some of my oldest Bonney pieces (a small Champion vise and a couple wrenches) only in the 1914 catalog, and while I suspect that they were probably being made in the Philadelphia plant prior to the move to Allentown in 1906, they aren't marked with any address, Philadelphia or Allentown. I've never seen a Bonney catalog earlier than 1914, or a tool marked "Philadelphia", even on-line. I remember seeing a tool - can't remember what or where - with a 1903 patent date that would've proven Philadelphia manufacturing, but that's the kind of thing you would need, I think. The question, a good one, is prompting me to do an early inventory.

As for use, if only to balance things out here with the utilitarians, and not to cause trouble (I respect everyone's prerogatives), I wouldn't dream of using any of my collectibles, including and maybe especially my Bonney, when a contemporary tool will do the same job. To me, and I emphasize that, it would feel like putting my 91-year old mother to work when she visits while my son sits around watching TV. They are cleaned, fixed, polished, admired, and handled with kid gloves in the Lugzsonian.

There are a few vintage specialty tools I have used because it was the only tool for the task at hand for an equally vintage vehicle.

I had my 1888 Newkirk, Ritchie & Bills on TA. Coolest cat ever. Has a note from C S Bonney himself wishing well the new owners of his company. Can't seem to upload pics right now, I'll try later. Only wrenches are the Always Ready double S Gator and the Acme twisted handle. Neither those, nor any vise, lathe dog, or double auger illustrations show any markings.

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[Private Lugnutz]

I had my 1888 Newkirk, Ritchie & Bills on TA. Coolest cat ever. Has a note from C S Bonney himself wishing well the new owners of his company. Can't seem to upload pics right now, I'll try later. Only wrenches are the Always Ready double S Gator and the Acme twisted handle. Neither those, nor any vise, lathe dog, or double auger illustrations show any markings.

I don't remember looking through that one!

Was it really called a "Gator" in the catalog or are you using that colloquially? Reason I ask is Roebling Sons TM'ed the term "Alligator" and only Roebling Sons used it in ads and on the wrenches. I have a Bonney single end No. 2 "Crocodile" (no kidding, that's what they called them in the 1914 catalog!!) with what looks like an early Bonney logo to me. It's the name C. S. BONNEY inside an oblong. I have never seen that one anywhere else except Bonney pliers with a 1903 patent date.

 

[twertsy]

I don't remember looking through that one!

Was it really called a "Gator" in the catalog or are you using that colloquially? Reason I ask is Roebling Sons TM'ed the term "Alligator" and only Roebling Sons used it in ads and on the wrenches. I have a Bonney single end No. 2 "Crocodile" (no kidding, that's what they called them in the 1914 catalog!!) with what looks like an early Bonney logo to me. It's the name C. S. BONNEY inside an oblong. I have never seen that one anywhere else except Bonney pliers with a 1903 patent date.

colloquially.

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[twertsy]

Here's the note from C S Bonney.

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[Private Lugnutz]

Fantastic!

 

[Private Lugnutz]

So, here is the logo on my BONNEY No. 2 "Crocodile" wrench...

Here is the figure for the "Crocodile" wrenches in the Bonney 1914 catalog...

See how it has the shield logo? All of the tools are shown like that in the 1914 catalog, including the "Always Read" wrench that Todd just showed in the older catalog without any logo. And my early Bonney tools all have that shield logo.

Now look at this very similar logo on pliers with a 1902 patent on AA...

That's my pitch for this wrench being a Philly tool!

 

[twertsy]

So, here is the logo on my BONNEY No. 2 "Crocodile" wrench...

Here is the figure for the "Crocodile" wrenches in the Bonney 1914 catalog...

See how it has the shield logo? All of the tools are shown like that in the 1914 catalog, including the "Always Read" wrench that Todd just showed in the older catalog without any logo. And my early Bonney tools all have that shield logo.



Now look at this very similar logo on pliers with a 1902 patent on AA...

