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Spreading the Bonney affliction!

Private Lugnutz

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I don't know, but they seem long to me, and the hand grip (instead of a box end or other open end) also implies more leverage. Some of the Bonney numbers are phonetic, but "PE" is doing nothing for me. Why did they come in pairs? I'd say tappet wrenches, but they wouldn't have thick heads. I just looked through a few catalogs (1951, 1957, 1967, and 1977). No sign of them.
 
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LesserSon

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Dammit! Sam Saxton died. He was was kindly, humorous, and still sharp as a tack. He was a member of the Livingston Club, as were the Durhams. I met him toward the end of an annual dinner I attend, and meant to prep and ask him about it last year, but COVID took away the opportunity.
 
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Shelbylex

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Well, after all your shiny and beautiful things I am not sure if I can even post it here : )
Bonney 4085 1/2 speeder. How rare is it? Saw it in a pile of rusty tools and it followed me home for a $1
Oxidized, covered with some paint - will see how it cleans up...Bonney4085_1.jpgBonney4085_2.jpg
 
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bonneyman

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Well, after all your shiny and beautiful things I am not sure if I can even post it here : )
Bonney 4085 1/2 speeder. How rare is it? Saw it in a pile of rusty tools and it followed me home for a $1
Oxidized, covered with some paint - will see how it cleans up...Bonney4085_1.jpgBonney4085_2.jpg

I'd say drown your pain in some $10 wine and use the tool. lol

CV puts it pretty far back. How do the handles spin? Usually on speeders I find in the wild the handles are frozen or really crunchy.
 

LesserSon

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Oxidized, covered with some paint - will see how it cleans up...
Go easy on that.
If you usually clean up tools with wire brush or wheel, try a small spot outdoors first. Wear respirator protection, gloves. If it gets real shiny easily, STOP. It looks like cadmium to me. Toxic dust. I’m suspicious when I see blotches of red-brown rust (instead of orange) and no flaking chrome.
If it doesn’t shine up immediately, but does improve, it might be nickel plate.
Bonney trademarked “CV” as a wrench alloy in 1922. They started making sockets and drive tools in 1927. The use of alloy was disrupted by restrictions during WWII, but may only have applied to the finish on drive tools.
[R/W, Lugz?]
They did renew the trademark in 1943, but since Bonney had two other trademarked alloys, and the caché was fading anyway, I don’t think they bothered to resurrect it postwar.
Unfortunately, the catalog illustrations are not reliable for dating specific styles, or the ribbed grip might pin it down. Judging from font style of the stamp, my guess would be late in the CV era. Maybe specifically 1945. Just a guess. I’ve been studying the stamps on the sockets, and haven’t really scrutinized the drive tools, because I have fewer examples.
 
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Stillgottimefor1

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When I said if You couldn’t find it then it must be custom made I was saying that if the brilliant tool sages on this site (etc.). Without imogis it may have sounded wrong... the exclamation at the end looked like I was shouting?...unintended.
 

Shelbylex

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Thank you, Bonneyman and LesserSon.
The middle handle spins very well. The top one spins with some resistance (though I tried only slightly after I brought it home - it might need several complete rotations).
Thank you for warning as well, LesserSon. Will be very careful cleaning it. In general I now always clean the tools under the running water, wearing goggles (took few splashes to learn) and gloves.
It will now reside for 7 days in the garage (COVID precautions though we are opening up)

LesserSon, I missed your post about Sam Saxton. Please accept my condolences.
 
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bonneyman

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Perhaps it's been discussed already, but what is the effect of Evaporust on cadmium plating? It wouldn't involve wire brushing, but sometimes you get a color change. Or maybe fumes?

What say the experts?
 

Private Lugnutz

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Perhaps it's been discussed already, but what is the effect of Evaporust on cadmium plating?
Somebody hasn't been reading my Lugzsonian: A Virtual Tour thread!! :yikes: :lol:

I've never noticed any effects of Evaporust on cadmium, but someone said they had, which surprised me, so I did a test. I immersed a cad-plated Walden socket in a baby food jar and took photos daily for a week. Last report linked here.
 

LesserSon

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Lugz:
At first, I was confounded by the results of your experiment. To the best of my recollection, EVERY cadmium-plated tool I have crock-potted (warm setting) in EvapoRust has grown grotesque, yellowish plumes, and lost its cadmium.
I had abandoned the practice, but now I must repeat and document.
Upon review of Lugzonian posts 220, 252, 254, 262, 267(Shiftless), & 268, I notice no mention of the temperature under which the experiment was conducted, but a guess that the Lugzonian is fairly cool in December and January leads me to think Plombob’s results are the result of heat, rather than a different plating composition.
Do you recall the thread where Plombob reported the effects? I would like to review it, because from your verbal summary, it seems to match my own experiences.
 
