Bought Bridgeport Clone - Now Getting it Set Up for Basic Machining

[slowtwitch73]

Not super rare in Southern California. But not as common as they used to be. Geobruin bought one $800 one I posted in the Craigslist deal section.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum...slist-list-here.157363/page-194#post-10128776

Used be to quite a few on Ebay (and accessories) , but not so much now...

 

[niget2002]

Enco first and Grizzly second. Table size matters even if you are looking for a drill tress with extended capabilities.

This is my thinking too.

 

[Nessism]

I've been looking for a machine like that Enco. It's a Taiwan made machine, sold by various different companies. Downside, is no support (parts). Grizzly still sells a variant, but made in China.

Round column can make perfectly fine parts. Problem with them is vertical travel. RongFu is the king of round column. Excellent quality, to be honest, but there are limitations.

 

[whateg01]

..., only 1 angle on the head so limited to maybe 8" cut in the Y vs a Bridgeport usually can angle for cuts in the X so can do several feet.

I'm not sure what you mean by this. The y travel is what the y travel is. What does nodding the head have to do with that?

Also small spindle and belt drive like a drill press. Seemed to always have chatter.
Some Bridgeport are belt drive too though.

I would say most Bridgeport are belt drive.

A real Bridgeport or "clone" is what I'd pick. They are often in the 2-4k area. Even if it's 3 phase, a China vfd converter is $300-500

Seems like chump change to some, but double the money can be a lot for others. I do use a $100 vfd on mine. It doesn't support a braking resistor, but it has a physical brake so I don't worry about it.

 

[larry_g]

The pictures of the small mills you are showing are not in line with the crawler you just bought. Think real hard on what you intend doing with this tool and then the size of the projects you may want to do. Those small machines may top out at drilling a 1/2" hole and that is size of most of the small fasteners on the crawler.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[whateg01]

...Those small machines may top out at drilling a 1/2" hole and that is size of most of the small fasteners on the crawler.

lg
no neat sig line

Don't most of those go down to about 150 rpm? Then again, my old 1100 with a 6 pole motor runs at about 50 rpm and I prefer to run my drills slower.

 

[bulletpruf]

My choice for what you have shown:
Enco Knee Mill 100-5200, not sure if it's single phase, not sure on table size, don't know if it comes with tooling, $1,500

price is about right. I sold mine 10+ years ago for $900.

if you want to more info, search for A1-S mill (The generic model number). Usually a 1.5hp motor And R8 collet size. Made in Taiwan. Needs 120v 20A single phase circuit or change the wiring to 240V.

Good for up to a 1/2” end mill. Larger tends to chatter.

If you want a better used small mill, look for a Millrite Mill (picture below) . 2/3 scale version of a Bridgeport with three different table widths. Built like a tank and very stiff (higher stiffness = less chatter).

I haven't seen a Millrite for sale around here.

Thanks

 

[whateg01]

What do you consider to be a reasonable drive? I drive to Atlanta, tx to pickup the 10ee and to Dallas for my Bridgeport clone.

 

[bulletpruf]

Had a Grizzly similar to that Enco.

It was ok, but limited in function vs a standard Bridgeport.

No brake, only 1 angle on the head so limited to maybe 8" cut in the Y vs a Bridgeport usually can angle for cuts in the X so can do several feet.

Also small spindle and belt drive like a drill press. Seemed to always have chatter.
Some Bridgeport are belt drive too though.

Always felt like it was sort of a mill, but not quite.

A real Bridgeport or "clone" is what I'd pick. They are often in the 2-4k area. Even if it's 3 phase, a China vfd converter is $300-500

There are other mills available here; just not familiar with them.

Exacto Vertical Mill for $1,500. Problem is that it's in Dallas, and that's 5 hours away.

 

[whateg01]

If it's not completely worn out and you can live with the bigger footprint, that's a drive I would make - well, I did. I paid $1000 for my Newport machine. Called in sick and headed south.

 

[bulletpruf]

Rather than favor one brand/type over another I think a buyer should consider just what the intended purpose and capability of the mill should be. For just drilling the occasional simple hole then most of the machines depicted are adequate. However, not all holes could be considered "simple". Some holes need to be reamed for a target size, RPM range needs to be considered.

Does the hole need to sometimes have locational importance? Will the hole require boring to size? How large are the holes themselves? The mill/drill machines are terrible at milling. Round column mills aren't very good either but it really depends upon what you expect from it.

I am looking for something to drill holes for general fabrication work; nothing where the location of the hole is super critical. I am also interested in fabricating some one-off parts for my project vehicles. Nothing too fancy, nothing too complicated.

Milling is a different animal than just drilling. Many good mills don't have a quill and that makes drilling even a simple hole more complicated than it should. By the same token, drills make terrible milling machines that can be dangerous when the taper shank becomes unattached to the spindle. So how much milling do you intend to do and what type of milling? How accurate does it need to be? Is the mill for job shop type work (time is money) or is it for more casual one-off work?

Hobby stuff. Casual one-off.