That's my pitch for this wrench being a Philly tool!

I have at least 1 Always Ready wrench with that "jelly Bean" Bonney logo.

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[Private Lugnutz]

I just repaired the original handle on a vintage BONNEY 12 oz ball-pein hammer... Not my best work, but it'll do.

BEFORE

AFTER

 

[Oldtuleguy]

I have had good luck using bondo on hammer handles. Just sand it down and stain it. You can mix the stain into it before applying it. Good for a cosmetic repair.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Interesting. Thanks for the tip, Otg. Maybe I'll try it sometime. But I prefer the oldtimers' way! Learned how to put a wire whipping on all kinds of cracked handles from my old man!

Here is a link to a hand truck handle I repaired. The other handle was completely separated, so I put a glue-and-prewrap cast on it, shown here in the same thread, then I put a wire whipping on that one, too.

 

[rickhigginshtbr]

Awesome pliers Lug!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vtg-BONNEY-Pipe-Wrench-18-PHILA-PA-USA-Rare-Find-Indeed/264219939446

Found this Bonney Stillson wrench on eBay, and now debating it just for the cool factor. At least it's a little more proof of production!

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I have at least 1 Always Ready wrench with that "jelly Bean" Bonney logo.

Nice. Do you agree with my rationale? It isn't later, so it has to be earlier.

Awesome pliers Lug!

They are. But note that those are on AA. I just used the pic for the "jellybean" logo being similar to the "jellybean" logo on my Crocodile wrench.

At least it's a little more proof of production!

Absolutely. I have never seen one before. Have to modify my notes now. The DID put their address on at least some Philly tools. Thanks.

 

[akasrick]

Originally Posted by rickhigginshtbr
At least it's a little more proof of production!

Originally Posted by Private Lugnutz
Absolutely. I have never seen one before. Have to modify my notes now. The DID put their address on at least some Philly tools. Thanks.

I see that you are a serious note maker, We live close.

akasrick

 

[Mikeske]

Found something a bit strange. A Bonney CL5 Clutch Head screwdriver today. That is its name as listed in the 1986 Bonney Tool Catalog. I found it at a pawn shop for a Dollar. From all appearances it was never used.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

In case you didn't know it, Mikeske, Chevrolet was crazy for clutch head screws on their trucks in the 40's and 50's. I collect BHM-made clutch head screwdrivers - 5/32", 1/4", and 5/16" tips - for WWII-era Chevy trucks. Not easy to find. They had black wooden handles, pot steel ferrules, and carbon steel blades.

Yours is much newer of course with the triangle logo to the right of the BONNEY name suggesting Triangle era Bonney made in the Bonney-Utica-Herbrand conglomerated plant in Spartanburg, SC. So very late 50's and 60's at the earliest up to the 1986 catalog you found them in. I wouldn't know what the application would be in that era. Maybe the same.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

We live close.

I see that. Not too close, though, I am thinking, territorially - which is good!

 

[Mikeske]

In case you didn't know it, Mikeske, Chevrolet was crazy for clutch head screws on their trucks in the 40's and 50's. I collect BHM-made clutch head screwdrivers - 5/32", 1/4", and 5/16" tips - for WWII-era Chevy trucks. Not easy to find. They had black wooden handles, pot steel ferrules, and carbon steel blades.

Yours is much newer of course with the triangle logo to the right of the BONNEY name suggesting Triangle era Bonney made in the Bonney-Utica-Herbrand conglomerated plant in Spartanburg, SC. So very late 50's and 60's at the earliest up to the 1986 catalog you found them in. I wouldn't know what the application would be in that era. Maybe the same.