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Private Lugnutz

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Lesserson said:
...a guess that the Lugzonian is fairly cool in December and January...
Since it's the basement, near the furnace, and with all the hot water pipes running to and fro overhead, I wouldn't say cool. It's not warm, either. I would say cozy or just right. I can't wear a long sleeve shirt down there, put it that way. It's cooler near the brick foundation, of course, but even though there are no radiators down there, the furnace and the pipes provide heat throughout in "the middle." The jar was on a steel machinists chest about 3 feet from the ceiling (where the pipes run) and about a foot away from a wall. My extremely unscientific guess would be high 60's. The house, with steam radiators, is set to 68 during the day, 65 at night.

If someone reminds me, I will take a few readings of that spot come winter. Although I suspect your experiment might provide more control.

There are some oxides in a few cadmium formulas I found, I was surprised to see. Not much, though.

Do you recall the thread where Plombob reported the effects? I would like to review it, because from your verbal summary, it seems to match my own experiences.
Yup. See posts #9 through #23 or so, here. Note that Don has never experienced any Evaporust effects, either, and he collects just as many cad-plated tools as me. I'm pretty sure he doesn't use a crock pot. Just a plastic bin, like me. He's in Northern California.

Maybe this deserves a separate thread with more data inputs.

And, not to cast doubt, but it's hard to verify that we're all identifying cadmium as cadmium. There are phosphates that appear soft and gray, like cadmium can sometimes appear.
 
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d42jeep

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I dip cad tools all the time but no heat is involved. Whatever the ambient temperature is in my garage is the norm. Here is a before and after shot of some particularly ugly Plomb WF sockets.
-DonC3043BF6-FE77-4C84-9641-99479F44DE55.jpegA5BD421F-4186-4D4F-BF67-4B408A30DBBE.jpeg
 

LesserSon

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Thank you.
I don’t see Plombob mention use of heat. I will set something up, but don’t hold your breath: I will be away off and on over the next few weeks, so would not be able to monitor the progress. Plus, I currently have a jug of Metal Rescue, not EvapoRust.
As for designing the experiment, I think three similar sockets, each placed in container under different conditions: cool basement, warm outdoor/sunshine, and crockpot. The crockpot I have used keeps EvapoRust just below a simmer. I will quantify the temperatures with actual thermometer readings - I hypothesize that to be the most salient (and largely unreported) factor distinguishing our experiences.
 
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Mikeske

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Got a Bonney 6825 with loc rite broaching from eBay today
 

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bonneyman

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I have a single Saltus wrench in Bonney - 1/4" 6-point. Kinda handy in case I need to remove buried panel screws.
 

Private Lugnutz

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Snagged this at the flea today. Believe it or not, it's the first screwdriver I have ever found in the wild. The only other screwdrivers I have are a Phillips CP3 that came from UNAIU if I recall, and those three little ignition jobbies in the midget kit. Anyway, I am super impressed. This is a serious screwdriver. Prewar or wartime. Stanley is the OEM, I presume?

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Stanley is the OEM. I believe they added the hex shape to the ferrul/top of the handle post war. I generally look for the ones that are rounded at the top of the handle which are the ones depicted in the wartime catalog.
Still finding a Bonney screwdriver in serviceable condition is always nice. (y)
 

LesserSon

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Nice driver, Lugz.
These are my Bonney pickups for today, including the best-condition CP2 Phillips of this age I think I’ve seen in the wild. The co-branded Mack is an 81-A (3/4x7/8), date code GR(July1940). The 865G Textile Machine Works has the same openings. Seems like it should have a date code, but I see nothing. 9DC80EAC-9E54-48D8-91C7-CC566930EAE4.jpeg
 

Mikeske

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New addition to my Bonney collection of double box wrench’s a 2809 7/8ths X 15/16th
 

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LesserSon

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And just in time for Fathers Day, an eBay delivery: wire wheel spoke ****** wrench 2552A, 19/64” openings. I cannot make out the date code. These appear in catalogs throughout the 1930s. I have never seen one in the wild. Not many wire-spoked wheels, either, which may explain the fantastic shape the decal is in.502F5294-FD5C-4AD9-AAA4-BCA3C85B1A69.jpegB117FE80-058E-4EF0-95C9-C8BB87C590CB.jpeg0D65EFA0-904F-42AC-9E95-176B2523D798.jpeg74E047C0-C79A-491C-8810-1826EE090183.jpeg
Smaller than I expected; apparently made from the same blank as the 2814 single-offset DBE, at 8-1/4” OAL.
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LesserSon

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More Bonney this morning: No115 2-1/4” Champion vise (with a little unseen crack in the slide), and four B-shield wrenches. 9EAD283B-5F8E-4884-B789-05BB516B6B33.jpeg
 

Oldtuleguy

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Nice Sunday haul! Got this monster in the mail saturday20210619_072939.jpg
 

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Mikeske

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Found a Chrysler MTSC 16MM 12 point socket in my pawn shop trip today. This obviously made by Bonney down to the broaching and the groove in the base that makes it Bonney
 

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Mikeske

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Chrysler had a relationship with bonney. I see their technician award sets for sale frequently.
Yes they did at the time. I have a technical award set I got in 1985 when I worked in the dealership. That is why I knew what I was looking at in the random socket pile that the pawn shop had. the groove in the base is what Bonney had on the high polish metric sockets. All of my metric 3/8ths are 6 point but I knew what I was looking at.
 
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