Why are these questions important? Because mass translates to heavier cuts in less time and likely improved surface finishes with greater predictability of accuracy. I'm not a fan of machines from Chi-Wan because of poor build quality, short lived electric motors, exploding plastic gears, and difficulty sourcing replacement parts. That doesn't mean they're worthless either, they're just not something I shop for any more (have 3 I don't use any more). Even new, most Chi-Wan mills I've seen are poorly constructed.

Older machines may exhibit wear but if they hold the tolerances you expect then I'd consider them a better buy than some import with porous, fragile castings with bearings in need of replacement in 5 years. Need 3P power? There's plenty of info out there about generating 3P from 1P. I've roughly 40+ years of machine shop experience and I'm not saying you need top shelf equipment. I'm saying I could give you a better opinion if you could better define your purposes. Also, are you willing to travel 100 miles to get a better machine tool market? Seems like Houston and Dallas ought to have a better market than San Antonio.

I'm looking in a 5 hour drive radius of San Antonio. That includes Austin, Houston, Dallas, Fort Worth. I have a car hauler trailer with 6,000# capacity.

Thanks

 

[bulletpruf]

If it's not completely worn out and you can live with the bigger footprint, that's a drive I would make - well, I did. I paid $1000 for my Newport machine. Called in sick and headed south.

It's further than I'd like to drive but I would do it for the right machine. The problem is the footprint and the weight. I'm not set up to unload and position something that size, so I'd have to borrow or rent a forklift.

 

[bulletpruf]

Well, here's a surplus Bridgeport for $1,000. It's about 6 hours away. Seller doesn't know anything about it, doesn't know if it works. Looks like a project, and I'm really in the market for something that works.

 

[bulletpruf]

I'd go with the Enco out of all of those. I had the Grizzly equivalent for 6 years and really liked it. Work envelope is pretty small, especially once you add up the vise, work, chuck and cutter, but it's rigid enough to do some decent work in steel within that envelope. Not sure if I would buy one if I really needed a drill press though as it's work envelope is similar to a cheap benchtop drill press. Buy a nice floor standing drill press first, then see if you need a mill.

Well, I already have a drill press for the house garage, so I have access to one if I need it. Also, the nicer drill presses around here seem to cost about as much as a mill, so makes more sense to me to get a mill.

Thanks

 

[bulletpruf]

The pictures of the small mills you are showing are not in line with the crawler you just bought. Think real hard on what you intend doing with this tool and then the size of the projects you may want to do. Those small machines may top out at drilling a 1/2" hole and that is size of most of the small fasteners on the crawler.

lg
no neat sig line

Yeah, it's going to be limited if I need stuff done for the 977.

 

[bulletpruf]

Don't most of those go down to about 150 rpm? Then again, my old 1100 with a 6 pole motor runs at about 50 rpm and I prefer to run my drills slower.

I think the slowest speed on the Enco is 250 rpm. Would certainly prefer something slower.

 

[alfadan]

Well, here's a surplus Bridgeport for $1,000. It's about 6 hours away. Seller doesn't know anything about it, doesn't know if it works. Looks like a project, and I'm really in the market for something that works.

Nope!

 

[whateg01]

The round ram machine an hour farther away would not be my choice, especially in that condition. Footprint isn't something I can help you with. The weight is a challenge. I unloaded mine with an engine hoist. Seller loaded it with a forklift. I lifted the upper half off the base to make it easier to manage. Reassembled just outside the garage door, then used my pallet jack to move it into the garage and in place. Still takes some care to not lose control of it. Correctly placed rigging and such.

 

[bulletpruf]

Ok, whoever mentioned Index mills, here you go. This one is north of Dallas, so 6 hours each way. Looks like a heavy sumbitch, too. $2k, and don't know if it's single phase or 3 phase.

 

[whateg01]

Unfortunately, you won't know what shape the machine is really in until you go turn the handwheels. That is one thing that ***** about driving a long ways to look.

 

[alfadan]

It's further than I'd like to drive but I would do it for the right machine. The problem is the footprint and the weight. I'm not set up to unload and position something that size, so I'd have to borrow or rent a forklift.

I got lucky with my mill. The guy used a forklift to load it and my neighbor used his skid steer to unload. I thought he was out of town, so I set up an appointment with a wrecker company to use their recovery crane, but obviously didn't need it.

 

[whateg01]

Funny story... Well, funny to me.

After the seller loaded mine, I sat in the street and strapped it down. Those big 27' long straps that hf sells for $10, well, used to. I bolted the base to a couple 4x4 the width of the trailer to help it not want to tip, then strapped the base down followed by a strap pulling forward and one rearward up high. Some stranger drives by then turns around to tell me that I needed more straps. Told him, I think it'll be just fine. So he goes back to his little beat up Nissan pickup and comes back with a 4 pack of NIB Goodyear 1.5" ratchet straps and says here you need to add these. I said thank you and he left. Then I put them in the back of my truck and left.

ETA: the machine made it back to Wichita just fine including a near panic stop as some a hole in an Escalade flew past the line of cars entering a construction zone single lane and swerved over in front of me then hit the brakes. Maybe they were just a holes. Maybe they were looking for a pay out. Dunno. The machine stayed upright though.