Some of the GM pickup trucks the Air Force had in the mid to late 1970's had the clutch head fasteners on them and they were the darnest things to work on have standard screws all over then pop in with the clutch head screws in weird places. I hated them and I would on reassembly I would replace the clutch head screws with a standard Phillips head. Mostly these vehicles were being deployed to remote locations and it was not likely you would have a clutch head screwdriver when you needed to a repair in that remote location. It could be a real show stopper as it might be your only vehicle.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Some of you may remember the Bonney 2578 Ford fan belt hook spanner and Bonney 2531 Dodge rear motor support wrench I found last August, my post linked here. Well, I added another 25XX series tool to the Lugzsonian this morning. This is a Bonney 2545 hook spanner for Ford Model A and AA water pumps.

The "DU" date code and the CV marking indicates 1929. I've included a 1933 catalog excerpt for context.

 

[d42jeep]

In case you didn't know it, Mikeske, Chevrolet was crazy for clutch head screws on their trucks in the 40's and 50's. I collect BHM-made clutch head screwdrivers - 5/32", 1/4", and 5/16" tips - for WWII-era Chevy trucks. Not easy to find. They had black wooden handles, pot steel ferrules, and carbon steel blades.

Yours is much newer of course with the triangle logo to the right of the BONNEY name suggesting Triangle era Bonney made in the Bonney-Utica-Herbrand conglomerated plant in Spartanburg, SC. So very late 50's and 60's at the earliest up to the 1986 catalog you found them in. I wouldn't know what the application would be in that era. Maybe the same.

Some of you may remember the Bonney 2578 Ford fan belt hook spanner and Bonney 2531 Dodge rear motor support wrench I found last August, my post linked here. Well, I added another 25XX series tool to the Lugzsonian this morning. This is a Bonney 2545 hook spanner for Ford Model A and AA water pumps.

The "DU" date code and the CV marking indicates 1929. I've included a 1933 catalog excerpt for context.

Here are two pictures of my cars that those two tools would be appropriate for. It probably won’t be hard to figure out which tool would be used on which car.
One of them I no longer have.
-Don

 

[rickhigginshtbr]

You know lugz, slightly off topic but you may know the answer. Dodge tools, they weren’t stamped with the dodge logo like ford was, how do you identify them? Was debating making a new thread investigating them.


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[Machineman84]

Lesserson that display Board of bonney wrenches looks great nice going.


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[PFSard]

I just repaired the original handle on a vintage BONNEY 12 oz ball-pein hammer... Not my best work, but it'll do.

That's cool. I like that method. And for anyone like me who is new to this technique, GJ has a thread on this :

How to Make a Wire Whipping
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=269263

 

[Private Lugnutz]

That's cool. I like that method. And for anyone like me who is new to this technique, GJ has a thread on this :

How to Make a Wire Whipping
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=269263

Hmm. That's interesting. That's not the way I was taught to make a whipping. Not saying 2oolhound's method is wrong. I trust him implicitly. Just pointing out there is more than one way, apparently. I make wire whippings the same way I make twine whippings on rope splices. For that method, see here. Honestly, I can see how 2oolhound's would be better for heavier gauge wire. With my way, you have to pull the wire through, underneath the wire whippings. That gets harder to do the heavier you go with wire. On the other hand, there are NO exposed ends when you do it my way. The end never meet, and there is nothing to twist. The lead end is pulled under the wraps.

 

[LesserSon]

Do you agree with my rationale? It isn't later, so it has to be earlier.

I know you addressed this to Twertsy, who has delved much deeper into the period than anyone I know of, but I asked him a similar question a couple years ago, and have given his response some thought. CS Bonney’s patents and known products are mostly screw-driven vises and adjustable wrenches. Somewhere (Newark NJ, by Kraeuter & Ace) the alligator/crocodile wrench gets in there, but where are the fixed-opening automotive wrenches? Maybe they were not made by any “BONNEY” entity in the Philadelphia years.
I think you’re on solid ground that the “BONNEY” jellybean logo is from before the 1913 “first use” of the B-shield logo. But how much earlier remains to be proved. In 1885 CS Bonney & Son acknowledges sale of their interest in Bonney Vise & Tool. But they didn’t sell their name. CS Bonney continues to patent new items long afterward. In 1886 the Newkirk, Ritchie, Newkirk catalog shows Bonney’s standard vises and Bonney’s quick travel vises, along with many tools and goods not associated CS Bonney’s patents. The Bonney tool illustrations show no helpful logos. In 1903 (not 1902) CS Bonney patents that AA plier design; DATAMP says it was manufactured by “Bonney, Kraeuter,” but who is “BONNEY” and who is “CS BONNEY of Portsmouth OH”? They are NOT the same entity. You pointed out when we were discussing the wartime Bonney-stamped Danielson and Crescent pliers that “Bonney” was not much of a pliers manufacturer. So “CS BONNEY” and “BONNEY” could appear on contemporaneous tools, even appear in a catalog like the Newkirk one, but NOT be the production of a single company.
Perhaps these conplexities were resolved by the time the Durham family acquired “Bonney Vise & Tool,” in 1906, when the Allentown brothers graduated from Princeton. The family had addresses in both Allentown and Philadelphia (Germantown) for a time.
I am not saying the jellybean logo is not Philadelphia manufacture, but that it might not be. They must have some logo on their tools from 1906 to 1913, and I think it is the jellybean. We need dateable evidence like a detailed illustration in an advertisement or catalog, or an address stamp on the same tool with the logo to comfirm our suspicions, and we don’t yet have it.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I'm with you on all that, LS. Good work.

 

[WagonHo!]

Here's the note from C S Bonney.

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Great document just beautiful.
I’ve never seen that font before, anyone know what it is called?

 

[Oldtuleguy]

That is spectacular

 

[bonneyman]

Great document just beautiful.
I’ve never seen that font before, anyone know what it is called?

How about "Manual Typewriter"?

 

[Oldtuleguy]

I could not find it on Google fonts

 

[akasrick]

Great document just beautiful.
I’ve never seen that font before, anyone know what it is called?

bonneyman How about "Manual Typewriter"?

Oldtuleguy That is spectacular

I think I read that Adobe has a collection of antique fonts, Maybe Microsoft typography also. Possibly you could get someone interested there.
I emailed a question to a company in England that did fonts for castings, the COLuMBIA font, they wrote back that it looked home made.

akasrick

 

[Private Lugnutz]

If you guys are talking about the extremely ornate "Notice," I highly doubt that was typeset manually or mechanically. It looks like it was done by a calligrapher. And I could be wrong, but I don't think it was integral to the catalog, i.e. part of a catalog page. (Todd could answer that.) I got the impression it was an insert. If I am wrong about that and it was reproduced in the catalog, integral to a catalog page with the other catalog typesetting, which was printed in 1888, it had to also be typeset, almost surely manually. Linotype and Ludlow machines, with mechanical typesetting, were still very new at the time. So new that I doubt they included forms as unique as that. The forms would've still had to have been created manually by the Linotype and Ludlow people.

If you're thinking that means it had to be handwritten by the calligrapher thousands of times, remember again that it was 1888. The first 'mother of all catalogs' (Sears, Roebuck), which was very basic, wasn't even published until 1894. I am thinking the 1888 Newkirk, Ritchie, & Bills catalog Todd owns an original copy of maybe went out to a hundred addresses, all hardware outfits or jobbers, and probably in and around Philadelphia. They were out of business ("stock is completely worthless", Philadelphia Securities, 1891), only three years later!

I could be wrong about all this. Just thinking out loud.

 

[LesserSon]

It sure looks to be based on the Courier monospaced type tailored for mechanical typewriters and related type machines. It just has a few flourishes added, like the descenders on the h, n and m, and the gingerbread on the capitals.
Perhaps a typewriter collector would know if such specialized typewriters existed in the 1880s?
I can think of no reason a calligrapher would choose a monospaced typeface for a message that is obviously intended to convey a personal touch. Surely a script type would serve the purpose more elegantly, with a flat brush instead of the round brush that would be necessary for that type. And the size is really small - such precise uniformity of duplication seems unlikely.