 

[bulletpruf]

Here's one I haven't heard of - Supermill. Said to be a 1967. In Dallas for $1,000. 3 phase. Looks heavy.

 

[whateg01]

Here's one I haven't heard of - Supermill. Said to be a 1967. In Dallas for $1,000. 3 phase. Looks heavy.

In general, the bigger the machine, the bigger the motor, the bigger the electrical requirements. So, is footprint not as important now?

 

[alfadan]

Don't be scared of 3 phase as that is what all these machines are going to be. Even 3 hp VFDs are really affordable. I use the Teco Westinghouse L510 and am very satisfied.

 

[alfadan]

In general, the bigger the machine, the bigger the motor, the bigger the electrical requirements. So, is footprint not as important now?

He's got the bug for sure!

 

[bulletpruf]

Another big cheap one - $950 in Houston. Don't know make or model.

 

[bulletpruf]

What do you consider to be a reasonable drive? I drive to Atlanta, tx to pickup the 10ee and to Dallas for my Bridgeport clone.

I'm searching in a 5 hour radius.

thanks

 

[bulletpruf]

In general, the bigger the machine, the bigger the motor, the bigger the electrical requirements. So, is footprint not as important now?

If I found something that was perfect (i.e., not too far, within budget, great deal, great condition, etc) except for the size, I'd figure out how to make it work.

 

[alfadan]

They do look bigger in pictures just picture your hand on the crank handles and you get an idea of the size.

 

[whateg01]

As long as you are going bigger...

Grizzly G0797 - 10" x 50" 3 HP Variable-Speed Vertical Mill with Power Feed and DRO - Grizzly Industrial, Inc.

<h1>G0797 10" x 50" 3 HP Vertical Mill with Power Feed and DRO</h1> <h2>An industrial-grade machine with amazing features at a low price point.</h2> <p>The G0797 10" x 50" Vertical Mill with power feed and DRO is a full-featured mill built for those that have the use of three-phase power. <p>The...

www.grizzly.com

Only a little over 3000#

 

[bulletpruf]

As long as you are going bigger...

Grizzly G0797 - 10" x 50" 3 HP Variable-Speed Vertical Mill with Power Feed and DRO - Grizzly Industrial, Inc.

<h1>G0797 10" x 50" 3 HP Vertical Mill with Power Feed and DRO</h1> <h2>An industrial-grade machine with amazing features at a low price point.</h2> <p>The G0797 10" x 50" Vertical Mill with power feed and DRO is a full-featured mill built for those that have the use of three-phase power. <p>The...

www.grizzly.com

Only a little over 3000#

And 10x my budget...

 

[whateg01]

And 10x my budget...

Geez! Goldie locks? JK

Just pointing out that while A J head seems big when compared to a mill/drill, they do get bigger.

 

[GeoBruin]

Not super rare in Southern California. But not as common as they used to be. Geobruin bought one $800 one I posted in the Craigslist deal section.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum...slist-list-here.157363/page-194#post-10128776

Ha! I forgot it was your fault I became an unintentional Millrite collector.

I just used my current main squeeze today to mill a chamfer on a piece of cold rolled bar. 24" continuous cut. Couldn't have done that on the little MV you linked but it sure was compact.

 

[Cruzan80]

I would go with the Meehanite, Supermill or Exactor (BP "style" Mills). All should have have roughly the same footprint, 9x49" table. I think BP did do a 36" table, but stay away from the round ram that you pictured.

 

[Sumboodie]

Don't be scared of 3 phase as that is what all these machines are going to be. Even 3 hp VFDs are really affordable. I use the Teco Westinghouse L510 and am very satisfied.

I paid about $500 for a 20hp vfd. 3hp are cheap.

 

[682bear]

I would go with the Meehanite, Supermill or Exactor (BP "style" Mills). All should have have roughly the same footprint, 9x49" table. I think BP did do a 36" table, but stay away from the round ram that you pictured.

This... or the Index... any of these are much better than a round column.

The benchtop mill/drills that you listed to start with are all overpriced, IMO...

-Bear

 

[Ultradog MN]

Too bad you're not closer.
I recently bought a Bridgeport J head. It needs some tweeking but is still a pretty good old mill.
Means I will be selling my WWII vintage Midway Millmaster 501. I have done a lot of fun and usefull stuff on it and it made a great drill press before I bought my Solberga. Mill will come with kind of a beater 6" china swivel vise and the B&S #9 collets and tooling shown for under your stated budget.
It is 3 phase tho.
I made my own rotary phase converter for about $200 a few years ago and absolutely would go that route again. Can run any of my now six 3 phase machines off it.
Once you go 3 ph it will open up a whole realm of of used, industrial grade machines that even if worn will still put your hobby grade single phase stuff to shame.

 

[whateg01]

This is why I drive 5+ hours each way to buy machines.

 

[loganb]

The Exacto in Dallas or the Houston Meenhite are both Bridgeport clones and should be far better machines than the Enco. Lot of parts are interchangeable between brands on those. If you find one with a variable speed head instead of pulley swaps that's even better.

Once you find one... A DRO, power drawbar and some tooling will get you setup and good to go